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My Apology

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Ai Shun
#2421 - 2012-03-27 21:53:23 UTC
Markus Reese wrote:
Ai Shun wrote:
Only 70 to 80 odd pages until this overtakes the WiS threadnaught. Go go Goons go!


Wrong, there are two parallel threads totaling over 240 pages, it already has.


Odd. I see one thread at 132 / 133 odd pages. I had not realised we've redefined a threadnaught so it can contain all threads that mention the same topic. But then, this whole thing seems about redefining CCP, CSM and EVE - so okay. I am thus redefining 240 pages to be less than 192. WiS wins. Fatality.
de4deye
Terra Nova Innovations
Sedition.
#2422 - 2012-03-27 21:53:32 UTC
Bye Bye, Mittens. It's been fun. Big smile
Princess Bride
SharkNado
#2423 - 2012-03-27 21:55:59 UTC
SmilingVagrant wrote:

Honestly Mittens giving an apology is a major break of the "Smuggo" character he's created over the last several years.


Yep. It's pretty clear that a complete 180 was necessary for even the slightest chance of getting out of this with a CSM spot and his accounts intact. However I believe that was only wishful thinking. It may mitigate the damage somewhat, but he's not going to emerge unscathed, and he knows it. CCP cannot afford to just let him off the hook at this point, period. Legal and PR need a head on a platter.

http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/
Princess Bride
SharkNado
#2424 - 2012-03-27 21:59:38 UTC
Danfen Fenix wrote:
Tbf, I actually have a small amount of respect for Mittani atm. Not for his actions at FF, but rather the fact that he has made his apology, done all the correct steps so far, and left it at that. No falling to any baiting, or getting in to forum arguements, just accepting it & taking things as they are, and go, so far

(at least, as it appears atm P )


The silence you hear is the sound of Alex holding his breath and praying silently that when this is over he can still play Eve. Any sign of smugness from him at this point is pretty much a biomass sentence.

http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#2425 - 2012-03-27 22:02:29 UTC
Yeep wrote:
Abriael VonRosen wrote:
Ranger 1 wrote:
Okay, I admit my posting in this thread sucked.

I should never have made the mistake of relying on logic and fact to counter hysteria and misinformation... bad puns seem to be far more effective. At least then they stop posting crap for awhile until they can stop groaning about them. Ugh


There is a large difference between "hysteria and misinformation" and simple, clear cut calls for someone guilty of an unacceptable social and professional behavior to face the actual consequences of what he did, instead of just saying "sorry I was drunk" and hoping to get away with a wirstslap.


I think most of the actual (by which I mean rational, unselfishly motivated) disagreement is over what an appropriate consequence is.

Ranger 1 wrote:
Okay, I admit my posting in this thread sucked.

I should never have made the mistake of relying on logic and fact to counter hysteria and misinformation... bad puns seem to be far more effective. At least then they stop posting crap for awhile until they can stop groaning about them. Ugh


Have you considered using logic and fact alongside bad puns?


Yes, but then they get so confused they fail to appreciate my delicate wit.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.
Kalathia Eginald
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#2426 - 2012-03-27 22:03:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Kalathia Eginald
Princess Bride wrote:
Yep. It's pretty clear that a complete 180 was necessary for even the slightest chance of getting out of this with a CSM spot and his accounts intact. However I believe that was only wishful thinking. It may mitigate the damage somewhat, but he's not going to emerge unscathed, and he knows it. CCP cannot afford to just let him off the hook at this point, period. Legal and PR need a head on a platter.


Actually they don't the people calling for it do. There in lies part of the problem.

Even if he is sanctioned for his behaviour some of the people will not be happy unless they see what is done. To me that is not justice but vengance. Justice will be he gets what ever punishment he deserves if any and not my or anyone else seeing him hanged, drawn and quarted.

