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Singularity - Changing the rules?

First post
Author
fab24
Tax Fraud The Return Corporation
#21 - 2012-04-01 08:38:05 UTC
Don't want to enforce the rules? Give someone the ability of doing it. And I was actually talking about me.
Headerman
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#22 - 2012-04-01 11:18:06 UTC
I know it is an unusual request, but there are some people out there looking to buy some NeX clothes in different colours, we have the ones seeded on Sisi, can anything be done to mod up TQ to allow colour variations on purchasing?

That, and maybe a script to fix drones if at all possible? maybe remove all drones and wrecks around each beacon one every hour on the hour?

Otherwise.. all good :D

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CCP Konflikt
Doomheim
#23 - 2012-04-01 13:18:15 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Konflikt
There is very little reasoning in the previous responses, you should make yourselves familiar with why the rules changed to what they are now and make suggestions in line with the goals of this post, because ultimately we want an efficient system which requires very little maintenance.

If your solution involves making something that doesn't exist on TQ it's likely to not be considered.

Also think outside the box eg. Should there be a testing constellation instead of a testing system?

CCP Konflikt Quality Assurance Engineer Team Trilambda

Green Cobra
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#24 - 2012-04-01 13:30:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Green Cobra
Hi again

Any form of rules where CCP rely on players choosing to obey them will result in work from CCP as there will be default always be greefers that choose to disregard the rules and hinder testing for others. So I can't see a way to keep within the TQ framework to make it good.

However, changing the system to a kind where the rules are in code or DB will eliminate all rule breking and will in the long run save CCP allot of time. How to make this happen within the TQ framework where almost 100% are based on player freedom I can't say with the information I have about the games design. Some input on this from anyone with more insight in to the tools CCP have that we don't have maybe?

Best regards
Green Cobra
Wallyx
Masterderizando
#25 - 2012-04-01 13:50:51 UTC
CCP Habakuk wrote:
[...]

Regarding acceleration gates: Do you have any good ideas about how to avoid camping the acceleration gate itself? It would be nearly useless, if we would have a acceleration to an area without capitals, when the capitals are camping the acceleration gate itself.



Why not adding some Concord Turrets at Acceleration Gates? Agression? BOOMB!!!

I think is not much work
DonHel
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#26 - 2012-04-01 14:33:29 UTC
Hi there ccp, Not sure on how easy it would be.. but is it possible that there could be 2 systems instead of one that are set as main zones. One able to block super caps from entering? this way ccp doesnt have to hear, theres a dude on beacon with super ever.. Keep it still a ffa all over, to much hassle trying to maintain whats going on in the individual sites. Just make the supers have to play in another zone if someone wants to play .. and if they want to try and organize a super cap defense test.. they can be the ones having to hunt down people to help test that, as there is alot more people without supers being told they have to go somewhere else and pretty much do the same if they want to test.. This should clear up the whole crying of it, and at the same time you can make it to where supers are able to be accessed much easier because the damage they can do to other testers will be limited.

Thanks
Kein Echerie
Doomheim
#27 - 2012-04-01 15:36:28 UTC
Seed Super cap but put them at 500 billion isk or higher
Supercarrier: 260 bill isk
Titans:550 bill isk
PPL need to test supers other then TFIXT and shiva.......

like New titans players if thay want to test them. just let them it's kind of unfair that supers are not seeded

Lucas Quaan
Dark Enlightenment
New Eden Alliance 99013733
#28 - 2012-04-01 17:02:04 UTC
Comodore John wrote:
Problems with fixes suggested:
1. Acceleration gates - this doesn't stop people, simply camp the acceleration gate with your "oversized" ship.

Like already mentioned, it does if you put them on the station grid. The problem would perhaps be with the warp-in point in the dead-space behind the gate, where people could now camp the spot where you will land, but at least they will be of the same size as you.
Fird
Stay Frosty.
A Band Apart.
#29 - 2012-04-01 18:49:29 UTC
Solution: Remove super-caps from eve.

Reimburse SP, lose some bitter-vet players, gain new people after friends tell them how much better the game is.

Ghazbaran
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#30 - 2012-04-01 21:51:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Ghazbaran
Hello,

Here are my 2 cents,



COMBAT:

The best way to fix the rules in singularity is not having to enforce them.

