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Help! New Miner!

Author
Skorpynekomimi
#21 - 2012-01-27 04:45:49 UTC
Different regions and security levels have different ores.

Economic PVP

RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#22 - 2012-01-27 06:03:26 UTC
Tuvan VanBuurin wrote:
Thank you so much for all your replies. I picked the iteron because i could hold so much! Everyone told me not to jetcan because its dangerous. I am 2 days from getting my retriever which will help alot!

How do I join a corporation?
Also, I cannot seem to find any pyroxcres? I heard that is the big money maker.

Thanks everyone!


Talk to people. Socialize. Then ask to join one of your new friend's corps.

Jetcan mining has a slight risk of being canflipped. The result of which is either losing the ore in the can, or if you're stupid and shoot, your ship as well.

As for Mining profit and ore location, Google that Mother already.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon

Raiz Nhell
Tactically Challenged
The Initiative.
#23 - 2012-01-27 08:19:35 UTC
I used to mine in a Badger... Pure and simply cause I could set and forget... Mining lasers and cargo expanders...

But it's bloody boring, mind you I fly a Hulk now, and it's still boring, just a lot quicker...

But I mine while I'm at work, so I can't do intensive stuff... I just set and forget, and come back to a full cargo bay, a lonely pod or a weird station with a headache...

There is no such thing as a fair fight...

If your fighting fair you have automatically put yourself at a disadvantage.

Aubrey Addams
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#24 - 2012-01-27 09:48:04 UTC
I recommened mining only if you play a lot semi-afk, from work or something. If you play the game normally, do missions for money. You will realise that mining is just a waste of time and skillpoints to learn.
Kestrix
Gallente Federation Private Members Club.
#25 - 2012-01-27 20:41:45 UTC
Miranda Fluffbunny wrote:
RubyPorto wrote:
Run missions, make isk, buy more minerals than you would be able to mine in the same amount of time (at every SP level)


This. Mining is a mug's game. Even if you manage to avoid getting suicide ganked, war decced or ruthlessly mocked by the other carebears you'll never get rich from it.


I like to mine. I'm also a billionaire... is that rich enough? I'm currently filling a station vault with Ore just becasue I can (thats 10mill m3) When I refine and sell the minerals will I be rich then? BTW what do you classify as rich?
Taedrin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#26 - 2012-01-27 22:39:04 UTC
Kestrix wrote:
Miranda Fluffbunny wrote:
RubyPorto wrote:
Run missions, make isk, buy more minerals than you would be able to mine in the same amount of time (at every SP level)


This. Mining is a mug's game. Even if you manage to avoid getting suicide ganked, war decced or ruthlessly mocked by the other carebears you'll never get rich from it.


I like to mine. I'm also a billionaire... is that rich enough? I'm currently filling a station vault with Ore just becasue I can (thats 10mill m3) When I refine and sell the minerals will I be rich then? BTW what do you classify as rich?


You can make a lot of mining - just not in high sec.

To the OP, you may wish to reconsider your choice of occupation for the immediate future. Hulkageddon so it will be much more likely for you to get suicide ganked for the next month or two.
Jacob Stiller
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2012-01-28 01:52:04 UTC
My advice is to stop your mining career this instant. It is the lowest isk/hour earner in the game thanks to competition from refineable drops and botters (i.e. those who automate masses of mining characters by hacking the game and writing scripts). Most players are best off earning isk by ratting, running missions, and/or running incursions. If you want to graduate to something more advanced, there's trading, production, and exploration.
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#28 - 2012-01-28 02:01:13 UTC
Kestrix wrote:
Miranda Fluffbunny wrote:
RubyPorto wrote:
Run missions, make isk, buy more minerals than you would be able to mine in the same amount of time (at every SP level)


This. Mining is a mug's game. Even if you manage to avoid getting suicide ganked, war decced or ruthlessly mocked by the other carebears you'll never get rich from it.


I like to mine. I'm also a billionaire... is that rich enough? I'm currently filling a station vault with Ore just becasue I can (thats 10mill m3) When I refine and sell the minerals will I be rich then? BTW what do you classify as rich?


I got ~2m m3 of minerals (not ore) in a station warehouse atm. Not really sure what I'm gonna do with it atm. I haven't mined in over ~18 months. None of those minerals were ever ore.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon

Jacob Stiller
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2012-01-28 03:12:47 UTC
Kestrix wrote:
Miranda Fluffbunny wrote:
RubyPorto wrote:
Run missions, make isk, buy more minerals than you would be able to mine in the same amount of time (at every SP level)


This. Mining is a mug's game. Even if you manage to avoid getting suicide ganked, war decced or ruthlessly mocked by the other carebears you'll never get rich from it.


