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I'm Really Not Sure This Is The Game For Me Anymore.
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Indahmawar Fazmarai
#21 - 2012-03-14 14:37:43 UTC
Nova Fox wrote:
I mean seriously the quicker you learn how to stop being a victim the beter this game gets.


Why, of course, in addition to have a PVP alt, she must train her miner alt to be as good as a PVP alt in case it gots kill rights on a hisec ganker...

Very smart you are, sir. Very smart. Roll
Abyss Azizora
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#22 - 2012-03-14 14:38:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Abyss Azizora
I must admit, it's rare to see someone go that long "without" being suicide ganked, especially a miner. Funny thing about the so-called interdiction is that the bots already adapted to use perma-run shield/armor transfers, and now use propper tanks, making them almost immune to removal via-suicide ganking. (And the ones they do lose to malestrom BS volleys are easily replaced.) And yet players still haven't. Lol

Edit: On a positive note, I hear word of transferable kill-rights for fixing much of the risk-free suicide ganking problem. Hell people may actually pay you for the ability to gank the gankers in the near future. That should offset much of the losses.
Ana Vyr
Vyral Technologies
#23 - 2012-03-14 14:43:13 UTC
Mr John22ta wrote:
Ana Vyr wrote:
CCP's in a bit of a bind in that if they now institute anti-ganking rules of any kind in an attempt to hold onto players like you, they'll lose subs in droves when all the sociopathic tear harvesters quit in disgust.


CCP has already introduced "anti-ganking" incentives in the removal of insurance for those that are killed by Concord. This is as far as they will go, as they both encourage and support these types of behaviors. The reason they support it is because it's part of what make's Eve Eve. CCP isn't "in a bind" because of this, if anything it's due to the "softening" of the game through things like PVE and Barbies in space.



Yeah, those were some awesome anti-ganking incentives, LOL. Personally, I don't care a bit about how harsh the game is because that's what makes it EvE, so I completely agree with you there. But then CCP and the community needs to stop crying about sub numbers, because the game isn't going to grow mainstream with folks running around blowing up peoples assets for no reason other than to humiliate them and see if they'll cry.

EvE will always be a niche game, and that suits me just fine. I bet CCP wouldn't agree though, as evidenced by their awkward attempts to make the game more appealing to non hard core PvPers with features like WiS. All I'm saying is that CCP can't have it both ways.
Hexus Draidin
Intersteller Masons
#24 - 2012-03-14 14:43:39 UTC
It's simple, really. Never undock a ship without expecting to lose it the moment you undock. Every time you undock , do your thing and dock again safely will be a pleasant surprise. You've been lucky to avoid suicide ganking for so long in EVE, but this is one of those lessons that you need to learn. Everything you have in EVE can and probably will be scammed, destroyed, or stolen from you.

I'm So Meta, Even This Acronym 
TheBlueMonkey
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#25 - 2012-03-14 14:48:26 UTC
Estrelita Nobunaga wrote:
I've been playing for nearly 3 years, and have 4 accounts now

I've lost between 50 and a hundred ships all together

Yesterday this character qualified for a Mackinaw, so I fitted one for her and she went ice mining in Agal with a Mammoth for hauling. She didn't even finish a cycle before the Mackinaw was gone and the Mammoth was at 80% armor

I guess I was lucky that Concord responded so quickly

I'm not sure that I've ever been ganked before, but, for some reason, this bothered me more than any other ship loss that I can remember

The other character involved was from 2005, and had a 2.1 Concord sec status. Probably had a lot of experience doing this kind of thing, because he/she/it was pretty slick

There are parts of this game that I enjoy. PvP isn't one of them. Especially not this type

So what options do I have? One week of kill rights. That's a big help for a miner. If I went looking for the ganker, what are the chances that I could catch up to him, and, if I did, I doubt that there would be a happy ending for me

