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Boycott the CSM selection process and vote
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Ganagati
Perkone
Caldari State
#41 - 2012-01-27 02:10:38 UTC
met worst wrote:
ILikeMarkets wrote:
I don't disagree with what you are saying, but I do disagree with how you want to do it. This helps the 0.0 bears more than it helps us. Not voting is effectively the same as voting for a 0.0 player, as 0.0 corps WILL vote for their own. So if we don't vote, we just make sure there is no competition for them.

And you don't think that CCP - as the executive body - is going to sit up and notice the lack of efficacy of the current system when no-one can be bothered voting? It MUST already be in their radar range!

Perhaps you're not seeing what I am saying - 0.0 can HAVE the CSM under the current structure. A minority group can only govern with the SUPPORT of the majority. The CSM is NOT a ruling body and can be dumped/remodelled/restructred IF and ONLY IF CCP have the pretext to do so.

NOT voting or even totally ignoring the process will disempower the CSM. Utterly. CCP will be forced to restructure. They cannot act upon anything the CSM puts forward and claim a mandate to do so with such minimal support.

TBH, supporting the current system by using it will only fuel the status quo. Which, in fairness, is fine if it should go that way. But the message about the efficacy of the CSM needs to be sent to the executive body, not the voters.

My stance and my view is to boycott and kill the current process for want of a better one.

It's a political campaign and policy in and of itself.

SUPPORT INACTION.


So... highsec players don't vote, allowing lowsec and 0.0 to vote for whoever they want without competition?

...

I see what you did there.

.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#42 - 2012-01-27 02:13:44 UTC
I fully support this. Boycott the vote.

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Rene Fullchest
Doomheim
#43 - 2012-01-27 02:13:48 UTC
met worst wrote:
ILikeMarkets wrote:
I don't disagree with what you are saying, but I do disagree with how you want to do it. This helps the 0.0 bears more than it helps us. Not voting is effectively the same as voting for a 0.0 player, as 0.0 corps WILL vote for their own. So if we don't vote, we just make sure there is no competition for them.

And you don't think that CCP - as the executive body - is going to sit up and notice the lack of efficacy of the current system when no-one can be bothered voting? It MUST already be in their radar range!

Perhaps you're not seeing what I am saying - 0.0 can HAVE the CSM under the current structure. A minority group can only govern with the SUPPORT of the majority. The CSM is NOT a ruling body and can be dumped/remodelled/restructred IF and ONLY IF CCP have the pretext to do so.

NOT voting or even totally ignoring the process will disempower the CSM. Utterly. CCP will be forced to restructure. They cannot act upon anything the CSM puts forward and claim a mandate to do so with such minimal support.

TBH, supporting the current system by using it will only fuel the status quo. Which, in fairness, is fine if it should go that way. But the message about the efficacy of the CSM needs to be sent to the executive body, not the voters.

My stance and my view is to boycott and kill the current process for want of a better one.

It's a political campaign and policy in and of itself.

SUPPORT INACTION.


And what you do not seem to fathom is that for your plan to work it would need ALL active players to make that statement.

Of course, this will not happen, so your notion as to how to effect change is null on its face.
met worst
Doomheim
#44 - 2012-01-27 02:19:17 UTC
Rene Fullchest wrote:
met worst wrote:
ILikeMarkets wrote:
I don't disagree with what you are saying, but I do disagree with how you want to do it. This helps the 0.0 bears more than it helps us. Not voting is effectively the same as voting for a 0.0 player, as 0.0 corps WILL vote for their own. So if we don't vote, we just make sure there is no competition for them.

And you don't think that CCP - as the executive body - is going to sit up and notice the lack of efficacy of the current system when no-one can be bothered voting? It MUST already be in their radar range!

Perhaps you're not seeing what I am saying - 0.0 can HAVE the CSM under the current structure. A minority group can only govern with the SUPPORT of the majority. The CSM is NOT a ruling body and can be dumped/remodelled/restructred IF and ONLY IF CCP have the pretext to do so.

NOT voting or even totally ignoring the process will disempower the CSM. Utterly. CCP will be forced to restructure. They cannot act upon anything the CSM puts forward and claim a mandate to do so with such minimal support.

TBH, supporting the current system by using it will only fuel the status quo. Which, in fairness, is fine if it should go that way. But the message about the efficacy of the CSM needs to be sent to the executive body, not the voters.