I like to mine. I'm also a billionaire... is that rich enough? I'm currently filling a station vault with Ore just becasue I can (thats 10mill m3) When I refine and sell the minerals will I be rich then? BTW what do you classify as rich?


My trade alt has over 3.5 billion in assets and I still consider myself small fry. Most of that was made since Dec 20, when I finally decided to get serious about increasing my capital.
Sevastian Liao
DreamWeaver Inc.
#30 - 2012-01-28 05:51:21 UTC  |  Edited by: Sevastian Liao
If you're really interested in specializing long-term into mining, I've found that deciding where to settle down is one of the more important decisions you can make that will decide whether you enjoy your time mining. Some factors to consider when deciding which solar system to mine in:

1) Is there a 50% base refining yield station in the system? For now, you're most probably better off selling the ore/storing it up, but in future - after maxing out the relevant mining skills - you may want to train up refining skills. I've found that refining ore into its component minerals tends to add another 5-10% additional profit margin onto your sales. Another benefit is that this allows for more efficient transportation of your goods in future, since the component minerals take up much less space than the equivalent unit of ore

2) Does said station belong to a corp that has nearby mining agents? Having mining missions available allows you to put some variety into your mining career, as well as allowing you to build up reputation with the corp that will reduce your sales tax and refining tax, building up even larger profit margins in future. Since you've specced out to mine effectively, might as well turn those skills to use in your missions instead of trying to run other missions which call for ships and skills you probably have not trained for

3) Is there a large pool of regional buy orders in your region? Obviously, having more parties buying ore/minerals in a region is beneficial to you. Check the range on the buy orders - do they extend to the station that you want to base out of? If a decent number of them do, congratulations - You won't have to haul the ore around yourself, as there's a buyer willing to travel to where you are to pick up your goods. Should you really need ISK fast, this also allows you the option of selling your ore/minerals to buy orders (not recommended otherwise)

4) Is there a lot of regular traffic to that system? More traffic means a higher chance of competing miners / passing canflippers who will be disruptive to your mining efforts. Canflippers are likely to trawl through newbie systems, so take a few days to mine and observe the movement of your friendly neighbourhood flippers. And yes, if you do manage to find such a quiet system you probably should jetcan mine, it's a huge efficiency boost compared to turning around for the station everytime your mining ship's full.

It may seem like a good deal of effort to find that ideal location for yourself, but it's worth it if you really do enjoy mining and want to make the most out of the profession. More than any other career I'd say mining's the most dependent on squeezing out marginal efficiencies here and there to make worthwhile, and hence deciding where to settle down should be a priority, since it affects so many other variables that affect your mining career.

Some random, additional tips:
- Pyroxeres is indeed one of the more profitable ores in high sec at the moment. You can find them in systems with a security level of 0.9 and below. The lower the sec status, the larger the quantity of ore available
- Systems with a sec level of 0.8 and below spawn NPC rats in the asteroid belts. Your retriever can tank most of these spawns, but I still like to take a few combat drones to kill them off. The noise gets annoying
- Mining drones can be a good boost to your mining yield, but I'd suggest spending a day at most training up drone skills, and instead focusing on maxing out the higher return mining turret and ship-based mining boosts first
- When deciding which ore's more profitable remember to consider profit per m3, not profit per unit
- Always stock up and sell your stuff in bulk if possible. Most buyers are willing to pay a decent premium for the convenience

Good luck!
Toshiro GreyHawk
#31 - 2012-01-28 12:27:05 UTC



The only reason for doing anything in a game is - that you like doing it. You can make money doing all kinds of things and you can certainly make a lot of money mining. Also - mining in the early stages does make more money than running lower level missions - anyone who tells you differently is full of **** - most likely a mission runner who knows nothing about what they're talking about.

Mission running consists of being some NPC's lackey. He says "Jump!" and you say "How High?" He runs your life. You go here - you go there - you go wherever he tells you to go and do what he tells you to do. And - since the missions repeat - you can do the same one over and over and over and over again.

Trading is where the real money is - and you need virtually nothing to start - you just have to like doing it.



So - mine if you want to, run missions if you want to, trade if you want to, any or all of the above. Have fun.



Now a few comments:


1) Rookie ships cannot fit two mining lasers - they don't have the PG. But - one or two mine and return trips later - you have the 20k needed to buy a mining frigate. The Navitas and Bantam are about the same. The Tormentor has more cargo space as it can take 3 expanded cargo holds but it has one mid slot - so you're looking at choosing between an AB & Shield Booster where as the Navitas & Bantam can have both. Ore scanners aren't worth while for frigates as their mining lasers don't really pull enough to matter.

