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Recent CSM/Mittani High Sec/Null Sec issues
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Chiggy W
Hard-Luck Industries
#1 - 2012-02-02 15:45:51 UTC
The forums are currently filled with tears, rage and a generally feeling that high sec is getting screwed by the current CSM. This has peaked my interest because to date, I have seen no evidence of the Mittani or other CSM members causing high sec to be nerfed. Please answer the following if you can:

1. What has been "nerfed" in high sec recently as a direct result of the CSM? More to the point, what in high sec has been nerfed recently, regardless of CSM involvement?

2. Why the hate on the Mittani? Despite my personal views on Goons, I think he has done a pretty good job, but it seems that tons of you disagree with this, why?

3. Why the rage over CSM candidates playstyles? Although I might not be a scammer or a so called "griefer", I understand that they are valid playstyles, and therefore deserve CSM representation if enough people get behind a candidate to make them a CSM.

4. Do people not understand why more people in null are motivated to vote, and why we have a largely (not completely) null sec based CSM (hint is has nothing to do with moon goo, if you don't understand it, please don't sperge about it)? Why are people claiming that the 66% of characters in high sec means that high sec should have automatically get representation?

I know I will get trolled to high heaven, but I'm genuinely interested in what people have to say about the above.
Karn Dulake
Doomheim
#2 - 2012-02-02 15:55:37 UTC
Chiggy W wrote:
The forums are currently filled with tears, rage and a generally feeling that high sec is getting screwed by the current CSM. This has peaked my interest because to date, I have seen no evidence of the Mittani or other CSM members causing high sec to be nerfed. Please answer the following if you can:

1. What has been "nerfed" in high sec recently as a direct result of the CSM? More to the point, what in high sec has been nerfed recently, regardless of CSM involvement?

2. Why the hate on the Mittani? Despite my personal views on Goons, I think he has done a pretty good job, but it seems that tons of you disagree with this, why?

3. Why the rage over CSM candidates playstyles? Although I might not be a scammer or a so called "griefer", I understand that they are valid playstyles, and therefore deserve CSM representation if enough people get behind a candidate to make them a CSM.

4. Do people not understand why more people in null are motivated to vote, and why we have a largely (not completely) null sec based CSM (hint is has nothing to do with moon goo, if you don't understand it, please don't sperge about it)? Why are people claiming that the 66% of characters in high sec means that high sec should have automatically get representation?

I know I will get trolled to high heaven, but I'm genuinely interested in what people have to say about the above.



The main beef with a lot of people is that Mighty Mittans is only interested in nullsec and not interested in lowsec/highsec.

Secondly he wears the title of CSM chairman but he actively scams people using that title which is not what it was invented for.

and he and his neckbeard army get the drop on all future plans for the game far in advance of everyone else and his alliance is there to ruin the gameplay of other people.

Stuff like that
I dont normally troll, but when i do i do it on General Discussion.
Heimdallofasgard
Ministry of Furious Retribution
Insidious.
#3 - 2012-02-02 15:56:49 UTC
Three words:

Gallente Ice Interdiction.

High sec tears linger a lot longer than normal tears. they'll be talking about it for years.
Messoroz
AQUILA INC
#4 - 2012-02-02 16:03:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Messoroz
Karn Dulake wrote:
Chiggy W wrote:
The forums are currently filled with tears, rage and a generally feeling that high sec is getting screwed by the current CSM. This has peaked my interest because to date, I have seen no evidence of the Mittani or other CSM members causing high sec to be nerfed. Please answer the following if you can:

1. What has been "nerfed" in high sec recently as a direct result of the CSM? More to the point, what in high sec has been nerfed recently, regardless of CSM involvement?

2. Why the hate on the Mittani? Despite my personal views on Goons, I think he has done a pretty good job, but it seems that tons of you disagree with this, why?

3. Why the rage over CSM candidates playstyles? Although I might not be a scammer or a so called "griefer", I understand that they are valid playstyles, and therefore deserve CSM representation if enough people get behind a candidate to make them a CSM.

