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CCP do something about the suicide ganking problem

Author
Ai Shun
#81 - 2012-03-12 06:41:52 UTC
Cosmos Serendipity wrote:
Sure people will make ganking alts, but thats just eve. As it is null is safer than high sec and doesn't even adress low sec, but with people being banished from high sec, at least after time the population would grow in low waiting to gank high and null sec dwellers as they pass through.


I think you have hit on the core of the problem there. The more rules you make the more overburdened a system becomes. And the more likely you make it that someone will find a way around those rules.

I still think they should remove CONCORD, implement NPC defensive ships that match the capabilities of player ships to defend NPC space (With realistically escalating numbers in the face of a larger threat) and allow corporations to defend their own space. Let the player population defend their own and take control of the sandbox in that way.

But, that's me. I'm a sucker for punishment Lol
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#82 - 2012-03-12 07:01:20 UTC
Cosmos Serendipity wrote:
As it is null is safer than high sec


ahahah sure why don't you come right down

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar

Stella SGP
#83 - 2012-03-12 07:04:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Stella SGP
Ai Shun wrote:
Cosmos Serendipity wrote:
Sure people will make ganking alts, but thats just eve. As it is null is safer than high sec and doesn't even adress low sec, but with people being banished from high sec, at least after time the population would grow in low waiting to gank high and null sec dwellers as they pass through.


I think you have hit on the core of the problem there. The more rules you make the more overburdened a system becomes. And the more likely you make it that someone will find a way around those rules.

I still think they should remove CONCORD, implement NPC defensive ships that match the capabilities of player ships to defend NPC space (With realistically escalating numbers in the face of a larger threat) and allow corporations to defend their own space. Let the player population defend their own and take control of the sandbox in that way.

But, that's me. I'm a sucker for punishment Lol

Concord ships used to be alot weaker and was possible to tank them and even destroy them. They were then buffed to their current strength for a good reason. Even the current criminal flagging system owes much of its history to the same incident many years ago...

Feel free to dig up some of Eve's more interesting history.

Want a hint? Look up "Zombies, Siege of Yulai"
Ai Shun
#84 - 2012-03-12 07:34:58 UTC
Stella SGP wrote:
Want a hint? Look up "Zombies, Siege of Yulai"


Thank you, that will make for interesting reading. I had suspected there was a good reason they are so powerful; for the same reasons Guards in Age of Conan, World of Warcraft and other MMOs are so strong. But one would think there are better ways around that now.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#85 - 2012-03-12 07:42:54 UTC
Jas Dor wrote:
Here's a quick list of things that can no longer be moved by the freighterload


Antimatter Charge M = 3920 isk/m3 (using lowest Forge price).
EMP M = 3920 ism/m3 (give or take a couple of isk).
Hammerhead I = 2889 isk/m3

The gank limit is currently around 1000isk m/3 (For 700mil in drop from 700K of cargohold).

When a freighter can not move a full cargohold of T1 ammo or T1 drones something has gone horribly wrong.



Its a rather daft ganker who goes after a freighter for a billion isk.
Pheusia
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#86 - 2012-03-12 07:57:39 UTC
Jas Dor wrote:
beor oranes wrote:
Though not in the last little while, I have over the years moved billions (up to abour 10bil) at a time in and out of Jita. The only time I got ganked was when I left some T2 BPC's in a shuttle by accident and AP'd to Jita and was sat on a gate for about 20 minutes. Suicide ganking is easily avoidable if you take simple and common sense precautions, if you don't you deserve to lose your ship and cargo.


Yeah and back in the day I loaded a Large Faction Tower into an Ity IV, put some tank on the thing, and made it to my destination. This is not back in the day. Simply fitting a tank and not AFKing is no longer enough.


Now you ought to use an appropriate ship, fit it properly and pay attention to your route.


Just like always.
Tangodude
Star One Corp
#87 - 2012-03-12 07:59:28 UTC
I got suicide ganked yesterday. Delightful experience. Funny now but wasn't impressed at the time. My tengu got hit by 5 thrashers and a rupture. Pilots had -9.x type sec status. Killboard revealed they ganked 2 other tengus in the preceeding hour. Neither had a single faction mod. I had minimal faction gear.

It appears players (with bad sec status) can take out a series of ships in high sec with essentially no penalty.

So why is it called high sec? How about a name change (or penalty)? 'Gank sec' lol?

