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Lowsec
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Caleb Seremshur
Bloodhorn
Patchwork Freelancers
#1 - 2012-03-14 08:08:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Caleb Seremshur
I had an interesting thought about the game while I was on the way to buy a new bed today

People on the forums frequently claim that lowsec offers no incentive to reside in, no incentive to mission in and poses too much risk for too little reward. So I began to think about things that already exist in the game and how to fit them into the lowsec regions to make them more exciting

First off

1. Faction patrols. Lowsec is in empire space, to assume that the extent of their efforts would be limited to gate-guns is quite redundant when looking at how many stations the SPROT/Megacorps have in lowsec. Surely these stations aren't just there because it suits them? Surely they must be defended

Therefore I propose that lowsec systems with a rating of 0.4 and 0.3 have patrols around the gates. Pirates who enter these systems must fight these patrols before they can warp off. Periodicly they will also have a group of faction police spawn on them

Before the tears start to flow let me propose that these spawns do certain things. They drop faction ammo, the leader is an elite spawn with a good chance (15%?) of dropping a faction module. They obviously drop tags also. These spawns shall be tough, and have HP and damage similar to what a player could output. This will discourage farming them by solo players. Group sizes should be between 3 and 6 ships of varying hull class

Throughout the day complexes should open up also. Call them 'flashpoints' or whatever. Warping to this flashpoint will show a small group of the regional faction police fighting against a randomly determined pirate invasion. Notably the pirates should have a much larger fleet e.g. 6 police vs 25 pirate ships. The pirate ships shall have HP and damage similar to what a player can output and drop faction ammo plus modules (but only up to the lowest faction grade ie pithi-c type)

Conversely in 0.2 and 0.1 systems the reverse is true. Pirates will camp all gates, scramble and web etc etc and have damage outputs/hp similar to a player.

There shall be pirate stations in these systems. Pirates shall patrol the system with their vessels (and yes I do mean droneboat rattlesnakes, ashimmu's and whatevers) and they shall drop faction ammo and have any elite leader units drop faction modules periodicly.

These lowsec systems shall also have flashpoints. The reverse shall also be true. Empire spawns of, for example 25 ships vs 6 pirate vessels.

Lowsec systems shall be subject to FW from pirates as well, which players can elect to join officially and fight for. Therefore it is possible to have pirate players capturing territory for pirate factions and earning LP to spend in pirate stores with faction tags. The tags they collect shall be relative to the faction the other FW player was aligned with. For example, it will become possible to upgrade a scorpion to a rattlesnake provided that x-volume caldari and x-volume gallente tags are acquired

Similarly Empire LP stores shall offer more powerful modules that will require pirate tags in addition to their traditional enemy empire tags. I see no reason why the caldari navy, with its mega-corp support and legions of workers is out-classed technologically by pirate factions who control ant-hills of territory in space.

That's the first of my ideas.

Hit me.
Serene Repose
#2 - 2012-03-14 08:16:40 UTC
I kinda agree with this. Getting off scott free is boring. Making the sovereigns over even low sec where they have stations make some effort to enforce their sovereignty I've been screaming about for years. It's specious not to. However, providing a risk/reward process for the pirates that would seek safe harbor where there's supposed to be enforced sovereignty might satisfy my angst about them getting a free ride altogether...claiming they run risks...tsk tsk.

Have the cops come after 'em and if they can handle the shootout, goodies all around. But, you know the low sec pirates won't like it 'cause they'll at last have to put some effort into their chosen career, and we all know they prefer to faceroll and call it skill, so they'll squeal like stuck pigs over this one.

We must accommodate the idiocracy.
Caleb Seremshur
Bloodhorn
Patchwork Freelancers
#3 - 2012-03-14 11:29:15 UTC
74 views and only 1 reply?

Not even any trolling?

Is this too ambitious, just plain bad? Noone wants to discuss this?
Jace Errata
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#4 - 2012-03-14 11:34:27 UTC
Not sure about the "pirates camping all gates" part. It'd make getting into null a *****, and that's not necessarily a good thing.

tweeten

One day they woke me up so I could live forever

It's such a shame the same will never happen to you
Rico Minali
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2012-03-14 11:36:25 UTC
Sadly you probably wont get a hell of alot of response to this, so many people have wanted lowsec to be made good, several threads were made, notably a thread named OUTLAW by myself that had huge amounts of information and ideas from many sources, teh support for it was phenominal.

It was completely ignored by ccp, GMs, devs alike. Mynxee (where is she now?) headed up a panel of those notables in lowsec who were well known for one reason or another, and given the go ahead to create a lowsec upgrade ideas package to give to ccp. It went nowhere, as everythign else to do with lowsec has.