So I'm not sure I'm going to keep playing. It seems to me that the game has changed since I started playing, and that the type of player that it attracts is changing, too. That part I blame on CCP. I think they have more control over the type of player the game attracts than most people think. But, let's face it. They do have to make a profit in order to support Hilmar's grand schemes

The question for me right now is: Do I want to try to keep playing the parts of the game that I like in spite of the quality of the other players

As I said. I really don't know. I do know that losing 4 more accounts is not going to have any noticeable effect on CCP, and that what I say in this is not going to have any effect on the players that I object to

This is the only public way that I have to express my dissatisfaction with the players and the trends I see. It's not the game. It's the players.



Join a decent 0.0 alliance and mine in peace

That's my constructive bit

My less constructive post is HTFU
Darth Tickles
Doomheim
#26 - 2012-03-14 14:50:50 UTC
Ana Vyr wrote:
EvE will always be a niche game, and that suits me just fine. I bet CCP wouldn't agree though, as evidenced by their awkward attempts to make the game more appealing to non hard core PvPers with features like WiS. All I'm saying is that CCP can't have it both ways.


This I agree with. However, I think there is a grey area alternative in that people can learn to like the niche aspect of Eve, given the right amount of time and progression structure. Some people love Eve and are natural customers, some people hate it and will never last more than 5 days, yet in the middle is a huge range of people that might grow to be loyal customers and dedicated players given the right set of experiences as they play the game initially. I think that`s where CCP needs to focus its efforts to expanding the playerbase. They`ve got a solid niche identity, they just need to learn to create an environment where people can go from having their hands held to enjoying the freedom of a harsh sandbox game.

I think Eve is cutting edge, and that more and more games will take on some of the foundational characteristics that make Eve what it is. It`s just right now the vast majority of gamers are used to heavily structured and low-consequence games. However, I believe there is also a growing dissatisfaction with these games, it`s just people haven`t learned to identify that it`s this very handholding and excessive structure that makes these games boring and ultimately unsatisfying.
Lyron-Baktos
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2012-03-14 14:50:51 UTC
there is nothing wrong with being a 100% miner as long as you enjoy it so don't listen to people who try to tell you otherwise.

Regarding your gank, try to figure out what you did wrong or if you did nothing wrong, figure out what you can do to make yourself safer. pay more attention to local/scanner, add more gank/speed to your ships to help you escape quicker, don't mine in the same spot too long etc etc

I will say I don't agree with suicide ganking. takes the "realness" out of it
Doddy
Excidium.
#28 - 2012-03-14 14:52:39 UTC
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
Nova Fox wrote:
I mean seriously the quicker you learn how to stop being a victim the beter this game gets.


Why, of course, in addition to have a PVP alt, she must train her miner alt to be as good as a PVP alt in case it gots kill rights on a hisec ganker...

Very smart you are, sir. Very smart. Roll


It takes like 5 days to make a miner pvp capable. Anyway kill rights (which last much longer than a week btw) are not to be wasted on a pvp ship, you wait for him to go fly past in a hauler full of goodies.
THE L0CK
Denying You Access
#29 - 2012-03-14 14:52:54 UTC
Garnoo wrote:
can i get your stuff? Shocked



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0VcppiFP4sc

Do you smell what the Lock's cooking?
Rico Minali
Sons Of 0din
Commonwealth Vanguard
#30 - 2012-03-14 15:03:24 UTC
Estrelita Nobunaga wrote:
I've been playing for nearly 3 years, and have 4 accounts now


The other character involved was from 2005, and had a 2.1 Concord sec status. Probably had a lot of experience doing this kind of thing, because he/she/it was pretty slick

It seems to me that the game has changed since I started playing, and that the type of player that it attracts is changing, too. That part I blame on CCP. I think they have more control over the type of player the game attracts than most people think.


.



