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Harbinger, fast L3 missions - how to fit?

Author
Coveted
Yellow Consortium
#1 - 2012-03-13 20:49:34 UTC
Hello everyone

I'm currently moving from my coercer/L2 into L3 missions (amarr corps/space) and the bonuses on the Harbinger seems to make it the "go-to" for missions, as I prefer gank over tank (dead ships don't hurt, etc). However, I'm having some issues deciding on the fit, since the difference in power requirements make it hard to switch between pulses and beams on the fly and the two weapon systems have one very blatant issue each (to me)

In short, my problem is: when fitting with pulses I can't actually get enough range on it to make it worthwhile, while beams instead end up with so bad DPS that it's laughable. In fact, I'd say that my Coercer currently has better and more applicable DPS (for L2s) than I get with either weapon system on the harbinger (for L3s). By that I mean that I either get good DPS; or applicable DPS. I don't get good and applicable DPS.

So, my questions to you guys are as follows: Should I fit pulses or beams on my Harbinger and how would you fit it with either? Should I use something else? I can fly Gallente as well, but I cannot shield tank nor use T2 medium hybrids of either kind, so it'd introduce a bump in my training time (10 days-ish), and the myrmidon seems to lack offensive power (though possibly higher applicable DPS).
Andrea Griffin
#2 - 2012-03-13 21:02:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Andrea Griffin
If you can use T2 Pulse Lasers, then use the pulse lasers with Scorch crystals. You'll have plenty of range. If you cannot use T2 pulse lasers, then go with beams for range. Consider something like this:

[Harbinger, Low Skill L3 Runner]
Medium 'Accommodation' Vestment Reconstructer I
N-Type EM Hardener I
N-Type Thermic Hardener I
Damage Control II
Extruded Heat Sink I
Extruded Heat Sink I

'Orion' Tracking CPU I, Optimal Range
'Orion' Tracking CPU I, Optimal Range
Experimental 10MN Afterburner I
Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Cap Booster 800

Focused Modulated Medium Energy Beam I, Multifrequency M
Focused Modulated Medium Energy Beam I, Multifrequency M
Focused Modulated Medium Energy Beam I, Multifrequency M
Focused Modulated Medium Energy Beam I, Multifrequency M
Focused Modulated Medium Energy Beam I, Multifrequency M
Focused Modulated Medium Energy Beam I, Multifrequency M
Focused Modulated Medium Energy Beam I, Multifrequency M
[empty high slot]



Hobgoblin I x5

Rigs to taste; I would go with damage rigs, personally. Should be able to get 300 DPS easily with mediocre skills. Swap all of the named stuff for T2 where applicable - I don't know what your skills are like. If you can fit the larger beams, go for it.

In a mission with lots of up-close targets you can swap the AB for a web and use tracking speed scripts in the tracking computer instead of range scripts.

Myrmidon is also a decent ship for missioning, with a solid armor tank. If you tank according to the damage you'll be taking, much of the time you can enter a L3 mission, get full-room aggro, release your drones then go AFK for a while.

You DO NOT need to gimp yourself with Capacitor Control Circuit rigs and Cap Recharger modules. Use a capacitor booster to keep things running. You can fit plenty of charges in your cargohold and it frees up a lot of space for damage / tracking modules.

You can go for a perma-tank setup if you want, but only do that if you are lazy and don't mind taking forever to finish missions. Fit a light-to-medium tank, and fill the rest with MURDER AND DEATH.

When you can fit T2 pulse lasers, not much changes on this fit other than the guns. Pulse Lasers + Scorch = Win.
Coveted
Yellow Consortium
#3 - 2012-03-13 22:25:30 UTC
I should've clarified that I can fully T2-fit my harbinger, however...

Is the 30km-ish I get on pulses enough? I'm quite sure I've had mercenaries (the NPC kind) and some sansha orbiting me outside that range in L2's, and the Harbinger has half the speed of my coercer.

After adapting the one you posted a bit I've reached a fit which goes out to 28+7.8km, dealing 498 DPS including drones when using scorch, and 170 DPS perma-tank by EFT. Still I am not convinced that the range will be enough. I do have the drones outside of that... but 130 DPS from drones won't break the large rats that orbit at those ranges. I could fit a weapon rig for range, but due to diminishing returns, it'd be very ineffective (since there's 2 tracking comps already). Another negative point is that buying enough armor hardeners to handle all damage types will be very expensive, as I can't fit this otherwise due to CPU, and it already requires a 1% PG implant (and a 6% CPU implant is super-expensive, as well).
[[Harbinger, L3 offensive]
Medium Armor Repairer II
Shadow Serpentis Armor EM Hardener
Shadow Serpentis Armor Thermic Hardener
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II
Heat Sink II

Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
Tracking Computer II, Optimal Range
10MN Afterburner II
Medium Capacitor Booster II, Cap Booster 800

Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
Heavy Pulse Laser II, Scorch M
[empty high slot]

Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Medium Auxiliary Nano Pump I
Medium Anti-Explosive Pump I


Hammerhead II x5
Lili Lu
#4 - 2012-03-13 22:47:40 UTC
Fit beams for missions. Sanshas tracking disrupt, so even with scorch your optimal will not be very good when being cut in half. With beams you have ammo options that give you the range to hit them before they do serious damage to you.

If you have trained WU5 and at least AWU3 heavy beams should be doable with a rig or low slot PDS or RC depending on what else you are fitting to the ship.

Missions are much easier when you can snipe frigs at range, and then turn to high damage shorter range lenses when the heavier ships have closed on you. It beats charging toward and after rats because your only option is close range.

Same goes for blood raiders. Better to try killing them at range then allow them to get close with their neuts.

The only rats that really oblige a close range turret are serps and angels. Serps respond to laser fire reasonably well due to the thermal content, even if less thatn ideal weapon system against them. But with Angels forget it in a laser boat. Have a second race you can fly against them that does explo or kinetic damage. You say you have Gallente trained, so use a Myrm with explo drones against angels.
Andrea Griffin
#5 - 2012-03-15 01:08:29 UTC
The 35km range with Scorch should be plenty for L3 missions, especially with an AB.

When missions are using optimal range disruption on you, your pulses might get whacked down to 15km or so - but beams will be cut down to 30km or so. Not really a big difference since you can just flick on the afterburner and be in range in a few seconds anyway.

When tracking disruption isn't an issue (which will be most of the time), pulses will afford you better raw DPS and better tracking up close.

It's a matter of taste though - there's nothing wrong with fitting beams over pulses if you really want that extra range. I just much prefer the DPS and tracking of pulses. Lili Lu prefers beams. Lili isn't wrong, and neither will you be if you want beams.

Best of luck!