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Titan changes - update

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Reaver Glitterstim
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1241 - 2013-04-25 10:01:43 UTC
If people are losing subcaps to a Titan, they are not moving. It's kind of their fault.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
Carniflex
StarHunt
Mordus Angels
#1242 - 2013-04-26 11:10:32 UTC
Reaver Glitterstim wrote:
If people are losing subcaps to a Titan, they are not moving. It's kind of their fault.


That sidesteps the underlying problem of having a "broken" ship in game. Ship is "broken" when the only alternative of that ship is to bring more of that ship.

As far as I can see under the current mechanics it is basically so with the titans and supercarriers. If you are facing hundreds of them your best counter is to just bring out more of them. If desperate, you can attempt things like suicide dreads and such but that approach runs out of steam very fast.

You can kill small number of them if you outnumber them substantially, but at certain threshold it does not matter really that much anymore.

Here, sanity... niiiice sanity, come to daddy... okay, that's a good sanity... THWONK! GOT the bastard.
Reaver Glitterstim
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1243 - 2013-04-27 22:33:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Reaver Glitterstim
I agree with that assessment. I think one solution would be to produce a supercapital weapon (both turrets and bombers) which deal much higher damage than regular capital weapons and can be fit on dreadnoughts or carriers - but which are ineffective at shooting regular capitals. One of the traits of the supercapital turrets should be an automatic miss effect for signature radiuses smaller than 10km, the turret missing more and more the smaller the sig radius is, regardless of radial velocity.

Or maybe regular capital weapons should do this--then you can attack titans with a big subcap fleet and it can't fight back on its own.

But Titans should have lower tracking than dreadnoughts, seriously.

Howabout a skirmish dreadnought with higher speed and agility and a tanking skill bonus, and then a skirmish siege module which boosts damage less than regular siege but actually increases capital tracking and does not disallow movement. It would also grant less or no defensive bonus. Then these ships could orbit a titan or supercarrier and tear it to bits in relative safety.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
Hagika
Standard Corp 123
#1244 - 2013-05-16 17:51:58 UTC
CynoNet Two wrote:

Killerhound wrote:
Clone Vat Bay is horribly broken or well absolutely worthless, due to following Problems:

- makes you immoblie (no warp, move, jump)
- has a duration of 3 mins and needs to be activated
- installation process is horribly complicated (needs pilot to invite "customer")
- costs something
- Usage is a oneway process, because it works only to jump to it not from it, therefor the clones in there have no imps unless carried with the titan. Horrible work if 75 dudes need there specific imps (Warfare imps, Hardwirings, ....)
- Module needs to be active to jump to titan
- You pop out of the titan around it, you have to board your ship and put in your imps before you can start the engagement.

All this makes this module only useful for Interdictor pilots or similar roles but in a very specific case....


It's almost certainly outside the scope for a near-future patch, but revisting Clone vats is definitely on the list for giving titans a non-combat frontline role. Consider this:

a) Scrap the current clone-installation method for clone vats. Make it so that they no longer contain jump clones in their current form. Remove the 'max clone limit' too.
b) Prevent use of Clone Vat Bay inside a starbase shield.
c) Allow pilots to instantly clone-jump from a station to an active clone vat module on a ship in the same fleet as them, appearing in a pod next to the capital ship. This jump is not affected by jump clone timers or the player's max jump clone limit.
d) Change the Clone Vat skill to affect how many people can use the module per cycle, so it is worth skilling up. E.g. 10 people per cycle at level 1, up to 50 people per cycle at level 5.
e) Increase Titan SMA capacity by at least 100% so that they can hold substantial numbers of spare ships for people cloning into a fight.





Do like this idea alot.
Hagika
Standard Corp 123
#1245 - 2013-05-16 18:36:21 UTC
A couple great ideas on here and one that would put guns more in line with missiles in terms of dealing less damage to smaller targets.

My question is.. Is there a reason you are so bent on making the deadline? Is someone holding a pistol to your head?

How about take just a little more time to do it correctly, instead of finding a band aid to do it now?
Seriously, do it right the first time so people are satisfied. I think most will not care if they have to wait maybe another month if that to get a good fix instead of a half arsed fixed that will not really solve any issues.
I'm Down
Macabre Votum
Northern Coalition.
#1246 - 2013-05-19 03:09:33 UTC
only 14 months old... what great iteration we've seen.

That temporary fix only accounts for about 12 % of the entire game's life.
Joe D'Trader
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#1247 - 2013-05-23 01:30:06 UTC
Necro?
pmchem
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1248 - 2013-06-16 23:23:08 UTC
Don't worry, they'll get back to this thread for tiericiding supercaps.

https://twitter.com/pmchem/ || http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/community-spotlight-garpa/ || Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal
Misaka Todako
Close Proximity
#1249 - 2013-06-17 02:16:58 UTC
pmchem wrote:
Don't worry, they'll get back to this thread for tiericiding supercaps.

