These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Miners, an endangered species.
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Rico Minali
Sons Of 0din
Commonwealth Vanguard
#21 - 2012-03-20 08:09:47 UTC
TravisWB wrote:
And these people were not bots, Bots are only in null, mining ABC around the clock.
Veldspar bots? Ice Bots, are you freaking STUPID?.



Possibly th emost stupid thing I have seen on the Eve-Os for a very long time.

Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing.
Adunh Slavy
#22 - 2012-03-20 10:27:23 UTC
The whole suicide gank thing has gotten out of hand, more often I am encountering less than year old players who've gotten hit one too many times and are ready to quit.

Bump barges, indies, freighters and Orca HP by two to three times and it will put an end to a lot of this. If there needs to be a cost balance for that, bump build requirements by two to three times as well. It still leaves space plenty dangerous, still plenty of aggro games people can play with cans and wrecks, lame use of neut RR and cheesy Orca docking bay games.

The scam situation is not much better.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt
Sevena Black
The Black Redemption
#23 - 2012-03-20 11:00:06 UTC
Miners are indeed an endangered species. I also believe the reason is the suicide ganking as already mentioned.

The most defensible barge out there is an exhumer by the name "Hulk". I've lost 2 of them to a 7 man destroyer gang. Nothing I could do. I saved a third by warping in time by sheer luck of already being aligned. Since I dont mass mine with all three but actually lost them 1 at a time I also stopped mining. If I cant do anything while at my keyboard looking at my screen, then I'm moving on to other income methods.

Any barge but a hulk isnt even worth buying imho. They'll die even faster.

I havent really mined outside barges except for the Osprey. In the old days people would mine in Abbadons or Rokhs. Maybe they're a more viable optiuon these days and ages?
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#24 - 2012-03-20 11:19:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Krixtal Icefluxor
Ladie Harlot wrote:
TravisWB wrote:
The base of the Eve economy is vanishing.


Mining isn't the base of the Eve economy.



The New Player Tutorial quite clearly states IN PRINT that "Mining is the Backbone of EVE and its Economy".

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#25 - 2012-03-20 11:22:19 UTC
Cipher Jones wrote:
miners are scum


Then lick us clean with your voluptuous tongue.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
J3ssica Alba
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#26 - 2012-03-20 11:23:02 UTC
TravisWB wrote:
Link is repaired.

Isk faucet known as incursions and no miners added together equals runaway inflation.




Your eyes, my sig 
This is my signature. There are many others like it, but this one is mine.  Without me, my signature is useless. Without my signature, I am useless
Mutnin
SQUIDS.
#27 - 2012-03-20 11:24:13 UTC
As someone whom has been suicide ganking Ice Miners lately I can tell you, you are extremely nieve if you really think there are no botters in high sec. The ice belts are littered with bots.

When I can go up to a "miner" sitting next to an Orca bump him all over the place, target him, try to convo but always get the same message "you are not allowed to convo "random bot name" get no response to anything even in local. Meanwhile at the same time I'm cargo scaning his hull and watching the Ice being move to the Orca.


Come back and gank him, watch his pod warp off to the station while the other 2 or 3 Macks + the Orca stay in the belt waiting for their turn to be ganked. No, of course it's a legit player than can manage to warp his pod to the station & empty his cargo to his Orca while being AFK..

While suicide ganking of "Miners" is IMO a problem, that is not what killed the Mining profession making it a worthless past time. Bots did that long before because CCP let them run rampant.

IMO it kinda sucks that real miners don't really have a defense to ganking, but with out the ganking there would be even more bots in this game.

CCP needs to do more about the botting issue and then change up the Mining profession and add some ships that are more capable of defending them selves but perhaps mine a lower yield or something. I've always thought CCP missed the boat with the T3 cruisers and industry roles.

CCP could do things like add new sub system that can only be bought from ORE LP store that turn T3's into heavily tanked & covert Mining Barges with some sort of done bonus for defense. In trade they so be required to manually adjust things somehow while mining in order to weed the bots out from using the ships.