No one escapse from a balls up with their undies still intact, it happens to all of us at some point or other I go red thinking of some of the things I have done in the past, kareokee and me are not a good combination especially after a few snakebites and blackOops. However it is what happens after it that matters. Making a mistake once is human, however learning from it is not stupid.
GallowsCalibrator
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#2427 - 2012-03-27 22:03:18 UTC
Princess Bride wrote:
Danfen Fenix wrote:
Tbf, I actually have a small amount of respect for Mittani atm. Not for his actions at FF, but rather the fact that he has made his apology, done all the correct steps so far, and left it at that. No falling to any baiting, or getting in to forum arguements, just accepting it & taking things as they are, and go, so far

(at least, as it appears atm P )


The silence you hear is the sound of Alex holding his breath and praying silently that when this is over he can still play Eve. Any sign of smugness from him at this point is pretty much a biomass sentence.


Noooo, the silence is the fact that more level-headed approaches are being properly considered before anything happens. You know, like Seleene said earlier. Anything else is pretty much a piece of conjecture.
Danfen Fenix
#2428 - 2012-03-27 22:03:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Danfen Fenix
Princess Bride wrote:
Danfen Fenix wrote:
Tbf, I actually have a small amount of respect for Mittani atm. Not for his actions at FF, but rather the fact that he has made his apology, done all the correct steps so far, and left it at that. No falling to any baiting, or getting in to forum arguements, just accepting it & taking things as they are, and go, so far

(at least, as it appears atm P )


The silence you hear is the sound of Alex holding his breath and praying silently that when this is over he can still play Eve. Any sign of smugness from him at this point is pretty much a biomass sentence.


That may be true, but there are also so many others who would get in to arguements and make things worse P Just the fact that he knows that he should stay silent, for personal gain or not, is better than the opposite.

GallowsCalibrator wrote:

Noooo, the silence is the fact that more level-headed approaches are being properly considered before anything happens. You know, like Seleene said earlier. Anything else is pretty much a piece of conjecture.


And for once I agree with a goon...he has probably also been advised to keep his mouth shut while they (CCP/rest of the CSM) deal with the issue appropriatly.
Abriael VonRosen
State War Academy
Caldari State
#2429 - 2012-03-27 22:04:45 UTC
Yeep wrote:

I think most of the actual (by which I mean rational, unselfishly motivated) disagreement is over what an appropriate consequence is.


Ultimately the room of discussion is limited. The CSM grants a certain amount of personal visibility, influence and advantages. With the perks comes responsibility, and consequence for the breach of that responsibility needs to be unforgiving.

Now that the media got its hands on this mess (and mind you the same should happens if the media didn't, as it should be a matter of principle), the only way for the CSM to keep it's credibility is to remove the offender.

Do we seriously want to be publicly represented by someone that doesn't have the slight sense necessary not to get wasted before a televised panel he has to speak at, during an all expenses paid trip? That seems a rather mindboggling idea to me.
Doddy
Excidium.
#2430 - 2012-03-27 22:10:20 UTC
Abriael VonRosen wrote:

Do we seriously want to be publicly represented by someone that doesn't have the slight sense necessary not to get wasted before a televised panel he has to speak at, during an all expenses paid trip? That seems a rather mindboggling idea to me.


Doesn't bother me, doesn't bother ccp (have you seen oveur vids?), probably doesn't bother many who voted for him. The only issue is what he actually said. Even then If he wasn't a goon this would have blown over already.
GallowsCalibrator
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#2431 - 2012-03-27 22:11:13 UTC
Doddy wrote:
Abriael VonRosen wrote:

Do we seriously want to be publicly represented by someone that doesn't have the slight sense necessary not to get wasted before a televised panel he has to speak at, during an all expenses paid trip? That seems a rather mindboggling idea to me.


Doesn't bother me, doesn't bother ccp (have you seen oveur vids?), probably doesn't bother many who voted for him. The only issue is what he actually said. Even then If he wasn't a goon this would have blown over already.