4. Do people not understand why more people in null are motivated to vote, and why we have a largely (not completely) null sec based CSM (hint is has nothing to do with moon goo, if you don't understand it, please don't sperge about it)? Why are people claiming that the 66% of characters in high sec means that high sec should have automatically get representation?

I know I will get trolled to high heaven, but I'm genuinely interested in what people have to say about the above.



The main beef with a lot of people is that Mighty Mittans is only interested in nullsec and not interested in lowsec/highsec.

Secondly he wears the title of CSM chairman but he actively scams people using that title which is not what it was invented for.

and he and his neckbeard army get the drop on all future plans for the game far in advance of everyone else and his alliance is there to ruin the gameplay of other people.

Stuff like that


There are no CCP rules regarding what the CSM and CSM chairs must be interested in. It's also silly to think that there could be even an way to make sure an CSM person keeps interest in everything uniformly.

He has never scammed anyone using the title, heck he tends to stay out of getting involved in scams directly but often is implicated indirectly.

Right, because goons clearly forsaw the future plan was to nerf tech moons, so they decided to take a region full of tech moons?
Jayem See
Perkone
Caldari State
#5 - 2012-02-02 16:06:09 UTC
1. Insurance payouts. That was a silly (but strangely common sense) nerf

2. I don't really care that much - he's doing ok as far as my limited ass gives a shite

3. Sandbox. Play how you like

4. Yes I understand - and whilst I don't currently live there I also understand that most of them want what is good for Eve. Even if that doesn't fit your playstyle. You want more? Make more noise. It's all about investment of time at the end of the day.

5..........oh.

Aaaaaaand relax.
Krios Ahzek
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2012-02-02 16:11:12 UTC
Jayem See wrote:
1. Insurance payouts. That was a silly (but strangely common sense) nerf



Nerfing insurance payouts on suicide ganking is actually a highsec buff.

Unless there's a conspiracy which I am not aware of.

 Though All Men Do Despise Us
Karadion
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#7 - 2012-02-02 16:14:42 UTC
Unlimited source of income with little effort (High-Sec Incursion) under Concord protection is a high-sec buff.
KrakizBad
Section 8.
#8 - 2012-02-02 16:15:52 UTC
Karn Dulake wrote:
Chiggy W wrote:
The forums are currently filled with tears, rage and a generally feeling that high sec is getting screwed by the current CSM. This has peaked my interest because to date, I have seen no evidence of the Mittani or other CSM members causing high sec to be nerfed. Please answer the following if you can:

1. What has been "nerfed" in high sec recently as a direct result of the CSM? More to the point, what in high sec has been nerfed recently, regardless of CSM involvement?

2. Why the hate on the Mittani? Despite my personal views on Goons, I think he has done a pretty good job, but it seems that tons of you disagree with this, why?

3. Why the rage over CSM candidates playstyles? Although I might not be a scammer or a so called "griefer", I understand that they are valid playstyles, and therefore deserve CSM representation if enough people get behind a candidate to make them a CSM.

4. Do people not understand why more people in null are motivated to vote, and why we have a largely (not completely) null sec based CSM (hint is has nothing to do with moon goo, if you don't understand it, please don't sperge about it)? Why are people claiming that the 66% of characters in high sec means that high sec should have automatically get representation?

I know I will get trolled to high heaven, but I'm genuinely interested in what people have to say about the above.



The main beef with a lot of people is that Mighty Mittans is only interested in nullsec and not interested in lowsec/highsec.

Secondly he wears the title of CSM chairman but he actively scams people using that title which is not what it was invented for.

and he and his neckbeard army get the drop on all future plans for the game far in advance of everyone else and his alliance is there to ruin the gameplay of other people.

Stuff like that

Prove it.
Chiggy W
Hard-Luck Industries
#9 - 2012-02-02 16:18:24 UTC
Karn Dulake wrote:


The main beef with a lot of people is that Mighty Mittans is only interested in nullsec and not interested in lowsec/highsec.



People get upset that a CSM rep for 0.0 gets elected and doesn't represent low sec/high sec? So people are basicly getting upset that a candidate they didn't vote for doesn't represent their interests?

Karn Dulake wrote:

Secondly he wears the title of CSM chairman but he actively scams people using that title which is not what it was invented for.


