Science & Industry

I would put mining revamp above nullsec improvements.

Nullsec has been noodled with repeatedly over the last couple ot years, the core mining experience is identical to what it was from the beginning, Mining is overdue for some attention.

Issler Dainze
The Miner's Friend
CSM 7 Candidate

You make no mention of Drone Regions and the removal of drone compounds from the game to be replaced by ISK bounties on drones instead. I believe the figures are somewhere around 60% of all minerals come from drone compounds. CSM6 and CCP discussed this during the last summit but I haven't heard anything about it since and none of the candidates seem to be talking about it too much. There has even been some analysis connecting the rise in Trit and Pyerite to the conflict in the drone regions.

Null sec alliances don't bother running mining operations because they can just import all the minerals they need by JF from Jita in the form of weapons modules. Cut off this supply from NPC drone ratting and you will see a rise in the minerals prices and a greater need for miners in Null sec as well as some possible support from these blocks when they have to mine their own ores.

It doesn't seem right to me that minerals should have a secondary source of origin in the game - if we suggested that Moon Minerals have another source in game I can't even imagine the public outcry that would result from the power blocks having their ISK faucets undercut.

"I think the only thing broken in mining atm is the isk vs. rewards when you look at null/low/hi-sec. Currently Lowsec ore is worth roughly 10isk per m3 more then highsec ore, totally not worth the extra risk, and with interruptions probably works out worse isk/hour. Null sec isn't quite as bad, but could still use a boost. Possibly changing what minerals (and the quantity's) are refined from each ore could help fix this?"

I have seen this same complaint for quite a while now and I just don't understand if people are unwilling or unable to understand what appears to be very simple game mechanics. I'm not talking about mining in general but overall game mechanics.

From my experience Mining in high and null are just fine. Each has negatives and positives that come with each.

1) Null sec has better ores available, while high has lower quality ores. Yeah null doesn't have as many belts available but it's still a crazy high amount.

2) In low you have access to all sorts of extras such as POS's with minimal negative effects while high sec POS have nothing but negatives.

3) You have better Planet resources by x5 compared to high sec.

4) You have an area you can control against other players and so on. While high is relatively "safe" if someone chooses to pod you than you're going to get podded, and there is no way for you (or corp, alliance, fleet, friends) can do anything about it.

High sec and null have a semiotic relationship with one another with low sec being some useless middle ground between the two. You can control and own stuff in null sec as well has make crazy isk and do what you want. But in null their is "little" ore (a little worth quite a bit). But at the same time in High sec there is crazy ore available and little isk (compared to null). They both depend on one another and as far as I can tell have a pretty good balance the way things are.


You cant have everything. You can't be in null, have POS's, great ISK, PVP, best paying PVE, best isk generating everything, really the best everything and than add into it more ore (adding more of the best ores). Make isk in null, buy ore and goods in high and fight for sovereignty.

Adding more ore (or changes to ore qualities, amounts, types, whatever) to null would remove any reason for null players to interact with high sec, deal with logistics of moving materials to systems to continue to hold sovereignty, make ships/items/whatever. Null sec is supposed to be a no mans (or woman's) land. Not the land of isk and ores falling into your laps happy time.

That pretty much says it all.

CCP stop messing with Empire space and what happens there.

The only "fix" miners need is for the penalty for ganking to be more serious and we all know that will not happen.

Why do you think CCP put the penultimate gank ships in the game, the new glass cannon Tier3 BCs?

In my mind exploration would be part of a new higher end mining experience, the current static location would be retained for "normal" mining.

Issler

I think it is important to keep in mind why players mine.. Not because they want action or quick ISK, but because they want an easy going activity, where they can chat with friends ingame, where they can leave / alt+tab for a while without much risk at a moments notice and where they still have a feeling of accomplishment and some ISK gain.
I do other PvE and I do PvP. But if I know friends might be stopping by every minute, roams or Incursions aren't the best idea. And sometimes, after work, I'm just to lazy to use my brain more than necessary and mining while chatting or browsing is quite relaxing. Missioning is not much different either, yet not the same either - no jumping/warping around, no mission deadlines, no rats that might kill you while you 'quickly' answer the doorbell.

Issler, is the above (roughly) true aswell for you? Or why else do you mine? What concrete issues do you have with mining as it is? By that I don't mean concrete gameplay features, but how it satisfies your expectations (or how it doesn't).

I agree with this statement entirely. We need what amounts to tier/tech 3 mining. IMO it shouldn't be cloaked miners and it shouldn't be a crazy massive ship (which are still cool). It should be a new style of mining, more dangerous and exciting than before. PVE against the environment like with mercoxite mining, pvp against your fellow miners for limited MOBILE resources.

In short, bring on the comets, bring on the deep space asteroids

m/

you guys need to accept that CCP will never improve mining.

Glad CCP is taking some anti-bot action: bots are not only an exploit of mechanics in my view but it also gives a pseudo justification to gankers, not that they need justification, it just adds to this form of high-sec bullying tear-fest a "fuzzy feel", not that ganking has anything to do with manipulation of markets of course.

I just think that mining is just too predictable: fix that, you fix a lot of concerns with mining.

Currently, you (a) know where the belts are (except for the one gravimetric site with a couple of oh-hum rocks), (b) the composition of the belts doesn't change so one bookmark later, back at mining the same stuff, day in and day out which only makes botting that much easier, (c) the location of the belts are the same (see point b), (d) the roids refresh predictably (see point b), (e) there is no incentive to mine certain rock types (eg, scordite).

I'd much rather have rocks more general with easier access to different ore types everywhere, but vary quantities, and do so over time. I suggest that the market forces will positively react to more variety but less quantity per given area, especially if it changes over time so ore sources change from belt to belt, chance based.

Some suggestions

- improved gravimetric sites both in terms of numbers and market value of the roids, eg, make it worth "my while" as you do for other exploration related site types. Fewer belts but more grav sites would help a lot, and give miners something else to train. The other benefit is that it would force gankers to actually put some effort in finding the easy kill.

- mix more ore types, but vary the quantity of ore over time, and mix it by belt / system so it's not predictable and some "work" needs to go into finding a site. That removes the "rinse, repeat" nature of mining.

- make ice roids part of the regular roid formations - eliminate ice fields and eliminate ice roids that never run out. Also helps with bots and predictability.

- it'd be nice to have a way for miners to be able to defend themselves, such as, the ability to strip mine a catalyst. Surely a laser able to pulverize rock can suck dry a largely tritanium based hull? At least, overheat modules on said hull - give the mining lasers moderate teeth to deal with the " why the heck can a single 1M fit pulverize a 220M fit in seconds" = that was a rhetorical question btw.

Fix this and mining will be a bit more interesting, balanced and generally pleasing for everyone, market included.

Z

MIners Unite!

m/

The voting levels tell me that some of us are going to the polls!

Everyone that crunches rocks should vote in the CSM for someone they think will remind CCP the mining, likely the most common activity in Eve today deserves its place in the new feature work in Eve (as well as the continued work on existing content).

Mining matters CCP!!

Issler Dainze
The Miner's Friend
CSM 7 Candidate