These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Science & Industry

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Hisec Hulk Tanking
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#21 - 2012-02-28 12:06:44 UTC
TravisWB wrote:
HISEC Hulk Tanking????

Its done like this:

Forget about AFK MINING.


This. True, and the best advice.

It's astonishing the number of posts with a noob questioning at some point to the effect of ".....and for some AFK mining should I tank with.....", etc.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#22 - 2012-02-28 12:10:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Krixtal Icefluxor
Tau Cabalander wrote:
This is what I use. It works well with a Siege Warfare: Shield Harmonizing link on an Orca.

I don't AFK mine. I watch local and dscan. I overheat and GTFO if it looks risky, sacrificing the drones if need be (they are cheaper than a new Hulk). The Orca deals with belt rats.

You can substitute a Viscoelastic EM Ward Salubrity I for the Caldari Navy / Dread Guristas EM amplifier.

[Hulk, Hisec]
Damage Control II
Power Diagnostic System II



[Hulk, EHP]
Micro Auxiliary Power Core I
Damage Control II



Bad fit from the start as this is a seriously paranoid reduction in Yield from zero MLU's.


Tau Cabalander wrote:


This fit has more EHP, but I've not used it:



And this.............OMG. Are we supposed to say 'thanks' ? Whatever dude.
Next.........

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Celgar Thurn
Department 10
#23 - 2012-02-28 16:10:49 UTC
Hmmm. It all depends on the 'quality' of the suicide ganker/s and if they know what they are doing. I had a Retriever survive a suicide gank from a destroyer a while back in Ammatar space before Concord saved the day. Recently I had a Hulk with about 9000 EHP survive a suicide gank from a different pilot in a destroyer. Ideally you want as much EHP on your mining vessel as possible without damaging your yield. You should be fine in the 13,000 to 22,000 EHP with a single dessie attack. As others have said keep an eye on local if you are worried. Know your local space scum and stay aligned.


Current top tip for the wary: Uttindar in Minmatar high sec - The asteroid belts are currently patrolled here by a two pilot 'frigate & dessie' team. I don't have their names to hand. I personally advise you don't mine in this system. At least one failed & one successful suicide gank perpetrated by this team. Members of NPC corp 'The Scope'.
PvtColt
Next Level of Leela
#24 - 2012-02-28 18:13:19 UTC
I believe somewhere was a thread where some guy proposed to create an alt,
put this alt in a rookie ship, fly it on the belt and then shoot your hulk.

Your Hulk will easily tank this shooting and Concord will destroy your alt, but after it Concord stays on the belt and you don't need to wait it for 15 sec if ganker will attack you Blink

TwistedTwistedTwisted
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#25 - 2012-02-28 18:43:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Bad fit from the start as this is a seriously paranoid reduction in Yield from zero MLU's.

Hulk has a built-in MLU, and a Hulk wreck yield even less ore, and takes a considerable amount of mining to replace.

Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Tau Cabalander wrote:
This fit has more EHP, but I've not used it:

And this.............OMG. Are we supposed to say 'thanks' ? Whatever dude.
Next.........

The fit is provided as an option for those seeking a higher EHP fitting, as I believe it is better than the previously posted small extender fits. Unlike many people, I try not to recommend fits I've only EFT warrior-ed, so I disclosed that fact.

I've not used it because I prefer to be able to swap out the PDU in my hisec fitting for a wstab when mining in w-space; it has saved my Hulks. I can't do that with the EHP fit as the APC is required to fit the medium extender. There are no suicide alpha-ganks in w-space, so I fit the PDU when in hisec to give a few more HP, as a hull reinforcement module won't fit.

If you prefer a less durable but higher yield MLU fit, I certainly won't stop you. The choice is yours.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#26 - 2012-02-28 18:43:53 UTC
PvtColt wrote:
I believe somewhere was a thread where some guy proposed to create an alt,
put this alt in a rookie ship, fly it on the belt and then shoot your hulk.

Your Hulk will easily tank this shooting and Concord will destroy your alt, but after it Concord stays on the belt and you don't need to wait it for 15 sec if ganker will attack you Blink

TwistedTwistedTwisted



Erm...just have the Rookie Ship shoot a can. Less of a Sec hit than shooting a ship.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#27 - 2012-02-28 18:52:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Krixtal Icefluxor
Tau Cabalander wrote:

Hulk has a built-in MLU, and a Hulk wreck yield even less ore, and takes a considerable amount of mining to replace.


WTF you talkin' 'bout Willis ???????

_______________________________
Mining Barge Skill Bonus:
3% better yield for Strip Miners per level
7.5% bonus to all shield resistances per level

Exhumers Skill Bonus:
3% better yield for Strip Miners per level
3% reduction in Ice Harvester duration per level

Role Bonus:
Able to equip Strip Miner and Ice Harvester turrets
_______________________________


I see no built-in MLU unless I'm REALLY blind or something.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Frontman 242
Doomheim
#28 - 2012-02-28 19:12:20 UTC
best protection fer hulkz iz not buying 1
Skorpynekomimi
#29 - 2012-02-28 19:38:57 UTC
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Tau Cabalander wrote:

Hulk has a built-in MLU, and a Hulk wreck yield even less ore, and takes a considerable amount of mining to replace.