I've lost SP in pvp and pve but losing SP to a suicide gank is rude.

Suicide ganking isn't combat. It shouldn't boost kill records. Moreover, if the target hasn't heard of suicide ganking then it isn't even pvp.

Well, Im off to buy a thrasher.
Pheusia
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#88 - 2012-03-12 08:01:30 UTC
Jas Dor wrote:
Here's a quick list of things that can no longer be moved by the freighterload


Antimatter Charge M = 3920 isk/m3 (using lowest Forge price).
EMP M = 3920 ism/m3 (give or take a couple of isk).
Hammerhead I = 2889 isk/m3

The gank limit is currently around 1000isk m/3 (For 700mil in drop from 700K of cargohold).

When a freighter can not move a full cargohold of T1 ammo or T1 drones something has gone horribly wrong.


Can you cite examples of freighters with these kinds of cargos being suicide ganked? Or shall we just skip straight past the part where you make yourself look silly for claiming an obvious falsehood and retire from the thread in a huff?
Pheusia
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#89 - 2012-03-12 08:02:56 UTC
Tangodude wrote:
I got suicide ganked yesterday. Delightful experience. Funny now but wasn't impressed at the time. My tengu got hit by 5 thrashers and a rupture. Pilots had -9.x type sec status. Killboard revealed they ganked 2 other tengus in the preceeding hour. Neither had a single faction mod. I had minimal faction gear.

It appears players (with bad sec status) can take out a series of ships in high sec with essentially no penalty.

So why is it called high sec? How about a name change (or penalty)? 'Gank sec' lol?

I've lost SP in pvp and pve but losing SP to a suicide gank is rude.

Suicide ganking isn't combat. It shouldn't boost kill records. Moreover, if the target hasn't heard of suicide ganking then it isn't even pvp.

Well, Im off to buy a thrasher.


You didn't "lose" those skillpoints. You traded them in for a realisation that situational awareness is required even in hi-sec.
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#90 - 2012-03-12 08:07:20 UTC
Pheusia wrote:
Jas Dor wrote:
beor oranes wrote:
Though not in the last little while, I have over the years moved billions (up to abour 10bil) at a time in and out of Jita. The only time I got ganked was when I left some T2 BPC's in a shuttle by accident and AP'd to Jita and was sat on a gate for about 20 minutes. Suicide ganking is easily avoidable if you take simple and common sense precautions, if you don't you deserve to lose your ship and cargo.


Yeah and back in the day I loaded a Large Faction Tower into an Ity IV, put some tank on the thing, and made it to my destination. This is not back in the day. Simply fitting a tank and not AFKing is no longer enough.


Now you ought to use an appropriate ship, fit it properly and pay attention to your route.


Just like always.


It's easy to blame game designers for making the mechanics allow suicide ganking (which is fine) rather than the idiots who fly loot pinatas through camped gates. They lose their ships, their lossmails top eve-kill and people start to smell blood in the water and position gank fleets along popular pipes hoping for lucrative targets who will then whine on the forums when they realize that this is actually a PvP game.

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar

Cosmos Serendipity
BRAHMA CORP
#91 - 2012-03-12 08:10:56 UTC
Andski wrote:
Cosmos Serendipity wrote:
As it is null is safer than high sec


ahahah sure why don't you come right down


I've been in null, lived there for awhile, it was pretty safe in alliance held space.....or are you saying Goons now operate on NRDS? If not, why not?
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#92 - 2012-03-12 08:12:21 UTC
Tangodude wrote:
I got suicide ganked yesterday. Delightful experience. Funny now but wasn't impressed at the time. My tengu got hit by 5 thrashers and a rupture. Pilots had -9.x type sec status. Killboard revealed they ganked 2 other tengus in the preceeding hour. Neither had a single faction mod. I had minimal faction gear.

It appears players (with bad sec status) can take out a series of ships in high sec with essentially no penalty.

So why is it called high sec? How about a name change (or penalty)? 'Gank sec' lol?

I've lost SP in pvp and pve but losing SP to a suicide gank is rude.

Suicide ganking isn't combat. It shouldn't boost kill records. Moreover, if the target hasn't heard of suicide ganking then it isn't even pvp.

Well, Im off to buy a thrasher.


http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=12704064

Don't fly what you can't afford to lose.