Most of us got so sick of the lack of any new or decent content in lowsec we went off to live elsewhere. My coro has been living in nullsec for ages now, even though were were born and bred lowsec. Sadly I dont think you will get anyone to listen to you.

Look up teh old thread OUTLAW (if it can still be found) see the support it got, and see how it was ignored and tehn abandoned by us too eventually as a bad cause.

Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing.
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#6 - 2012-03-14 11:39:27 UTC
Lowsec is very much fine imho, but anything that adds flesh to the world of EVE is cool.

Realistic and dynamic NPC interaction is probably the weak spot of New Eden. Co-operating with all factions could happen much more

I'd also like to see dynamic sec status calculated from both NPC and player kills (dependent on pilot sec status). Lowsec border zones would be volatile, player efforts could make 0.4 to 0.5, and vice versa.

But then again, I'd like Incursions do the same, but change seems to be something that many EVE players don't handle too well.

.
Maluscious Melody
The First Foundation
Legion of xXDEATHXx
#7 - 2012-03-14 11:41:05 UTC
I like it!
Sasha Azala
Doomheim
#8 - 2012-03-14 11:43:24 UTC
I like your line of thinking, although stopping solo players farming in favour of group farming does not really work for me, as farming is farming regardless of who does it. Might even drive some of the low-sec people back into high-sec.
Karn Dulake
Doomheim
#9 - 2012-03-14 11:47:57 UTC
Sounds like a reasonable addition. The only problem would be for solol pvpers
I dont normally troll, but when i do i do it on General Discussion.
War Kitten
Panda McLegion
#10 - 2012-03-14 11:48:56 UTC
Caleb Seremshur wrote:
74 views and only 1 reply?

Not even any trolling?

Is this too ambitious, just plain bad? Noone wants to discuss this?


Ambitious and bad?

Your 0.1 - 0.2 flashpoints are belts - pirates patrol them. They also spawn/warp to gates at times.

Lowsec is lowsec because the faction police don't go there. If they did, it would be highsec.

RP reasons: Why would the factions be risking their military constantly in systems they cannot control and in systems that Concord has abandoned? It would be a waste of resources.

When Concord was killable, people killed concord. If your faction police are killable, people will kill them, especially if they drop faction loot, and you haven't really increased any safety for the people you're trying to lure into lowsec. You're just providing more reward and more risk on the gates for the folks already there.

What you'd end up with are more lowsec gatecamps because now there are rats to kill for profit while waiting to gank hapless travellers.

It's interesting, and I wouldn't oppose having more "rats" to shoot at, whatever faction they belong to, but I just think its a neat idea in search of a problem to solve. In the end you're really just adding more dumb AI to shoot at in lowsec.

I don't judge people by their race, religion, color, size, age, gender, or ethnicity. I judge them by their grammar, spelling, syntax, punctuation, clarity of expression, and logical consistency.
Grumpymunky
Monkey Steals The Peach
#11 - 2012-03-14 12:34:55 UTC
I think the real issue here is, what happened to your old bed?

Post with your monkey.

Thread locked due to lack of pants.
St Mio
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2012-03-14 12:49:30 UTC  |  Edited by: St Mio
Some interesting ideas here Idea

For the NPCs camping lowsec gates and only shooting -5 / GCC, I can see it deterring solo/smaller gang/less dedicated campers if they're anything like the Incursion gatecamping rats in lowsec.

I greatly disagree with them dropping faction modules though, since the gatecampers already have a 50% chance of getting modules from players they gank. I don't think they should have free faction rats spawning and dropping them loot while everyone else has to hunt for exploration signatures and run the entire site and pray for drops at the end.

We need more incentive for players to fight at locations that aren't gates if you want more people in lowsec.

And then on the other hand, I'm not sure that it's the right thing to do by adding NPCs to do what the players themselves should be doing; I'd much rather there be a buff to players policing pirates (also, fix bounties). It does however make space seem more "alive", especially so if you have two opposing NPC factions fighting each other.

As for pirate FW, we've nagged CCP for this before and I definitely recall them saying "No." at the time.
Vertisce Soritenshi
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2012-03-14 12:51:09 UTC
I read the whole post and I am confused by one thing...what does getting a new bed have to do with any of this?

