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My Apology

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Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
#2101 - 2012-03-27 18:19:44 UTC
Meissa Anunthiel wrote:
First off, it's not something I'd ever say personally and find objectionable because that's not what I do, but I'm not the goonest of the goons either so I also believe one has to keep a sense of proportion and perspective.

The Mittani, CEO of goonswarm and notorious ahole did a presentation, he did so in that quality. While he does also have a seat on the CSM, he didn't act in that capacity anymore than he did act as a lawyer, as an american or as a male. Saying it's the same thing would be akin to saying "American incite others to harass blokes, death to all americans".

Circumstances play a role, it's fanfest where goons spend days pretending to be idiots or griefers. There was also booze involved.

It's blown out of proportion, people would do well to get out of the lynch mentality and analyze the actual damage/impact for a moment before calling for blood, or are we requesting that CCP ban all those who "hoped" CCP Soundwave would die in a fire for InCarna?


Nope but if they had served on the CSM and drunkenly called for Soundwave to be trolled into suicide during a panel at fanfest I'd expect at the absolute minimum they not be allowed to continue as chairman of the CSM.

The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom
David Cedarbridge
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#2102 - 2012-03-27 18:20:16 UTC
Inovy Dacella wrote:
The bottom line is players have been banned for lot smaller offenses. Remember he was speaking infront of an audiance! In an EVE event, on camera! This is a historical debacle of epic proportions! Shocked

If they forgive him it will not be fair to all the other players that got banned. I think it's over, they will kick him out of the game, his sincere apology will not suffice.

Never give a microphone to a drunk person!


I'm sure that some of you don't really get it but "EVE is real" is a marketing catchphrase.
Nacion Allier
Blohm und Voss
#2103 - 2012-03-27 18:21:02 UTC
Seleene wrote:
OFFICIAL: The CSM are discussing recent events and will issue a public statement after a few days.



By showing yourself as a drunken loudmouths the CMS lost all credibility, disband yourself is the only decent thing to do!
Asuka Solo
I N E X T R E M I S
Tactical Narcotics Team
#2104 - 2012-03-27 18:22:19 UTC
This drama cannot be complete without a few unruly protests...

To the space statues!

Eve is about Capital ships, WiS, Boobs, PI and Isk!
Amity Lane
Hek Mining Association
#2105 - 2012-03-27 18:22:46 UTC
Regardless of what may or may not happen in the future, I think we can all safely assume that The Mittani will not be banned for one very simple reason:

10,000 * $15 * 12 = $1,800,000

Unless CCP can comfortably assume that the negative PR (if any) of this incident will cost them more than this, there's no way they'll ban him. To do so would be an idiotic move from a business standpoint.

Besides (as I keep reminding everyone) he hasn't actually broken any rules. There's no reason to ban him from a EULA/TOS perspective, no matter how acceptable his behaviour may or may not have been.
Alaxen
State War Academy
Caldari State
#2106 - 2012-03-27 18:23:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Alaxen
Mittens, your apology might have been believable if you hadn't also been consistently saying the same outside of the Alliance Forum. At the Null Sec round table you got a laugh out of the crowd for talking about "Murdering" newcomers to the game.

The footage of you saying this at the Null Sec round table was filmed as well. Not sure who was filming it.

Given that you're apologizing here and banning people who disagree with you over on Kugu.com, I'm going to go with 'obvious troll'. What?
Jade Constantine
Jericho Fraction
The Star Fraction
#2107 - 2012-03-27 18:25:32 UTC
Jint Hikaru wrote:
Ice Fist wrote:
Meissa Anunthiel wrote:
First off, it's not something I'd ever say personally and find objectionable because that's not what I do, but I'm not the goonest of the goons either so I also believe one has to keep a sense of proportion and perspective.

The Mittani, CEO of goonswarm and notorious ahole did a presentation, he did so in that quality. While he does also have a seat on the CSM, he didn't act in that capacity anymore than he did act as a lawyer, as an american or as a male. Saying it's the same thing would be akin to saying "American incite others to harass blokes, death to all americans".

Circumstances play a role, it's fanfest where goons spend days pretending to be idiots or griefers. There was also booze involved.

It's blown out of proportion, people would do well to get out of the lynch mentality and analyze the actual damage/impact for a moment before calling for blood, or are we requesting that CCP ban all those who "hoped" CCP Soundwave would die in a fire for InCarna?


Look at this Jade, do you see this? This is a good post from a sitting CSM member whose alliance is not friendly with ours, but can make a decision without letting previous history and poor culture assessments as well as a distinct inability to separate Mittens the Goon from Alex the person get in the way of said decision.



Um, the person who sujjested that Soundwave would Die in a fire DID get banned.


And though HB did eventually get unbanned I think its highly unlikely that person's application to stand for CSM would be accepted (you need a history clean of serious warnings).

And this is the whole point really. CSM representatives are SUPPOSED to be held to a higher standard than the rest of the players since they are representing the players in front of CCP and the gaming media. Once you start excusing behaviour that gets ordinary players banned just because the perpetrator is an important internet politician then the whole system is thrown open to question and corruption again and we're back to the bad old days of T20.