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar

Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#93 - 2012-03-12 08:16:01 UTC
Cosmos Serendipity wrote:
I've been in null, lived there for awhile, it was pretty safe in alliance held space.....or are you saying Goons now operate on NRDS? If not, why not?


Have you ever been in a situation where your assets are trapped in a station that you are unable to dock in? Ever heard of awoxers? Are you aware that any semblance of "safety" in nullsec is entirely dependent on those who live in that space, rather than instagibbing NPCs?

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#94 - 2012-03-12 08:24:18 UTC
Cosmos Serendipity wrote:


I've been in null, lived there for awhile, it was pretty safe in alliance held space.....or are you saying Goons now operate on NRDS? If not, why not?


It is only safe in null sec so long as the people make it safe.
Tangodude
Star One Corp
#95 - 2012-03-12 08:27:39 UTC
Andski wrote:
Tangodude wrote:
I got suicide ganked yesterday. Delightful experience. Funny now but wasn't impressed at the time. My tengu got hit by 5 thrashers and a rupture. Pilots had -9.x type sec status. Killboard revealed they ganked 2 other tengus in the preceeding hour. Neither had a single faction mod. I had minimal faction gear.

It appears players (with bad sec status) can take out a series of ships in high sec with essentially no penalty.

So why is it called high sec? How about a name change (or penalty)? 'Gank sec' lol?

I've lost SP in pvp and pve but losing SP to a suicide gank is rude.

Suicide ganking isn't combat. It shouldn't boost kill records. Moreover, if the target hasn't heard of suicide ganking then it isn't even pvp.

Well, Im off to buy a thrasher.


http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=12704064

Don't fly what you can't afford to lose.



Brief but pointless
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#96 - 2012-03-12 08:31:18 UTC
Tangodude wrote:
Andski wrote:
Tangodude wrote:
I got suicide ganked yesterday. Delightful experience. Funny now but wasn't impressed at the time. My tengu got hit by 5 thrashers and a rupture. Pilots had -9.x type sec status. Killboard revealed they ganked 2 other tengus in the preceeding hour. Neither had a single faction mod. I had minimal faction gear.

It appears players (with bad sec status) can take out a series of ships in high sec with essentially no penalty.

So why is it called high sec? How about a name change (or penalty)? 'Gank sec' lol?

I've lost SP in pvp and pve but losing SP to a suicide gank is rude.

Suicide ganking isn't combat. It shouldn't boost kill records. Moreover, if the target hasn't heard of suicide ganking then it isn't even pvp.

Well, Im off to buy a thrasher.


http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=12704064

Don't fly what you can't afford to lose.



Brief but pointless


I think I drove the point home, actually. You're whining about losing your 1b Tengu (awful fit btw) to suicide gankers because, much like the rest of the highsec welfare queens, you felt that it's perfectly safe because Concord is supposed to protect you. That turned out not to be the case, and you proceeded to make a post about it.

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#97 - 2012-03-12 08:33:22 UTC  |  Edited by: baltec1
Tangodude wrote:


Brief but pointless


It showed that you made yourself a target. That was a fair bit of bling you had on there.
Psychotic Monk
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#98 - 2012-03-12 08:36:37 UTC
Andski, I'm starting to believe that all this time it's been *us* that's been wrong. I'm believing more and more that Everybody vs. Everybody *is* a game where people in highsec can expect to be perfectly safe from any and all interference with their persons.

Maybe we should just all hang up our guns and accept that the west is no longer wild.

/me is defeated.
Tangodude
Star One Corp
#99 - 2012-03-12 08:41:17 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Tangodude wrote:


Brief but pointless


It showed that you made yourself a target. That was a fair bit of bling you had on there.


As I stated, the 2 other tengus didn't have a single faction mod. 300M isn't a lot of bling. 100M dropped. It wasn't about isk.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#100 - 2012-03-12 08:45:21 UTC
Tangodude wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Tangodude wrote:


Brief but pointless


It showed that you made yourself a target. That was a fair bit of bling you had on there.


As I stated, the 2 other tengus didn't have a single faction mod. 300M isn't a lot of bling. 100M dropped. It wasn't about isk.


Yes it is.

Those thrashers have made quite a bit of profit between them. See, I know of the guys who are doing this and they don't go for a t2 target unless the tears were worth it. They are making quite a bit of isk whacking pimp tengu, most of which are bots.