WTF you talkin' 'bout Willis ???????

_______________________________
Mining Barge Skill Bonus:
3% better yield for Strip Miners per level
7.5% bonus to all shield resistances per level

Exhumers Skill Bonus:
3% better yield for Strip Miners per level
3% reduction in Ice Harvester duration per level

Role Bonus:
Able to equip Strip Miner and Ice Harvester turrets
_______________________________


I see no built-in MLU unless I'm REALLY blind or something.


You must really be blind!

Economic PVP
Salcon Cliff
Zephyr Corp
#30 - 2012-02-28 20:27:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Salcon Cliff
Quote:
Current top tip for the wary: Uttindar in Minmatar high sec - The asteroid belts are currently patrolled here by a two pilot 'frigate & dessie' team. I don't have their names to hand. I personally advise you don't mine in this system. At least one failed & one successful suicide gank perpetrated by this team. Members of NPC corp 'The Scope'.

Long ago, I survived two or three ss gank attacks in a max-tanked retriever (during one of the hulk-aggedons) in Utti, but then one of the earlier 'failures' came back in a cruiser and succeeded. All in all, it was quite fun. If I had been smart, I would have had at least one combat drone, so I would have gotten a kill, but alas, that was long ago and I knew not better.

Anyway, maybe I will have to try again....a nice command ship in system helps a lot too, so maybe I will add that this time Twisted.

As for the person suggesting that you 'call' concord via an intentional ss gank - my understanding (completely untested but read multiple times) is that an entirely new wave of Concord ships will spawn for each incident of aggression while any in the area will just toddle about. Now, their presence may dissuade would be gankers, but not sure.
Ajita al Tchar
Doomheim
#31 - 2012-02-28 20:42:08 UTC
ITT: Krixtal shows why caffeine is a helluva drug Big smile

Krixtal made some very good points that are worth noting, though, I tease. Good ideas already, but I'll add this: one very important benefit to mining in a system where there aren't 50 other people mining, running missions or just shooting the **** is that you can see stuff on d-scan before it lands on top of you. Hulks take a while to warp out, but if you're in a system where there aren't a ton of other ships on d-scan, and at a belt that's a good distance from stations and stargates, you should be able to warp out in time no problem. Spam that d-scan like you're mining in w-space! Of course, this kind of an aspect of high sec mining that seems important to a lot of people: not paying too much attention to the task.

I can't emphasize this enough: where you mine (the system, that is) is extremely important! It's not like ice mining where there aren't that many ice systems, you can find ore belts almost anywhere any time of the day (and if a system has no more roids left, that's the first hint to reconsider mining there). Finding a system where you literally won't see another person in the belt the whole time you're there is actually not too difficult.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#32 - 2012-02-28 20:54:08 UTC
Ajita al Tchar wrote:
ITT: Krixtal shows why caffeine is a helluva drug Big smile

Krixtal made some very good points that are worth noting, though, I tease.

Of course, with Smartbombs it's all out the window anyway.

3 BS's with them will even pop your ORCA's Pod before CONCORD comes to the 'rescue'.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Haffsol
#33 - 2012-02-28 21:37:33 UTC
sorry but I find all this (these) thread(s) a bit useless. Imho there are only 3 simple things to think about when fitting a Hulk:

1- you want more yeld
2- you want to max out your yeld
3- you can squeeze a lil bit more your yeld numbers

+ the golden rule which is called GET AN HAULER.

Now: do you want to spend more in fitting than in hull? Do you want to AFK mine? Do you want to live an easy life and don't care about being ganked? Do you want to solo mine and spend your time going up&down from belt to station?

Great, you made your choice: it's called Covetor!
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#34 - 2012-02-28 21:46:21 UTC
Haffsol wrote:
sorry but I find all this (these) thread(s) a bit useless. Imho there are only 3 simple things to think about when fitting a Hulk:

1- you want more yeld
2- you want to max out your yeld
3- you can squeeze a lil bit more your yeld numbers

+ the golden rule which is called GET AN HAULER.



This is my philosophy........and a hauler is indeed essential, but helps not with ganks. In fact, it gives you MORE TO LOSE.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Zathryon
Amarr General Drilling and Construction
#35 - 2012-02-28 22:14:02 UTC
ok...

1. I dont AFK mine, but sometimes I do get surprised
2. I mine in a pretty good system, ganks dont happen too often but I want to avoid having any (no station, lots of belts, out of the way)
3. I have a hauler...its called an Orca and a POS...
4. Im not using the Orca at the belt, its staying in the POS unless its hauling, Im not risking a talented and committed ganker taking out my Orca


ty for all the good fits tho, I think im coming down to a pretty solid one.
Ajita al Tchar
Doomheim
#36 - 2012-02-28 23:03:31 UTC  |  Edited by: Ajita al Tchar
Zathryon wrote:
ok...

