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Incursion fixes/feedback thread

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Smoking Blunts
ZC Omega
#21 - 2012-01-23 17:15:38 UTC
-make vanguards harder, there far to easy as they are. balance all sites so they can not be blitzed.
-buff payouts on scouts, make them worth bothering with.
-isk payouts can go down as long as lp payouts go up to compensate.
-add more stuffs to lp pools, currently so much of it is crap. add 6% science implants, new faction/concord mods etc etc etc.
-make the mom only show after x amount of time, currently its after so many sites. so an incursion can be done in such a short time, they really should have an 'expected life span'
-increase the number of sites per system, if the sites are harder and take longer there should be more of them
-some randomness to the rats/spawns would be good, keep people from getting bored. be careful with thsi one, you guys tend to make things too megahelldeath nukethelivingfuckoutofthem first time round

OMG when can i get a pic here
Reppyk
The Black Shell
#22 - 2012-01-23 17:16:46 UTC
Sansha gatecamps in high sec, but with a message popup when you're about to jump inside the constellation.

I AM SPACE CAPTAIN REPPYK. BEWARE.

Proud co-admin of frugu.net, a French fansite about EVE !
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
#23 - 2012-01-23 17:24:35 UTC
try to stop encouraging people to farm pve content

- penalties are to low, there is no good reason to kick the sansha out of the constellation (no gatecamps highsec, nothing what hurts)
- HQ rewards are to low
- sites do not escalate: if you gain control, easy sites should disappear until only the boss site is left

give incursions a escalation scenario. They could start with small sites until player gain some system control back. This annoys the shansha quite a bit and they start the big offensive with the larger sites. If players beat them and continue to gain control smaller sites disappear until only the HQs are left.

the current system just invites to farm it. I would be curious if it was intended this way or not - i really hope not.

how to fix eve: 1) remove ECM 2) rename dampeners to ECM 3) add new anti-drone ewar for caldari 4) give offgrid boosters ongrid combat value
Jafit McJafitson
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#24 - 2012-01-23 17:33:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Jafit McJafitson
Okay actual suggestion.

Could you try making incursions as close as possible to actual PvP? Shorter engagements, far less predictable, the chance to actually lose your ship, etc. Require warp scramblers to keep targets on grid, realistic ship stats and drops instead of the standard meh DPS battleship rat?

So basically sell your faction fit legion and buy something you can afford to lose.
Sedilis
Lead Farmers
#25 - 2012-01-23 17:35:06 UTC
1) Reduce the payouts to bring it in-line with other PvE activities in that level of security space
2) Stop the blitzing of sites
3) When the mother ship spawns tail off and eventually stop other sites from spawning so that incursion has to be completed not farmed indefinitely
4) If you do no.3 then reduce the re-spawn timer so another incursion pops up sooner in another region of space. People can move and run the new one
Nerve Grallok
Grallok and Associates Salvage Inc
#26 - 2012-01-23 17:43:18 UTC
I enjoy incursions as they are currently implemented. However it is hard to enjoy them when they only last for a few hours, so I recommend:

1) Making it take longer for the mothership to appear. I suggest one week minimum.

In terms of general system streamlining and simplification I also recommend:

2) Reducing or eliminating the LP reward and increasing the ISK bounty reward.

Thanks for taking the time to solicit and read player feedback!
Jas Dor
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#27 - 2012-01-23 17:46:34 UTC
Despawn the incursion at the DT after the Mom has been killed and then respawn any replacement incursion.
Jas Dor
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#28 - 2012-01-23 17:51:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Jas Dor
Akrasjel Lanate wrote:
Joe SMASH wrote:
Reduce payouts across the board. Bring vanguard sites down to level 4 mission (ISK/hr) payouts (per member of fleet).

Anyone else who complains about people killing the Mom are ignorant to the way incursions were supposed to be run. Farming vanguards w/o giving thought to killing the mom to extend the incursion as long as possible is nothing short of an exploit that should be fixed.


Large Collidable Object wrote:
Remove isk rewards entirely, increase LP payout and stop spawning/despawn any sites once the mom has spawned.



