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My Apology

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Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#981 - 2012-03-27 05:25:04 UTC
Cipher Jones wrote:
Disambiguation;

It matters legally in the sense that the charges are harsher if there is intent, but no the lack of intent does not make it legal either.


Cipher, Cyber Bullying is not a victimless crime.

The Wiz maintains that he was not bullied as a result of the Mittani's comments, nor was he aware of them until someone pointed it out to him. He could care less.

If the supposed "victim" maintains the crime did not happen in this case, there is no crime.

A case theoretically "might" have been made if someone had taken Mittani's statement at face value and harassed The Wiz to the point of emotional distress by advocating suicide to him (although what country would be able to actually act in this case is debatable).

However, that didn't happen.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.
SmilingVagrant
Doomheim
#982 - 2012-03-27 05:25:55 UTC
Pedro Chang wrote:

Some pubbie drivel


So if it's impossible to divorce alliance heads from CSM actions at what point does the entire CSM process become bunk?

*Hint: If you disallow for that it's bunk from the very start.
Zhade Lezte
#983 - 2012-03-27 05:27:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Zhade Lezte
I have never gotten so IRL bent out of shape at the people pushing their axe now that Mitanni has "promised" something in a moment of weakness than any other thing about some silly video game. Those of you using this to push even FURTHER and call to remove Mitanni from the CSM and thus disenfranchise a significant portion of the playerbase entirely disgust me. This election was great and we have a huge variety of representatives, including two hisec representatives on the main CSM and one hisec alternate! Don't **** this up by pouncing on his weakness with "moralistic" pretext, and I seriously question how many of you would actually forgive him if he DID resign from the CSM. The answer to that question may reveal something you might not want to admit to even yourself.

That is not to say that people should not be disgusted by what he did, I was myself and seriously considered if I wanted to keep playing Eve Online if the atmosphere would be like this.

I'm sure you don't need anyone to tell you this at this point Mitanni, but make this decision on your own. Resign from your chairmanship if you feel it's right, but please don't quit the CSM.
Lexmana
#984 - 2012-03-27 05:27:28 UTC
haysis wrote:
I was just saying, I don't think Eve needs more bad PR then it already has. I guess, what I'm trying to say is. Better safe then sorry?


Bad PR for some is good PR for others. Did you listen to David Ried on fanfest?

Also, he got 10k votes and it might even be worse publicity for CCP if they sack this guy now.

Anyway, I do think it is blown out of proportions. He did stupid but that happens every minute in every MMO out there. The Mittani is however a public figure and he has many enemies and the forums really loves drama.

I think he has a good chance to survive this but he has to ride the storm first like any true politician has to do.

Shogun Archer
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#985 - 2012-03-27 05:27:29 UTC
People are WAAAY too offended for other people these days.
Half the time it's fake. In reality most people barely get offended
even when it's directed at them personally.

It's the namby pamby world we live in.

If you run into more than 2 a**holes in a day, you should probably look in the mirror.
Blut'Engel
Phantom Space
Space Madness.
#986 - 2012-03-27 05:27:47 UTC
GG mittens.
Pahineh Amelana
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#987 - 2012-03-27 05:28:34 UTC
Pahineh Amelana wrote:
Let's be straight, and not over look some important facts.

You made the presentation prior to going to the panel. (your intentions at this point were clear)
You spoke @ the panel. (you acted on your intentions prior to the fanfest)
Your members backed what you said for several days here on the forums. (further showing that these intentions were/are shared by a larger group of associates)

Now you apologize. For yourself, for your associates, for who? To save face?




Just goes to show how sincere this apology really is.

Bigger people in the real world have apologized and resigned from real positions of power, for much much smaller things.
That being said, make the sacrifice to make it sincere. Integrity.

If you had not made it a part of your actual presentation, it could be ran off as a mistake, mis-speaking.
If your fellow members didn't stand behind what you said, and pander all over the EVE-O forums like monkeys, it could have again, been ran off as a mistake.


