These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE Information Portal

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

New dev blog: Rebalancing EVE, one ship at a time

First post First post
Author
Ntrails
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
#321 - 2012-03-06 19:36:33 UTC
skill queue online though
Skippermonkey
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#322 - 2012-03-06 19:36:39 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Phantom
Bloodpetal wrote:
Erim Solfara wrote:


You're reading more into that than you need to, the latter image says nothing about skill requirements. It's alluding to a thematic structure for ships, nothing more, nothing less.

Someone who flies destroyers and interceptors might logically want to fly an interdictor, that is all.



These images match the CURRENT design. They aren't the "NEW DESIGN".

Use your eyeballs and you'll see that.

http://content.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/8742/1/Skilltreebefore_1920.jpg

http://content.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/8742/1/Amarrshiptree2_1920.jpg


These two images match exactly. The "BEFORE" and "Amarr Ship Tree" are exactly the same layouts, not matching the new format proposed @

http://content.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/8742/1/Skilltreeafter_1920.jpg


Hence, asking for them to correct or clarify what they're trying to demonstrate.


Here, let me add notes for you

the current skill tree
http://content.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/8742/1/Skilltreebefore_1920.jpg

the current ship tree
http://content.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/8742/1/Amarrshiptree2_1920.jpg

the proposed change to the skill tree
http://content.eveonline.com/www/newssystem/media/8742/1/Skilltreeafter_1920.jpg

COME AT ME BRO

I'LL JUST BE DOCKED IN THIS STATION

Spoon Dame
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#323 - 2012-03-06 19:37:27 UTC
I like the general tone of this update, but it does concern me a little about BC being required for BS. I have all racial battleships to IV. Getting only the racial BC SP reimbursement would be rather inconvenient, but I'd live.

Curious how all this will pan out.
Anika Mobius
Solid State Security
#324 - 2012-03-06 19:37:34 UTC
Generally good stuff. Very un-CCP because this actually is starting to make sense and god knowns CCP has been known for confusing and obscure systems. Are you sure EVE is still developed by CCP? P

Anyways, one thing I did notice immediatly is that only Caldari ships were listed as Bombardment ships. Seems like a massive design flaw that no other race has the capacity to field bombardment role ships. CCP designers should look into this.
  • A.Mobius
Lelob
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#325 - 2012-03-06 19:37:38 UTC
I don't like this at all. It's a huge kick in the shins to all the noobies out there by adding more and more and more SP needed to cross-train. I know when I started off with my first main I started going amarr, which turned out to be a huge mistake. Being able to get into a drake instead of a harbinger was a huge deal for me, because it opened up a whole world of possibilities, not just in terms of pvp but also pve. Going from cruiser>bc>bs doesn't help really anyone and it just makes it harder on the noobies because they'd have to completely start from scratch with a new race. It's a move that takes out one of the more dynamic factors of EVE for no discernible benefit, save for the RP factor.
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#326 - 2012-03-06 19:37:42 UTC
Mikron Alexarr wrote:
Erim Solfara wrote:
Mikron Alexarr wrote:
Scatim Helicon wrote:
Isn't it our job to define roles for particular ships, not yours?



Quoted for Truth. does the term sandbox mean anything to anyone anymore?


Lies and fallacy, CCP make the game, balance the ships, and give them bonuses.

If you want to fly one different to it's intended use, go ahead, but they should all have obvious intended uses. Today, I watched a video of an iteron taking out a megathron, which was awesome.

It was awesome because someone had taken a ship with an obvious intended role, and used it completely differently. If the iteron HAD no role, and was just another blank-slate hull, it'd have been completely meaningless, no different to someone using any other cruiser sized ship.

Your argument holds no water.


I'll try and make this simple.

The role of a blockade runner did exist before the t2 haulers (I fly the crane for instance). The best ship for this was debatable (sigil with speed mods in low, badger with ECM). Then it was decided that t2 haulers should exist. \0/

It was the players that defined the role. CCP can enable roles to form, but we the players decide what we like for a particular role.


Yes, player actions highlight (to a degree) different needed ship roles... CCP often designs their ships with this in mind.

Which, fortunately, is exactly what is occuring here. Smile

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.

Arcin Hamir
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#327 - 2012-03-06 19:37:55 UTC
What on earth do you think this actually adds? It seems a lot of resource and time will be devoted that adds essentially nothing but removes a fair amount of flavour.
Megnamon
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#328 - 2012-03-06 19:38:12 UTC
I like the idea of jetting tiers.

I like the idea of changing recs for destroyers and BC's if implemented properly.

I like that CCP is working to make the game more balanced and make more ships useful.

I like not freaking out any time a change is proposed.

That is all.
Kippis
exception.
#329 - 2012-03-06 19:38:20 UTC
Interesting...

So how will it be called, this new game you are talking about?

But seriously: WTF? The Destroyer and Battlecruiser concepts are awesome BECAUSE they allow you to fly all races' ships with one skill. Also do you seriously want to shorten Capital skill training time by 30 days? Having to train BS to level V is one of the things that makes Capitals special, which they should be IMO.

I can find nothing wrong with the current skill system. Rebalance the ships, yes, and make some Tiers worth flying again, but please do not change the skills. They're awesome as is.