1. I am unaware of any scams he has been involved in, especially one involving the CSM title, please provide evidence/info

Karn Dulake wrote:

and he and his neckbeard army get the drop on all future plans for the game far in advance of everyone else and his alliance is there to ruin the gameplay of other people.

Stuff like that


Not disputing that he could have access to this info, but as the previous point, I think we need some more info/evidence. As far as I know, the CSM stuff is heavilly NDA'd, and surely if it was being used for in-game advantage it would be a) obvious and b) picked up upon by CCP?
Jayem See
Perkone
Caldari State
#10 - 2012-02-02 16:21:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Jayem See
Krios Ahzek wrote:
Jayem See wrote:
1. Insurance payouts. That was a silly (but strangely common sense) nerf



Nerfing insurance payouts on suicide ganking is actually a highsec buff.

Unless there's a conspiracy which I am not aware of.


I know - I was playing with words.... Smile

Ed: was pretty subtle and perhaps not obvious enough - I'll leave that one to Tippia to explain

Aaaaaaand relax.
Weiland Taur
The Icarus Expedition
Solyaris Chtonium
#11 - 2012-02-02 16:23:19 UTC

The CSM Chair appears to be doing a great job.

His style may rub some the wrong way but other's find it amusing. I think the general rage in hisec is from the PVE base that saw what they percieved to be a general across the board boost in the ability of griefers and gankers to make their lives miserable with no corresponding boost in counter measures. This coupled with the Mittani's general endorsement of such activity and Goonswarm's Ice Interdiction has helped to raise the overall temperature among those feeling... victimized and marginalized.

While I would not endorse senseless flopping and whining ... the perception that a cerain game segment is here to provide targets for a smaller segment has not helped make the PVE crowd feel any better and the Chair makes an easy target.

Samillian
Angry Mustellid
#12 - 2012-02-02 16:23:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Samillian
1. Nothing except insurance payouts to losses involving CONCORD.

2. I agree he's done a reasonable job as on the whole has the majority of the CSM for the entire game.

3. I get the feeling that this has more to do with the perception of a portion of the HiSec population that are not Low or Null sec alts or just getting on with playing thew game and having fun. There are a fair few who are so used to everything going their way that when other aspects of the game are looked at they need something to focus their rage on. Wait until FW, LowSec and WH space get some love the rage will probably be just as vitriolic but focused on whoever pushed for these areas to be worked on and rather than attack the policies they will attack the person.

4. No. I wouldn't be surprised if maybe not the majority then at least a considerable minority of HiSec's 66% were Low/Null sec alts (three of them are my alts and I know players with far more HiSec alts than that) and are already represented by those their mains voted into CSM6.

NBSI shall be the whole of the Law
Karn Dulake
Doomheim
#13 - 2012-02-02 16:32:13 UTC
Messoroz wrote:
Karn Dulake wrote:
Chiggy W wrote:
The forums are currently filled with tears, rage and a generally feeling that high sec is getting screwed by the current CSM. This has peaked my interest because to date, I have seen no evidence of the Mittani or other CSM members causing high sec to be nerfed. Please answer the following if you can:

1. What has been "nerfed" in high sec recently as a direct result of the CSM? More to the point, what in high sec has been nerfed recently, regardless of CSM involvement?

2. Why the hate on the Mittani? Despite my personal views on Goons, I think he has done a pretty good job, but it seems that tons of you disagree with this, why?

3. Why the rage over CSM candidates playstyles? Although I might not be a scammer or a so called "griefer", I understand that they are valid playstyles, and therefore deserve CSM representation if enough people get behind a candidate to make them a CSM.

4. Do people not understand why more people in null are motivated to vote, and why we have a largely (not completely) null sec based CSM (hint is has nothing to do with moon goo, if you don't understand it, please don't sperge about it)? Why are people claiming that the 66% of characters in high sec means that high sec should have automatically get representation?

I know I will get trolled to high heaven, but I'm genuinely interested in what people have to say about the above.



The main beef with a lot of people is that Mighty Mittans is only interested in nullsec and not interested in lowsec/highsec.