Now I dont want to look like im trolling you because I am not. So you have been playing for 3 years, the guy who killed you has been playing for 7 years, you are cross about the type of people the game attracts now. The guy who killed you is over twice your age, so does that mean you are the type of person teh game attracts now and he was the original type? Am I reading this wrong?

You have been playing 3 years and only ganked once, and now. Thats actually pretty good. Ganking miners has been going on since miners have existed, this is no new thing, and to be honest I dont think it is any more prolific now than it was when you started 3 years ago if you take out the ice interdiction (which was a valid in game tactic that was used by a major power to get a specific result).

So really, I think you are somehow redirecting your real issues with eve onto this one small event.

Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing.
Calliste Orange
House Orange
#31 - 2012-03-14 15:06:20 UTC
There is something you can do to help your plight if it is a viable option, give or take.

Try to locate your nearest or dearest Faction Warfare corp who has an Indy division (they're out there) and ask to sign up with them for potential mutual gain. Their miners, if they have them, contend with griefers and war targets simultaneously. Sometimes they'll have a standing guard -but it's better that they don't if they're simply mining ice or low-ends.

Why?

Because like them, you'll soon appreciate the need for a sort of sixth sense -which will come soon enough - the need for constant attentiion to your surroundings at all times, a dozen tips and tricks and, for added value -not infrequent excitement. You will lose covetors and macks of course, but the experience will sharpen over time and you will lose less of them.

I've been doing this for a while now, and there is simply no better teacher than FW mining as to how to increase survival odds, sometimes quite dramatically -solo. If you have a FW corp guard, so much the better -but solo teaches you more, at least at first. Haven't lost a mack yet.

Give it a try.
Shogun Archer
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#32 - 2012-03-14 15:09:28 UTC
Morganta wrote:
anyone else find it highly ironic that the OP took the last name of one of Japan's greatest WARlords to shoot rocks for 3 years?
Pirate



This

If you run into more than 2 a**holes in a day, you should probably look in the mirror.
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#33 - 2012-03-14 15:10:15 UTC
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:
Nova Fox wrote:
I mean seriously the quicker you learn how to stop being a victim the beter this game gets.


Why, of course, in addition to have a PVP alt, she must train her miner alt to be as good as a PVP alt in case it gots kill rights on a hisec ganker...

Very smart you are, sir. Very smart. Roll


dear sir and/or ma'am

Skill points do not dictate who kills who on the battlefield.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.
Lexmana
#34 - 2012-03-14 15:24:36 UTC
Estrelita Nobunaga wrote:
I've been playing for nearly 3 years, and have 4 accounts now
/.../
I'm not sure that I've ever been ganked before, but, for some reason, this bothered me more than any other ship loss that I can remember

Let me get this straight. You were ganked for the first time in 3 years over 4 accounts and thats it. You quit!!

Kids these days.
Pheusia
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#35 - 2012-03-14 15:24:53 UTC
Nova Fox wrote:
I mean seriously the quicker you learn how to stop being a victim the beter this game gets.
gfldex
#36 - 2012-03-14 15:26:44 UTC  |  Edited by: gfldex
Estrelita Nobunaga wrote:
It seems to me that the game has changed since I started playing, and that the type of player that it attracts is changing, too.


The first Player I ever ganked out of a belt was Blue Flame back in 2005. I was in a Thorax and he was in a Cyclone (properly tanked that one).

The game has changed. A Thorax would not be able to gank a Cyclone these days. And the player base has changed too. We had a good laugh back then. Today there is whining when a ship explodes.

If you take all the sand out of the box, only the cat poo will remain.
gfldex
#37 - 2012-03-14 15:29:23 UTC
Calliste Orange wrote:
Because like them, you'll soon appreciate the need for a sort of sixth sense -which will come soon enough - the need for constant attentiion to your surroundings at all times, a dozen tips and tricks and, for added value -not infrequent excitement.


Dude, not paying attention to the screen (because you don't have to) is the point of ice mining. That's why ppl are doing something that boring.