My stance and my view is to boycott and kill the current process for want of a better one.

It's a political campaign and policy in and of itself.

SUPPORT INACTION.


And what you do not seem to fathom is that for your plan to work it would need ALL active players to make that statement.

Of course, this will not happen, so your notion as to how to effect change is null on its face.

Not ALL, never was. I'm campaigning to make a flawed minority system even less important. I don't need a majority to do much, they're already doing it.

Nobody is seriously asking why.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#45 - 2012-01-27 02:26:06 UTC
everyone ignores the 600 pound gorilla in the room that is the reason for the nullsec ~takeover~ of the CSM

CCP put all sorts of stupid ideas past the last CSM, like "jump bridges are the primary means of force projection" and we ended up with CCP discussing removing jump bridges entirely and nerfing anomalies into the ground.

had those changes gone through as presented to the last CSM, nullsec would be dead with a few shell alliances holding space.

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
met worst
Doomheim
#46 - 2012-01-27 02:40:29 UTC
Andski wrote:
everyone ignores the 600 pound gorilla in the room that is the reason for the nullsec ~takeover~ of the CSM

CCP put all sorts of stupid ideas past the last CSM, like "jump bridges are the primary means of force projection" and we ended up with CCP discussing removing jump bridges entirely and nerfing anomalies into the ground.

had those changes gone through as presented to the last CSM, nullsec would be dead with a few shell alliances holding space.

Admirable but you missed the point. 66% of the Eve playerbase care less.

Might actually allow some of 'em to get started and REALLY stir things up.

The fat lazy pricks sitting on their fat 0.0 asses while their minions do their bidding is what is ******* the game up. 34% don't know it yet because they don't have to think beyond the next op and/or anom.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#47 - 2012-01-27 02:50:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Andski
met worst wrote:
Andski wrote:
everyone ignores the 600 pound gorilla in the room that is the reason for the nullsec ~takeover~ of the CSM

CCP put all sorts of stupid ideas past the last CSM, like "jump bridges are the primary means of force projection" and we ended up with CCP discussing removing jump bridges entirely and nerfing anomalies into the ground.

had those changes gone through as presented to the last CSM, nullsec would be dead with a few shell alliances holding space.

Admirable but you missed the point. 66% of the Eve playerbase care less.

Might actually allow some of 'em to get started and REALLY stir things up.

The fat lazy pricks sitting on their fat 0.0 asses while their minions do their bidding is what is ******* the game up. 34% don't know it yet because they don't have to think beyond the next op and/or anom.


oh man please keep that crap coming my way

tell me more about how nullsec players are mindless drones when it's the highsec publords who are great at doing repetitive tasks mindlessly, i.e. mining, missions and incursions

that 66% of the playerbase doesn't give a **** and do not care about the game as long as they can do whatever dumb crap it is they do

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Caldari Citizen 786478786
#48 - 2012-01-27 02:52:06 UTC
Boycotts are dumb. They solve nothing. A better idea would be to focus your rage into finding and electing a candidate who represents what you believe in. Whining on the forums and shouting names at people who choose to play EVE in Nullsec does nothing to help your cause or your image.
None ofthe Above
#49 - 2012-01-27 04:20:03 UTC
Don't boycott!

Vote for me!

The only end-game content in EVE Online is the crap that makes you rage quit.
Grumpy Owly
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#50 - 2012-01-27 06:08:19 UTC
Caldari Citizen 786478786 wrote:
Boycotts are dumb. They solve nothing. A better idea would be to focus your rage into finding and electing a candidate who represents what you believe in. Whining on the forums and shouting names at people who choose to play EVE in Nullsec does nothing to help your cause or your image.


QFT.

I totally agree that I will not be voting for any candidate or supporting any campign whose sole purpose will be about CSM problematic members regardless of how much I agree with it to be an issue.

I will simply be looking at what the person stands for and wether or not their manifesto represents my interests. As I want to see a person capable of not being embroiled in the petty metawin politics, but someone who has a purposeful intention of making the EvE game and it's community a much better experience and wishes to focus their energies into such.

Had this been the attitude of some of the existing CSM I doubt the community would be so dissaffected with the voting process and what the CSM does. Which is a shame given CCPs intentions in the first place. But then I suppose, certain elements of this gaming community will seek to try and control you and your interests for purely their own selfish motivations who are ruining the EvE experience and thinking its "Kewl" in the process.