2) If you repackage your rookie ship and then assemble it again - you'll get a new set of free rookie miner & weapon modules. You can fit two rookie weapons on your rookie ship. Train Drones and Scout Drone Operation and in a few minutes you can carry a drone which will drastically improve your hitting power in that rookie ship. Until you get something better - use the rookie ship for killing rats and the mining frigate for mining.

3) Run the career agent missions, Buisness first, then Industry, then exploration, then combat, then advanced combat. The combat missions have the most ore in them. If you mine out all that ore it comes to about 35 million ISK. Run the mission but don't turn it in (if it has rocks in it) then salvage it if you want - then go get your miner. Mine into a jet can, setting the name to the time it was created. They last 2 hours. Periodically create a new jet can and move the ore into it letting the old one pop. You will have gotten a free industrial from your earlier mission sets - use that to come empty your jet cans.

4) Use the Map, set to Pilots in Space - to find a quiet system in Hi Sec. You want one that has a station in it that gives a 50% base yield. You also want one that has an agent that gives out combat missions - as those are the ones that have marketable ore in them. Mining missions only have mission object ore - which you cannot sell. Mine missions in that space just as you did in the career agent missions above.

5) If you're in mission space - someone trying to find you has to use combat scanner probes to do it. They can't scan down your mission space and they can't scan down your wrecks - they can only scan down - you. So, keep your DScan up and active - and if you see any combat scanner probes on it - warp out of your mission until they go away. If you have turned in the mission - this will cause the mission space to go away - so make sure you bookmark you jet cans. If you haven't turned in the mission - the mission space will be there when you come back.

6) Consider that the true value of what you mine is based on more than the market price per unit. Mining lasers mine in terms of Meters Cubed. Different ores take up different amounts of space per unit. Thus, it may take you longer to mine 100 units of one ore than another. Since Ore is sold by units - ore that takes longer to mine per unit has that as a factor in addition to how much it is going for per unit on the market. Veldspar, taking up the least m3, is the easiest to mine - and hence may make you more money in the same amount of time than some other ore which has a higher per unit price. Thus, the objection of many to mission mining - in that the ores there are usually Veldspar and Scoredite - is less valid than it may seem. This doesn't mean that you can't have a flavor of the month ore that is more valuable - but it does mean that Trit is always in there as a good money maker.

7) If you are team mining with an alt or another player - jettison a bookmark to create a jet can and keep it open. You can just drag and drop one from your people and places into your cargo hold. Then move the ore from your miners hold to the jet can where the hauler immeidately takes it out - leaving only the bookmark. In this way, if you don't want to mine mission space, you can be relatively safe from can flippers. Mine in a quiet system. Have at leat two tabs in your over view - one with the rocks and one without and only go to the mining tab long enough to target new rocks - then come back. This will let you see immediately if something comes into your belt. If another player comes into your belt, do a Look on them and move your POV around to their stern so you can see where they're headed. Then keep an eye on them. If they start heading for your can, pull the bookmark and pop the can. Don't trash talk them and they will probably go some where else to bother someone who is less alert.


8) Industrials are good for mining AFK. Put mining upgrades in the lows, an ore scanner, medium shield extenders and an Invul. Field in the mids and fit a Miner II. Go out into a 1.0 or .9 system, pick out a nice fat rock, turn on the laser and go wash the dishes or run missions with your alts. If someone comes along and pops you - all you've lost is a T1 industrial and a Miner II.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#32 - 2012-01-28 12:37:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Krixtal Icefluxor
Aubrey Addams wrote:
You will realise that mining is just a waste of time and skillpoints to learn.



Tell that to my Hulk full of arkonor and crockite from that WH yesterday...............

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882

Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#33 - 2012-01-28 12:40:51 UTC
Toshiro GreyHawk wrote:


8) Industrials are good for mining AFK. Put mining upgrades in the lows, an ore scanner, medium shield extenders and an Invul. Field in the mids and fit a Miner II. Go out into a 1.0 or .9 system, pick out a nice fat rock, turn on the laser and go wash the dishes or run missions with your alts. If someone comes along and pops you - all you've lost is a T1 industrial and a Miner II.


NEVER EVER EVER MINE AFK

Jesus F'in Christ, people...........................

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882

Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#34 - 2012-01-28 12:43:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Krixtal Icefluxor
Sevastian Liao wrote:
Some random, additional tips:
- Pyroxeres is indeed one of the more profitable ores in high sec at the moment.!




