These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
Previous page123Next page
 

Micro-Siege Destroyer- The Minmatar Hedgehog

Author
CaleAdaire
Deep Core Mining Inc.
#21 - 2012-02-15 15:52:35 UTC  |  Edited by: CaleAdaire
Broken Post

Trust in God, Have Faith in Fusion.

CaleAdaire
Deep Core Mining Inc.
#22 - 2012-02-15 15:54:22 UTC  |  Edited by: CaleAdaire
Bearilian wrote:
CaleAdaire wrote:
Dude, believe it or not, CCP already implemented this. They created an entire group of ships that use larger weapons than their class counterparts, these ships can easily strike bigger ships, smaller ships can be alpha'ed by these ships but these ships are not invulnerable. The very best part? No "Micro-Siege Module" or anything complicated, just point and shoot. Maybe you should play some before suggesting changes.


its surprises me the level of limited creativity some of eve players have. and the retorts are pitifully prescripted. the sad part to me is that so many people lack the imagination to help further most ideas. they only have a habit of playing the game a certian way, and refuse to accept the idea that there would ever be a major change... like you said in your post, the "best part" of tier 3 bc's is they are not to complicated for you to fly. "just point and shoot" is that really all you can handle when it comes to playing games??? and then you tell us to play more before making suggestions and ideas in the "FEATURES AND IDEAS DISCUSSIONS????? you should look up what features and idea mean before simply coming into the forums and crying that everything is working the way you want it to and ccp should only make the changes that benefit your play style...

if there are MAJOR mechanical ballancing issues with the idea that the OP suggested, then you should outline them in detail. explain to the rest of us how it would effect fleet combat, solo combat and gang combat etc. be specific because if there is an actuall issue with the release of a ship concept, everyone involved will at least read it, and some of us (myself) included are not afraid to admit we were wrong if you can explain why. well my rant is over. thanks for reading Bear

-now to respond to what you wrote. no, there is nothing like this in the game. supers can perform something similar, but we are talking about the destroyer hull.. the second smallist ship size in the game! the suggestion i offered was just a tangent on the mother idea, and would introduce intrigue to combat.

I'll admit i have some unthought out ideas that would not work with the games mechanics. But I am in the right forum thread for comming up with ideas. and proposing changes. and suggesting fixes.

The word you are looking for is "Pro-scripted", not "Prescripted".
It's spelled "Balancing".
And you were thinking of "Affect" not "Effect".
The single flaw is this, you want new toys because YOU want new toys. The reality of it is this, CCP only just turned a page in their book and began a new chapter in the story of EvE online. CCP's great apology for WiS was Tier3 BC's, and while new ships are always cool and neat and most certainly tactics will evolve around them, those ships marred their apologies. They came out as a distraction from what was broken, like when your dog died as a kid and Mom and Dad got you a kitten or whatever, they are great, and we love them, but they aren't the same are they? What we need now is for CCP to begin in earnest, the repair of the game. SOV mechanics need to be drastically overhauled to spark war again, balance needs to be brought to the CSM for accurate representation of the player base, many ships already in game are in desperate need of rebalancing.

Those are only three of many issues plaguing EvE online, and to add insult injury, players aren't concerned with making a good game great again!. People like you walk in on Mommy and Daddy fighting about whats wrong with the house and say... "I want a new toy!" Or, the best one I've heard so far, "I want my missile names back!" Let CCP fix whats broken, balance whats falling, and work out whats wrong before we all start pestering for new toys.

And I'm not against new stuff, just the opposite, I love new things and embrace the scary change they bring. A T3 hunter seeker destroyer specifically made to find SB's, HELL YEAH! Or maybe Tech 3 frigs? That would be legit. But both ideas require alot of in depth mechanics analysis to ensure these things aren't overpowered. When I say the Tier3 BC's are "simple", I don't mean that they are "easy" to fly. I mean they were implemented with relatively small effort. From alliances in 0.0 to corps in WH's to single dudes in HighSec, EVERYONE is still figuring out ways to use this new toy.