Something like that


Carefully cycle the items in the associated LP store so that there is always something interesting to buy, but the market doesn't glut on any one item. You might also consider making the MOM site, and only the MOM site, a PvP area.
Braelyn
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#29 - 2012-01-23 18:04:30 UTC
Joe SMASH wrote:
Large Collidable Object wrote:
Remove isk rewards entirely, increase LP payout and stop spawning/despawn any sites once the mom has spawned.


100% this.

Remove all ISK payouts for incursion rats, bump up LP significantly. No ISK is created and the LP can then be spent to make cash the normal way.

Once the Mom is in play, all sites stop spawning.


This is an interesting idea. Support.
Jas Dor
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#30 - 2012-01-23 18:11:32 UTC
Reppyk wrote:
Sansha gatecamps in high sec, but with a message popup when you're about to jump inside the constellation.


What happens if an incursion with rats on gate spawns on one of the main autopilot routes between Jita and one of the other hubs?
Joe SMASH
You Got A Purty Mouth
#31 - 2012-01-23 18:12:57 UTC
Jas Dor wrote:
Reppyk wrote:
Sansha gatecamps in high sec, but with a message popup when you're about to jump inside the constellation.


What happens if an incursion with rats on gate spawns on one of the main autopilot routes between Jita and one of the other hubs?


Same thing that happened in the Incursion trailer... a lot of freighters gonna die.
Gul Amarr
Orange County Cruisers
#32 - 2012-01-23 18:14:09 UTC
mkint wrote:
This thread is heading nowhere good. If you want incursion feedback, ask people who run incursions, not people who are butthurt because "ihazdrake!" doesn't get any fleet invites.



Trusting the cat to keep the cream much?
Classy McSucksalot
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#33 - 2012-01-23 18:38:09 UTC
Speaking for the industrialist community, I believe I know why so many people are upset with the incursion mechanics (as evidenced by posts such as Large Collidable Object's).

Traditionally PvE in EvE has generated both ISK and materials, i.e. salvage and loot drops, which are used to build ships and components. As long as the amount of ISK and materials generated from PvE were relatively balanced, the prices of said materials would remain fairly stable. Inflation would occur with certain rare goods as materials can leave the game via PvP while ISK only leaves the game via sales taxes and NPC sell orders, but in general market competition would keep prices close to the cost of manufacture.

Incursions are allowing a large amount of ISK to be injected into the marketplace, with little production of material goods. By all accounts this should be causing massive inflation, but prices in Jita have actually been fairly stable, why?

Because the people who are generating the ISK (incursion runners) have nothing to spend their money on, apart from faction loot and PLEX, which have indeed been going up in price rapidly since the introduction of incursions. This is especially upsetting to those who live in 0.0 as they are having to use more of their income to PLEX their accounts which they would rather use to PvP, as well as increasing the cost of fitting out their ships.

In order to rectify this situation, I recommend reducing the ISK payout from incursions, and adding decent drops and salvage to the Sansha rats to balance it out. This also has the side benefit of allowing PvP in incursion sites in the EvE tradition of loot ninjaing.

Nuclear Nautics, for all your production and transportation needs.
Ninavask
The Synenose Accord
#34 - 2012-01-23 18:44:12 UTC
Here is what should happen:

-Lower Sansha Influence gets less sites till when the mothership appears only the mothership site exists. Similar to if you were actually pushing back the Sansha, not just farming them.

-Lower Sansha influence get more violent the sites get, increasing spawns and such by 10-15 percent.

-Lower isk payout for vanguard sites by 30-40 percent and boost headquarters sites by 30-40%

--Include Sansha pirates on gates incresing per system, make them act like belt rats. Also have them over planets and any other celestial beacon.

-Boost mothership takeout rewards so people have the sense to actually kill it.

-Increase CONCORD LP by 30-50%, focus more on LP then on cash.

Dr. Ninavask Revan

Colonist

Alexylva Paradox

The views above are the opinions and beliefs of Dr. Ninavask and do in no way reflect on his employeers or associates at the time of posting.
Sarah Schneider
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#35 - 2012-01-23 18:48:42 UTC
raise the vanguard site payouts by 10%, assaults by 30%
and
remove CONCORD or CONCORD responses completely from hisec incursion staging sites during the incursion period.