This way real players have an alternative and a ability to continue to mine and have a ship that would be capable of going into low sec to ninja mine but also better suited to avoid high sec ganks.
Rico Minali
Sons Of 0din
Commonwealth Vanguard
#28 - 2012-03-20 11:25:18 UTC
Miners just need to smarten up, it really isnt hard. Corp mining ops anyone? Have a repping BS sit with you, make it cap stable and you dont even have to watch it. You dont even need expensive ships use T1 logi cruisers.

I think what people are complaining about is that it isnt safe to solo afk mine. This is true. If your not afk and you see a combat ship warp in close or approach you, then warp off. But if you are in groups then how hard would it be for 10 hulks to be solidly repped by two or three t1 logi cruisers or a couple of 8 hislot BSs?

Dont whine, adapt, make the people who prey on you sad, make them quit suicide ganking because YOU made them stop not because you cried until CCP changed the rules. I know which I would feel better about.

It is an MMO, if you work in teams you will survive, adapt, be stronger than your opposition. How sad would they be if your 10 Hulks were defended by a pair of cap stable perma armour repping Domi's with heavy shield repping drones prelaunched and running on everyone? Fit a DC 2 and a plate, make those hulks hard. Carry shield or armour repping drones and have them perma repping a buddy, now you are solidly spider tanked and your hulks are near invulnerable. What if you also had an insta locking Cane with you, their suicided ship now also results in a player involved lossmail, and we all know how we value our stats...

Quitting is for quitters, be smarter than your enemy.

Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing.
Serge Bastana
GWA Corp
#29 - 2012-03-20 11:30:22 UTC
TravisWB wrote:

And these people were not bots, Bots are only in null, mining ABC around the clock.
Veldspar bots? Ice Bots, are you freaking STUPID?


You're talking out of your arse, try harder next time. There are bots in high sec and have been for a long time.

WoW holds your hand until end game, and gives you a cookie whether you win or lose. EVE not only takes your cookie, but laughs at you for bringing one in the first place...

Vito Antonio
Doomheim
#30 - 2012-03-20 11:34:35 UTC
Ganking is certainly a problem, but it isn't the most important one that hurts miners.

1. Bots.
2. Drone alloys.
3. Then comes ganking.

Drone alloys are getting removed(reduced?) so its a start, although botters arent going anywhere. So I wouldn't bother with mining. Run incursions and enjoy the flow of isk in your wallet.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#31 - 2012-03-20 11:36:50 UTC
Interesting how most of the respondants with 'advice' are NOT MINERS nor have they EVER BEEN.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Popular Jack
Log Et Billot
#32 - 2012-03-20 11:39:29 UTC
Rico Minali wrote:
Miners just need to smarten up, it really isnt hard. Corp mining ops anyone? Have a repping BS sit with you, make it cap stable and you dont even have to watch it. You dont even need expensive ships use T1 logi cruisers.

I think what people are complaining about is that it isnt safe to solo afk mine. This is true. If your not afk and you see a combat ship warp in close or approach you, then warp off. But if you are in groups then how hard would it be for 10 hulks to be solidly repped by two or three t1 logi cruisers or a couple of 8 hislot BSs?

Dont whine, adapt, make the people who prey on you sad, make them quit suicide ganking because YOU made them stop not because you cried until CCP changed the rules. I know which I would feel better about.

It is an MMO, if you work in teams you will survive, adapt, be stronger than your opposition. How sad would they be if your 10 Hulks were defended by a pair of cap stable perma armour repping Domi's with heavy shield repping drones prelaunched and running on everyone? Fit a DC 2 and a plate, make those hulks hard. Carry shield or armour repping drones and have them perma repping a buddy, now you are solidly spider tanked and your hulks are near invulnerable. What if you also had an insta locking Cane with you, their suicided ship now also results in a player involved lossmail, and we all know how we value our stats...

Quitting is for quitters, be smarter than your enemy.


Interesting point, honestly.