1) Make acceleration gates for the FFA's or the now called CA's. ( this is done for missions, no reason why it cannot be done in SISI )

a) Frigate
b) Cruiser and below
c) BC and below
d) BS and below
e) capital and below
f) No Acceleration gate to a "supercap" and below area

2) Make an effect on station grid that does not permit the use of any turret, launcher, smart-bomb, scram, disruptor, etc, and make the same effect on the acceleration gate grids.

The above will eliminate most tester rage and eliminate the need to have someone monitoring forums to figure out who they have to ban.

* This permits the testing of different ship types along with their changes
* To be tested efficiently all modules, ships etc, should be put through controlled ( in a sense ) and sporadic combat

* EXAMPLE: The recent change to Assault Frigates cannot be completely tested in small fleets because larger ships keep interfering. As well as not having the option to test efficiency up to a specific ship size to battle against. These new changes cannot be completely understood and given feedback about if we are not able to test them properly. ( in a controlled environment )
-- People who say EVE online is not a controlled environment; I understand you but, in testing, nothing should be done without a control.

P.S. The Supercaps and Caps, that interfere with the CA's are not emulating "TRUE" eve behavior because these will rarely be seen alone in battle on TQ

- The above stated will allow for the implementation of faster build time for supercaps since these will not affect testing anymore.



MAINTENANCE:

Make everything that is not anchored have a 1 hour timer, just like wrecks in which they disappear.

*including drones, which i imagine make a lot of the server junk.



SUPPORT:

Make a way to set up singularity through the new eve launcher. This will get more testers, unless you are currently happy with the number of testers.

-- Make drop-down menu that will allow for the choice of TQ or SIS to log in to.
* Make the launcher do all the pertinent steps to gain access to the Singularity server or duality for that matter.
* This will make it possible for many more people to join the test server. Mass test might see unprecedented numbers allowing for more accurate testing.
Headerman
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#31 - 2012-04-01 23:17:04 UTC
Lucas Quaan wrote:
Comodore John wrote:
Problems with fixes suggested:
1. Acceleration gates - this doesn't stop people, simply camp the acceleration gate with your "oversized" ship.

Like already mentioned, it does if you put them on the station grid. The problem would perhaps be with the warp-in point in the dead-space behind the gate, where people could now camp the spot where you will land, but at least they will be of the same size as you.


Just had an idea about this one, perhaps there could be an invulnerable period when spooling up for the accelleration gate? SImilar to what happens on a station undock, but happens as soon as you hit warp when you are within 2500 meters.

Wouldn't stop bubbles, but not many people would get thrills out of bubbling gates when caps are around

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Chribba
Otherworld Enterprises
Otherworld Empire
#32 - 2012-04-02 09:19:01 UTC
Reduce the timers when logging off etc (so you disappear quickly). I've lost a number of supercaps to "probers" just because they feel it's enjoyable to kill someone after they log out - regardless if they were in the consensual combat or not.

/c

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Twitter @ChribbaVeldspar

Lucas Quaan
Dark Enlightenment
New Eden Alliance 99013733
#33 - 2012-04-02 09:27:08 UTC
Headerman wrote:
Lucas Quaan wrote:
Comodore John wrote:
Problems with fixes suggested:
1. Acceleration gates - this doesn't stop people, simply camp the acceleration gate with your "oversized" ship.

Like already mentioned, it does if you put them on the station grid. The problem would perhaps be with the warp-in point in the dead-space behind the gate, where people could now camp the spot where you will land, but at least they will be of the same size as you.


Just had an idea about this one, perhaps there could be an invulnerable period when spooling up for the accelleration gate? SImilar to what happens on a station undock, but happens as soon as you hit warp when you are within 2500 meters.

Wouldn't stop bubbles, but not many people would get thrills out of bubbling gates when caps are around

Or, you know, just put them on grid with the station.
DonHel
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#34 - 2012-04-02 11:11:45 UTC
Chribba wrote:
Reduce the timers when logging off etc (so you disappear quickly). I've lost a number of supercaps to "probers" just because they feel it's enjoyable to kill someone after they log out - regardless if they were in the consensual combat or not.