I look forward to 2018 then.
destiny2
Decaying Rocky Odious Non Evil Stupid Inane Nobody
Rogue Drone Recovery Syndicate
#1250 - 2013-06-25 23:48:59 UTC
if they keep getting nerf'd does that mean prices will drop Shocked can never have to many titans :D
Apo Lamperouge
#1251 - 2013-09-05 11:21:07 UTC
Gnaw LF wrote:
If you are going to do this then you will also need to split off the XL gun into a category used by Dreadnaughts and Titans. Otherwise the Dreads will be inadvertently nerfed.


And would that also affect our POS guns?

Affecting dreads would kinda screw up the wormhole guys. If we had even more problems targeting sleepers with big guns, the whole sleeper thing (well in c5s) would be ruined

Just sayin

Sometimes a knife right through your heart is exactly what you need.
El Scotch
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#1252 - 2013-09-12 20:08:21 UTC
Fix the Leviathan's high slots; 7 weapon mounts vs 6 for all the rest is a foolish anachronism.
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#1253 - 2013-09-17 16:37:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Barrogh Habalu
El Scotch wrote:
Fix the Leviathan's high slots; 7 weapon mounts vs 6 for all the rest is a foolish anachronism.

Leviathan's issues with its weapon system go beyond just hardpoint layout.
And I expect that to be addressed not before aforementioned capital revamp...

Future of T3 cruisers - multi-tool they aspired to be instead of sledgehammer they have become
Gondola Jones
Prometheus Resources
#1254 - 2013-10-05 17:09:42 UTC
bump? necro? still no changes?
sir Theador
Gambit Enterprise
#1255 - 2013-11-11 07:02:16 UTC
ok after thinking about this for a wile I realize that the whole titan blobs of death problem can be solved with out getting anyone too upset.
next expansion the titans should go back to the way they were, that is, the nerff on the guns damage to small targets that ccp put in effect last expansion should be lifted.
to prevent titan blobs of death ccp should give us a module that makes sub cap ships immune to the big guns.
this module would be something like a deflective shield that redirects the massive incoming energy pulse around the small signature radius.
I would suggest the modal fit in a high slot.
this would allow titans to rat and do the other things they used to do wile keeping them form over stepping there role in fleet battles in this particular area.
Capt Under
Starlight Holdings
#1256 - 2013-12-02 19:23:42 UTC
Use Titans to terraform and colonize planets in Worm hole space/new star clusters or something similar to the movie Titan A.E. Need one titan for each new planet. Once deployed the titan become space junk and can never be used again. Go watch the movie Titan A.E. for some inspiration what the new Titan role could be like:
Titan A.E. Trailer

This new colonized planet then give you enough PI materials from which you can build alliance and/or faction owned mobile refinery, factory, cloning and warp gate structures around the planet. The mobile warp gate can only connect to other WH systems within that star cluster (not new eden). These "new" alliance owned structures should cost the same as an outpost but can be destroyed..

To conquer one of these colonized planets you need to use dust514 mercs and then another titan to claim it. Rince and repeat.
Reaver Glitterstim
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1257 - 2013-12-04 16:02:32 UTC
In Titan A.E. they had a specific ship called Titan that was capable of traveling a great distance. They needed to use that ship not to colonize, but to arrive. Since it was big, it could also carry everything they needed.

Sort of like an EVE Industrial with its big cargo bay and warp drive. Probably holds hundreds of people, too.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
Rainbow Dash
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1258 - 2013-12-15 15:32:07 UTC
Just remove supercaps. Isk refund the BPOs, no refund for the hulls. You sink a ton of minerals and get rid of a huge balance issue at the same time.
Bobinu
Unsober
Last Picks
#1259 - 2013-12-17 14:02:39 UTC
How about a Titan amnesty, all Alliances agree not to use them....muhahaha!

What if there was a limit of how many Titans per Grid / System? Not that I agree with this idea, someone else's idea of limited the amount of Titans, to balance the fight.

Cant remember who said it, be nice for Titans to have a clear defined role.

Maybe like an Incursion modifier for non fleet ships!!

Or

Some kick ass fleet bonus's (maybe even fleet dps)

Sorry to bring up a previous comment, I looked at the equation for Turrets, excuse my stupidity but range is factor'd in twice for the to hit chance, is it not given enough significance within the equation?

Maybe to prevent BS (sub caps etc) being hit by Big guns there is a firing delay or ROF penalty based on Range vs Sig radius (unmodified) so shooting small ships is a bad choice for Supers, something along the lines of the Targeting computer needs exptra time to calculate the variables.
Misaka Todako
Close Proximity
#1260 - 2013-12-19 06:03:13 UTC
I honestly don't believe capital weapons are a threat to subcaps right now. If there is a BR that indicates otherwise, I'd be interested in seeing it. However it should be difficult if not impossible for a titan to be effective against an orbiting BS with the tracking speed on capital weapons.

To be clear, I'm not arguing that capital guns need buffed; simply that further nerfs aren't necessary. Titan "death blobs" haven't been a thing for a while.