However, spending this kind of time and ressources, while very wise, seems a waste when you consider that you could spend them on non-industrial activities that pay a lot more.

Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#33 - 2012-03-20 11:41:23 UTC
Rico Minali wrote:
Miners just need to smarten up, it really isnt hard. Corp mining ops anyone? Have a repping BS sit with you, make it cap stable and you dont even have to watch it. You dont even need expensive ships use T1 logi cruisers.

I think what people are complaining about is that it isnt safe to solo afk mine. This is true. If your not afk and you see a combat ship warp in close or approach you, then warp off. But if you are in groups then how hard would it be for 10 hulks to be solidly repped by two or three t1 logi cruisers or a couple of 8 hislot BSs?

Dont whine, adapt, make the people who prey on you sad, make them quit suicide ganking because YOU made them stop not because you cried until CCP changed the rules. I know which I would feel better about.

It is an MMO, if you work in teams you will survive, adapt, be stronger than your opposition. How sad would they be if your 10 Hulks were defended by a pair of cap stable perma armour repping Domi's with heavy shield repping drones prelaunched and running on everyone? Fit a DC 2 and a plate, make those hulks hard. Carry shield or armour repping drones and have them perma repping a buddy, now you are solidly spider tanked and your hulks are near invulnerable. What if you also had an insta locking Cane with you, their suicided ship now also results in a player involved lossmail, and we all know how we value our stats...

Quitting is for quitters, be smarter than your enemy.



You have NEVER mined a unit of ORE ever.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#34 - 2012-03-20 11:43:53 UTC
Rico Minali wrote:
Miners just need to smarten up, it really isnt hard. Corp mining ops anyone? Have a repping BS sit with you, make it cap stable and you dont even have to watch it. You dont even need expensive ships use T1 logi cruisers.

I think what people are complaining about is that it isnt safe to solo afk mine. This is true. If your not afk and you see a combat ship warp in close or approach you, then warp off. But if you are in groups then how hard would it be for 10 hulks to be solidly repped by two or three t1 logi cruisers or a couple of 8 hislot BSs?

Dont whine, adapt, make the people who prey on you sad, make them quit suicide ganking because YOU made them stop not because you cried until CCP changed the rules. I know which I would feel better about.

It is an MMO, if you work in teams you will survive, adapt, be stronger than your opposition. How sad would they be if your 10 Hulks were defended by a pair of cap stable perma armour repping Domi's with heavy shield repping drones prelaunched and running on everyone? Fit a DC 2 and a plate, make those hulks hard. Carry shield or armour repping drones and have them perma repping a buddy, now you are solidly spider tanked and your hulks are near invulnerable. What if you also had an insta locking Cane with you, their suicided ship now also results in a player involved lossmail, and we all know how we value our stats...

Quitting is for quitters, be smarter than your enemy.


This is only viable on paper.
Nobody, NOBODY will waste his time or effort to put up a defense fleet like that. It's just not worth it and not worth the bother.

Plus you are talking to the poorest, newbies, lowest level layer of players in game, that is exactly those who don't know about this stuff, don't have the time for this stuff, don't have the money for this stuff.

Don't go to Nigeria to teach how good is having an iPad. They can't even afford to eat.

Also, the income is so awfully BAD that all this plating this plating that get Orca here get repping Domi there just won't happen. They get 5M per hour (ice) with all out thin tank and maximum yield and can play for 2h a day yet you suggest a months long investment plan?

There is only one solution and it's to go farm incursions. It's the new purple level.

Those who can't? We did not want those new players anyway.

EvE Online portal | EvE markets tutorials
Popular Jack
Log Et Billot
#35 - 2012-03-20 11:46:47 UTC
The change in the risk/reward factor plus the economy inflation, notably because of incursion, seems to be what affect the most the miners.
Dane Eham
Negative Density
#36 - 2012-03-20 11:47:29 UTC
No belts, more grav sites. It'll hamper bots and provide some level of security against gankers. Everybody wins!
Tallian Saotome
Nuclear Arms Exchange Inc.
#37 - 2012-03-20 11:49:12 UTC
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Rico Minali wrote:
Miners just need to smarten up, it really isnt hard. Corp mining ops anyone? Have a repping BS sit with you, make it cap stable and you dont even have to watch it. You dont even need expensive ships use T1 logi cruisers.

