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EVE New Citizens Q&A

 
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"how do corps find newbies"?
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Kata Amentis
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#61 - 2012-03-08 12:25:04 UTC
I guess there is quite a difference between newbies who are already looking around and digging up information and guides and those who are keeping their heads down trying to make sense of the bit of the game right in front of them.

I think someone used the word "self starter" to describe these people with their heads up and it's a good description. They're already likely to have seen the posts in here which give them advice on how to find and pick a corp, how to see through some of the BS and scams etc. Ironically they're also probably the newbies in need of the least amount of help from newbie orientated corps Roll

The ones who are concentrating on the bit in front of them would probably respond quite well to the "oh, wow, whats that then?!" approach, i guess "shock and awe" would be another description.


Looking at the "types of newbie", hopefully without stereotyping too much, the ones which just follow the path of the tutorials without looking around too much are probably the ones who end up quitting at the end of the trial/tutorial/short amount of time thinking Eve is a boring game. From CCP's point of view is probably these ones that they'd like player corps to catch and "enlighten" to the wonders, and they'd be the subgroup of newbies that would benefit the most...


... and probably the least likely to join in a discussion thread on the forums Sad

Curiosity killed the Kata... ... but being immortal he wasn't too worried about keeping a count.
Roland Renoir
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#62 - 2012-03-08 13:04:03 UTC
Kata Amentis wrote:
... and probably the least likely to join in a discussion thread on the forums Sad


They are shy, comon.

But, about seeking the newbies that ask intelligent questions and answer some, well... I find the Rookie Help to be chaotic. I really dislike the place. I rather ask my dumb questions to some bitter vet than trying my luck in those channels, so I don't think that should be a proper way of recruiting.

And well, who doesn't zoom in to check shiny ships? I surely do!

"Give a man fish and you'll feed him for a day. Teach him how to fish and you'll feed him for his life."
FeralShadow
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#63 - 2012-03-08 20:21:19 UTC
Xerxes definitely brings up some valid concerns that people may be feeling. I've been playing too long to even remember what it felt like being a true newbie, all I can say for certain is that after a few days of playing I searched around for a smallish start-up corp, who taught me pretty much most of what I know. I probably had some reservations, but for the sake of actually experiencing the game, I had decided to place those in a box and shove them out the airlock.

As to the paranoia.... I'm only paranoid if they give me a reason to be paranoid. For instance, a player convos me and talks to me about this great deal he's having. Paranoia alarms are ringing all over the place, and I check every angle I can to see if it's legitimate or not. Another person may convo me and this person is asking questions about this, that, and the other thing. No paranoia there, as that person is only wanting general information.

The distinction here is between someone wanting something, and someone simply asking innocent questions. If someone wants something, I generally think about why that person wants it, and what good that could possibly do him. If I decide there's malicious intent, then that person can just go fly his ship into the nearest asteroid. However, if it's simple curiosity then I answer any/all questions they throw at me.

TL;DR - before deciding someone is a spy try to think about what they are gaining out of the relationship.

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
Vel Tora
Doomheim
#64 - 2012-03-09 07:04:25 UTC
Kata Amentis wrote:
I guess there is quite a difference between newbies who are already looking around and digging up information and guides and those who are keeping their heads down trying to make sense of the bit of the game right in front of them.

I think someone used the word "self starter" to describe these people with their heads up and it's a good description. They're already likely to have seen the posts in here which give them advice on how to find and pick a corp, how to see through some of the BS and scams etc. Ironically they're also probably the newbies in need of the least amount of help from newbie orientated corps Roll

The ones who are concentrating on the bit in front of them would probably respond quite well to the "oh, wow, whats that then?!" approach, i guess "shock and awe" would be another description.


Looking at the "types of newbie", hopefully without stereotyping too much, the ones which just follow the path of the tutorials without looking around too much are probably the ones who end up quitting at the end of the trial/tutorial/short amount of time thinking Eve is a boring game. From CCP's point of view is probably these ones that they'd like player corps to catch and "enlighten" to the wonders, and they'd be the subgroup of newbies that would benefit the most...


... and probably the least likely to join in a discussion thread on the forums Sad


To a degree you are correct. I guess it comes down to defining what you mean by help. I have Google’d a ton of guides and read forum posts. But that doesn’t compare to hands on experience or the practical application of ideas in game. That's attractive to a new player like me. There is also the need to feel like you contribute something rather than simply being laden with a ton of freebies and left feeling guilty or unable to repay the gift. It can be tough at start to feel competent or worthy enough to just reach out in a Hyper-Darwinistic environment like Eve.