Let's let the current issues get resolved, let's play with our new toy right now, and let's let Mommy and Daddy fix the house so we don't have to go live with uncle Star Wars, or god forbid... Crazy aunt WoW!

Trust in God, Have Faith in Fusion.

Mary Annabelle
Moonlit Bonsai
#23 - 2012-02-15 16:14:32 UTC
CaleAdaire wrote:
The word you are looking for is "Pro-scripted", not "Prescripted".
It's spelled "Balancing"
The single flaw is this, you want new toys because YOU want new toys. The reality of it is this, CCP only just turned a page in their book and began a new chapter in the story of EvE online. CCP's great apology for WiS was Tier3 BC's, and while new ships are always cool and neat and most certainly tactics will evolve around them, those ships marred their apologies. They came out as a distraction from what was broken, like when your dog died as a kid and Mom and Dad got you a kitten or whatever, they are great, and we love them, but they aren't the same are they? What we need now is for CCP to begin in earnest, the repair of the game. SOV mechanics need to be drastically overhauled to spark war again, balance needs to be brought to the CSM for accurate representation of the player base, many ships already in game are in desperate need of rebalancing.

Those are only three of many issues plaguing EvE online, and to add insult injury, players aren't concerned with making a good game great again!. People like you walk in on Mommy and Daddy fighting about whats wrong with the house and say... "I want a new toy!" Or, the best one I've heard so far, "I want my missile names back!" Let CCP fix whats broken, balance whats falling, and work out whats wrong before we all start pestering for new toys.

And I'm not against new stuff, just the opposite, I love new things and embrace the scary change they bring. A T3 hunter seeker destroyer specifically made to find SB's, HELL YEAH! Or maybe Tech 3 frigs? That would be legit. But both ideas require alot of in depth mechanics analysis to ensure these things aren't overpowered. When I say the Tier3 BC's are "simple", I don't mean that they are "easy" to fly. I mean they were implemented with relatively small effort. From alliances in 0.0 to corps in WH's to single dudes in HighSec, EVERYONE is still figuring out ways to use this new toy.

Let's let the current issues get resolved, let's play with our new toy right now, and let's let Mommy and Daddy fix the house so we don't have to go live with uncle Star Wars, or god forbid... Crazy aunt WoW!

Wait... what?

You have some powerful things to say about now not being the time to bring in new ideas, but to fix what is already out there.

I would be happy to endorse your idea, if you were to make a thread for it on it's own. I happen to think broken things need attention too!

Now, please leave the destroyers alone, I want moar....
CaleAdaire
Deep Core Mining Inc.
#24 - 2012-02-15 17:01:24 UTC
Mary Annabelle wrote:

Wait... what?

You have some powerful things to say about now not being the time to bring in new ideas, but to fix what is already out there.

I would be happy to endorse your idea, if you were to make a thread for it on it's own. I happen to think broken things need attention too!

Now, please leave the destroyers alone, I want moar....

So wait... You endorse what I have to say, and agree with it, then turn around and say "MOAR TOYS!"?

I'm confused, do you or don't you agree with me? Please elaborate how you can agree with my post then ask for more toys. I think obvious troll is obvious in this case. That or your head is so far up your @$$ that you fail to see the complete death of logic in your statement.

Trust in God, Have Faith in Fusion.

Mary Annabelle
Moonlit Bonsai
#25 - 2012-02-15 17:20:00 UTC
CaleAdaire wrote:
Mary Annabelle wrote:

Wait... what?

You have some powerful things to say about now not being the time to bring in new ideas, but to fix what is already out there.

I would be happy to endorse your idea, if you were to make a thread for it on it's own. I happen to think broken things need attention too!

Now, please leave the destroyers alone, I want moar....

So wait... You endorse what I have to say, and agree with it, then turn around and say "MOAR TOYS!"?