I forgot about some of Oveur's best. I'm going to have to youtube some.
Kalathia Eginald
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#2432 - 2012-03-27 22:12:23 UTC
Abriael VonRosen wrote:
Ultimately the room of discussion is limited. The CSM grants a certain amount of personal visibility, influence and advantages. With the perks comes responsibility, and consequence for the breach of that responsibility needs to be unforgiving.

Now that the media got its hands on this mess (and mind you the same should happens if the media didn't, as it should be a matter of principle), the only way for the CSM to keep it's credibility is to remove the offender.

Do we seriously want to be publicly represented by someone that doesn't have the slight sense necessary not to get wasted before a televised panel he has to speak at, during an all expenses paid trip? That seems a rather mindboggling idea to me.


How many politicians have been caught with prossies, doing drugs, having an affair, and are still in their seats?

I'd rather be represented by someone who has made a mistake, is willing to admit it and learn from it, otherwise known as a human being, than some of the hollier than thou politicians we get. Whether or not he will learn form it is something that will have to be seen as until it is it is just conjecture that he will.

I can see both side of this argument, as I have no vested interest in either camp, and in the end what will happen will happen and we have to accept it or vote with our money.
GallowsCalibrator
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#2433 - 2012-03-27 22:14:00 UTC
Kalathia Eginald wrote:
Abriael VonRosen wrote:
Ultimately the room of discussion is limited. The CSM grants a certain amount of personal visibility, influence and advantages. With the perks comes responsibility, and consequence for the breach of that responsibility needs to be unforgiving.

Now that the media got its hands on this mess (and mind you the same should happens if the media didn't, as it should be a matter of principle), the only way for the CSM to keep it's credibility is to remove the offender.

Do we seriously want to be publicly represented by someone that doesn't have the slight sense necessary not to get wasted before a televised panel he has to speak at, during an all expenses paid trip? That seems a rather mindboggling idea to me.


How many politicians have been caught with prossies, doing drugs, having an affair, and are still in their seats?

I'd rather be represented by someone who has made a mistake, is willing to admit it and learn from it, otherwise known as a human being, than some of the hollier than thou politicians we get. Whether or not he will learn form it is something that will have to be seen as until it is it is just conjecture that he will.

I can see both side of this argument, as I have no vested interest in either camp, and in the end what will happen will happen and we have to accept it or vote with our money.


This too is a good post.
Lt Pizi
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#2434 - 2012-03-27 22:14:18 UTC
GallowsCalibrator wrote:
Princess Bride wrote:
Danfen Fenix wrote:
Tbf, I actually have a small amount of respect for Mittani atm. Not for his actions at FF, but rather the fact that he has made his apology, done all the correct steps so far, and left it at that. No falling to any baiting, or getting in to forum arguements, just accepting it & taking things as they are, and go, so far

(at least, as it appears atm P )


The silence you hear is the sound of Alex holding his breath and praying silently that when this is over he can still play Eve. Any sign of smugness from him at this point is pretty much a biomass sentence.


Noooo, the silence is the fact that more level-headed approaches are being properly considered before anything happens. You know, like Seleene said earlier. Anything else is pretty much a piece of conjecture.


so true

but then his own corp/ally mates makes all that even worse for him and ccp by all this not even remotely funny posts

Goon Tears are best tears, because they're 25% alcohol by volume!
Sunviking
Doomheim
#2435 - 2012-03-27 22:16:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Sunviking
Mitanni, that was a terrible apology, and so insincere.

You are only saying this to desperately try and stave off any impact it might have on your RL career in Law.
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#2436 - 2012-03-27 22:16:08 UTC
Abriael VonRosen wrote:
Yeep wrote:

I think most of the actual (by which I mean rational, unselfishly motivated) disagreement is over what an appropriate consequence is.


Ultimately the room of discussion is limited. The CSM grants a certain amount of personal visibility, influence and advantages. With the perks comes responsibility, and consequence for the breach of that responsibility needs to be unforgiving.

Now that the media got its hands on this mess (and mind you the same should happens if the media didn't, as it should be a matter of principle), the only way for the CSM to keep it's credibility is to remove the offender.