/c



I don't doubt this is a problem, but isnt that how it functions on TQ?
Chribba
Otherworld Enterprises
Otherworld Empire
#35 - 2012-04-02 11:23:06 UTC
DonHel wrote:
Chribba wrote:
Reduce the timers when logging off etc (so you disappear quickly). I've lost a number of supercaps to "probers" just because they feel it's enjoyable to kill someone after they log out - regardless if they were in the consensual combat or not.

/c



I don't doubt this is a problem, but isnt that how it functions on TQ?
It is, I was under the impression how to update the SiSi rules though - and while this isn't a rule change and CCP saying that they want more time spent on bugs rather than investigating people breaking the rules, a thing like this could make more time for bugspending since less risk of people breaking rules by non-consensual combat.

/c

★★★ Secure 3rd party service ★★★

Visit my in-game channel 'Holy Veldspar'

Twitter @ChribbaVeldspar

DonHel
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#36 - 2012-04-02 14:29:44 UTC
Chribba wrote:
DonHel wrote:
Chribba wrote:
Reduce the timers when logging off etc (so you disappear quickly). I've lost a number of supercaps to "probers" just because they feel it's enjoyable to kill someone after they log out - regardless if they were in the consensual combat or not.

/c



I don't doubt this is a problem, but isnt that how it functions on TQ?
It is, I was under the impression how to update the SiSi rules though - and while this isn't a rule change and CCP saying that they want more time spent on bugs rather than investigating people breaking the rules, a thing like this could make more time for bugspending since less risk of people breaking rules by non-consensual combat.

/c



ahh, I see your argument
Copine Callmeknau
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#37 - 2012-04-02 15:39:57 UTC
I agree with the other posters here that the simplest solution is to have deadspace FFA's accessible via accel gates only, and have the gates on station grid.

You will still need some sort of monitoring bot that can ensure the station grid remains safe though.

All faction ships should be seeded also
Having none is bad because it turns SiSi into srs spaceship bznz, I shouldn't have to be worried about losing my vindi on the test server :/

Apart from that everything as it is now, I like bombs bubbles, smartbombs and podding

There should be a rather awesome pic here

Shirley Serious
Gutter Press
#38 - 2012-04-02 17:57:51 UTC
CCP Konflikt wrote:

Also think outside the box eg. Should there be a testing constellation instead of a testing system?


You mean like:

Constellation blah, is testing constellation.

System A includes combat zones for ships up to battleship size

System B has combat zones for ships including dreadnoughts and carriers

System C has combat zones for unrestricted free for alls

That sort of thing ?

That would simplify things a lot, wouldn't it? It would be a simple case to spot supercapitals or whatever in the wrong system.

Just the facts.

Todes
Unshattered Allegience
#39 - 2012-04-02 18:00:51 UTC
My biggest issue is the podding being allowed. I understand the accidental smartbombs. but outright podding can be a massive inconvience, especially if your traveling from a great distance to test ship fits and potency of modules. people do forget to change locations for the medical clone and have to travel that distance back.
Missile War
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#40 - 2012-04-02 18:30:45 UTC
acceleration gates > BAD IDEA. people would just camp the side of the acc gate where you warp into too.
several systems > could work, but would need a cyno jammer in the no-capitals system and no capitals seeded...(however, alot of banning needed for idiots on the capitals only but no supers if they are that stupid)

and podding being allowed is good, this way ccp doesn't need to monitor those bans, and if there could possibly be a bug in there, it would be found easily.(also, moveme exists...)

and spreading over several systems has the problem > its already unpopulated at times in 6-c, let stand if we have to spread around 2+ systems...everyone would just be in the same and no targets at all for capitals, and triage carriers are awesome to have in fleet at times which would become useless if there won't be any subcaps in system...

and getting killed when logged off, isn't possible to be monitored i think, so they can't do anything against that? and lowering the log off time does require some work, which ccp is trying to avoid. btw chribba, first time i see you on test server forum(and your revenant loss ingame sadly, so welcome:P)



i still keep with my suggestion of having a mirror every 1.5 months or near that. since i hate long mirrors because im stuck to the same ship for a LONG time. and can't test any other ships :3