1. I dont AFK mine, but sometimes I do get surprised
2. I mine in a pretty good system, ganks dont happen too often but I want to avoid having any (no station, lots of belts, out of the way)
3. I have a hauler...its called an Orca and a POS...
4. Im not using the Orca at the belt, its staying in the POS unless its hauling, Im not risking a talented and committed ganker taking out my Orca


ty for all the good fits tho, I think im coming down to a pretty solid one.


Wellll, there's a way you can avoid pretty much all ganks and it doesn't even need a tank. Warp Hulk to roid. Lock roid, start mining. Align to your off grid Orca, cap speed at 75%. When your cargo is full or when you're almost out of range for strips, warp to Orca, unload, return, repeat. For this it's nice to have the range-increasing link running, and the slower your Hulk is, the slower you drift out of range which means you're more likely to leave only when your cargo fills up. When gankers show up, insta-warp away.

Obviously this reduces your overall session yield since you have to warp back and forth. It helps to have the Orca a few thousand km away rather than like 40 au away. There's almost zero percent chance of anyone in high sec scanning down an Orca like that, bringing in smartbombing battleships and blasting it away. But for bonus points you can also have your Orca aligned to your POS so it could also insta-warp away just in case someone really wants to kill you. Mining in this way is definitely an exercise in creative ways to make it harder for you, though, i don't recommend it if you want to continue enjoying mining a few months down the road.

Basically, you can't have it 100% safe, and that's the way it works. That's the way it should work, too.
Dexxel Farcry
Taggart Transdimensional
Virtue of Selfishness
#37 - 2012-02-29 01:03:14 UTC
I fit for maximum yield. I don't care about tanking anything. Gankers don't scare me. Because I pay attention, you should also. If you want to avoid being ganked it's simple. Bury yourself in the belt, align yourself to the station, keep your eye on local, dscan, and use ecm drones. Easy really..
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#38 - 2012-02-29 04:30:01 UTC
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Ajita al Tchar wrote:
ITT: Krixtal shows why caffeine is a helluva drug Big smile

Krixtal made some very good points that are worth noting, though, I tease.

Of course, with Smartbombs it's all out the window anyway.

3 BS's with them will even pop your ORCA's Pod before CONCORD comes to the 'rescue'.


Nope.

I dunno why people fit max cargo orca's (its kinda pointless given only cargo bay, not hangers or ore bay expands), but they almost always have basic shield tanks, and it requires more than 60 seconds for this to work. Concord will be there for 40 seconds.

most orcas are lost to aggressing by the pilot, awoxing, or flying during wars.
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#39 - 2012-02-29 04:45:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Tauranon
Tau Cabalander wrote:
Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Bad fit from the start as this is a seriously paranoid reduction in Yield from zero MLU's.

Hulk has a built-in MLU, and a Hulk wreck yield even less ore, and takes a considerable amount of mining to replace.

Krixtal Icefluxor wrote:
Tau Cabalander wrote:
This fit has more EHP, but I've not used it:

And this.............OMG. Are we supposed to say 'thanks' ? Whatever dude.
Next.........

The fit is provided as an option for those seeking a higher EHP fitting, as I believe it is better than the previously posted small extender fits. Unlike many people, I try not to recommend fits I've only EFT warrior-ed, so I disclosed that fact.

I've not used it because I prefer to be able to swap out the PDU in my hisec fitting for a wstab when mining in w-space; it has saved my Hulks. I can't do that with the EHP fit as the APC is required to fit the medium extender. There are no suicide alpha-ganks in w-space, so I fit the PDU when in hisec to give a few more HP, as a hull reinforcement module won't fit.

If you prefer a less durable but higher yield MLU fit, I certainly won't stop you. The choice is yours.



The fit is basically correct imo - Krixtals elitist absolute is kinda wrong in this case. You lose only 9% by not having the MLU, and if this fit is decisive in survival event, then the owner is about 200 mining hours ahead of the theoretical someone that lost a hulk because they had the MLU.

It EFTs out to a bit less than my alts fit that I use, but my alt uses a grid implant, so that I can avoid losing a shield rig. IMO not enough to bother with buying the implant if you don't already have it.

Being over 30k ehp, means its largely proof against a solo brutix gank, requires 4 destroyers or 3 cruisers instead of 3 and 2, and is only a so-so proposition for a T2 gun tornado (they don't always get the third volley). IMO those are enough circumstances that its a lot more survivable for overlooking things on d-scan (or having the phone ring and then local spiking or whatever).
Haffsol
#40 - 2012-02-29 06:44:06 UTC
Quote:
You lose only 9% by not having the MLU


1 Hulk - 1 MLU = Covetor!

so if you bought an Hulk you want that "only 9%"