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Logoffski exploit, video proof.

First post
Author
Dimitryy
Silent Knights.
LinkNet
#281 - 2012-05-02 19:47:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Dimitryy
Aron Croup wrote:
I like how this is going. Miners and haulers complain for months and years about the volatility of Hulks and Freighters and the low cost of suicide ganking in high-security space, and can barely get a squeek out of CCP.

Pirates fail at killing a freighter, following standard game mechanics and suddenly we have to change the game.

Shows you the priorities doesn't it?



Lets go over this hauler and miner point. When a hauler gets ganked in highsec he CHOOSES to carry his entire bankroll in a bestower. When a miner gets ganked, he CHOOSES to fit no tank/mine in a busy system/fit faction/agress flipper. These people make choices, and suffer the consequences.

Now a freighter CHOOSES to jump into lowsec unscouted, he too has made a choice, but because of this mechanic he does not have to suffer the consequences of his choice. That is what the thread is about.

The idea that people even post about the 'volatility' of hulks and freighters in highsec makes me fear for the future of this game.
Lexmana
#282 - 2012-05-02 19:50:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Lexmana
Aron Croup wrote:
CCP Goliath wrote:
Hi guys,

Posting to let you know that we haven't forgotten about you! GD are super busy right now but they have had a quick discussion on it and will get into it more in-depth once we have our current deployment out of the way I should think. We have all of the opinions and information that we need at this point, so I would urge you all to focus your energies elsewhere pending a response.


I like how this is going. Miners and haulers complain for months and years about the volatility of Hulks and Freighters and the low cost of suicide ganking in high-security space, and can barely get a squeek out of CCP.

Pirates fail at killing a freighter, following standard game mechanics and suddenly we have to change the game.

Shows you the priorities doesn't it?


Priorities are on making the game work in all important aspects: gathering, manufacturing and destruction.
Antihrist Pripravnik
Scorpion Road Industry
#283 - 2012-05-02 23:22:18 UTC
Lexmana wrote:
Aron Croup wrote:
CCP Goliath wrote:
Hi guys,

Posting to let you know that we haven't forgotten about you! GD are super busy right now but they have had a quick discussion on it and will get into it more in-depth once we have our current deployment out of the way I should think. We have all of the opinions and information that we need at this point, so I would urge you all to focus your energies elsewhere pending a response.


I like how this is going. Miners and haulers complain for months and years about the volatility of Hulks and Freighters and the low cost of suicide ganking in high-security space, and can barely get a squeek out of CCP.

Pirates fail at killing a freighter, following standard game mechanics and suddenly we have to change the game.

Shows you the priorities doesn't it?


Priorities are on making the game work in all important aspects: gathering, manufacturing and destruction.


Sadly, it fails in all 3 aspects.
xxxTRUSTxxx
Galactic Rangers
#284 - 2012-05-02 23:48:44 UTC
lol man that guy with the lagging mic, mute it, the guy that logged out and escaped, fair play to him.
be honest, if it was one of your guys and he got away, you'd be saying well done man,, nice one Lol
Beekeeper Bob
Beekeepers Anonymous
#285 - 2012-05-02 23:51:23 UTC
Dimitryy wrote:
Aron Croup wrote:
I like how this is going. Miners and haulers complain for months and years about the volatility of Hulks and Freighters and the low cost of suicide ganking in high-security space, and can barely get a squeek out of CCP.

Pirates fail at killing a freighter, following standard game mechanics and suddenly we have to change the game.

Shows you the priorities doesn't it?



Lets go over this hauler and miner point. When a hauler gets ganked in highsec he CHOOSES to carry his entire bankroll in a bestower. When a miner gets ganked, he CHOOSES to fit no tank/mine in a busy system/fit faction/agress flipper. These people make choices, and suffer the consequences.

Now a freighter CHOOSES to jump into lowsec unscouted, he too has made a choice, but because of this mechanic he does not have to suffer the consequences of his choice. That is what the thread is about.

The idea that people even post about the 'volatility' of hulks and freighters in highsec makes me fear for the future of this game.



Yes, because low skill miners can tank a hulk that will stop anything.....Roll

Not one of them, but your reasoning is faulty....Lol

Signature removed - CCP Eterne

Nephilius
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#286 - 2012-05-03 00:32:16 UTC
RougeOperator wrote:
Spectre80 wrote:



shut up you big baby. bring more firepower



Yeah cause 20 guys taking it to 15% hull in less then 30 seconds is not enough firepower.......


Thats clearly a ridiculous burden to put on the players.

You know what all log offs should have the 15 min rule cause this is freaking broken.




Dude...this is Eve. Stop sniveling, accept the loss and move on. You don't see every fool that got jacked during the Jita Burn posting up, do you? He was not aggressed, the timer does not apply. You didn't get a shiny KM, better luck next time.