Like, since October 2010 with announcement of Nocxium requirement for the Noctis.

It's a LLOONNGGGG 'moment'.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882

Toshiro GreyHawk
#35 - 2012-01-28 12:47:01 UTC


Left out a few ship comments ...


8) The Burst sucks - it has only one low slot for an expanded cargo hold - and it has no drone. If you are minmatar - train some body elses ships to Frigate II.

9) Mining Cruisers:

a) The Osprey is the best, it has 3 miners, a good cargo hold and a few drones. 20% increase in miner output per level trained.

b) The scythe is next, 3 miners and 20% increase in miner output per level trained - only one drone though.

c) The Vexxor is next - a good combat cruiser but it's bonus is for it's drones - which don't mine as much as mining lasers. I has got 4 laser though.

d) The Arbitrator, like the Vexxor gets it's bonuses to it's drones - it is also a good ship but to few turret slots make it suck as a miner.


10) You can skip mining cruiser all together if you never want a cruiser and just train for mining barges

a) The Procuror is underrated. If you don't train cruisers you might buy one as soon as you can to get out of the mining frigate although mining frigates maxed out can out mine a Procuror but it does have a much bigger cargo hold where as a maxed out mining frigate has to alternate lasers and jettison every 30 seconds to keep from over flowing it's cargo hold. Anything you mount on the Procuror can be swapped to your Retriever when you get one. One drone.

b) Retriever - 5 drones - so it can defend itself fairly well. Cargo Expander II's in the lows and it will hold a decent amount. If you had trained for it you could use the strip miner II with crystals but most people don't.

c) Covetor - almost a Hulk and much cheaper. 10 drones so you can have both combat and mining drones. Use the Covetor until you have the money and skills for the Hulk - then keep it as a back up in case the Hulk gets ganked.

d) Hulk - much, much tougher than a Covetor with a larger hold but also vastly more expensive. Mines slightly more. 10 drones.


Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#36 - 2012-01-28 12:49:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Krixtal Icefluxor
Jacob Stiller wrote:
My advice is to stop your mining career this instant. It is the lowest isk/hour earner in the game thanks to competition from refineable drops and botters (i.e. those who automate masses of mining characters by hacking the game and writing scripts). Most players are best off earning isk by ratting, running missions, and/or running incursions. If you want to graduate to something more advanced, there's trading, production, and exploration.



Lowest ISK/hour earned in High Sec is Anomalies. (High sec Drone droppings? Really ???) Your statement here was just flat-out false.

Running Incursions is a money maker after the past 3 weeks ?? Read the news......

Production requires minerals, better gotten by your own hand to be REALLY efficient....or is running 25 jumps and back to Jita for them more efficient ??

Half of Exploration involves finding and mining valuable ores.

I'm just SAYIN'...........

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882

Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#37 - 2012-01-28 12:55:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Krixtal Icefluxor
Toshiro GreyHawk wrote:



a) The Procuror is underrated. If you don't train cruisers you might buy one as soon as you can to get out of the mining frigate although mining frigates maxed out can out mine a Procuror but it does have a much bigger cargo hold where as a maxed out mining frigate has to alternate lasers and jettison every 30 seconds to keep from over flowing it's cargo hold. Anything you mount on the Procuror can be swapped to your Retriever when you get one. One drone.

b) Retriever - 5 drones - so it can defend itself fairly well. Cargo Expander II's in the lows and it will hold a decent amount. If you had trained for it you could use the strip miner II with crystals but most people don't.

c) Covetor - almost a Hulk and much cheaper. 10 drones so you can have both combat and mining drones. Use the Covetor until you have the money and skills for the Hulk - then keep it as a back up in case the Hulk gets ganked.

d) Hulk - much, much tougher than a Covetor with a larger hold but also vastly more expensive. Mines slightly more. 10 drones.




An Osprey cruiser WILL outmine the idiotic Procurer. It is only used for making the T2 Skiff. Please ignore above advice about this.

I know of no serious miners who do NOT use Crystals II. Please ignore above advice again as without Crystals II you are mining a CRAP amount.

If you step into a Covetor finally....you can step into a Hulk 18 hours later............and it takes so long (Covetor is THE ONLY T1 ship requiring 2 higher rank Level V skills to even step into...but that's another story) that if one doesn't have Hulk money in pocket by then, you have done something wrong with all that Mission money they have told you to get instead.

I'm just SAYIN'.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882

Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#38 - 2012-01-28 13:07:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Krixtal Icefluxor
It's just nigh on impossible to keep up with all the BAD mining advice. Has been forever...........................