The True Knowledge is that nothing matters that does not matter to you, might does make right and power makes freedom
Kara Roideater
#2108 - 2012-03-27 18:25:53 UTC
Seleene wrote:
OFFICIAL: The CSM are discussing recent events and will issue a public statement after a few days.


The body currently headed by The Mittani is discussing recent events involving the behaviour of The Mittani? Cool.
Princess Bride
SharkNado
#2109 - 2012-03-27 18:26:39 UTC
David Cedarbridge wrote:

You're not very good at dodging questions. I'll take your inability to respond to the point as your concession that you have no response. Face it, you and your alts have your hands stuck in the cookie jar and there's no getting out of it. You are the one's making mountains of molehills for your own agendas and you know it. Also, quoting yourself was a pretty stupid move as it makes your motivations very clear as to why you're so attached to the issue of getting more and more punishments heaped on an issue you are in no way directly connected to. I'd suggest you stop trying to dig out of the hole you're in.


How tpb "The Wis" feels about what happened is not the primary issue. It never was. The issue is that what Alex did was reprehensible and unacceptable. If you need an explanation as to why, read Alex's apology where he explains it clearly. Do you agree with Alex on this point, or not?

http://eveprincessbride.wordpress.com/
Alexandra Alt
Doomheim
#2110 - 2012-03-27 18:29:48 UTC
Amity Lane wrote:
Regardless of what may or may not happen in the future, I think we can all safely assume that The Mittani will not be banned for one very simple reason:

10,000 * $15 * 12 = $1,800,000

Unless CCP can comfortably assume that the negative PR (if any) of this incident will cost them more than this, there's no way they'll ban him. To do so would be an idiotic move from a business standpoint.

Besides (as I keep reminding everyone) he hasn't actually broken any rules. There's no reason to ban him from a EULA/TOS perspective, no matter how acceptable his behaviour may or may not have been.


That is exactly one of the moral dilemas CCP is facing, but trust me, if CCP does want to remove him from the picture I'm pretty sure all they need is to ask him to do so in order not to enrage those 10k accounts (not players, accounts) and he'll do so promptly because as seen in his apology, he's responsable enough to do so.
Andrea Roche
State War Academy
Caldari State
#2111 - 2012-03-27 18:30:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Andrea Roche
Here is a few good set of question for CCP...........

Will i get banned for saying someone should kill them selves, just like the MIttani said, will i get banned?
What if i am a CSM, will i still get banned or can i abuse the rules cos i have a star in my jumpwings as a CSM?
Or are we allowed to scorn people now by saying so and so should kill themselves without the risk of been banned?

This is getting interesting Shocked
Ai Shun
#2112 - 2012-03-27 18:30:28 UTC
Amity Lane wrote:
Regardless of what may or may not happen in the future, I think we can all safely assume that The Mittani will not be banned for one very simple reason:

10,000 * $15 * 12 = $1,800,000

Unless CCP can comfortably assume that the negative PR (if any) of this incident will cost them more than this, there's no way they'll ban him. To do so would be an idiotic move from a business standpoint.


It is a fairly big assumption that each and every single Goon will quit the game if the Mittani is banned.
Ice Fist
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#2113 - 2012-03-27 18:31:06 UTC
Kara Roideater wrote:
Seleene wrote:
OFFICIAL: The CSM are discussing recent events and will issue a public statement after a few days.


The body currently headed by The Mittani is discussing recent events involving the behaviour of The Mittani? Cool.


You know, there are like 11 other members? I'm sure they all have something they'd like to say and discuss. Or are the other CSM members incapable of intelligent discussion (based on the evemail I got from Darius I'd say I'm worried about some of them).
Inovy Dacella
Empire Assault Corp
Dead Terrorists
#2114 - 2012-03-27 18:31:36 UTC
Amity Lane wrote:
Regardless of what may or may not happen in the future, I think we can all safely assume that The Mittani will not be banned for one very simple reason:

10,000 * $15 * 12 = $1,800,000

Unless CCP can comfortably assume that the negative PR (if any) of this incident will cost them more than this, there's no way they'll ban him. To do so would be an idiotic move from a business standpoint.

Besides (as I keep reminding everyone) he hasn't actually broken any rules. There's no reason to ban him from a EULA/TOS perspective, no matter how acceptable his behaviour may or may not have been.



Do you honestly think 10,000 players will quit because of one person? And even if they did it would make no difference, he would still be banned. Money will not take part in the decision.
Kara Roideater
#2115 - 2012-03-27 18:31:46 UTC
L00B wrote:
Couple those things with this internet rage machine you seem to be caught in being WAY more mad about this event than the actual person aggrieved, is just pathetic, transparent, and an obvious ploy for nothing but attention cloaked as politics.