Do we seriously want to be publicly represented by someone that doesn't have the slight sense necessary not to get wasted before a televised panel he has to speak at, during an all expenses paid trip? That seems a rather mindboggling idea to me.


Actually drunkeness was rather expected, may that never change. He needs to learn how to handle his liquor better though.

The only real questions are:

Are Panel members at FanFest subject to the same restrictions on what they can say as people are in game or on the forums?
Are CSM members subject to the same restrictions on what they can say as people are in game or on the forums?
If so, does this apply at all times or only when acting in their official capacity as CSM members?

If the decision that they apply to anyone speaking at FanFest in person, or at all times to people on the CSM, then the normal rules should apply. Namely a ban whose length should be determined by the circumstance by CCP.

Stepping down from his position as chairman or from the CSM entirely is another matter, but I believe those decisions would be directly affected by the decisions made above... then appropriate PUN-ishments can be determined (if any).

(See, now they are going to be all confused again).



View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.
Lt Pizi
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#2437 - 2012-03-27 22:16:08 UTC
GallowsCalibrator wrote:
Kalathia Eginald wrote:
Abriael VonRosen wrote:
Ultimately the room of discussion is limited. The CSM grants a certain amount of personal visibility, influence and advantages. With the perks comes responsibility, and consequence for the breach of that responsibility needs to be unforgiving.

Now that the media got its hands on this mess (and mind you the same should happens if the media didn't, as it should be a matter of principle), the only way for the CSM to keep it's credibility is to remove the offender.

Do we seriously want to be publicly represented by someone that doesn't have the slight sense necessary not to get wasted before a televised panel he has to speak at, during an all expenses paid trip? That seems a rather mindboggling idea to me.


How many politicians have been caught with prossies, doing drugs, having an affair, and are still in their seats?

I'd rather be represented by someone who has made a mistake, is willing to admit it and learn from it, otherwise known as a human being, than some of the hollier than thou politicians we get. Whether or not he will learn form it is something that will have to be seen as until it is it is just conjecture that he will.

I can see both side of this argument, as I have no vested interest in either camp, and in the end what will happen will happen and we have to accept it or vote with our money.


This too is a good post.


this isnt politics and the csm isnt a democracy

ccp will do whats best for them , and imo that is the banhammer

Goon Tears are best tears, because they're 25% alcohol by volume!
Doddy
Excidium.
#2438 - 2012-03-27 22:17:30 UTC
Sunviking wrote:
That was a terrible apology, and so insincere.

You are only saying this to desperately try and stave off any impact it might have on your RL career in Law.


What career?
Markus Reese
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#2439 - 2012-03-27 22:17:51 UTC
Lt Pizi wrote:
GallowsCalibrator wrote:


Noooo, the silence is the fact that more level-headed approaches are being properly considered before anything happens. You know, like Seleene said earlier. Anything else is pretty much a piece of conjecture.


so true

but then his own corp/ally mates makes all that even worse for him and ccp by all this not even remotely funny posts


Yeah, not sure did I post it here? But in the tweets, Seleene said a few days will be the official statements.

To quote Lfod Shi

The ratting itself is PvE. Getting away with it is PvP.
Voull
Visional
#2440 - 2012-03-27 22:18:43 UTC
I'm new to this game but can tell that if this was anyone else, they would have been banned already.

I don't get why there is so ball fondling for this mittani guy, especially after I watched the video in question from his presentation. You all have to realize he is just some meglomaniac, and that by supporting him you are just enabling him to continue to behave in a socially unacceptable manner.

A lot of you need to step away from the game and reflect on what you're really saying when you try to just let the situation blow over. I am really confused why some continue to say what happened is not noteworthy when even mittani himself has issued a public apology and reprimanded his own actions.

This incident could have been so much worse, but we were fortunate enough it wasn't. Next time, who knows. Being a troll has it's place, and that type of behavior is completely inappropriate for this incident.