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Crime & Punishment

 
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GMs - Please weigh in on the boomerang maneuver. Exploit (y/n)?

First post
Author
Herr Wilkus
Aggressive Salvage Services LLC
#121 - 2012-03-24 10:13:44 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
Herr Wilkus wrote:

I was just shooting down a stupid reactive carebear idea. "LOL, I know! Make it so they cannot warp out after a gank! That will fix it!" When really, there is nothing here to fix....


Selective thinking here:


Herr Wilkus wrote:

It might surprise a bonehead like yourself, but given a choice, I'd prefer to warp off! Its better than having to sit there locked down by Concord for 15 seconds, while an interceptor closes in to snag my pod. Because I prefer not to be podded.


It might surprise you but given a choice, the ganked guy would have preferred to not lose ship and pod to you.
Yet he's the carebear and you aren't one?


Herr Wilkus wrote:

Another news flash: I also prefer to be able to keep my mods, rather than let a random Orca or frigate steal them from me. Not really 'scared' of it as you claim. At this moment, I've got somewhere between 110 and 120 T2 Tornados fit and ready to gank in 5 different ice systems. I don't even count the T2 Catalysts.


Again, this is risk aversion. If you do a gank you take the responsibility that comes with it. Else you are as carebear and actually cheating because you gank with a setup not with an empty hull thus you shall lose the setup or get castigated by a GM.



But currently, there is nothing preventing ANYONE from warp scrambling or podding me. Thats what being a -10 in highsec means. Duh. And currently, if I wait around, NPCs will eventually show up and do your work for you.

There is ample time for ANYONE to get a lock on a -10 ganking Tornado, and warp scramble it, and try to pod.

Thus - I put myself in a position to be podded every single gank....so don't talk to me about 'Risk Aversion'.

Why you haven't explained is: Why do you need Concord to do it for you?

I still haven't seen a single cogent argument that explains why gankers need to be locked in place by Concord the instant they shoot.

"Because we want to pod you." "Because you are a dirty ganker and you somehow 'deserve' to lose your stuff."...isn't an argument.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#122 - 2012-03-24 10:59:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Herr Wilkus wrote:

But currently, there is nothing preventing ANYONE from warp scrambling or podding me. Thats what being a -10 in highsec means. Duh. And currently, if I wait around, NPCs will eventually show up and do your work for you.


And that was YOUR choice to become -10 and still come in hi sec.


Herr Wilkus wrote:

There is ample time for ANYONE to get a lock on a -10 ganking Tornado, and warp scramble it, and try to pod.


Let me time how much ample time somebody gets when you warp from an unknown safespot to the "bookmark ship" close to the target, lock it up and start firing. What's it, all of 5 seconds?


Herr Wilkus wrote:

Thus - I put myself in a position to be podded every single gank....so don't talk to me about 'Risk Aversion'.


I have seen some hi sec gank videos (one right on GD this morning) sporting a guy taking 5 seconds to warp off his pod after the gank.
That's not risk taking, that's being bad. Even in my small PvP experience I learned spamming warp to celestial so it takes a SEBO tackler to still get the pod.


Herr Wilkus wrote:

Why you haven't explained is: Why do you need Concord to do it for you?

I still haven't seen a single cogent argument that explains why gankers need to be locked in place by Concord the instant they shoot.


I never leave a station anymore (can't really play and I just trade) so I am not so touched by this at all. But I can give you the cogent argument.

The cogent argument is: Because CCP Decided So.
And by signing their EULA you accepted it.
Tallian Saotome
Nuclear Arms Exchange Inc.
#123 - 2012-03-24 11:04:49 UTC
Christ, if you take a whole 5 seconds to warp out your pod, which insta-warps, you deserve to lose it.

And he can't lock you much faster than you can lock him, after all, so you can point him, have a tank to survive his first volley(hopefully) and concord will be there and take over.

Inappropriate signature removed, CCP Phantom.

Kelvan Hemanseh
Hole Exploitation Inc.
#124 - 2012-03-24 12:45:49 UTC
Prince Kobol wrote:
Read the the OP's post, couldn't be bothered ready the replies.

Short answer... No



If only you had a red tag that said GM.
Bacon Tree
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#125 - 2012-03-24 21:59:17 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:

The cogent argument is: Because CCP Decided So.
And by signing their EULA you accepted it.


Which passage be dat!
Bacon Tree
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#126 - 2012-03-24 22:11:44 UTC
An for da record here, starting a police chase during a crime spree and endin it off wit a spectacular explosion, some good gameplay dere let me tell ya. I wonder if anyone ever make a game 'bout dat.
Herping yourDerp
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#127 - 2012-03-25 03:37:45 UTC
definitely an exploit, basically you can kill dozens of ships in different areas before your death.
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
#128 - 2012-03-25 04:24:30 UTC
Sahara Uhuru wrote:

Possibility A) You gank someone and while (or directly after that) a friend shoots down your ship so you get your insurance.


No, you do not get insurance. We tested this back in December after Crucible launched.