I think what people are complaining about is that it isnt safe to solo afk mine. This is true. If your not afk and you see a combat ship warp in close or approach you, then warp off. But if you are in groups then how hard would it be for 10 hulks to be solidly repped by two or three t1 logi cruisers or a couple of 8 hislot BSs?

Dont whine, adapt, make the people who prey on you sad, make them quit suicide ganking because YOU made them stop not because you cried until CCP changed the rules. I know which I would feel better about.

It is an MMO, if you work in teams you will survive, adapt, be stronger than your opposition. How sad would they be if your 10 Hulks were defended by a pair of cap stable perma armour repping Domi's with heavy shield repping drones prelaunched and running on everyone? Fit a DC 2 and a plate, make those hulks hard. Carry shield or armour repping drones and have them perma repping a buddy, now you are solidly spider tanked and your hulks are near invulnerable. What if you also had an insta locking Cane with you, their suicided ship now also results in a player involved lossmail, and we all know how we value our stats...

Quitting is for quitters, be smarter than your enemy.



You have NEVER mined a unit of ORE ever.

I have, in high, low, and now run mining ops in null, and Rico knows what he is saying. Every word is true(tho the shield drones would be countered with smartbombs).

You are willfully ignorant, and most never going to succeed in this game if you don't get smart.

HTFU or contract me your stuff.

Inappropriate signature removed, CCP Phantom.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#38 - 2012-03-20 11:51:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Krixtal Icefluxor
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:

This is only viable on paper.
Nobody, NOBODY will waste his time or effort to put up a defense fleet like that. It's just not worth it and not worth the bother.

Plus you are talking to the poorest, newbies, lowest level layer of players in game, that is exactly those who don't know about this stuff, don't have the time for this stuff, don't have the money for this stuff.


I agree about the Defences thing, but the other part ?..........2 year player here with 3 Bill ISK.


Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:

Don't go to Nigeria to teach how good is having an iPad. They can't even afford to eat.

Also, the income is so awfully BAD that all this plating this plating that get Orca here get repping Domi there just won't happen. They get 5M per hour (ice) with all out thin tank and maximum yield and can play for 2h a day yet you suggest a months long investment plan?


An Orca can be filled by 2 Macks in an hour easily, and that is 22 million at least, NOT 5 Mill.

Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:

There is only one solution and it's to go farm incursions. It's the new purple level.

Those who can't? We did not want those new players anyway.


I assume these last 2 comments are an attempt at sarcasm ????

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#39 - 2012-03-20 11:53:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Krixtal Icefluxor
Tallian Saotome wrote:
[I have, in high, low, and now run mining ops in null, and Rico knows what he is saying. Every word is true(tho the shield drones would be countered with smartbombs).

You are willfully ignorant, and most never going to succeed in this game if you don't get smart.

HTFU or contract me your stuff.



Who are U ? QuestionQuestion I must be doing well with my own Corp, POS, daily income of 350,000,000, 3 Bill in bank, and no losses to ganks in OVER A YEAR.

I am patheti-fail I guess. Lol

Why don't YOU HTFU or contract me your stuff.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Adunh Slavy
#40 - 2012-03-20 11:57:14 UTC
Rico Minali wrote:

stuff



This post above is a load of bunk.

For one, it's not a profitable way to mine. Over supply from drone alloys and rat loot are responsible for that. Secondly, this tendancy of some of the Eve community to blame the victim is the typical battle cry of the gankbear class.

Hopefully the removal of drone alloys and perhaps the eventual removal of rat loot, and some inceasing consumption of minerals by other means, will alter the cost benift ratio against the gankbears.

No one is arguing that space should be safe, it should like wise not be safe for gankbears to have it as easy as they do either.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt