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self destruct changes?
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clamslayer
Doomheim
#21 - 2012-03-23 07:16:18 UTC
Lexmana wrote:
clamslayer wrote:
this is what it boils down to, its an option a player has. if a player exercises that option, and destroy their ship before their enemy does, a kill mail shouldnt be awarded to their enemy.

I guess you still have an option not to self destruct to deny them the killmail ...


...until all their boyfriends show up.
clamslayer
Doomheim
#22 - 2012-03-23 07:17:01 UTC
Terminal Insanity wrote:
clamslayer wrote:

if self destruct is strictly for preventing someone from holding you in position, then why doesn't loot drop?

it denies fit information as well.

there is more to it then what you mentioned

Loot does drop.


unless there was a change in the last month, loot does not drop.
Lord Haur
Star Frontiers
Brotherhood of Spacers
#23 - 2012-03-23 07:17:29 UTC
Instead of a "killmail" you should get a "self-destruct mail". Similar format to killmail, but it should be clear that the ship self-destructed instead of being killed via normal methods.

What should be included:

Player/Ship information, as on current killmails
a flag confirming it as a self-destruction
a readout of the shield/armor/hull % at the time of self-destruct would be nice as well.

List of aggressing parties as on killmails: I'm not sure if damage should be included, but I'm leaning towards it.

List of destroyed mods, as current.


Again, the mail should include flags that it's a self-destruct mail and not a killmail. Same end result (player X lost a ship), different method.
Terminal Insanity
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#24 - 2012-03-23 07:22:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Terminal Insanity
Lord Haur wrote:
Instead of a "killmail" you should get a "self-destruct mail". Similar format to killmail, but it should be clear that the ship self-destructed instead of being killed via normal methods.

What should be included:

Player/Ship information, as on current killmails
a flag confirming it as a self-destruction
a readout of the shield/armor/hull % at the time of self-destruct would be nice as well.

List of aggressing parties as on killmails: I'm not sure if damage should be included, but I'm leaning towards it.

List of destroyed mods, as current.


Again, the mail should include flags that it's a self-destruct mail and not a killmail. Same end result (player X lost a ship), different method.


Should be a regular killmail so it can be easily parsed by current KB's. Just give the "Final Blow" to the guy who lost his ship, or to some kind of non-player name like "Self-Destruct"
Should also include the ammount of damage done at least. Or preferably the ammount of shield/armor/structure Remaining would be nice (Credit where its due etc)

"clamslayer" wrote:
unless there was a change in the last month, loot does not drop.

There are proposals in the Assembly Hall to actually change this function, and make it so loot DOESNT drop. Currently, it does indeed drop. Maybe last time you were just unlucky (or lucky, all relative =p)

"War declarations are never officially considered griefing and are not a bannable offense, and it has been repeatedly stated by the developers that the possibility for non-consensual PvP is an intended feature." - CCP
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#25 - 2012-03-23 07:23:15 UTC
i literally do not care

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
clamslayer
Doomheim
#26 - 2012-03-23 07:25:54 UTC
Terminal Insanity wrote:
Lord Haur wrote:
Instead of a "killmail" you should get a "self-destruct mail". Similar format to killmail, but it should be clear that the ship self-destructed instead of being killed via normal methods.

What should be included:

Player/Ship information, as on current killmails
a flag confirming it as a self-destruction
a readout of the shield/armor/hull % at the time of self-destruct would be nice as well.

List of aggressing parties as on killmails: I'm not sure if damage should be included, but I'm leaning towards it.

List of destroyed mods, as current.


Again, the mail should include flags that it's a self-destruct mail and not a killmail. Same end result (player X lost a ship), different method.


Should be a regular killmail so it can be easily parsed by current KB's. Just give the "Final Blow" to the guy who lost his ship, or to some kind of non-player name like "Self-Destruct"
Should also include the ammount of damage done at least. Or preferably the ammount of shield/armor/structure Remaining would be nice (Credit where its due etc)

"clamslayer" wrote:
unless there was a change in the last month, loot does not drop.

