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Highsec Concerns about CSM- no representation? Highsec's fault? Help from CCP?
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ugh zug
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#101 - 2012-01-28 18:30:03 UTC
Guys, if this is really an issue, the next CSM election put yourself on the ballet or find yourself a person who could represent the needs of highsec players and get behind them. there are many more highsec players then there are null and lowsec, all you need to do is VOTE.

Want me to shut up? Remove content from my post,1B. Remove my content from a thread I have started 2B.
Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#102 - 2012-01-28 18:32:44 UTC
Thing is I look at all the ones claiming to be running for high sec CSM and not a single one of them I feel has grasp or understanding of the situation.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.
Hainnz
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#103 - 2012-01-28 18:58:01 UTC
Ankh probably got elected because she was hard-core bat-**** crazy enough to do the work required to get elected as a (generally) high/low-sec rep. Of course the prob is that once elected, that person is still hard-core bat-**** crazy...
Name Family Name
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#104 - 2012-01-28 19:11:04 UTC
All characters on my 3 accounts are in highsec currently, yet I want to see it nerfed into the ground.

I guess I'm not the only one - so the OPs assumption that those 66% living in highsec also want it to be buffed is flawed.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#105 - 2012-01-28 19:11:10 UTC
Hainnz wrote:
Ankh probably got elected because she was hard-core bat-**** crazy enough to do the work required to get elected as a (generally) high/low-sec rep. Of course the prob is that once elected, that person is still hard-core bat-**** crazy...


Her basic MO was to spread fear, uncertainty and doubt about the other candidates. She'd basically make stuff up about the other guys running for CSMs [THEY'RE COMING FOR YOUR MISSIONS!!!11] and evemailed it directly to the local list or just straight up posted it in local in trade hubs.

Then she made a boatload of vague promises to "protect hi-sec" from these fictitious threats, and, so far as I know, never actually delivered any real result whatsoever other than feeding her own titanic ego and exposing her massive ignorance of the the way EVE works.

Her campaign goals, from start to finish, were: All glory to the Ankhnotoad!

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#106 - 2012-01-28 19:12:20 UTC
Name Family Name wrote:
All characters on my 3 accounts are in highsec currently, yet I want to see it nerfed into the ground.

I guess I'm not the only one - so the OPs assumption that those 66% living in highsec also want it to be buffed is flawed.


Both my mains are in 0.0, 3 of the 6 characters on my account are in hi-sec, and I want hi-sec to be improved beyond all recognition.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Hainnz
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#107 - 2012-01-28 19:18:56 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Her campaign goals, from start to finish, were: All glory to the Ankhnotoad!


Can't argue with that, from what I've read.

Personally, I'm not concerned about who get elected to CSM. CCP is in charge, and I think they genuinely want EVE to be the best game possible.
Ganagati
Perkone
Caldari State
#108 - 2012-01-28 19:22:53 UTC
Fredfredbug4 wrote:

The game is classified as an MMO, EVERYONE who reviews the game, plays the game, and made the game will acknowledge that the game is indeed an MMO and the purpose of which is to try and interact with other players. I get it, we all like to play solo once in a while, but playing the entire game by yourself when you could play with any number of 44,000 people is just ridiculous. Your better off playing SPORE in the Space Stage because that's essentially what you are doing here.

Plus playing with bots doesn't make a game harder. Enemies are stupid and teammates actually work as a team. With actual people you have to worry about smart enemies and generally ignorant teammates.



This is a fail argument used by many spergy internet guys across the most popular MMOs, and continues to fail today because of its shady logic.

Even playing solo, you are STILL actively participating in the MMO aspect of the game. You are interacting with a constantly changing economy that is run purely on player interaction- thus participating in MMOs. You are randomly grouping for larger, harder tasks with other players... even if it is only once a month! Thus participating in MMOs. You are constantly in danger of being destroyed, even in highsec, by other players- thus participating in MMOs. You are surrounded by thousands of other ships, all doing things that often make no sense whatsoever but complete conscious of them because you know that a player is sitting behind the other end of them, and they will likely do something even more stupid because of that fact- thus participating in MMOs. You participate in the local and corp chat discussions, maybe even joining a corp (while still continuing to play solo, though now being subject to wardecs just like the rest), which involves social interaction with other players during your gameplay- thus participating in MMOs.

People who make that argument fail to see the big picture of anything. It's a simply minded argument that does not hold up in any way shape or form... and honestly it's tiring seeing people get laughed at for using it over and over again.