Damn bears.
"If."
Mars Theran
Foreign Interloper
#287 - 2012-05-03 00:32:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Mars Theran
How do you know he didn't disco loading the system?

Either way, when a ship that large can be stripped that fast, it means they need at least some fitting capability. Freighters are pathetic.
zubzubzubzubzubzubzubzub
Skex Relbore
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#288 - 2012-05-03 01:12:30 UTC
Tarsas Phage wrote:
Aqriue wrote:
I call it as it is

Butthurt Oops

Cause they planned something, failed to take the fact into consideration of being able to log off as it is currently working, and failed so hard they


The greater issue here is not that there wasn't enough DPS to kill a ~330k EHP ship in under 1 minute, the issue is more of a case of large ships such as freighters, jump freighters, and even orcas being granted risk-free flying when going through gates unscouted or without an escort.

Jump through a gate and see reds/bads? Just CTRL-Q before gate cloak is down and you are pretty much guaranteed to save your ship before you derez. Having to cart around 10 Vindicators to kill a ship like this in < 1 minute is not a realistic expectation, especially if this situation is not expected.

This issue of avoiding combat by using logoff tactics to correct your mistake has even more implication in a wardec setting, where the logged off pilot can be kicked from corp and log back on no-longer a war target and get away scott-free.

/T



Risk free? Really? if that crew had had a bit more dps that freighter wouldn't have had a chance. Period. The fact is the pilot in question made a gamble and he won.

Just because you can sit on a gate for hours on end does not mean you are entitled to a kill. **** happens sometimes you get them sometimes you don't this was a don't the pilot in question got lucky nothing else.

The line is very simple you log off without agro you stay around for 1 minute you log off with agro you stay on for 15 or as long as you're aggressed.

I mean really whiners like you give PVP a bad name. "oh booohooohooo I couldn't kill a ship that had no ******* skills applied can't fit a ******* module and has no way of fighting back in less than a minute with 10 buddies, please oh please CCP make this game easier, it's too hard for me"


The answer is to stop crying and suck less not cry to CCP to compensate for your failings.

BTW you've doubled the amount of EHP a freighter has in your silly whine above , with no skills applied it's around 150k for a freighter and 175k for a JF.

Cloned S0ul
POCKOCMOC Inc.
#289 - 2012-05-03 01:23:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Cloned S0ul
Logoffski exploit, video proof?

Bring more dps and stop talking about expolit, he logoff and after short time he disapere here nothing wrong! i dont see any wrong things in this video, he was almost rip, no wonder he disapere your fleet was in other system before you arrive to grid.
Volaras Shadowfall
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#290 - 2012-05-03 15:25:50 UTC
This is way too many pages to be justified. Can't believe OP is still crying about missing a KM. Fire more lasorz or sit outside Jita if you are that hard up for a freighter. QQ and L2thermodynamics.
ian papabear
No Regard.
#291 - 2012-05-03 15:37:50 UTC
RougeOperator wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USepJOINZKk&feature=g-u-u&context=G2a828a3FUAAAAAAAAAA]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USepJOINZKk&feature=g-u-u&context=G2a828a3FUAAAAAAAAAA


Guy jumps a freighter into low sec.

He logs out before even loading the system.

His freighter decloaks.

One of our guys point it. Thinking we have 15 min to kill it.

Warp in and start shooting it and less the a minute with only 15% hull or so left if that, it just vanishes.

If this is working as intended CCP can get bent.

From the wiki

PvP Log Off Timer (15 Minutes)

The PvP log off timer is triggered by any aggressive action a pilot takes or is taken against him. If a pilot with an active PvP log off timer logs out from the game, his ship will remain in space for at least 15 minutes afterward. If the pilot is shot again after logging off within the 15 minutes, the timer will reset to 15 minutes. This timer will renew for the capsule, should the ship be destroyed.


The wiki indicates its an exploit.



oh you mad becasue you and your carebear buddies camped that gate for like 4 hours and he was the only ship that came through?

.

Benny Ohu
Chaotic Tranquility
#292 - 2012-05-03 15:42:28 UTC
Who bumped this thread?

For those too stupid to understand, just the fact that the OP was clearly posting because he'd wanted the KM doesn't mean this usage of the logoff mechanic isn't unfair

CCP Goliath said they had a look at it and I assume they had a look at it

Now stop posting in this ancient thread that's already far done with for the love of God
Tanya Powers
Doomheim
#293 - 2012-05-04 18:06:16 UTC
Benny Ohu wrote:
Who bumped this thread?