You think that a given victim should be the arbiter of how a community feels about these actions? Because if that guy feels ok the same actions could never, ever be repeated towards someone else? Because these actions have absolutely no implications for anyone but that one individual? Sound reasoning, sir!
Yeep
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2116 - 2012-03-27 18:32:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Yeep
Kara Roideater wrote:
Seleene wrote:
OFFICIAL: The CSM are discussing recent events and will issue a public statement after a few days.


The body currently headed by The Mittani is discussing recent events involving the behaviour of The Mittani? Cool.


No you're right, lets have another election.

Kara Roideater wrote:

You think that a given victim should be the arbiter of how a community feels about these actions? Because if that guy feels ok the same actions could never, ever be repeated towards someone else? Because these actions have absolutely no implications for anyone but that one individual? Sound reasoning, sir!


Conversely, if theres no victim this time whats to say there'll be no victim next time. Have some internal consistency in your arguments please.
Kai Tel
State War Academy
Caldari State
#2117 - 2012-03-27 18:33:05 UTC
Meissa Anunthiel wrote:
First off, it's not something I'd ever say personally and find objectionable because that's not what I do, but I'm not the goonest of the goons either so I also believe one has to keep a sense of proportion and perspective.

The Mittani, CEO of goonswarm and notorious ahole did a presentation, he did so in that quality. While he does also have a seat on the CSM, he didn't act in that capacity anymore than he did act as a lawyer, as an american or as a male. Saying it's the same thing would be akin to saying "American incite others to harass blokes, death to all americans".

Circumstances play a role, it's fanfest where goons spend days pretending to be idiots or griefers. There was also booze involved.

It's blown out of proportion, people would do well to get out of the lynch mentality and analyze the actual damage/impact for a moment before calling for blood, or are we requesting that CCP ban all those who "hoped" CCP Soundwave would die in a fire for InCarna?


What’s the point of this stupid ****? Are you trying to tell us Mitty has turned into a pussy and is backing out of his promise to resign? Are you trying to bail your buddy out of a hole? Being drunk isn’t any excuse and you know it. He used his position on a public stage provided by CCP to mock, bully, and attempted to instigate widespread harassment of another player in real life.

That guy that ”hoped” CCP Soundwave died in a fire? Well, he was banned. I guess by that logic Mitty’s fate is a forgone conclusion, right? After all, Mitty didn’t just hope he “encouraged people to bully a guy into committing suicide” in real life…

Why shouldn’t he be banned? This isn’t just a public relations issue this is a company policy issue. **** off and let the big boys sing us their song. They claim to be doing the investigation right now.
Jake Warbird
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#2118 - 2012-03-27 18:33:34 UTC
Ai Shun wrote:
Amity Lane wrote:
Regardless of what may or may not happen in the future, I think we can all safely assume that The Mittani will not be banned for one very simple reason:

10,000 * $15 * 12 = $1,800,000

Unless CCP can comfortably assume that the negative PR (if any) of this incident will cost them more than this, there's no way they'll ban him. To do so would be an idiotic move from a business standpoint.


It is a fairly big assumption that each and every single Goon will quit the game if the Mittani is banned.

Sugar Von MurdererTits : Jake Warbird gets my vote for most intriguing and attractive male character in Eve.
Ntrails
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
#2119 - 2012-03-27 18:33:38 UTC
Alaxen wrote:
Mittens, your apology might have been believable if you hadn't also been consistently saying the same outside of the Alliance Forum. At the Null Sec round table you got a laugh out of the crowd for talking about "Murdering" newcomers to the game.

Given that you're apologizing here and banning people who disagree with you over on Kugu.com, I'm going to go with 'obvious troll'. What?



The ban is for using the word fail in a fashion commensurate with being a bad poster. I think it would be upheld anywhere with even lax standards.
David Cedarbridge
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#2120 - 2012-03-27 18:33:42 UTC
David Cedarbridge wrote:

You're not very good at dodging questions. I'll take your inability to respond to the point as your concession that you have no response. Face it, you and your alts have your hands stuck in the cookie jar and there's no getting out of it. You are the one's making mountains of molehills for your own agendas and you know it. Also, quoting yourself was a pretty stupid move as it makes your motivations very clear as to why you're so attached to the issue of getting more and more punishments heaped on an issue you are in no way directly connected to. I'd suggest you stop trying to dig out of the hole you're in.


How tpb "The Wis" feels about what happened is not the primary issue. It never was.[/quote]

I know it was. As I've already pointed out (and how you seem to like ignoring for convenience), the issue is that you found something public that you could personally feel indignant about and blew it out of proportion and grabbed your pitchfork for a witch hunt. You have an axe to grind. You don't contest this because it is true. I'm ready to hear your backpedaling.

Princess Bride wrote:
The issue is that what Alex did was reprehensible and unacceptable. If you need an explanation as to why, read Alex's apology where he explains it clearly. Do you agree with Alex on this point, or not?


Clearly every statement made in poor taste in or about EVE requires a media circus in the gaming blogs and a 100+ post threadnaught. Since the offense only has a victim in the form of a bunch of angry white knights with agendas and nothing else, I personally find little reason to care about what you find "unacceptable."