.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#109 - 2012-01-28 19:23:01 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Both my mains are in 0.0, 3 of the 6 characters on my account are in hi-sec, and I want hi-sec to be improved beyond all recognition.
…but to be fair, your version of “improvement” might be a bit unorthodox since it doesn't entail massive security increases and equally massive additions of 23.5/7-gushing ISK geysers.
Alexandra Delarge
The Korova
#110 - 2012-01-28 19:48:33 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Hainnz wrote:
Ankh probably got elected because she was hard-core bat-**** crazy enough to do the work required to get elected as a (generally) high/low-sec rep. Of course the prob is that once elected, that person is still hard-core bat-**** crazy...


Her basic MO was to spread fear, uncertainty and doubt about the other candidates. She'd basically make stuff up about the other guys running for CSMs [THEY'RE COMING FOR YOUR MISSIONS!!!11] and evemailed it directly to the local list or just straight up posted it in local in trade hubs.

Then she made a boatload of vague promises to "protect hi-sec" from these fictitious threats, and, so far as I know, never actually delivered any real result whatsoever other than feeding her own titanic ego and exposing her massive ignorance of the the way EVE works.

Her campaign goals, from start to finish, were: All glory to the Ankhnotoad!

Someone also found out that she was using alts to say 'she's hot' and criticise other candidates. They tried to blackmail her. She refused to pay and was forced to admit it to the community before the nefarious blackmailer spilled the beans.

Oh and Ank if you are somehow reading this I would just like to say 'Jedi Scam'. Lol
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#111 - 2012-01-28 20:48:32 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Malcanis wrote:
Both my mains are in 0.0, 3 of the 6 characters on my account are in hi-sec, and I want hi-sec to be improved beyond all recognition.
…but to be fair, your version of “improvement” might be a bit unorthodox since it doesn't entail massive security increases and equally massive additions of 23.5/7-gushing ISK geysers.


Speaking of which, I am not sure whether to be humiliated that you didn't think my manifesto was worth even criticising or complimented that you thought it was so majestically perfect that you had nothing to add.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#112 - 2012-01-28 21:54:25 UTC
Mr Kidd wrote:
The problem with CSM is the same problem with any political system. The available representatives are mouth pieces for those with the resources. The resources are in null. And so, that's where the representation comes from and whom they represent. The CSM is rife with the pitfalls of any RL political system. One need only look at one's own country for an analog.

While Tippia's conclusions are logical, they might not be correct. One can't look at population and representation in order to make conclusions here. Certainly the ghettos of the world outnumber the posh suburban neighborhoods of the wealthy. Yet, representation is clearly in the favor of the few with resources.

I would caution CCP for allowing RL dynamics to overly influence a game which many play to escape their real lives. If there aren't any routes for the escapist to pursue then the escapist will look elsewhere.



What resources does one need to be in the CSM? Technetium gets no votes.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#113 - 2012-01-28 23:05:37 UTC
High sec does not need a representative in the CSM in such manner that said rep would "protect" the interests of high sec or seek to improve it.

What is really needed are high sec CSMs who will work on making the game more enthusiastic towards getting out of high sec with additional content that is not limited to who you are renting from or whose pet you are going to be.

Were it up to me to represent high sec in a voting body, I would certainly push for more ways to get people into null without the overhead of corp politics and drama, and most important: something has to be done about the Great Wall of Carebear comprised of gate camps and blob tactics. There are bears on both sides of that wall, by the way, but the warp bubble need to fall to the wayside and the combat probe dominate in need before anything is going to change.




Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Buff Jesus
#114 - 2012-01-28 23:17:52 UTC
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
High sec does not need a representative in the CSM in such manner that said rep would "protect" the interests of high sec or seek to improve it.

What is really needed are high sec CSMs who will work on making the game more enthusiastic towards getting out of high sec with additional content that is not limited to who you are renting from or whose pet you are going to be.

Were it up to me to represent high sec in a voting body, I would certainly push for more ways to get people into null without the overhead of corp politics and drama, and most important: something has to be done about the Great Wall of Carebear comprised of gate camps and blob tactics. There are bears on both sides of that wall, by the way, but the warp bubble need to fall to the wayside and the combat probe dominate in need before anything is going to change.






This is a very good point. Nothing will put a sour taste in a highsec's mouth toward nullsec like getting raped at a gate camp in the first lowsec system they pass through.