On a lighter more philisophical note, couple of quotations:

"Some men just want to see the world burn" - Alfred, Dark Knight

"If you must be selfish, then be wise and not narrow-minded in your selfishness. The key point lies in the sense of universal responsibility. That is the real source of strength, the real source of happiness. If we exploit everything available, such as trees, water and minerals, and if we don´t plan for our next generation, for the future, then we´re at fault, aren´t we? However, if we have a genuine sense of universal responsibility as our central motivation, then our relations with the environment, and with all our neighbours, will be well balanced". - his holiness the Dalai Lama

Bounty Hunting - Soon (™): Retribution (Winter 2012)

It's just criminal - Smuggling
Lyrrashae
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
#51 - 2012-01-27 06:14:18 UTC
met worst wrote:
If you truly think as I do that the CSM selection system is flawed, pointless and no more than a 0.0 boys club, don't stand, don't select and don't vote.

If CCP can see that the CSM is wasted effort for THE MAJORITY (as it always has been), emphasise the irrelevance by treating it like the festering sore it has become.

Force the issue to a fairer method of representation. Better to have no system than a bad system.

Show your disgust. DO NOTHING.




Because doing nothing, and then complaining about the resulting ****-sandwich is always better than doing something, amirite?

[/sarcasm]

Ni.
met worst
Doomheim
#52 - 2012-01-27 06:16:00 UTC
Grumpy Owly wrote:
Caldari Citizen 786478786 wrote:
Boycotts are dumb. They solve nothing. A better idea would be to focus your rage into finding and electing a candidate who represents what you believe in. Whining on the forums and shouting names at people who choose to play EVE in Nullsec does nothing to help your cause or your image.


QFT.

I totally agree that I will not be voting for any candidate or supporting any campign whose sole purpose will be about CSM problematic members regardless of how much I agree with it to be an issue.

I will simply be looking at what the person stands for and wether or not their manifesto represents my interests. As I want to see a person capable of not being embroiled in the petty metawin politics, but someone who has a purposeful intention of making the EvE game and it's community a much better experience and wishes to focus their energies into such.

Had this been the attitude of some of the existing CSM I doubt the community would be so dissaffected with the voting process and what the CSM does. Which is a shame given CCPs intentions in the first place. But then I suppose, certain elements of this gaming community will seek to try and control you and your interests for purely their own selfish motivations who are ruining the EvE experience and thinking its "Kewl" in the process.

On a lighter more philisophical note, couple of quotations:

"Some men just want to see the world burn" - Alfred, Dark Knight

"If you must be selfish, then be wise and not narrow-minded in your selfishness. The key point lies in the sense of universal responsibility. That is the real source of strength, the real source of happiness. If we exploit everything available, such as trees, water and minerals, and if we don´t plan for our next generation, for the future, then we´re at fault, aren´t we? However, if we have a genuine sense of universal responsibility as our central motivation, then our relations with the environment, and with all our neighbours, will be well balanced". - his holiness the Dalai Lama

Any vote or action FOR the CSM process (irrespective of the candidates or their platforms) is a vote SUPPORTING the current system. As I have said, this is fine if you ARE happy with the current structure. No problem there.

But in considering the DL quote, my motivation is by NOT exploiting the current system to gain short term satisfaction but is to look further into how the CSM *could* be structured for a much longer and more certain future for ALL players.

Looking at ways this can be done MIGHT include apathetic (read passive) protest.

Sometimes the majority can be most effective by being silent.
EnslaverOfMinmatar
You gonna get aped
#53 - 2012-01-27 06:17:59 UTC
Adunh Slavy wrote:
Can we write in Ron Paul?

IBTL

Nope. He was renamed to Spooner Freeman

Every EVE player must read this http://www.eveonline.com/background/potw/default.asp?cid=29-01-07
Akirei Scytale
Okami Syndicate
#54 - 2012-01-27 06:18:36 UTC
hey guys, lets boycott the vote to make our voice heard! Lol
Lyrrashae
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
#55 - 2012-01-27 06:24:51 UTC
Mr Epeen wrote:
Just vote me in as a write in.

