Ships & Modules

The Tengu is obviously in need of a nerf.

When you are able to pump two billion ISK into a ship and use it with a five hundred million ISK boosting alt + a scouting alt to make it be able to take on lots of things, that obviously means it is overpowered, alright?

Also hoping you guys can see the sarcasm in this post and see that the Tengu is not in need of a nerf. It is only as effective as the other T3s should be... and without all the ISK people dump into them and without the boosting alts it would not be that effective... really.

The only reason I can see anybody considering the tengu overpowered is if you fit it with a 100mn AB as cheaply as possible and run it with skirmish links. Though I would argue that in this case it is not the tengu that is overpowered, but rather skirmish links.

Otherwise it does basically everything else pretty badly on a price/performance basis. Honestly I'm not really that familiar with how effective the tengu fleet comp is in direct comparison to other fleet comps, so maybe it's severely OP there, but I don't really think so. And even in the situation where it is decided that the tengu is OP in fleets (buffer,ab, HM fit I mean), it's ultimately more an issue of the insane damage projection of heavy missiles than the tengu itself (see drakes).

Scissors : "Paper is fine nerf Rock"

Go, fit a 3Bn Vindi or Bhall fit or even a bloody Mach or any non missile non oversized AB T3 setup, and get a T3 booster and a scouting alt, any drugs and implants of your choosing, and go try to engage series of 4-7 man gangs and wipe the floor with each one.

100MN ab Tengu (and missile Legion with similar fit) are broken like old nano was broken. Missiles ignore your own speed and so avoid causing problems to your own tracking that gun nano ships have to work with. They can engage and disengage when and who they want; without really committing to fights. Nano age didn't have that much solo pimp ships raping gang after gang, it was mostly nano gangs doing the raping. And extreme availability of T3 booster alts now also gives you ability to tackle people from 50km and laugh at them, being able to disengage whenever you want.

Did you even read the OP?

Pointless post in a pointless thread.

Sprite Can is cute.

I love you Jude

Rapier + Neut Dominix = Tengu dead with only ~250mil isk.

Sure, you'll probably lose the Rapier, but not before the Domi has gotten into its own web range.

Also, aren't the resists the same as t2 ships?

Which closes a quite entertaining circle, since they're also used as one of the few available counters to blobs on various levels of the game (100mn roaming, sig-buffer-reach fleeting; though the latter seem to have already hit the counter-balance issue of numbers, if you listen to Mittens latest smug on the MB3 show that got referenced by Jester's trek and linked up on these forums). I wonder when people wake up and realize that ship-ship balancing is getting more and more skewered by scale.

Kinda like Titans, and all discussion revolving around them - and once again a question of circling semantics ;).

As for the internal balance of Tech III... i guess it's pretty common knowledge these days that the Legion and Tengu only have mainstream-appeal in their respective "HAC" setups, while the Proteus and Loki respectively have their mainstream appeal in their "Recon" setups. It's quite balanced, beside the fact that it's statistically more representative flying a general purpose "HAC" than a more role specific "Recon" when Top20 lists and such are compiled.

In other uses the Loki is the most prioritized booster, the Tengu seem most proficient at reliable PvE-DPS when exploration fit, the Proteus has the best gank-return (even when cloaky) and the Legion have the most allround applicable side-appeal by dipping into the "Recon" ideal with it's mini-Bhaal mimic. I am probably omitting a bunch of other potential or circular uses, but that's the gist of it. There's really no such thing as untolerable imbalance among the Strategic Cruisers - mostly just a question of people wanting their Proteus do what the Tengu do well and vice versa, instead of training for a ship that match their personal purpose.

In that regard, the people crying out for a nerf to the Tengu is doing pretty much the same thing as the guy who wanted drones back on his Moros and got chewed out for it. The only difference is there being more idiots trying to empire-PvE with their Stratcruisers than there are trying othersec-PvE with their Dreads.