I'm confused, do you or don't you agree with me? Please elaborate how you can agree with my post then ask for more toys. I think obvious troll is obvious in this case. That or your head is so far up your @$$ that you fail to see the complete death of logic in your statement.

Down boy, you want the entire company to dance to your music?

At best, CCP will devote a limited number of people to anything, which includes fixing perceived issues as you describe them.

And what you are describing involves making new changes to establish conditions you like. More warfare? I am happy you have a shopping list, and I think it's a decent idea, but it hardly requires them to abandon all other ideas to implement.

As for your complaints about balancing existing items, you first need to convince them about it, and that is best done by offering ideas how you would do it.

Ship X is bad like this, but can be balanced by doing that. ETC.

Just leave cloaking and local chat out of the discussion, those are being done to death already.

It also helps if you believe in your ideas enough to put them into their own thread.
CaleAdaire
Deep Core Mining Inc.
#26 - 2012-02-15 17:28:25 UTC
Obvious Troll = Obvious. ^^^

Trust in God, Have Faith in Fusion.

Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#27 - 2012-02-15 17:39:47 UTC
CaleAdaire wrote:
Obvious Troll = Obvious. ^^^

ROFL @Cale

Sorry Mary, I think you fell for this one.

He even admits he was trolling, despite it being obvious enough already.

At least he had the mercy to let you off the hook... LOL
CaleAdaire
Deep Core Mining Inc.
#28 - 2012-02-15 19:32:22 UTC
(╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻
Screw it, y'all are idiots.

Trust in God, Have Faith in Fusion.

Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#29 - 2012-02-15 20:02:26 UTC
And people actually once complained MY ships where horrible?

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.

Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#30 - 2012-02-15 20:06:23 UTC
Nova Fox wrote:
And people actually once complained MY ships where horrible?

How would you change or improve upon the design I proposed?
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#31 - 2012-02-15 20:08:27 UTC
Thrash it start over on something not so out of the water, acutally listen to the feed back here.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.

Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#32 - 2012-02-15 20:35:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Nikk Narrel
Nova Fox wrote:
Thrash it start over on something not so out of the water, acutally listen to the feed back here.

I have been. Most of the feedback has attempted to be constructive, and more than anything pointed out that I made the mistake of forgetting people being unable to read my mind.
(They prompted me to better explain my idea here)

Basic summary of feedback so far in thread. (With how I responded)

Feedback points made:

* Why do new ships happen, (an automated canned post possibly, I still tried to respond)
* Won't it need to online it's modules after changing? (Nope- already covered in original post)
* Why would someone choose this over a BS? (List of reasons offered)
* Wouldn't smaller launchers be fun too? (Not destroyer sized either, reference Assault Launchers for cruisers, I pointed out anything below cruise was usable, but had limits of siege mode if CPU / grid too high in normal)
* Caps and Supercaps need love too! (I agreed)
* Suggestion regarding physical size of launchers, and the defense being un destroyer-ish (concept missunderstood, the launchers are cargo-packaged effectively and so is the CPU and Powergrid. I explained in the form of an italicized log entry by the engineering team to be more entertaining. Basically, anything stuck in stand-by mode is repackaged until siege mode unpacks them)
* Noone should make anything new until EVE problems are fixed. (problems described not necessarily considered important to everyone, but clearly to the poster they were)

A rather clever comparison was made to a siege tank in a blizz game, which when considered, makes for a fair analogy.