New Favorite Eve Hobby: Bumping BS's with a Crow.
Tallian Saotome
Nuclear Arms Exchange Inc.
#115 - 2012-02-01 09:25:08 UTC
Buff Jesus wrote:
Herzog Wolfhammer wrote:
High sec does not need a representative in the CSM in such manner that said rep would "protect" the interests of high sec or seek to improve it.

What is really needed are high sec CSMs who will work on making the game more enthusiastic towards getting out of high sec with additional content that is not limited to who you are renting from or whose pet you are going to be.

Were it up to me to represent high sec in a voting body, I would certainly push for more ways to get people into null without the overhead of corp politics and drama, and most important: something has to be done about the Great Wall of Carebear comprised of gate camps and blob tactics. There are bears on both sides of that wall, by the way, but the warp bubble need to fall to the wayside and the combat probe dominate in need before anything is going to change.



This is a very good point. Nothing will put a sour taste in a highsec's mouth toward nullsec like getting raped at a gate camp in the first lowsec system they pass through.


As a general rule it takes 10 people to bust the gatecamp in EC- on the Torrinos gate, which goes straight from highsec to nullsec. If there is a camp there at all(there are always bubbles, but not always people).

If you can't get together 10 people who want to fight in eve, you might want to try talking to more people before going out to null.

Oh, and nothing stops you from setting up shop in npc 0.0. Some of the best 0.0 space is not claimable by sov entities.

Inappropriate signature removed, CCP Phantom.
Jaroslav Unwanted
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#116 - 2012-02-01 09:27:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Jaroslav Unwanted
I endorse null sec overlords for CSM, because they dont give a **** about High sec. They leave it the way it is..

From some posts which propose fundamental changes to high sec., i am glad what CSM actually doing..
They play with their sand doing what they know best, and if they happens to cross the line / wormholes / then people who are sensible enough contribute to discussion in civil matter and making CSM understand.

So ..

Hans Jagerblitzen for FW CSM. Cool
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#117 - 2012-02-01 15:32:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Alavaria Fera
Jaroslav Unwanted wrote:
I endorse null sec overlords for CSM, because they dont give a **** about High sec. They leave it the way it is..

I too love supporting my null sec overlord ! It ain't all just mind control and indoctrination via uh.

Buff Jesus wrote:
This is a very good point. Nothing will put a sour taste in a highsec's mouth toward nullsec like getting raped at a gate camp in the first lowsec system they pass through.

The taste of their killmails isn't the best either. Of course in lowsec you don't have bubbles, but such is life.

It's always ideal to catch someone red to you. But sometimes people come in with these fits that make the whole group laugh. This makes the killmail (and pod, if they have a ton of expensive implants) qualify as Quality Local Entertainment (QLE) which is what gatecamps run on sometimes.
Tallian Saotome wrote:
As a general rule it takes 10 people to bust the gatecamp in EC- on the Torrinos gate, which goes straight from highsec to nullsec. If there is a camp there at all(there are always bubbles, but not always people).

Ah.

Someone let out the secret that we don't camp the EC- Torrinos gate 23.5/7, and that not every gate in null is constanly bubbled and camped. Oh dear.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#118 - 2012-02-01 15:53:36 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Speaking of which, I am not sure whether to be humiliated that you didn't think my manifesto was worth even criticising or complimented that you thought it was so majestically perfect that you had nothing to add.

Yes, I have not responded to it just to be mean and spiteful! Muahah! Twisted

Nah, I just couldn't think of anything useful to add to the whole thing by the time I noticed the thread. It's a good framework.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#119 - 2012-02-01 16:06:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Alavaria Fera
Malcanis wrote:
Then she made a boatload of vague promises to "protect hi-sec" from these fictitious threats, and, so far as I know, never actually delivered any real result whatsoever other than feeding her own titanic ego and exposing her massive ignorance of the the way EVE works.

You're not happening to refer to the nullsec weapons of mass destruction, I hope. It's clearly impossible for us to apply Titans to the face of Empire.
Malcanis wrote:
She'd basically make stuff up about the other guys running for CSMs [THEY'RE COMING FOR YOUR MISSIONS!!!11]

Isn't something like this what people say about the nullsec candidates? Making up grist to run your negative campaign trail seems to be popular in more than one place.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Dunbar Hulan
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#120 - 2012-02-01 16:16:35 UTC
Easy fix would be to put me on the CSM for empire/ hi sec. Never been to Reykjavík but went to Naval Air Station Keflavik once.
Got a ride there on an RAF Nimrod, had a great time, beer was kinda crappy, but cheap on the base.

 ** Manchester United - Paul Scholes= Genius**