Secondly he wears the title of CSM chairman but he actively scams people using that title which is not what it was invented for.

and he and his neckbeard army get the drop on all future plans for the game far in advance of everyone else and his alliance is there to ruin the gameplay of other people.

Stuff like that


There are no CCP rules regarding what the CSM and CSM chairs must be interested in. It's also silly to think that there could be even an way to make sure an CSM person keeps interest in everything uniformly.

He has never scammed anyone using the title, heck he tends to stay out of getting involved in scams directly but often is implicated indirectly.

Right, because goons clearly forsaw the future plan was to nerf tech moons, so they decided to take a region full of tech moons?



None of what you said matters, its what a lot of people believe and thats the nub of it
I dont normally troll, but when i do i do it on General Discussion.
Jayem See
Perkone
Caldari State
#14 - 2012-02-02 16:35:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Jayem See
Karn Dulake wrote:
[quote=Messoroz][quote=Karn Dulake][quote=Chiggy W]The forums are currently filled with tears, rage and a generally feeling that high sec is getting screwed by the current CSM. This has peaked my interest because to date, I have seen no evidence of the Mittani or other CSM members causing high sec to be nerfed. Please answer the following if you can:

Etc


None of what you said matters, its what a lot of people believe and thats the nub of it


Lots of people believe in Communism. That doesn't make it right.

None of what you said matters......

Ed: quote fail

Aaaaaaand relax.
KrakizBad
Section 8.
#15 - 2012-02-02 16:38:58 UTC
Karn Dulake wrote:
None of what you said matters, its what a lot of people believe and thats the nub of it

This, too, shall be relegated to the bowels of the forums where no one will see it or care. Like it deserves.
Il Feytid
State War Academy
Caldari State
#16 - 2012-02-02 16:39:56 UTC
Karadion wrote:
Unlimited source of income with little effort (High-Sec Incursion) under Concord protection is a high-sec buff.


Unlimited?! Well in that case let me head to high sec and... oh wait. Looks like the Incursions don't last forever. Looks like another goon lying about game mechanics. DOH!
Karadion
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#17 - 2012-02-02 16:42:32 UTC
Marlona Sky wrote:
Karadion wrote:
Unlimited source of income with little effort (High-Sec Incursion) under Concord protection is a high-sec buff.


Unlimited?! Well in that case let me head to high sec and... oh wait. Looks like the Incursions don't last forever. Looks like another goon lying about game mechanics. DOH!

There are always at least two incursions in high-sec almost all the time. Hence unlimited.
Karn Dulake
Doomheim
#18 - 2012-02-02 16:47:17 UTC
This is why the internet is annoying as its full of halfwitts

When i stated the reasons why people are against Mittans its not my view its a commonly held view

I could not careless what he gets up to and im sure he has been a force for good not that i give a flying ****. i was answering the OPs question of why the hate not why i hate him.


I dont normally troll, but when i do i do it on General Discussion.
Serene Repose
#19 - 2012-02-02 16:50:38 UTC
Who would troll a troll like this OP?
Not me.

We must accommodate the idiocracy.
Florestan Bronstein
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#20 - 2012-02-02 16:57:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Florestan Bronstein
Chiggy W wrote:
Karn Dulake wrote:

Secondly he wears the title of CSM chairman but he actively scams people using that title which is not what it was invented for.


1. I am unaware of any scams he has been involved in, especially one involving the CSM title, please provide evidence/info

you will probably hear wild stories about The Mittani being involved in supercapital scams but these are rumors created by a small clique of bitter ex-BOB pilots who'd try anything to discredit him.

As CCP's own Evelopdia states:

Quote:
CSM History

The Mittani has been chairman of the CSM for 3 Years Running now. He has substantial power over changes in EvE. He is known for his Anti-Scamming Regimes and Support for Balancing of Supercapitals

3rd Party Services

The Mittani is a well known and Often used 3rd Party for the past 4 Years, He has secured +10 Trillion isk in Trades of Super Capitals and Titans. He was famous for securing the trade of Shrike's Avatar one of the first avatars built and often Vouched for by Other Popular 3rd Parties
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