The fact is you made this an actual part of your presentation, then followed through with presenting it, as humor.
Then your members, friends, associates, supporters ran all over the EVE-O forums stating their support of your words, for this or that reason, further creating even more problems, divides and ultimately much deeper issues within the eve community.



Apologizing for bumping into someone. acceptable
Apologizing for spilling some water on someone on accident. acceptable
Apologizing for accidentally hurting someone. acceptable

Apologizing for deliberately trying to cause harm to someone utilizing a video game as your execution platform. Unacceptable.
Apologizing for egging others on to cause harm to another via a video game. Unacceptable.

It's called cyber bullying, and like it or not, it's not funny. Even if it's meant in jest.
Your words and actions do not just effect the individual you were targeting but an entire community of players. Cause & Effect.


As I've said. It's to the point.
Lolmer
Merciless Reckoning
#988 - 2012-03-27 05:29:09 UTC
David Carel wrote:
Tyrrax Thorrk wrote:
Lolmer wrote:
CCP is not a public company and has no shareholders. It has loans, but no public shares to trade on the market to go up or down from any publicity.


I don't remember what date this was but;

Major Shareholders
At the date of this Prospectus there were 97 shareholders in CCP. The ten largest shareholders owned a total of 97.9% of the Company's issued share capital.
NP ehf 33.99
Teno Investments S.-.R.L 17.21
Reynir Harðarson 11.37
Arion safnreikningur 5.60
Matthfas Guðmundsson 3.72
Hilmar Veigar Pétursson 2.82
Novator ehf 2.56
Frosti Sigurjónsson 2.44
Friðrik Örn Haraldsson 2.42
Guðmundur Kristinsson ehf 2.39


I haven't seen CCP being traded, though.


Right, which was my point. The shareholders are from private loans and there is no "market" to appease to get more money for the shareholders other than income (net or gross I am unsure for calculations of loan payout). If CCP were a publicly traded company, then yes public appearance would matter for the shareholders value and they'd have a "vote" in the companies policies., but not really on day-to-day matters.
Pedro Chang
Scorpus Legion
#989 - 2012-03-27 05:30:03 UTC
SmilingVagrant wrote:
Pedro Chang wrote:

Some pubbie drivel


So if it's impossible to divorce alliance heads from CSM actions at what point does the entire CSM process become bunk?

*Hint: If you disallow for that it's bunk from the very start.

The CSM process has nothing to do with this. He represents the whole of EVE in CCP's eyes, and vice versa. Bunk or not, he chose to take the actions he did while in that position. There is really no getting around that, but feel free to try I guess?
Sverige Pahis
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#990 - 2012-03-27 05:31:57 UTC
I'm a cop
Shere
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#991 - 2012-03-27 05:32:04 UTC
I like how CSM members and candidates are held to this higher standard of virtue and morality when in actuality they are just playing the same game we are.

This isn't about morality, or legality, or some fabricated PR damage to CCP, or even about the supposed victim in this incident. If it were about any of these things we wouldn't still be talking about it because those things don't exist. This is about people with some goon-grudge trying to find some oil for their torches and a stone to sharpen their pitchforks on.

Be more transparent, idiots.
Blut'Engel
Phantom Space
Space Madness.
#992 - 2012-03-27 05:34:28 UTC
Sverige Pahis wrote:
I'm a cop


did mittens resign yet, vee?
Lolmer
Merciless Reckoning
#993 - 2012-03-27 05:36:18 UTC
Ice Fist wrote:
Krutoj wrote:
This topic is going sideways, to be chairman or not to be, to be CSM or GSF leader, to be part of the Sandbox or to be morally constrained by the real world. This is a lot of bullshit and knowing Alex for the past year, him being able to separate his role as CSM chairman and his role of the evil Goonswarm empire CEO, and doing a damn good job at it, while representing the views of those that are cursing him right now in this thread. Well aint this just so polliticly correct thing to do eh?

In other news, am stuck waiting for my next flight in Sydney, this thread does provide some mild entertainment, but I must reflect on the things CSM6 must do in the view of the CCP's keynotes at the Fanfest. I think Alex (Mittani) will do the same if you stop this silliness.