Rookie chat is off putting in that to grow into a game you are going to have to try new things and take a few lumps. Listening to the typical chatter there will leave you afraid of venturing out of high sec and with a strong distrust of anyone on an account older than thirty days. There is just enough truth in those ideas to stick but enough hyperbole to turn you anti-social in what is supposed to be a social game.

I had thought on Eve University, as it seems to advertise specifically to new players, but remain on the look out for other options worthy of consideration too.
Kata Amentis
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#65 - 2012-03-09 12:44:35 UTC
FeralShadow wrote:

As to the paranoia.... I'm only paranoid if they give me a reason to be paranoid.
<...snip...>
TL;DR - before deciding someone is a spy try to think about what they are gaining out of the relationship.


Vel Tora wrote:

Rookie chat is off putting in that to grow into a game you are going to have to try new things and take a few lumps. Listening to the typical chatter there will leave you afraid of venturing out of high sec and with a strong distrust of anyone on an account older than thirty days. There is just enough truth in those ideas to stick but enough hyperbole to turn you anti-social in what is supposed to be a social game.


I agree completely with these points, but it's a very hard thing to balance the distrust and paranoia. I think a lot of the problems come from a lack of familiarity.

I'm going to go out on a limb here a little bit; but our general day to day lives aren't that full of doubt and worry about someone jumping out and doing horrible things to us (obviously, it shouldn't, but does happen in RL and it's going to be dependant on who and where you are etc.). Taking a "generic someone" who is living in a RL setting with laws, rules and social conventions and with all the expectations built ontop of that and putting them into a setting where none of those laws or rules exist is going to cause some problems.

If you'll excuse the self quoting:
Kata Amentis wrote:

source: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=797750#post797750
Imagine a bad wild west movie... some poor flea ridden speck of a town where people eek out their living... one day a meanie old outlaw comes in and shoots the old fat sheriff in his rocking chair, and the poor township is in fear of it's life... brutalized and murdered until they have had enough and they gang up on the mean old outlaw and gun him down (with some heart wrenching scene where the lead guy and half the town get gunned down trying etc.).


This is the setting for Eve, not some real world civilization where you have rights, or there are laws or you are given something without working for it or anything like that. It really is the real "wild" west (or wherever), rule of the gun. Concord is the state Marshall who turns up to hang whoever he finds that looks guilty, but that doesn't help the townspeople who got shot along the way.


I'm not sure how many eve players can say that that is the setting of their real life, and it's not always immediately obvious that that is what Eve is.

Curiosity killed the Kata... ... but being immortal he wasn't too worried about keeping a count.
Utsen Dari
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#66 - 2012-03-09 20:08:33 UTC
Indeed. But under the rule of the gun in a "wild west" setting, outlaws are out there robbing the stagecoach carrying the rich merchant and all the miners' payroll, not some poor dirt-farmer who has no money. Even for a criminal, there is the balance of risk and reward and there's no reward in a campaign of consistently harassing penniless rookies.

Now, a few months later, when the rookie at last has a fat stack of money and materiel, that is when he should start to worry about the ever-growing target on his back.
Ashora Ling
Rynodogs
#67 - 2012-03-11 02:20:20 UTC
Kata Amentis wrote:
I guess there is quite a difference between newbies who are already looking around and digging up information and guides and those who are keeping their heads down trying to make sense of the bit of the game right in front of them.

I think someone used the word "self starter" to describe these people with their heads up and it's a good description. They're already likely to have seen the posts in here which give them advice on how to find and pick a corp, how to see through some of the BS and scams etc. Ironically they're also probably the newbies in need of the least amount of help from newbie orientated corps Roll

The ones who are concentrating on the bit in front of them would probably respond quite well to the "oh, wow, whats that then?!" approach, i guess "shock and awe" would be another description.


Looking at the "types of newbie", hopefully without stereotyping too much, the ones which just follow the path of the tutorials without looking around too much are probably the ones who end up quitting at the end of the trial/tutorial/short amount of time thinking Eve is a boring game. From CCP's point of view is probably these ones that they'd like player corps to catch and "enlighten" to the wonders, and they'd be the subgroup of newbies that would benefit the most...


... and probably the least likely to join in a discussion thread on the forums Sad


It's ironic you say that about self starters. IRL I am naturally very paranoid so I have no problem staying away from scams.