I promises to do sweet **** all for my entire term. Odds are pretty good I won't even be bothered to get on the Icelandic gravy train...er...plane.

I can't be bought because I'm already rich and frankly, I just don't give a **** about what any of you think. I only care about the needs of Mr. Epeen.

Actually, come to think of it, I'm pretty much like the current CSM..

As you were.

Mr EpeenCool


You have my vote!

(And my Quarterstaff of Ass-beating +5, mustn't forget that...)

Ni.
met worst
Doomheim
#56 - 2012-01-27 06:25:50 UTC
Lyrrashae wrote:
met worst wrote:
If you truly think as I do that the CSM selection system is flawed, pointless and no more than a 0.0 boys club, don't stand, don't select and don't vote.

If CCP can see that the CSM is wasted effort for THE MAJORITY (as it always has been), emphasise the irrelevance by treating it like the festering sore it has become.

Force the issue to a fairer method of representation. Better to have no system than a bad system.

Show your disgust. DO NOTHING.




Because doing nothing, and then complaining about the resulting ****-sandwich is always better than doing something, amirite?

[/sarcasm]

lol. Tell me honestly now Lyrrashae (and from what I can understand you've thrown your hat in the ring), do you think you will get voted in on a highsec platform. If not you, who? And even if a highseccer DOES get in, how influential do you think they can be?

Now tell me that if the total vote was decimated by disinterest, whether CCP would take a SERIOUS look at what WILL work?

As I said above, the majority can make the loudest noise by saying the least. An inaction can carry far more weight than any action if used appropriately.
Lyrrashae
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
#57 - 2012-01-27 06:29:04 UTC
I'm not sure which nulltard concern you're hiding behind that generic forum alt, OP, but I must say...

Well-played, mate, well-played!

Troll-rating: 9/10 (-1 for slight lack of subtlety, but damned if it doesn't get the job done!)

[/golfclap]

Ni.
met worst
Doomheim
#58 - 2012-01-27 06:29:06 UTC
Akirei Scytale wrote:
hey guys, lets boycott the vote to make our voice heard! Lol

In isolation that's a funny comment.

In context it adds weight to my point. THIS is what people will be voting for - arrogance and indifference from 0.0.
Zimmy Zeta
Perkone
Caldari State
#59 - 2012-01-27 06:33:39 UTC
I am impressed how OP managed to attract most of the most prolific trolls on here within only three pages. Good job, OP.

Quote:
Arrowmet worst uses Summon Troll Level 20 ...

Arrow..... it is super effective

I'd like to apologize for the poor quality of the post above and sincerely hope you didn't waste your time reading it. Yes, I do feel bad about it.
Lyrrashae
Hellstar Towing and Recovery
#60 - 2012-01-27 06:36:11 UTC
met worst wrote:
Lyrrashae wrote:
met worst wrote:
If you truly think as I do that the CSM selection system is flawed, pointless and no more than a 0.0 boys club, don't stand, don't select and don't vote.

If CCP can see that the CSM is wasted effort for THE MAJORITY (as it always has been), emphasise the irrelevance by treating it like the festering sore it has become.

Force the issue to a fairer method of representation. Better to have no system than a bad system.

Show your disgust. DO NOTHING.




Because doing nothing, and then complaining about the resulting ****-sandwich is always better than doing something, amirite?

[/sarcasm]

lol. Tell me honestly now Lyrrashae (and from what I can understand you've thrown your hat in the ring), do you think you will get voted in on a highsec platform. If not you, who? And even if a highseccer DOES get in, how influential do you think they can be?

Now tell me that if the total vote was decimated by disinterest, whether CCP would take a SERIOUS look at what WILL work?

As I said above, the majority can make the loudest noise by saying the least. An inaction can carry far more weight than any action if used appropriately.


I've considered throwing my hat in.

The chances of me doing so, after some dealings with the certain examples of the "average" playerbase in the thread you indirectly reference have taught me that I would make a really crap politician, and it's really not for me....But maybe I still might, who knows?

My platform would not be hisec exclusively. Empire-PvP (NB for the terminally confused: Losec is empire-space, too) and wormhole-generalist, thank you very much.

"And even if a highseccer DOES get in, how influential do you think they can be?" (Forum troll-alt)

Thank you for proving your affiliations with your generic condescension to any/all non-null players. Once again, whose sock-puppet are you?

Ni.