If you take all the sand out of the box, only the cat poo will remain.
Henry Haphorn
Killer Yankee
#38 - 2012-03-14 15:33:42 UTC
I'm sorry to hear about your loss, but I disagree with your claim that Eve Online has changed in regards to high-sec suicide ganking. Such a mechanic has always been around since CCP first created Eve Online. It's that no one noticed it until some time later on when someone decided to go on a crusade using this mechanic.

The only reason CCP didn't stop this practice is because it brings in a whole new level of player-driven content that has a great impact on the New Eden economy. Now we have corporations that specialize in ganking for profit whether to solely corner a market, go after the faction mods fitted on miners, or to claim a system or region for themselves.

In addition, this form of player-driven content has even encouraged some miners to adapt and even look for systems where ganks could happen so that they can make a profit from the loss of another miner's ship or whenever a ganker needs a new ship. I do this all the time and I always make a profit every time some ganker tries to gank me with the ship that I made and sold to them.

It also keep miners from getting bored with their profession. Imagine if no one ganked a miner... ever in Eve Online. The profession would grow boring and profits would not be made because less ships are destroyed. Ganking has taken away that boredom and has replaced it with suspense. The fear that you might be next, that the next belt you go to might be the last belt your exhumer could ever visit and that all that you invested in could go *poof* in an instant. Fear, adrenaline, suspense, surprise. It never ends and I love it.

Adapt or Die
Sasha Azala
Doomheim
#39 - 2012-03-14 15:34:14 UTC
Calliste Orange wrote:
Because like them, you'll soon appreciate the need for a sort of sixth sense -which will come soon enough - the need for constant attentiion to your surroundings at all times, a dozen tips and tricks and, for added value -not infrequent excitement. You will lose covetors and macks of course, but the experience will sharpen over time and you will lose less of them.




You do realise the op has been playing for about 3 years?

How long does it take to aquire this sixth sense?
MeBiatch
GRR GOONS
#40 - 2012-03-14 15:34:31 UTC
Estrelita Nobunaga wrote:
I've been playing for nearly 3 years, and have 4 accounts now

I've lost between 50 and a hundred ships all together

Yesterday this character qualified for a Mackinaw, so I fitted one for her and she went ice mining in Agal with a Mammoth for hauling. She didn't even finish a cycle before the Mackinaw was gone and the Mammoth was at 80% armor

I guess I was lucky that Concord responded so quickly

I'm not sure that I've ever been ganked before, but, for some reason, this bothered me more than any other ship loss that I can remember

The other character involved was from 2005, and had a 2.1 Concord sec status. Probably had a lot of experience doing this kind of thing, because he/she/it was pretty slick

There are parts of this game that I enjoy. PvP isn't one of them. Especially not this type

So what options do I have? One week of kill rights. That's a big help for a miner. If I went looking for the ganker, what are the chances that I could catch up to him, and, if I did, I doubt that there would be a happy ending for me

So I'm not sure I'm going to keep playing. It seems to me that the game has changed since I started playing, and that the type of player that it attracts is changing, too. That part I blame on CCP. I think they have more control over the type of player the game attracts than most people think. But, let's face it. They do have to make a profit in order to support Hilmar's grand schemes

The question for me right now is: Do I want to try to keep playing the parts of the game that I like in spite of the quality of the other players

As I said. I really don't know. I do know that losing 4 more accounts is not going to have any noticeable effect on CCP, and that what I say in this is not going to have any effect on the players that I object to

This is the only public way that I have to express my dissatisfaction with the players and the trends I see. It's not the game. It's the players.


honestly you should be minning in 0.0 its pretty safe there... make sure you use comms to check for incomming peeps...

but tbh highsec is a death trap for minners...

well untill ccp comes out with the 5th subsystem set for tech III ships then you can return to high sec...

There are no stupid Questions... just stupid people... CCP Goliath wrote:

Ugh ti-di pooping makes me sad.