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ID's changing after downtime, WHY????
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42BelowVodka
Industry 42
#1 - 2012-01-26 13:36:15 UTC  |  Edited by: 42BelowVodka
after a downtime the id's(letter and number combo) from cosmic signatures and anomaly's change. WHY??
is this an intended or is this something that just happens during DT and cant be helped(database isue)
or is it maybe something ccp can do something about. its a pain in the ass when u live in a wh and have to scan down the same sigs after every DT. even more if u get 2 DT's in a day and dont know whats what anymore.

would appreciate a response from ccp about this, or if it is brought up before a link to that post(diddnt find any myself)
Mnemosyne Gloob
#2 - 2012-01-26 13:51:59 UTC
AFAIK it has always been like this.
XXSketchxx
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#3 - 2012-01-26 13:57:46 UTC
working as intended, nothing to see here, move along
Bek Thyron
#4 - 2012-01-26 14:01:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Bek Thyron
Uh. I always saved the scanned bookmarks like this:

"OOZ Grav1"
"HNV Grav2"
"ZIU Ladar1"
"DWZ Radar1"

etc...

Then, after DT, just refresh the bookmarks and all what is left are new signatures...not really hardCool
Just incase you do not know what "refreshing bookmarks" means: After DT, arrange 4 probes in your most stable scan-formation. Scale them down to 0.25 AU. Bring the 4 probes JUST OVER the bookmark. Click scan. If the site is still there, you will get a 100% hit directly after you scan - as long as a new signature. Rightklick on the sig and change the first three letters...and you are done. By the way, this is a great way to make the life of other scanners easierLol

"Bek you crazy german, you scanned the whole WH down? How many sigs are here?"
"42. Bookmarks are in corp hangar, gtg - work...."
".........Thanks man! Saved me a hour scanning!"


PS: You can also add the time and day to the scanned BMs - to keep track WHEN they are despawning.
Cyniac
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2012-01-26 14:21:14 UTC
Bek Thyron wrote:
Then, after DT, just refresh the bookmarks and all what is left are new signatures...not really hardCool


This.

As Bek says, it's not really hard, it just needs doing.

If you just need to find the WH exit there are fast ways of doing that too without having to scan the entire WH.
42BelowVodka
Industry 42
#6 - 2012-01-27 00:17:55 UTC
Bek Thyron wrote:
Uh. I always saved the scanned bookmarks like this:

"OOZ Grav1"
"HNV Grav2"
"ZIU Ladar1"
"DWZ Radar1"

etc...

Then, after DT, just refresh the bookmarks and all what is left are new signatures...not really hardCool
Just incase you do not know what "refreshing bookmarks" means: After DT, arrange 4 probes in your most stable scan-formation. Scale them down to 0.25 AU. Bring the 4 probes JUST OVER the bookmark. Click scan. If the site is still there, you will get a 100% hit directly after you scan - as long as a new signature. Rightklick on the sig and change the first three letters...and you are done. By the way, this is a great way to make the life of other scanners easierLol

"Bek you crazy german, you scanned the whole WH down? How many sigs are here?"
"42. Bookmarks are in corp hangar, gtg - work...."
".........Thanks man! Saved me a hour scanning!"


PS: You can also add the time and day to the scanned BMs - to keep track WHEN they are despawning.


that a good one bek, will try that. thx for the help
Substantia Nigra
Polaris Rising
Goonswarm Federation
#7 - 2012-01-27 01:34:22 UTC
Do you really expect CCP to justify, to you, something that has been part of game dynamics for ever-so-long? Me, I'd prefer they directed their resources at stuff that is going to improve our collective eve experience.

Those 'number plates' (e.g. ABC-123) change (for anoms and sigs at least) every scheduled downtime, every non-scheduled downtimes, most server crashes, and most / all client updates. Like others have already mentioned it's a bit of work, but not too arduous, to keep track of them.

Depending on what you're doing you either do not need to rescan them at all (hell, I don't care if the anom has changed from ABC-123 to XYZ-789, warping to my 'ABC' bookmark will present the exact same sleepers to me), or you simply focus your rescan on the bookmark to confirm the new number plate.
If it's a wormhole, I often label it something like "ABC-123 Unknown wormhole (XYZ, PQR)" where 'XYZ' and 'PQR' are the previous number plates for that location. If I warp to it, thereby starting its despawn timer, I add the type of WH and trigger time: "ABC-123 U210=>lowsec (18:30)".

The number plates used now have been simplified from what they were a wee while ago. Now most of them form a loose sequence (ABC-123, BBC-789, CBC-456 etc) rather than the completely pseudo-random gobbledeguck we used to get.

Crucible gave us some very nice (IMO) changes re ship number plates. Now my C4 noctis is always CSI-999 ... whoever is flying and wherever it is. Previously the number plate would change with each pilot, and each system, and each downtime / crash. I haven't checked to see how structures are handled but, now, ships keep the same number plate.