....and notice these folks practically admit they DO NOT DO IT.


Gotta read between the lines to really see the deceptions and falsehoods a lot of the time.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882

Toshiro GreyHawk
#39 - 2012-01-30 09:59:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Toshiro GreyHawk
Yeah ... I've seen this bull **** a lot. It was bull **** then and it's bull **** now. Some jack ass appoints themselves as the finall source on something - then runs their mouth spouting bull **** about things they don't know as much about as they think they do.

It mostly comes from people who have set hard and fast rules about Do This - Don't Do That - which involve turning off your brain and just obeying someone's dogma. If they did know as much as they think they do - they'd see the exceptions - and understand that there isn't just one ******* way to do things.

You notice how they term things as "advice" instead of "options"?



1) There is nothing wrong with mining AFK in an industrial. You pick a queit system turn on the lasers and go do some chores. Why the hell NOT? AS I SAID - what do you have to lose? A crappy T1 Industrial? Can you mine more in something else - NO - not if you're AFK. The cargo hold fills to fast or you exhaust the asteroids to fast. Actively mining in an industrial, that is using an industrial while you're sitting there is what's a mistake. If you're mining AFK in a Hulk - you will still fill the cargo hold to fast or exhaust the asteroids - which means you can't really just let the thing go - you have to come back and check on it more often - and - you're leaving a lot more out there to be ganked.


2) My Comments on the Procuror were accurate. An Osprey will NOT outmine ANYTHING if you DON'T train Cruisers. What part of that did you not get smart guy? You Don't even have to train Frigates to get into a Mining barge - but - you come out of the tubes with the skills to fly a mining frigate so there's no loss there. Not everyone wants to train cruisers. If all you're ever going to do with the character is mine - then you don't need to train cruisers and it's a diversion of your training time to do so. Now - yes - most people do get into a mining cruiser first because it's easy to train for - but - if you don't really train the skill up - then you're losing a lot of the skill bonus you get that makes flying a mining cruiser - or a mining frigate if you train frigates up - worth while. There isn't any one way to do things. I mentioned that the cargo space on the Procuror is it's primary reason for being purchased other wise you could just stick to frigates. How long you use it - whether you sell it or keep it as a back up after you've got a Retriever - is up to you.

3) Mining crystals ... virtually no one uses mining crystals with a Retriever. You did notice that the comment about mining crystals was in the section headed Retriever - didn't you? The reason they don't use mining crystals with a Retriever is that they're traying the skills to get into a Hulk or a Covetor. Now - once they're in a Hulk or a Covetor - then YES - they train to use mining crystals - but not while they're in a ******* Retriever. Now - here again - things are different for different people - IF - you are training up your refining skills so that you can refine your ore - then for those ores you have trained to refine - you can use some crystals. Some people do that but others, for other reasons - don't. For example people in a corporation who have someone else who has their refining skills fully trained and does the refining for the corporation don't have to refine their own ore.

4) How the hell do you know that someone else has done something 'WRONG' if they don't have the money for not merely the Hulk but the Exhumers skill to use it? Are you them? Do you have their priorities? Is there only ONE ******* WAY TO DO THINGS? And - Mr. Smart Guy - what part of DON'T FLY WHAT YOU CAN'T AFFORD TO LOSE - do you not get? Do you not understand that this means having not the money to fly ONE Hulk - but to replace it? Also - have you noticed - since you're so smart - that while we train our skills in real time - you have to actually have time spent playing the game in order to mine anything? Does ******* EVERYONE playing this game have the same amount of playing time? Does ******* EVERYONE playing this game have enough playing time to have made the money to buy a Hulk by the time they can get into a Covetor? NO JACKASS - they don't. They may also be doing something else with their time - such as learning different aspects of the game to see which ones they really like. There are any number of things they could have done with the money you seem to think they should easily have by the time they get the skill trained. And one more thing about that - if a corporation is buying the ships - you can put a lot more junior miners into Covetors for the same amount of money spent on Hulks. If they want themselves a Hulk - well they can buy it themselves. And of course - last but far from least - what if they have done something wrong and lost some ships or screwed something else up? I suppose you've never made a mistake?





This is the kind of simplistic - dogmatic - advice you will constantly see in this game. It all goes along the line "There is one right way to do things - and I'm doing it - so if you don't do what I do - you're an idiot."


Bull ****.

.
Sola Mercury
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#40 - 2012-01-31 09:14:19 UTC
Toshiro GreyHawk wrote:


great freak out Big smile




Dont be so rude with him..
He's the one ninja mining in a Hulk in w-space with an open HS hole.Roll

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