Bounties for all! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2279821#post2279821
Bischopt
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2012-03-14 12:57:57 UTC
Caleb Seremshur wrote:


Therefore I propose that lowsec systems with a rating of 0.4 and 0.3 have patrols around the gates. Pirates who enter these systems must fight these patrols before they can warp off. Periodicly they will also have a group of faction police spawn on them

Before the tears start to flow let me propose that these spawns do certain things. They drop faction ammo, the leader is an elite spawn with a good chance (15%?) of dropping a faction module. They obviously drop tags also. These spawns shall be tough, and have HP and damage similar to what a player could output. This will discourage farming them by solo players. Group sizes should be between 3 and 6 ships of varying hull class


must fight these patrols before they can warp off? So basically you want to force PvE on every outlaw that enters a 0.3 or 0.4 system. That would make traveling so difficult people would just quit. If I want faction rats that drop faction loot, I go look for them.

IMO gate guns and station guns are dangerous enough and they do their job well.
Skydell
Bad Girl Posse
#15 - 2012-03-14 13:25:19 UTC
Bischopt wrote:
Caleb Seremshur wrote:


Therefore I propose that lowsec systems with a rating of 0.4 and 0.3 have patrols around the gates. Pirates who enter these systems must fight these patrols before they can warp off. Periodicly they will also have a group of faction police spawn on them

Before the tears start to flow let me propose that these spawns do certain things. They drop faction ammo, the leader is an elite spawn with a good chance (15%?) of dropping a faction module. They obviously drop tags also. These spawns shall be tough, and have HP and damage similar to what a player could output. This will discourage farming them by solo players. Group sizes should be between 3 and 6 ships of varying hull class


must fight these patrols before they can warp off? So basically you want to force PvE on every outlaw that enters a 0.3 or 0.4 system. That would make traveling so difficult people would just quit. If I want faction rats that drop faction loot, I go look for them.

IMO gate guns and station guns are dangerous enough and they do their job well.


They used to be. A Huginn and Muninn shrug gate guns. it's backed by lore, they are the 'vandals' of EVE but low sec can be compared to battle cruisers. They aren't a cruiser and they aren't a battleship. With low sec, you get one thing trying to be two and that's a proverbial 'fail fit' in EVE. Just like the Battle cruiser, some low sec systems in EVE got "command ship" status and are usefull but most just float like ghost ships.
Jace Errata
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#16 - 2012-03-14 13:43:05 UTC
Skydell wrote:
Just like the Battle cruiser, some low sec systems in EVE got "command ship" status and are usefull but most just float like ghost ships.

Um. Tier 2 battlecruisers are among the most used ships in EVE. Analogy failure.

tweeten

One day they woke me up so I could live forever

It's such a shame the same will never happen to you
Jennylicous
Doomheim
#17 - 2012-03-14 13:53:50 UTC
I think a quick and easy solution is to have L4 Q20 agents in lowsec, and have L4 Q5 and lower in high sec. Reduce the no risk high reward incentive of high sec incursions, and I think you would have a larger populace in lowsec. I don’t think there’s a need to come up with new game mechanics to beef up lowsec. Just make some tweaks to the existing system.
Nick Bison
Bison Industrial Inc
Cat Scratch Fevers
#18 - 2012-03-14 13:58:18 UTC
I do believe that LowSec is probably the highest risk and lowest reward in Eve.

To that end, the OP puts forth a couple possible remedies that are unique.
Gonna have to mull them over before I can respond intelligently.

In any case, LowSec definitely needs some serious love.

Nothing clever at this time.
Ana Vyr
Vyral Technologies
#19 - 2012-03-14 14:26:27 UTC
Doesn't this entirely kill off the lone wolf style of pirating in lowsec?
Serge Bastana
GWA Corp
#20 - 2012-03-14 14:29:29 UTC
Bischopt wrote:
Caleb Seremshur wrote:


Therefore I propose that lowsec systems with a rating of 0.4 and 0.3 have patrols around the gates. Pirates who enter these systems must fight these patrols before they can warp off. Periodicly they will also have a group of faction police spawn on them

Before the tears start to flow let me propose that these spawns do certain things. They drop faction ammo, the leader is an elite spawn with a good chance (15%?) of dropping a faction module. They obviously drop tags also. These spawns shall be tough, and have HP and damage similar to what a player could output. This will discourage farming them by solo players. Group sizes should be between 3 and 6 ships of varying hull class


must fight these patrols before they can warp off? So basically you want to force PvE on every outlaw that enters a 0.3 or 0.4 system. That would make traveling so difficult people would just quit. If I want faction rats that drop faction loot, I go look for them.

IMO gate guns and station guns are dangerous enough and they do their job well.


My thoughts exactly, it would hinder movement around low sec, and since those with negative sec status have enough problems moving around, since low sec is separated by high sec in some cases, you'd be causing more problems for them than they already have.

I doubt this will get much support to be honest, certainly not from anyone who moves around in low sec much.

WoW holds your hand until end game, and gives you a cookie whether you win or lose. EVE not only takes your cookie, but laughs at you for bringing one in the first place...

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