I considered the cruiser class on this, but with recent battlecruiser additions that felt like it was done already.
I looked at frigates too, but we already have T2 frigs mounting torpedo launchers, and cloaking too! They seemed well represented already.
Bearilian
Man Eating Bears
#33 - 2012-02-15 21:53:20 UTC
every single new ship idea thread i have seen, someone assumes that we want this ship emediately, and we dont want any changes to the current unbalance. its a sad foresight, and so horribly wrong. "features and ideas" is not only for how we can fix the game mechanics, but for what we can add. what we can create. the devs takes our ideas and add them to their own if they like what they read. all we are doing is giving them more content to consider.

and this idea holds alot of merit, because it is unlike most other ship ideas. (and there are some seriously bad ones). this does not make an OP ship, it would have adaquate weaknesses for the strength it gains.

so please keep the hate out of this and other ship suggestion threads. all we need to know is how the idea can be improved to not be an unbalance if introduced.
Mary Annabelle
Moonlit Bonsai
#34 - 2012-02-15 21:56:57 UTC
Hey Nova, even I think his sub idea was toast. (May it rest in peace)

This one actually sounds fun, although I suspect it will be really vulnerable during it's transition phase.

(If I understand the idea, the shields won't be online until it finishes entering siege, and will lose it the moment it triggers leaving siege. That's one heck of a vulnerable period where the right ship with a smart bomb can casually cruise up, and pop it like a soap bubble)

Will it be fun? Yes.

I think fun SHOULD be high risk. This definitely will be that, I think, on both counts.
Nikk Narrel
Moonlit Bonsai
#35 - 2012-02-16 19:18:05 UTC
Mary Annabelle wrote:
Hey Nova, even I think his sub idea was toast. (May it rest in peace)

This one actually sounds fun, although I suspect it will be really vulnerable during it's transition phase.

(If I understand the idea, the shields won't be online until it finishes entering siege, and will lose it the moment it triggers leaving siege. That's one heck of a vulnerable period where the right ship with a smart bomb can casually cruise up, and pop it like a soap bubble)

Will it be fun? Yes.

I think fun SHOULD be high risk. This definitely will be that, I think, on both counts.

It is the intention that the siege level shields only are present in the actual mode itself. because it is in the process of being packed or unpacked, the power is not there to have them in transition.

Truly, a vulnerable period to take into consideration, as you observed.
Mary Annabelle
Moonlit Bonsai
#36 - 2012-02-16 23:06:07 UTC
Nikk Narrel wrote:
It is the intention that the siege level shields only are present in the actual mode itself. because it is in the process of being packed or unpacked, the power is not there to have them in transition.

Truly, a vulnerable period to take into consideration, as you observed.

I am getting visions of destroyer roams becoming more popular.

(Heck, who doesn't like thrasher fun already?)

I still think this one is a perfect mining buddy. Park it in your orca next to your hulk...
Geddhoff Mai-Lonn
Moonlit Bonsai
#37 - 2012-02-17 17:41:38 UTC
Friendly Bump
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#38 - 2012-02-17 20:06:00 UTC
Well I am just going to say one thing real quick

Fundamentally the ship is flawed as it becomes immobile for such minimal gains.

In one minute a tier 1 destroyer can destroy this ship if even the shields where online.

It wont fare much better from heavier ships that can oumph out more. Which is why I suggested another attempt at the same idea.

As for what I would suggest would actually incur using a ship I already designed for this role similarly.
Its called a pod ship it drops off external modules. While any ship could fit these 'pods' this classes of ships are known for carrying heavier than normal modules. As long as the ship is there locking targets the ejected pods will fire upon it. Pods can be destroyed, destorying the host ship only stops the pods form selecting newer targets. The pods will eventually run out of ammo or batteries before self popping.

Problem with pod ships and any external modules is that once the module is online its ejected out of the fitted and has to dock up to refit another, this can get expensive but its great for brining in additoinal fire power in a short amount of time.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.

Ares Renton
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#39 - 2012-02-18 00:36:30 UTC
The only thing I could see this ship being conceivably good at, is as a cheap deployable defense platform (since its DPS would be too weak to take on structures).

Generally though, most players would proooooobably rather roleplay a spaceship pilot than a sentry gun.
Amaroq Dricaldari
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#40 - 2012-02-19 03:35:09 UTC
Unscheduled Offworld Activation. Incoming Wormhole.

TL:DR
I just bumped your thread

This is my signature. There are many like it, but this one is mine.

Previous page123Next page