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[Proposal] CSM Member Real Life Names

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Stirko Hek
New Home Industries
#101 - 2012-04-01 07:28:38 UTC
How exactly does having their real life names make them any more accountable than if you don't? Is this so people unhappy with them can make threats on their pets and spouses?

I'm sorry, but that's total rubbish. A name doesn't make a bunch of pixels any more real to you, except if you want to go after them in real life.

The negative responses are very worrying. It's a game, you shouldn't have to know what or who these people are outside of it, even for the CSM. I don't exactly want to know where my elected politicans in my country live or do outside their official capacity, and I don't think I need to know either.
RougeOperator
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#102 - 2012-04-01 08:24:14 UTC
Wasnt and issue before.

All the sudden mittens gets in trouble, and its a jihad to hide from the public.


Dont want to give up your name, dont run.

**Space wizards are real, they can make 10058 votes vanish. "and for a moment i hurd 10k goons cry out, then silence" **
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Divine Damnation
#103 - 2012-04-01 08:27:00 UTC
RougeOperator wrote:
Wasnt and issue before.

All the sudden mittens gets in trouble, and its a jihad to hide from the public.


Dont want to give up your name, dont run.


This has literally nothing to do with The Mittani because his real name is already well known. Do try to stay on topic.

-Liang

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.
Banderlei Shiiba
SSAP KG
#104 - 2012-04-01 08:55:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Banderlei Shiiba
RougeOperator wrote:
Wasnt and issue before.

All the sudden mittens gets in trouble, and its a jihad to hide from the public.


Dont want to give up your name, dont run.


More like "Wasn't an issue before, then a half-psychotic playerbase decided to send a sitting CSM member actual RL threats"

Sounds like a very good reason to stop giving out players' personal info to me!
Eidric
Private Shelter for Mad People
#105 - 2012-04-01 09:13:41 UTC
I am Eidric and I support this post.
Darek Castigatus
Immortalis Inc.
Shadow Cartel
#106 - 2012-04-01 10:00:41 UTC
Given some peoples hysterical over reaction i have to support this idea. +1 to you sir

Pirates - The Invisible Fist of Darwin

you're welcome
Arkon Olacar
black.listed
#107 - 2012-04-01 11:04:04 UTC
RougeOperator wrote:
Wasnt and issue before.

All the sudden mittens gets in trouble, and its a jihad to hide from the public.


Dont want to give up your name, dont run.

This is not about mittens, he has been banned, you can take the tin foil hat off now. You spent days in the threadnaught tearing into mittens for what he did, and yet when he is the victim of far worse than he ever inflicted on anyone else, you refuse to even consider a proposal that will prevent such real life harrassment happening again. Hypocrite.

And before you call me a goon alt, Im not, this is my main. I do like goons though - in the same way I like all major alliances that can have 90 dudes in a system, but are afraid of two dozen noobs in t1 cruisers. All hail goon bravery.
Aineko Macx
#108 - 2012-04-01 11:39:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Aineko Macx
Liang Nuren wrote:
Uronksur Suth wrote:
I don't support this. If someone wants to be among the few representing the entire player-base, and have such perks as an all-expense paid trip to Iceland, they can do us the courtesy of revealing such basic information as their name and country of residence. For me, it is more the principle here. I could maybe get behind striking their country, but not their name. I think running for CSM should involve opening up to the playerbase enough to share their real name.

Let me quote a piece of the OP here, because I think it really addresses your objection on the basis of courtesy nicely:
Quote:

... We as a player community have proven that we are not responsible enough, not mature enough, and not sane enough to be trusted with this information ...

Well most of the time I agree with you Liang, but that is absurd. The argument has been abused countless times in history (only when convenient ofc). By that logic, all persons somehow exposed to publicity would have to run with pseudonyms. Imagine RL politics running anonymously lol. And it doesn't end there. If you want to keep anonymity for CSM members you'd have to avoid public appearances or broadcasts (at least with voice and image scrambling) because someone might identify them. And quite obviously with prominent use of facebook noone seems to give a fck.

CSM happens in meatspace and the idea to make it work like a virtual space is bound to fail. Also, revealing some personal details adds some accountability to the CSM candidacy which I find highly desirable.

I have to agree with RogueOperator, if you're not ok with that, don't run.

iveeCore 3.0: The PHP engine for industrial activities and CREST library
Veshta Yoshida
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#109 - 2012-04-01 11:59:46 UTC
Why they originally chose to release names in the first place is beyond me, but info such as nationality and occupation/education can not be used to identify an individual so can/should be available.
Quartzlight Evenstar Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Operations
#110 - 2012-04-01 12:54:43 UTC
This does nothing but bring about an obvious exploitable situation.

This makes it entirely TOO easy to run counter "shadow campaigns" and pack your voting bloc.