"I'd rather have other players get shot by other players than not interacting with others" -CCP Soundwave
Tore Vest
#36 - 2012-01-23 18:49:25 UTC
I want all gankers moved to Solitude...
And..
Timer on mom.... lets say 5 days or something before it spawns
Everything else is just fine
No need to change anything more Bear

No troll.
Haqar
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#37 - 2012-01-23 18:53:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Haqar
Here are my thoughts on it

Put the mom on a 2-3 day timer and link it with the influence thing
Make the sites more like this if possible:

vanguards like a lvl 3 mission
assualts like a lvl 4
hq like a lvl 5

While on that note make the sites as diverse as lvl 4 missions are, meaning take all those lvl 4 and convert them to a assaults with obvioudly more damage, with all the different lvl 4 you have alot assaults comming:)

Make the mom fight the most difficult thing around.

With that said redo or balance the payout for the sites while your at it.

Make the diversity in the sites so that it doesnt take an hour to form a hq fleet or 40 mins to run one., or an assault cause you need to many ships with certain roles

Also sort the dreadfull tagging system into the tagger or fc beeing able to go 'tagging mode' and uses control click to tag the target
Make it show in the fleet window/history on who blue the wrecks
Hope this helps
Lysaeus
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#38 - 2012-01-23 18:54:40 UTC
1. The blitzing of vanguard sites needs to be addressed. Either by reducing their payouts or increasing the length of time required to complete them. I'm partial to the latter as it could also be used to increase the amount of dps on the field and make the jobs of the logi pilots at least a little interesting.

2. Forcing the death of the mom shortly after it spawns. I do support the idea of new sites no longer spawning after the mothership appears. In order to keep incursions lasting longer than 2 hours the number of sites required before the mothership spawning would have to be increased by what margin I cannot say as I really don't know the current numbers. However, the appearance of the mothership should be signal the end of the incursion and should start the withdrawal timer.

3. The disparity between vanguards and assaults/headquarters sites. This is both that too much can be made blitzing vanguards and not enough is made running assaults/headquarters. Here I would suggest both reducing the isk/hour potential of vanguards and bossting the payouts on assaults by 10-15% and headquarters by 20%. I would also like to see the payout on the kundalini manifest increased by nearly 50% to help people rush to it when it spawns (so long as it automatically starts the withdrawal timer)

If these (especially 2) were to be used it would have to be met with a reduction in the spawn timer, perhaps somewhere in the neighbourhood of 25-50% (unintended consequences which would appear in low sec incursions include more revenant bpc's and their drop rate would have to be reduced to counter an increase in total drops). Even that would be far superior to the rampant ignore the boss farm vanguard sites for 5 days while we print so much isk it mocks nearly any other isk making venture in the game all while protected by the omnipotent space police.
Carton Mantory
Vindicate and Deliverance
#39 - 2012-01-23 18:54:52 UTC
Large Collidable Object wrote:
Remove isk rewards entirely, increase LP payout and stop spawning/despawn any sites once the mom has spawned.



Killing any NPC for incursions,Ratting or mission running. Make it all LP and salvage and loot. This goes the entire map 0.0 low-sec and high sec.

Let NPC be like the drone region... enuff said.
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
#40 - 2012-01-23 18:54:55 UTC
I would say that incursions should ramp up slowly - between 12-24 hours from appearance before they hit their maximum spawn rate for the sites. If players start engaging and completing sites then the incursion should ramp up faster (to the minimum of 12 hours to reach full speed).

After hour 60, there should be a gradually increasing chance that the mom site will spawn. Start with a 1% chance each hour, add 1% every additional hour, with a forced spawn around hour 90. If players are hitting the sites hot and heavy, make the percent chance of appearance increase by 2% each hour.

(Having the mom site spawn before the 60th hour makes incursions a bit unfair towards the more casual players who can't get out there until the incursion is already a day old.)

The mothership site should have a despawn timer, randomly between 10-30 hours. Which also ends the entire incursion, whether or not the mom is killed.

Once the mom does spawn, the frequency and maximum number of sites which can be up at the same time should start trailing off in a linear fashion over the next 10-30 hours (corresponding with the mothership despawning).