There are proposals in the Assembly Hall to actually change this function, and make it so loot DOESNT drop. Currently, it does indeed drop. Maybe last time you were just unlucky (or lucky, all relative =p)



now i have to log on and douple check whether or not loot drops, if it does the change is very recent, brb


also, no intel should be gathered from a self destructed ship, that is the whole point of scuttling a vessel in the first place.
Pheusia
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#27 - 2012-03-23 07:26:39 UTC
clamslayer wrote:
wtf, why?

its already bad enough that everyone on grid gets the message that you started self destruct, now a killmail for a ship that you didnt kill wtf?

what is the point of self destructing your ship now?

i know, plenty of you chodes who never solo, will start flaming me about self destruct being lame, but how about bring more dps.

this is ******* bullshit




Do you routinely self-destruct rather than admit you lost a fight?
Lord Haur
Star Frontiers
Brotherhood of Spacers
#28 - 2012-03-23 07:27:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Lord Haur
Terminal Insanity wrote:
Lord Haur wrote:
Instead of a "killmail" you should get a "self-destruct mail". Similar format to killmail, but it should be clear that the ship self-destructed instead of being killed via normal methods.

What should be included:

Player/Ship information, as on current killmails
a flag confirming it as a self-destruction
a readout of the shield/armor/hull % at the time of self-destruct would be nice as well.

List of aggressing parties as on killmails: I'm not sure if damage should be included, but I'm leaning towards it.

List of destroyed mods, as current.


Again, the mail should include flags that it's a self-destruct mail and not a killmail. Same end result (player X lost a ship), different method.


Should be a regular killmail so it can be easily parsed by current KB's. Just give the "Final Blow" to the guy who lost his ship, or to some kind of non-player name like "Self-Destruct"
Should also include the ammount of damage done at least. Or preferably the ammount of shield/armor/structure Remaining would be nice (Credit where its due etc)

"clamslayer" wrote:
unless there was a change in the last month, loot does not drop.

There are proposals in the Assembly Hall to actually change this function, and make it so loot DOESNT drop. Currently, it does indeed drop. Maybe last time you were just unlucky (or lucky, all relative =p)

Forgive me if it sounded like I was suggesting a completely new format. The current format would work perfectly well with suitable additions (hp remaining, something to indicate self-destruct, that's about it)

edit:
clamslayer wrote:
also, no intel should be gathered from a self destructed ship, that is the whole point of scuttling a vessel in the first place.


Maybe the fitting etc. shouldn't be included, seeing as there's currently no way of telling what went kablooey. But it would be so much sweeter if it was.
clamslayer
Doomheim
#29 - 2012-03-23 07:34:47 UTC
Pheusia wrote:
clamslayer wrote:
wtf, why?

its already bad enough that everyone on grid gets the message that you started self destruct, now a killmail for a ship that you didnt kill wtf?

what is the point of self destructing your ship now?

i know, plenty of you chodes who never solo, will start flaming me about self destruct being lame, but how about bring more dps.

this is ******* bullshit




Do you routinely self-destruct rather than admit you lost a fight?



since when is self destructing a victory, or a means of not admitting you lost a ship? the ******* ship explodes
clamslayer
Doomheim
#30 - 2012-03-23 07:37:17 UTC  |  Edited by: clamslayer
Terminal Insanity wrote:
Lord Haur wrote:
Instead of a "killmail" you should get a "self-destruct mail". Similar format to killmail, but it should be clear that the ship self-destructed instead of being killed via normal methods.

What should be included:

Player/Ship information, as on current killmails
a flag confirming it as a self-destruction
a readout of the shield/armor/hull % at the time of self-destruct would be nice as well.

List of aggressing parties as on killmails: I'm not sure if damage should be included, but I'm leaning towards it.

List of destroyed mods, as current.


Again, the mail should include flags that it's a self-destruct mail and not a killmail. Same end result (player X lost a ship), different method.


Should be a regular killmail so it can be easily parsed by current KB's. Just give the "Final Blow" to the guy who lost his ship, or to some kind of non-player name like "Self-Destruct"
Should also include the ammount of damage done at least. Or preferably the ammount of shield/armor/structure Remaining would be nice (Credit where its due etc)

"clamslayer" wrote:
unless there was a change in the last month, loot does not drop.

There are proposals in the Assembly Hall to actually change this function, and make it so loot DOESNT drop. Currently, it does indeed drop. Maybe last time you were just unlucky (or lucky, all relative =p)


just self destructed two ships, each fitted and with 4-6 dozen items in the cargo hold, nothing dropped

Edit,after self destructing five fitted and loaded ships, nothing dropped
Myz Toyou
Nekkid Inc.
#31 - 2012-03-23 07:37:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Myz Toyou
I hope this includes generating lossmails from cowards SDing their **** inside forcefields ( best would be to remove this option completely though ). If you live as a WH pvp corp/alliance you have not much to fight over other then what could possible drop from SMAs and CHAs, so you have the pain to reinforce their tower and then looking at them SDing all their ships like cowards inside the FF rather then fighting for their WH.