Oh, that's right. The GOONS are all for this. Makes sense NOW. Roll

***
Frying Doom
#111 - 2012-04-01 13:14:00 UTC
/signed

Any spelling, grammatical and punctuation errors are because frankly, I don't care!!
Archdaimon
Merchants of the Golden Goose
#112 - 2012-04-01 14:06:40 UTC
/signed.

Wormholes have the best accoustics. It's known. - Sing it for me -
Arkon Olacar
black.listed
#113 - 2012-04-01 14:10:36 UTC
Quartzlight Evenstar Icefluxor wrote:
This does nothing but bring about an obvious exploitable situation.

This makes it entirely TOO easy to run counter "shadow campaigns" and pack your voting bloc.

Oh, that's right. The GOONS are all for this. Makes sense NOW. Roll

You really do have an unhealthy obsession with goons... you do realise they arent actually that great?
Argyle Jones
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#114 - 2012-04-01 15:19:10 UTC
Signed, but with a caveat:

While I agree that giving real life information about CSM members and candidates to the sociopathic collective known as 'EVE players' is generally unnecessary, there is one circumstance where this information is relevant.

I have seen several candidates attempt to win over voters by telling us about their personal life, work experience, etc. If the CSM is anonymous and the voters have no way of verifying such information, then candidates should not be allowed to use their personal life as a platform for election.

Other than that little caveat, I'm 100% in agreement... video games are not worth RL threats and harrassment, and CCP needs to protect the players who step up to the challenge that is the CSM.

/Yargle
Loftybam
State War Academy
Caldari State
#115 - 2012-04-01 16:04:53 UTC
X singed
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Divine Damnation
#116 - 2012-04-01 17:07:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Liang Nuren
Aineko Macx wrote:

Well most of the time I agree with you Liang, but that is absurd. The argument has been abused countless times in history (only when convenient ofc). By that logic, all persons somehow exposed to publicity would have to run with pseudonyms. Imagine RL politics running anonymously lol. And it doesn't end there. If you want to keep anonymity for CSM members you'd have to avoid public appearances or broadcasts (at least with voice and image scrambling) because someone might identify them. And quite obviously with prominent use of facebook noone seems to give a fck.

CSM happens in meatspace and the idea to make it work like a virtual space is bound to fail. Also, revealing some personal details adds some accountability to the CSM candidacy which I find highly desirable.

I have to agree with RogueOperator, if you're not ok with that, don't run.


This is not real life, and these are not real life politicians. Please separate the two quite firmly in your mind.

-Liang

Ed: Also, I am extremely concerned about the people who keep insisting that real life information is required to keep CSM candidates/delegates accountable.

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Divine Damnation
#117 - 2012-04-01 17:24:06 UTC
Argyle Jones wrote:
Signed, but with a caveat:

While I agree that giving real life information about CSM members and candidates to the sociopathic collective known as 'EVE players' is generally unnecessary, there is one circumstance where this information is relevant.

I have seen several candidates attempt to win over voters by telling us about their personal life, work experience, etc. If the CSM is anonymous and the voters have no way of verifying such information, then candidates should not be allowed to use their personal life as a platform for election.

Other than that little caveat, I'm 100% in agreement... video games are not worth RL threats and harrassment, and CCP needs to protect the players who step up to the challenge that is the CSM.

/Yargle


CCP is more than capable of providing a vetted and verified biography of each CSM candidate. There's no need for any of us to go around calling their IRL boss to verify their claims about work in an internet spaceship game.

-Liang

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.
Kinja Garemoko
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#118 - 2012-04-01 18:20:32 UTC
I tend to think of the CSM as a more or less public office (more more than less) where actual people do the job. Yes, it is first and foremost a business relationship between CCP and CSM reps which does not require full disclosure. But I tend towards wanting to know who I am voting for as the person behind the character, with a history wider than the (max 9 years) lifespan of a Capsuleer.

Let existing legislation be the protection. Most western countries (while late in adopting appropriate laws) have a solid basis.

No representation without realism.
Richard Bong
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#119 - 2012-04-01 18:39:29 UTC
Its pretty easy to clear out anything specific from the Bio's and still be able to "know" you candidate.

Also existing legislation isn't enough to stop the creepy people. The Mittani is in the US and yet still people are threatening to **** his wife to death and kill his dog. Now I understand how this is outweighed by your need for "realism" but...

[ASK] Me about drive by thread shitting!
RougeOperator
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#120 - 2012-04-01 19:29:56 UTC  |  Edited by: RougeOperator
Quartzlight Evenstar Icefluxor wrote:
This does nothing but bring about an obvious exploitable situation.

This makes it entirely TOO easy to run counter "shadow campaigns" and pack your voting bloc.

Oh, that's right. The GOONS are all for this. Makes sense NOW. Roll



More or less,

Note that its goon supporters and pets/alts that are pushing this.


It also opens the door for fraud against the voting players.

**Space wizards are real, they can make 10058 votes vanish. "and for a moment i hurd 10k goons cry out, then silence" **