P.S.: Gallente dampening ends with the Exequror? I LOL'd
Laura Dexx
Criticised Construction
#330 - 2012-03-06 19:38:42 UTC
Skippermonkey wrote:
FOFOFOFOOOO wrote:
On a side note its quite funny to see that it now takes less time to get into a dread then a black ops bs. Good thing they fixed black ops bs.

+ 1 like


This can't be missed. Great job, this sure doesn't look like it was thought out in a night.
Aethlyn
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#331 - 2012-03-06 19:39:41 UTC
Iam Widdershins wrote:
Maybe something more along the lines of what CCP is trying to do: Make one of the bonuses on a battlecruiser be based upon the racial Cruiser skill, make the other based on the Battlecruiser skill.

Splitting up BC into racial components is the worst idea. Sorry.

Actually a nice idea. Always saw destroyers and battlecruisers more like an optional "1.5 upgrade". So instead of grabbing the next bigger class of ships you specialize here (even if it's juts on your current tech tier). But having them split up and put into the chain sounds interesting, too. I can actually understand both approaches here and I'm not really sure which one is the one I'd prefer.

In a similar way I always considered the T2 ships requiring other T2 ships as a prereq more like "T2.5". It added quite some complexity, that's right, but at the same time it isn't that bad. But yeah, it sometimes doesn't feel right, if you have to train some ship class that's not directly related with the one you'd like to fly (had that with Command Ships as well as my Orca).

Looking for more thoughts? Follow me on Twitter.

Ntrails
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
#332 - 2012-03-06 19:40:03 UTC
Has anyone got confirmation of whether they will be properly balancing headlights across the racial offerings? The current imbalance is disgraceful.
MisterNick
The Sagan Clan
#333 - 2012-03-06 19:40:06 UTC
I, for one, look forward to Exequrors being useful.

"Human beings make life so interesting. Do you know that in a universe so full of wonders, they have managed to invent boredom."

War Kitten
Panda McLegion
#334 - 2012-03-06 19:40:09 UTC
Awesome - an actual plan to follow when rebalancing ships.

And old ships get new life, very cool.

I like the BS4 for capitals change - it follows the theme, and might make for more overconfident newbs in carriers ratting in lowsec :)

Keep up the great work CCP!


Also, for the stupid people, one more requote:

CCP Soundwave wrote:

No one is saying you have to retrain them. Our principle for the reimbursement here will be "if you could fly it yesterday, you can still fly it today". Ytterbium will post the further details of this once it's written up.

I don't judge people by their race, religion, color, size, age, gender, or ethnicity. I judge them by their grammar, spelling, syntax, punctuation, clarity of expression, and logical consistency.

Buzzmong
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#335 - 2012-03-06 19:41:07 UTC
Removal of tiers! \o/
Exitar Stormscion
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#336 - 2012-03-06 19:41:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Exitar Stormscion
Best thing since removal of learning skills !

THERE IS HOPE !

I just hope CCP learns that in the future they NEED to write in caps and explain clearly in blogs that people wont lose anything and that every change will be done in there benefit so they avoid **** storm on the forums of people that do not read deep enough or understand the concept fully :)


Also SoundWave ! Can we have that ship trees in game ?


Could be very beneficial if added under skills in character sheet.
Maybe tied with certificates. Open it select race tab and clearly see what you can and what you cant fly and see how close you are to the new shiny ship and understand easy every ship tech level and orientation compared to the others.

Click on ship it self to see certificates check on market check skill train time etc :)
Maybe even expand in the future into module tech tree.


Visual representation FTW for new players and old ones alike.
The Snowman
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#337 - 2012-03-06 19:41:39 UTC
It seems everyone is more worried about what compensation they'll get! rather than worried if the damn ships are balanced or not. lol

Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#338 - 2012-03-06 19:42:02 UTC
Kippis wrote:
Interesting...

So how will it be called, this new game you are talking about?

But seriously: WTF? The Destroyer and Battlecruiser concepts are awesome BECAUSE they allow you to fly all races' ships with one skill. Also do you seriously want to shorten Capital skill training time by 30 days? Having to train BS to level V is one of the things that makes Capitals special, which they should be IMO.

I can find nothing wrong with the current skill system. Rebalance the ships, yes, and make some Tiers worth flying again, but please do not change the skills. They're awesome as is.

P.S.: Gallente dampening ends with the Exequror? I LOL'd


I believe his point was intended to be that it ends at the cruiser level... which means they would consider BC and BS dampner bonused ships.

Still complaining?

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.

Plyn
Uncharted.
#339 - 2012-03-06 19:42:44 UTC
On one hand:

THANK YOU GOD, please kill the tier system and fix all of the obsolete ships! This would make the game so much more diverse and super happytize me!

On the other hand:

Many people will be very disappointed to find that they have to train for several months to fly all of their BCs that they were fantastic in a couple of weeks ago. It makes total sense, but you can expect a lot of rage from it.

One idea to make this suck slightly less:

Introduce the racial BC and dessy skills at least a month before you make the change final. This will give people a chance to train up one race's BC 5 and dump the refunded SP into another race's BC 5.... At least this way there is less of a "rug pulled out from under my feet" feeling when you suddenly can't fly all those command ships you had tucked away.
Ntrails
Merch Industrial
Goonswarm Federation
#340 - 2012-03-06 19:42:49 UTC
The Snowman wrote:
It seems everyone is more worried about what compensation they'll get! rather than worried if the damn ships are balanced or not. lol




it's ccp, they will not be balanced. At all.