I guess I am almost a 'vet' by now. Hopefully not too bitter and managing to help more than I hinder. I build and sell many things, including large collections of bookmarks.
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#8 - 2012-01-27 05:35:26 UTC
Its an annoying exposure of an unnecessary implementation detail. Its effect is very poor when combined with the ignore signature functionality and the downtime, as downtime wipes ignores, and whatever I wrote down to manually ignore is also no longer meaningful.

ie when I used to live in a WH it became very important for me to finish scanning before the DT which is ALWAYS scheduled in the middle of AU tz playtime, and if DT was near, I would start needing to take a bet on fullscanning and BMing to get some value out of the scanning process, or betting I could find what I wanted before DT.

It would not be difficult to store the signature itself, that way I could manually write down the ignore list before DT if I wasn't going to finish a system.
John Bodie
Flying Zebras
#9 - 2012-01-27 07:49:14 UTC
Substantia Nigra wrote:
Do you really expect CCP to justify, to you, something that has been part of game dynamics for ever-so-long? Me, I'd prefer they directed their resources at stuff that is going to improve our collective eve experience.

Like others have already mentioned it's a bit of work, but not too arduous, to keep track of them.


WTF kind of reply is this? Getting rid of pointless work is always worth doing and does improve everyones experience (remember how popular the Loot-All button was, despite looting previously being "only a bit of work", and having been like that for ever, etc.)

Nobody answered the question - If it's meant to be like this for some reason, then fair enough. Otherwise, add it to the list of stupid annoyances to be got rid of when convenient.
Substantia Nigra
Polaris Rising
Goonswarm Federation
#10 - 2012-01-27 09:43:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Substantia Nigra
John Bodie wrote:
Nobody answered the question - If it's meant to be like this for some reason, then fair enough. Otherwise, add it to the list of stupid annoyances to be got rid of when convenient.


LOL. OP asked question seeking CCP response. Like I said, IMO the 'issue' is such a non-event it'd be a waste of their time. sure we can whine and moan bout squillions of little not-WOW things, but I reckon there are other things out there where time would be better spent.

We can prolly hypothesise the whys and wherefores ... perhaps a method of providing unique identifiers for convenience coupled with efficiency handling database items ... but even that is a bit of a "So what?"

Feel free to rant and rave yourself, but you not really contributed anything cept some baby tears. Like it's easy to slag off on responses from others when you not like them, but what have you actually added?

I guess I am almost a 'vet' by now. Hopefully not too bitter and managing to help more than I hinder. I build and sell many things, including large collections of bookmarks.
Elindreal
Planetary Interactors
#11 - 2012-01-31 04:20:03 UTC
lol
"i live in a wormhole and hate scanning, halp!"
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2012-01-31 05:13:20 UTC
I am certainly not a CCP programmer, and not that huge of a programmer in general. But here is my hypothesis.

Every downtime the servers reboot. And as we are all aware, systems don't actually load until someone actually enters that system.

In order to be more efficient, why tie up the database with SIG ID's until they are needed. So the SIG ID's are likely to be randomly generated as nodes come online due to activity. Bingo, different ID's
Disdaine
#13 - 2012-01-31 06:34:00 UTC
Don't worry, CSM is on it.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=19266

Three months ago.
Windorian
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2012-01-31 08:42:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Windorian
I fully feel that things should stay as they are. Most new players have no idea how easy scanning is now compared to how it was. Probes used to have a base scan time of 20 minutes (yes minutes) and with good skills and faction launcher, you could get down around 8 minutes.

You also used to have to drop different probes for different ranges, no scaling range/strength.

I tell you this because since the change (which i understand WH's made it nessacary) you see 50X more people probing, why? Because it's that damn easy now. Because of this, deadspace and faction gear plummeted in price, and rocketed in supply, leasing to every other ship flying with oodles of goodies. Everyone's rich now.

If ID's never chagned until a sig/anom despawned, then it would be even easier. There's already a dozen ways to make it easy to track your ID's, and new spawns, and even new ID's post-DT. Read up and learn them, they aren't hard.

Don't ask for soemthing that was initially near impossible to do (as such one of the greatest and most difficult proffessions) which was then made quite easy (Imagine trying to live in a WH with 10 minute scan times) And now you want it to be even easier?

Let's just make auto-pilot drop probes and scan for you, and make BM's.

i mean, 20 minutes is the most ANY system with less then 20 SIGS should take to scan. Come on man, nut up, man up, and fix your skirt, i can see your tampon.
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#15 - 2012-01-31 14:52:21 UTC
It helps to understand how the ID system works. Every ship has a unique ID in any given system. Your ID in Jita won't be the same as your ID in Perimeter. But if you jump from one system to the other and back, your ID will persist until downtime. If you dock up and change ships, the new ship gets a new ID.

Now add in the fact that every drone, probe, anomaly, signature, ship, and structure has a unique ID in every system. Signature ID counts will quickly move into the tens of thousands for some systems. Keeping signature IDs for everything would quickly pile up the database. Generating new ones is *necessary* for ships, drones, and probes. Anomalies and cosmic signatures were probably just lumped into that.

So what CCP needs to do is exclude cosmic IDs from being treated the same as ships and drones. That *sounds* like it should be easy, but who knows what that would impact.

Also, I think structure IDs should persist as well. When a structure is anchored, it should get a persistent ID that would be reset when it was unanchored or destroyed.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.