For those too stupid to understand, just the fact that the OP was clearly posting because he'd wanted the KM doesn't mean this usage of the logoff mechanic isn't unfair

CCP Goliath said they had a look at it and I assume they had a look at it

Now stop posting in this ancient thread that's already far done with for the love of God



*hips* moar tears bliz *hips*
Morganta
The Greater Goon
#294 - 2012-05-06 04:58:09 UTC
no exploit here

he logged off while UNAGRESSED
he gets a 1 minute timer

you can't agress someone who is not logged in, so it remains a 1 minute timer even if you shoot him

appears to be working as intended

as someone else pointed out you do have the option to wait for him to come back, and he will come back to the 20k off the gate e was at when he logged.

christsakes, quit being a baby and learn how to deal with the unexpected

yes ironic isn't it, you banked on him not expecting you to be there, and then come and cry on the forums when he does something unexpected in return.

heavy irony
General Aeacus
Doomheim
#295 - 2012-05-09 14:50:11 UTC
Tanya Powers wrote:
*hips* moar tears bliz *hips*
I never get tired of Pirate TearsĀ®.
Gawain Edmond
Khanid Bureau of Industry
#296 - 2012-05-09 15:07:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Gawain Edmond
isn't discussing exploits bad and can get you in lots of trouble? you're ment to do stuff like file a petition wait for a gm to respond then either be happy with the result or appeal and have it moved up to a higher ranking gm to look at to see if the right choice was made anythin else is bad mmmk

edit: apparently not with devs commenting on it and the like wow i fail at reading and stuff today
Feckfor Rufard
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#297 - 2012-05-09 16:24:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Feckfor Rufard
RougeOperator wrote:
Benny Ohu wrote:
Spectre80 wrote:
oh. cripes im sure all of them 10+ tornados would get instapopped by lowsec gateguns in that time of 15 seconds it takes to gank that freighter (really?). or maybe they can do that allready in highsec in that same time sacrificing all the ships at same time but still getting the kill?


This wasn't a suicide gank, I get the idea it was a bit more of a roam. A target was found and a tarp set with the ships they had? (Is this right?)

Those saying the pirates were not doing it right, from what I gather it was not your standard gatecamp because the pirates had to outsmart the scout.

Regardless of that, the point is, if a freighter pilot is dumb enough to jump into a lowsec camp (or the pirates tarp him somehow), should the freighter simply be able to see them from cloak and say, "well if I just log out I have a good chance of surviving"?

This is exactly the sort of thing the 15-minute timer was implemented to stop.



Pretty much.

The rest are just bad trolls.

I want CCP to say that it is the implicit intent to let someone log off to get out of trouble free.





no it was ment to stop supercaps with millions of ehp logging off in the middle of a fight when a fleet of subcaps cant take them down before the old timer ran out and it disappeared from space
GreyReaper
Consolidated Aerospace Technologies
#298 - 2012-05-09 16:29:53 UTC
Every time I see one of these tear threads I wonder why you must jump .5 ly to end up within 15km of a single point every time..
ian papabear
No Regard.
#299 - 2012-05-09 18:33:59 UTC
grr

.

FeralShadow
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#300 - 2012-05-09 19:48:00 UTC
Let me tell you a story, a story about pirates camping an entry system into our area of space. One day these pirates, while doing their usual shenanigans, notice a freighter jumped into their system. We were working our hardest to blockade this area of space to prevent our enemies from gaining reinforcements. We were elated that there was a freighter, likely from our enemies, that jumped randomly into our waiting arms. He decloaked, we pointed, locked, attacked, and then he disappeared.

We were, rightly so, angry. So, we did the only thing that was left to us. While this guy was logged off and doing other things, we had at LEASt 1 person sitting on that stargate 23/7 for the next 3 weeks waiting for this guy to log in. He likely had a neutral alt looking at us every now and then because he never ever logged in. After 3 weeks of waking up early, staying up really late, missing classes and work, we re-evaluated our position. We had poured countless hours into the camping of this stargate for the freighter, our locator agents told us he was still in system, so we knew he hadn't gotten out. But, because the freighter pilot was logged off, he could go do whatever he wanted and waste days and days of our lives while he just checked back every once in a while to see if it was safe. After 3 weeks we just couldn't keep it up, so we went back to our normal routine.

He promptly logged in, warped off, and went on to safety.

Moral of the story? This guy was a complete idiot and jumped unscouted into our camp. He logged off, so we couldn't kill him in time. Then we had to put days of our lives into camping for the freighter, while the target only had to look at our forces every once in a while, and he went and did other stuff. The amount of time we had to invest in killing him was WAY out proportional to the effort he had to do to ensure his complete safety. Camping the system for the freighter to log in just doesn't work because he can just stay offline indefinately until we give up. Additionally there was no way that we could have ever possibly killed him, since he logged out immediately upon jumping in.

It's a broken mechanic. If we're able to aggress before he can warp off, he deserves to die.

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia