Player Features and Ideas Discussion

No, in a forum discussion.




And "Blah-Blah-Blah, who cares about a game" doesn't fly as an argument once you've put in the effort to post about the CSM "representing" anyone, like they owe it to you.

This thread needs more Motorhead.


Also, if you don't think that the delegates to CSM is doing a good job, campaign yourself. There's still 85% of the player base who's votes you can get. But don't complain if you're too lazy to be arsed to vote or join the many discussions on the forum.

why should i care about any effectivity of CSM ?

I wish them plenty of holidays and alcohol .

Quoted for great justice.

If you read the minutes you might agree with what some of the CSM members propose or you might disagree but at least it will get you informed about what the CSM actually does.

I think we should be grateful that we have a body that does represent the players, you might say they represent certain alliances only but ultimately they still represent the players and not the company. The CSM is a body that makes decisions to improve the player experience; it is nice to have a body that is independent of the company (CCP) in order to get a different perspective.

What other video-game has a body like the CSM. I mean just the minutes briefing was 44 pages long of pure text, imagine how many hours of meetings are put into that by players in order to enhance our experience of the game and ensure that CCP does not get too carried away with changes that only benefit them as a company.

I implore you to take a look at other developers and see the changes they make to their games. Blizzard forces you to use your full name for their Real ID implementation and there was a huge outcry from players, but those players had to use other outlets to protest on, people made youtube videos and many bitched on the forums but if that was considered to be an option for CCP the CSM would express deep concerns and tell CCP it would be a bad idea (see CSM minutes concerning security for more details).

I think we as players really undervalue how CCP manages their game. Eve has a common price index, inflation of isk is actually monitored, statistics are kept and organized and most importantly analyzed. I don't think other developers put as much effort into their game as CCP does, and the CSM exists for that reason; I do not think CCP developers want to spend the extra hours required in formal meetings where everything in documented in order to hear the CSM complain about things that should be changed about EVE but guess what, we have that privilege.

I hope people would not be so narrow-eyed in thinking that developers only want $ and the CSM only wants changes that will benefit them. Developers are like artists and EVE is their masterpiece. Devs put so much time, effort and passion into something that at the end of the day they can say, "I helped make this universe"; devs are geeks just like us. I would hope that people don't imagine CCP employees as young guys in sleek suits with hair gelled back exclaiming that the only thing that matters is the bottum line. I think that if any of us were fortunate enough to meet some developers face-to-face we would smile and shake their hands while saying "thank you, for helping make a game that has an effect on my emotions; the excitement of winning a fleet battle with friends, the sadness of losing an expensive ship, the disappointment of not overheating my tackle to grab a nice kill before it gets away, the anxiety of repping a ship out of structure in an incursion/fleet battle, the conversations had during mining and the people I've met thanks for all of it." The dev would smile back and say "my pleasure."

Where am I going with all this? I'm saying if CCP see's EVE as it's work of art it will do whatever it thinks best to help improve EVE so that other people can enjoy it too and what CCP has chosen to do is make the CSM.

I don't believe the CSM only tries to enforce changes that will only benefit them. I'm sure many of the CSM members own supers yet the super nerf still went through and in the last CSM minutes that were released there was talk about other super changes as well.

We should not be so quick to criticize, I say why not give thanks for CSM members and CCP devs that take the time they don't have to in-order to have a player to developer interaction that ultimately wishes to improve the game we all play.

Read the blogs of the CSM members, the meeting minutes and get informed on their opinions and achievements before coming to the forums and make yourself a complete fool.

Also, answer the surveys that CCP continually uses to gather opinions from the player base at large.

CSM do not represent me and my views, in addition, given the choice between two bowls of **** in an election the only two things you can do is either not vote or pick the bowl of **** that smells best.

In any case, the CSM have no real power, it is something ''allowed'' by CCP to make thousands of other people happy in some sense. Another method of control. Like the police, courts, tickets, etc..

I've have run large clans in online games, for over 10 years now. I can personally tell you that after a certain point you lose touch with some parts of your member base. You simply can't keep up with every little snowflake you recruit, and the responsibility and administration of a clan puts some claim on your time which further stops you from really knowing what is going on with 100 percent of the people. It is a fine line of delegation and decision making that you have to figure out for yourself and weight what is an acceptable sacrifice of time day to day.

Those bitches in the CSM just like having their name on a list, getting to say whatever, and making deals behind the scenes with gullible people who think their agendas can be spread by isk just like a real politician. The only difference here is that instead of a real politician with years of law experience, you have some fat ass 34 year old living in his mother's basement drinking Red Bull like Mittani.

No I couldn't find one. I'm supposed to just pick from a list? None of them campaigned to me? Etc., etc..

I was generalizing, don't get butt hurt.


On semi-related subject - I don't believe in democracy. It is a complete failure in itself. I live in the USA and I hear about all the stupidity of the US Government all day long here. Do you really think I would support 1,000 people who don't support anything I am interested in? People who are more concerned about themselves, what kind of money they can generate for their personal interests, how they can keep their fingers on the tax rate to make life good for themselves, and how much debt they can put our country into? **** no. You gotta be out of your god damn mind.

I'd much rather have a dictator, and if the MF'er doesn't pan out, we coup'de'ta his ass.

I think you miss the point Ruby. They do. That is what they are there for; to represent all players in EVE equally. That is their tsk and their duty as detailed by CCP when they brought this all into being. They are not there to speak for their own , or their Corp, or even their Alliances best interests; they are intended to be objective and unbiased to the best of their ability, in representing the EVE playerbase as a whole. They are failing.

Fix it all you want, the point is in the US Government they have hundreds of people who supposedly represent millions in our nation. This is not the case. I would rather have one singular person representing EVE Online and possibly a couple of people to help filter.

None of them represent me and what I am interested in nor does anyone in the government. And for damn sure Mittani doesn't represent my interests in the game, especially when his alliance and buddies are all about scamming people and all around screwing EVE Online up. I don't think anyone who is a leader of a major powerblock should be anywhere near the CSM, they will be looking out primarily for their alliance's interests.

Look at the trend in EVE, CSM isn't helping anything. Failed expansions, UI is crap, null sec is dying in favor of high sec, broken client, game mechanics screwed up. Where is CSM truly fixing any of this? There is a easier way to go about this, post in the forum and whatever gets a popular following probably should be worked on. Where is the need for a CSM now? Devs can't spend 5 minutes a day looking at the forum?