Krutoj, at least I know that if Mittens resigns we have guys like you in there keeping half sentient morons like Darius from doing something stupid - oh wait, Darius doesn't do anything but disclose confidential information for Riverini lololol.


I guess you failed at reading http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=28529.

Krutoj isn't on CSM 7 to help out.
Shogun Archer
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#994 - 2012-03-27 05:36:36 UTC
Shere wrote:
I like how CSM members and candidates are held to this higher standard of virtue and morality when in actuality they are just playing the same game we are.

This isn't about morality, or legality, or some fabricated PR damage to CCP, or even about the supposed victim in this incident. If it were about any of these things we wouldn't still be talking about it because those things don't exist. This is about people with some goon-grudge trying to find some oil for their torches and a stone to sharpen their pitchforks on.

Be more transparent, idiots.



So true. I have fought the Goons here and there a few times, and never really "liked" them so to speak,
but I agree... I see the same thing. Just a bunch of opportunist trying to use some politically correct forum whining
to hopefully get their agenda achieved.

The man apologized. He is not a world leader. He is playing the game just like the rest of us.

If you run into more than 2 a**holes in a day, you should probably look in the mirror.
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#995 - 2012-03-27 05:36:39 UTC
Taiwanistan wrote:
Cipher Jones wrote:

Show me that quote and Ill biomass. Otherwise HTFU and GTFO.


https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=46031&p=1
actually, don't biomass, i don't want to be responsible for your own mental instability


Why would I biomass? You were wrong on top of being wrong. It's pretty laughable.

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it
Pedro Chang
Scorpus Legion
#996 - 2012-03-27 05:36:52 UTC
Shere wrote:
I like how CSM members and candidates are held to this higher standard of virtue and morality when in actuality they are just playing the same game we are.

This isn't about morality, or legality, or some fabricated PR damage to CCP, or even about the supposed victim in this incident. If it were about any of these things we wouldn't still be talking about it because those things don't exist. This is about people with some goon-grudge trying to find some oil for their torches and a stone to sharpen their pitchforks on.

Be more transparent, idiots.

Wouldn't matter if it was Molle, Mittens, or even Chribba. Doing that kind of thing in public, while in that position, deserves a ban. Yeah, some people hate Goons and this is a great opportunity for them to dogpile. Others are more concerned with CCP continuously bending rules over the years for big players. Molle is the most perfect example of that. Him and his ilk should have been banned many, many moons ago.
lady jailbait
ambertech industries
#997 - 2012-03-27 05:37:01 UTC  |  Edited by: lady jailbait
Shere wrote:
I like how CSM members and candidates are held to this higher standard of virtue and morality when in actuality they are just playing the same game we are.

This isn't about morality, or legality, or some fabricated PR damage to CCP, or even about the supposed victim in this incident. If it were about any of these things we wouldn't still be talking about it because those things don't exist. This is about people with some goon-grudge trying to find some oil for their torches and a stone to sharpen their pitchforks on.

Be more transparent, idiots.



your completly right its all about goons, your brilliant post has made it obvious to me that it isnt about bullying and in fact its all about goons

EDIT: Sarcasm
Roffle Lawler
Elitist Oops
#998 - 2012-03-27 05:37:34 UTC
We should all biomass our main's in protest.
Amity Lane
Hek Mining Association
#999 - 2012-03-27 05:38:10 UTC
Wait...so now GoonSwarm are the victims?

This reminds me of when Harry Whittington apologized to **** Cheney after being shot in the face by him.
Princess Bride
SharkNado
#1000 - 2012-03-27 05:40:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Princess Bride
The real question is, what action can CCP take to mitigate the damages in the lawsuit? No, probably not by the guy targeted by Alex. But if there ever IS a cyber-bullying lawsuit that drags CCP into court, and CCP didn't take action here, that WILL be used to prove that CCP ignored previous events, or that CCP is "soft" on cyber-bullies.

Like it or not, there are laws against it in a few states already, you don't see an eventual cause of action against CCP? I bet CCP does.

As a paralegal, I bet Alex has already done the math here. Just a matter of timing now.

http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/