1. Had my corp mates lock me up and get ready to fire.
2. I attempted to gank one of their alts.
3. They destroyed me before CONCORD arrived.
4. No insurance ISKies.
ceyriot
Carebear Educational Services
#129 - 2012-03-25 05:47:18 UTC
Several people have voiced opinions on changing GCC behavior. What about the implications of such in lowsec?

Personally, I feel the 'nado boomerang is a well-thought out maneuver that isn't an exploit, as long as you lose the ship eventually. (which happens, by all accounts).

However, I don't think using orca fitting service while on GCC should be allowed. Just feels a little too far, in my opinoin.

Good job on coking up the boomerang though Twisted

Not Flyinghotpocket's alt. At all.

Faction Warfare is like Fight Club. But with spaceships.

Herr Wilkus
Aggressive Salvage Services LLC
#130 - 2012-03-25 17:09:41 UTC
Herping yourDerp wrote:
definitely an exploit, basically you can kill dozens of ships in different areas before your death.


Totally inaccurate statement by an obvious troll alt.

Unless you care to back it up with an actual demonstration.....

No, didn't think so.
Care Bear Flair
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#131 - 2012-03-30 03:54:28 UTC
Let's get some official response on this, so we can hear the tears of all the griefers who think this is pvp.
54a
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#132 - 2012-03-30 04:51:37 UTC
Bump. Need an official response please CCP!
Zombo Brian
Doomheim
#133 - 2012-03-30 08:32:45 UTC
simple as that, concord needs an instant lock time and warp scramble for 200km, whoever attacks people in high MUST die and should not be able to get away in ANY way
ScooterPuff Sr
Shenanigans Mining Hub
#134 - 2012-03-30 08:48:44 UTC  |  Edited by: ScooterPuff Sr
Herping yourDerp wrote:
definitely an exploit, basically you can kill dozens of ships in different areas before your death.


This is not an exploit in any way. there are ways you can defend yourself. if you elect not to do so that is your problem. not ours. it takes skill do execute this. and its pretty fun.
you know whats funny.


watching it happen.
ScooterPuff Sr
Shenanigans Mining Hub
#135 - 2012-03-30 08:52:43 UTC
Zombo Brian wrote:
simple as that, concord needs an instant lock time and warp scramble for 200km, whoever attacks people in high MUST die and should not be able to get away in ANY way


that. is one of the dumber things i've heard. do you want your missions to be unscannable also so you can run them in 100% safety too?
Zombo Brian
Doomheim
#136 - 2012-03-30 09:06:55 UTC
ScooterPuff Sr wrote:
Zombo Brian wrote:
simple as that, concord needs an instant lock time and warp scramble for 200km, whoever attacks people in high MUST die and should not be able to get away in ANY way


that. is one of the dumber things i've heard. do you want your missions to be unscannable also so you can run them in 100% safety too?


remember when some players tanked concord some while back?

CCP declared that as an exploit and made concord unbeatable at that time

also you compare apples to eggs there, hitting on players should not be safe at all, not even if it takes skill (what exactly takes skill on that anyway? warp in, shoot, warp out, warp back in, shoot, hope to warp out before concord locks you)

you sir, have no idea how ganking in highsec works

no, you are still not 100% safe in highsec, because people can kill you, BUT THEY NEED TO DIE AFTER THAT from concord

that is eve's law
ScooterPuff Sr
Shenanigans Mining Hub
#137 - 2012-03-30 09:11:43 UTC
Zombo Brian wrote:
ScooterPuff Sr wrote:
Zombo Brian wrote:
simple as that, concord needs an instant lock time and warp scramble for 200km, whoever attacks people in high MUST die and should not be able to get away in ANY way


that. is one of the dumber things i've heard. do you want your missions to be unscannable also so you can run them in 100% safety too?


remember when some players tanked concord some while back?

CCP declared that as an exploit and made concord unbeatable at that time

also you compare apples to eggs there, hitting on players should not be safe at all, not even if it takes skill (what exactly takes skill on that anyway? warp in, shoot, warp out, warp back in, shoot, hope to warp out before concord locks you)

you sir, have no idea how ganking in highsec works

no, you are still not 100% safe in highsec, because people can kill you, BUT THEY NEED TO DIE AFTER THAT from concord

that is eve's law

they do die to concord. i'm quite familiar with the mechanics. far more familiar with them than you are. stop raging. if you got a problem with how it works i heard that checkers is alot safer and free
Zombo Brian
Doomheim
#138 - 2012-03-30 09:14:40 UTC
no, you can avoid concord totally, you just need to warp around 15 minutes and are fine, look into the "al freighters must die" thread, it is entirely possible, you are just feared for the nerfing bat to hit you

if tanking concord is an exploit, this is, too

just give concord instalock allready
ScooterPuff Sr
Shenanigans Mining Hub
#139 - 2012-03-30 09:14:58 UTC
you must be familiar with the system security rating, you know.. that thing. 1.0 -.5 being high sec, and concord response times reflecting system's stat.
end of story. stay in 1.0 and wish granted
Zombo Brian
Doomheim
#140 - 2012-03-30 09:16:40 UTC
its not about concord reacting too slow to warp in its them reacting too slow when they are allready at the crime scene

how else do you explain kills from solo tornados on freighters?