GG CCP if this makes it on the server.

edit: If you at please also remove insurance payout for SDing. If I blow up my car with dynamite I´m sure my Insurance Agency wont pay me.
clamslayer
Doomheim
#32 - 2012-03-23 07:40:20 UTC  |  Edited by: clamslayer
Myz Toyou wrote:
I hope this includes generating lossmails from cowards SDing their **** inside forcefields ( best would be to remove this option completely though ). If you live as a WH pvp corp/alliance you have not much to fight over other then what could possible drop from SMAs and CHAs, so you have the pain to reinforce their tower and then looking at them SDing all their ships like cowards inside the FF rather then fighting for their WH.

GG CCP if this makes it on the server.


i dont understand why its seen as cowardly to deny an enemy your assets, it is tactical decision.

self destruct shouldnt be changed, if anything there shouldnt be a warning to everyone on grid that so and so initiated self destruct.
Endeavour Starfleet
#33 - 2012-03-23 07:42:01 UTC
They said nothing about preventing loot dropping. SD to deny your enemies phat loot is a good idea still.
March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#34 - 2012-03-23 07:46:23 UTC
Shogun Archer wrote:
May as well just self destruct before the fight even starts if you think you are gonna lose.

I mean whats stopping you from self destructing right at the point where you get scrammed?

Seems kinda cowardly and petty to me. Are you seriously that concerned about your killboard status?

It's more about pissing off the victors in the engagement isn't it? That's like something a smart assy 12 year old
would do to his dad. Just die like a man.


we speak about sandbox didn't we?Roll

Oh, sorry. i missed the point when you said "killmail e-peen online" Oops

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
Myz Toyou
Nekkid Inc.
#35 - 2012-03-23 07:51:52 UTC
clamslayer wrote:


i dont understand why its seen as cowardly to deny an enemy your assets, it is tactical decision.

self destruct shouldnt be changed at all.


Its fine if they dont want to hand over their ships and stuff, they should rather fight for it. 14 days ago I saw 12 cap ships being SDed inside a FF. I dont know why they did that as we only had 3 dreads in their system so they could have easily put up a fight with a big chance of takeing our caps down.

Hello to "Revival of the Talocan Empire" Lol
clamslayer
Doomheim
#36 - 2012-03-23 07:57:48 UTC
Myz Toyou wrote:
clamslayer wrote:


i dont understand why its seen as cowardly to deny an enemy your assets, it is tactical decision.

self destruct shouldnt be changed at all.


Its fine if they dont want to hand over their ships and stuff, they should rather fight for it. 14 days ago I saw 12 cap ships being SDed inside a FF. I dont know why they did that as we only had 3 dreads in their system so they could have easily put up a fight with a big chance of takeing our caps down.

Hello to "Revival of the Talocan Empire" Lol


it really doesnt matter what their motives were
Rico Minali
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#37 - 2012-03-23 08:00:53 UTC
clamslayer wrote:
wtf, why?

now a killmail for a ship that you didnt kill wtf?





But you did kill the ship, by forcing the playet to self destruct. Stop being bad at everything.

Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing.
clamslayer
Doomheim
#38 - 2012-03-23 08:05:41 UTC
Rico Minali wrote:
clamslayer wrote:
wtf, why?

now a killmail for a ship that you didnt kill wtf?





But you did kill the ship, by forcing the playet to self destruct. Stop being bad at everything.



laying the final blow is a lot different then a player self destructing... and everyone knows it.
Zarnak Wulf
Task Force 641
Empyrean Edict
#39 - 2012-03-23 08:06:02 UTC
Waaaaah!!! My killboard efficiency! Waaaah!!!
Rico Minali
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#40 - 2012-03-23 08:14:08 UTC
clamslayer wrote:
Rico Minali wrote:
clamslayer wrote:
wtf, why?

now a killmail for a ship that you didnt kill wtf?





But you did kill the ship, by forcing the playet to self destruct. Stop being bad at everything.



laying the final blow is a lot different then a player self destructing... and everyone knows it.



Killmails are nothing to do with final blows though, its simply a record of who made explode, and by forcing tehm to self destruct, you made them explode. If Im shooting you and you cant win so you press self destruct then it is because of me, not because you didnt like your ship and didnt want it anymore.

Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing.