Ships & Modules

So you don't need support anymore with the new drake...

So they're more like a certain type of ship that doesn't need so much support. They're better then. Maybe elite pvpers will use these instead.

Okay, so is the enemy using Armor because New Drake can use to Explosive Missiles. If they are using Shield you can use EM Missiles. I will give you a second to adjust your EFT back to the level playing field.


No issue with tank, got it.


6 Second for HAM's to hit to max range. Realistically it is more like 4 in Small gang Ranges so Flight Time is not an Issue.


They will also be great for brawling.

Yes and they do that DPS with 50000k EHP. Drake has much better EHP then that which still translates well into small gangs. DPS isn't everything in a small gang when your opponent can drop you quick because you are paper.

Yes Caldari doesn't have Paper DPS Hammers but that is more Gallente's thing and you don't need them in a small gang it is just a different style, a good tank with good DPS is fine and 570 DPS is fine.

New Drake is fine for Brawling and Small Gangs.

Relevant.


Caldari Blasterdized Rail Boats are about to get a lot better.

That would be a valid view if these were blaster boats primarily. But they are supposed to be fit with Rails and right now Rail DPS without a Damage Bonus is a joke.

Yes they will be made better with Blasters DPS wise but they will loose tank to do so. That evens out the Blaster scenario while making Rails viable.

Right now joke DPS is the reason they are not.

Those "Paper DPS Hammers" known as Brutix's will tank 519dps (890 overloaded) with 38k EHP
Null DPS 511 (541 overloaded)

Since your fit uses a web and warp scrambler that means you're fighting at the Gallente's optimal where it can web and scramble and move in close. So let's use Void

Void DPS 624 (694 overloaded)

As for attempting to "range tank the Brutix" It can move out at 1488 m/s. A bit faster than your Drake. By the way, it's capacitor will last 6 minutes with overloaded reps.

Have fun with those Paper DPS Hammers! My fit doesn't even use damage mods!



P.S. What the reps would look like with some drugs is absolutely scary. Think about all angles here before you blanket judge a ship's abilities.

You sir are making the critical mistake.

You are judging a ship based upon the OTHER ships around it. Again... requiring the Drake (and other Caldari ships) to be gang/fleet ships.

But since you want to run 5v5...


I see no reason why 3 Brutix's vs 5 Drakes will have any trouble tearing your gang apart. Since 3 Brutix's will throw out 2082 dps each of your Drakes is going to last 27 seconds.

Your Drakes put out 2850 dps minus the 890 local tank of each Brutix = 1960 dps to your overall gang. However I am doing this with just 3 ships to your 5. And since repping is a nice way to buy time in gang warfare let's say my 2 Guardians jump the gate.

Now to put it politely you're screwed. Yes two of your Drakes will escape as I cannot hold all five there. Sorry. If we make this a 6v6 I'll bring an Arazu.

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I'm not the one grasping at straws. You're logic is flawed when you must hide it among the dynamic variances of "gang warfare."

Now I wondered how a pilot like you can have such a fantastically limited grasp of PVP to base the judgements you've made. That's when I realized you're in Red vs Blue.

Before you begin lecturing the global EVE community about how a ship's buff/nerfs affect us (most of us don't bother to laugh at you on the forums) please consider that there's a BIGGER world of pvp'ers who do not live in a mutual wardec of epic noobery.

For instance: You haven't factored in the affect of sentry fire. So you've completely excluded lowsec PVP from your equation. Which I find highly odd as lowsec sees more pvp than anywhere else (especially your "small gang PVP").... and it's very proficient pvp too.

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Yes I was being nice. The repps actually gimp the DPS abilities of a Brutix. If you want I'll setup a "Gang Brutix" that will do even more DPS with more buffer as it can rely upon it's other gang mates (the two Guardians) to stay alive. Oh and your Drakes will pop much faster

Has it occurred to you yet that we're comparing a Tier 1 BC gang to a Tier 2 BC gang? And even if you choose to put 2 Scimitars in your gang I still win out of shear DPS. Oh... and don't forget my Brutix's at current state can field 15 EC-600's so your potential logistics are going to be hurting.

So you are judging a gang fight around bringing T2 Ships on one side. Also I really am gonna doubt the 890 Local Tank again against every resist type. you can not get that


You just assume we never use Logi, Battlecruisers, Recons, Battleships and such in RvB or that I never fought in Low Sec before and used Sentry Guns to my Advantage / Been screwed by them before.


So you are exploring every available option for your Gang but not the other way around to prove a point. Pulling fictional numbers like 890 Omni Active Tank and not looking at the whole picture. Multiple Drake Webs for instance puts Rage Missiles in play with heat you can reach 750 DPS for one thing. Or having long points fitted on your buffer ships cuts there speed.

You jump so quickly against the Drake and rely on situation where your gang is guaranteed a win without the Drake Gang using counter tactics that are effective for it. You don't take into account Field positioning, or chasing the primary which is a major, major factor in Gallente Warfare.

All this you wrote is smoke an mirrors when there are Support Ships that can counter your support, Nano Drake Fits that can kite and so on. Combat is way to fluid for your limited example theory crafting and someone so intent on questioning my experience should know this. But the final truth is that 570 DPS and 70k EHP tank is not a bad thing at all for a brawler and it is only one small gang fit available for new Drake.

Sure explosive Hardener on a 5 low slot ship like you know what an enemy is going to be firing.

This is the most **** poor drake fit I've ever seen. Your point is short range, your damage is short range. You come in close and you die. You sir are a dumbass and I'd be happy to prove it in SISI.

I do not fly drakes (did when I was a noob and need a heavy tackle ship) I fly hurricanes. When we went after drakes all we worried about was their tank lasting longer then ours - NEVER their DPS. And you know what - since my cane does 712 dps NON OVERHEATED - has 64K EHP and resists of 80/67/62/63

Overheat and I have 805 dps without implants.

When fighting a drake I used to be worried about their epic tank - making sure I could tank the gate guns long enough to kill the drake. Also while you are comparing things - also note that my armor canes sig radius is is miniscule compared to your drake. Oh and while you are happy about your drake - remember I have open mid slots to use on you.

Drake will never EVER excell as a "brawler" battlecruiser - any who think so are vastly ignorant of other ships in the game.

(numbers taken from actual pilot skills, not maxed. Eat your heart out)

Drake "nerf" considering max skills:

-25% tank
+25% dps (Assuming non-kinetic missiles)
+25% range (all missiles)

So basically, it's now able to truly do omni damage - no other t1 BC can do this (The Hurricane/Cyclone can kind of do this, but not to the same extent) - and is able to viably use HAMs that can hit out to nano range. In a large fleet situation, HMLs can now outreach 1400mm howitzers (Alpha fleets) when it comes to reliable damage (they'll be losing damage to falloff). They do all this while retaining respectable BC ehp. (Just as much resists as other BCs, cept the ferox)

If you think this is a nerf, you rely on them too much for L4 missions...

I think a drake with missle turrets will look like eather wierd or dunb or both