These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE General Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Recent incursion issues

First post First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Akrasjel Lanate
Immemorial Coalescence Administration
Immemorial Coalescence
#441 - 2012-01-23 16:00:59 UTC
I Love Boobies wrote:
I think Incursions would be a great way to get the Jove involved with the game. Could have them warp in after a set amount of time and chase the dirty Sansha back where they belong since it doesn't seem Concord is going to do anything about the Sansha. Of course, the farmers still wouldn't like it since they couldn't farm the ISK any longer.


-_-

I heard spiolers from the new novel that they are ALL DEAD(didnt rear it yet tho)

CEO of Lanate Industries

Citizen of Solitude
Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#442 - 2012-01-23 16:03:12 UTC
Incursion runners are sociopaths.

All they think about is their own satisfaction. What about the little people, who live in those systems? They have to wait a week to be able to play?

Oh but they could move. Well so could you! You could finish the incursion, then move on to the next.



Right now, whether they care or not, Darius and crew are champions of antisociopathy.
Krissada
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#443 - 2012-01-23 16:05:22 UTC
Corina Jarr wrote:

Right now, whether they care or not, Darius and crew are champions of antisociopathy.


No one mentions me. I think I will join the incursion runners and cry with them. Cry
Lex Alandar
Q Division Five
#444 - 2012-01-23 16:18:31 UTC
I find it absolutely friggin hilarious that the group claiming bears are making too much risk-free isk are using those same bears to prime their own risk-free blueprint-farming activities.

And you all think it's about nerfing incursions?


ahahahahahahahahahaahaaaaaaaaaaaaaa


This thread clearly shows the motivation:

-tear collection
-as many sansha mom bpcs as the bears will serve up for them
Krissada
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#445 - 2012-01-23 16:20:26 UTC
Lex Alandar wrote:

This thread clearly shows the motivation:

-tear collection
-as many sansha mom bpcs as the bears will serve up for them



One is correct and the other is wrong.
Guess which one you imbecile.
Dr Jan Itor
Doomheim
#446 - 2012-01-23 16:57:56 UTC
Please ELI5 why it is a problem that people are doing incursions.
The Snowman
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#447 - 2012-01-23 17:03:34 UTC
Havoc Zealot wrote:
I actually logged in to reply to this thread.

I support these mom killings...they were meant to be killed and not have the lesser incursions farmed.

you forgot to log into your dev account to make this statement
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#448 - 2012-01-23 17:05:28 UTC
Lex Alandar wrote:
I find it absolutely friggin hilarious that the group claiming bears are making too much risk-free isk are using those same bears to prime their own risk-free blueprint-farming activities.

And you all think it's about nerfing incursions?


ahahahahahahahahahaahaaaaaaaaaaaaaa


This thread clearly shows the motivation:

-tear collection
-as many sansha mom bpcs as the bears will serve up for them



revenant BPCs only drop in lowsec incursions, hope that helps

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Katherine Starlight
Doomheim
#449 - 2012-01-23 18:34:36 UTC
Andski wrote:




revenant BPCs only drop in lowsec incursions, hope that helps[/quote]

they kill the lowsec ones too afaik.

Darius is a master at collecting tears, i wonder what he does with all of them, take a bath in them maybe?
Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#450 - 2012-01-23 18:48:06 UTC
Krissada wrote:
Lex Alandar wrote:

This thread clearly shows the motivation:

-tear collection
-as many sansha mom bpcs as the bears will serve up for them



One is correct and the other is wrong.
Guess which one you imbecile.



I know the answer :-)

Bring back DEEEEP Space!
Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#451 - 2012-01-23 19:01:43 UTC
Krissada wrote:
Corina Jarr wrote:

Right now, whether they care or not, Darius and crew are champions of antisociopathy.


No one mentions me. I think I will join the incursion runners and cry with them. Cry

I'm so sorry. I just can't ever remember how to spell your name, and I hate messing that up.


Krissada... now its in one of my posts so I can just check my post history.
Jas Dor
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#452 - 2012-01-23 19:08:00 UTC
Lets do some math. According to CCP incursions are paying out 621 billion a week. Lets use 30m/hour as a conservative figure on how much a level 4 mission runner can make. That gives us a total of 20700 l4 man/hours a week. Assuming 23/7 uptime we get 161 hours/week. Since Incrusion's can't be botted no one player will be able to play 23/7. In total though the isk for incursions equals the same income generation (live load) per hour as 129 level IV missions being run in that hour. (=621,000,000,000 / 30,000,000 / 161)

What this tells me is that the isk per hour of running an incursion isn't as good as most people think. While the isk per hour actually running incursions seems great, when organizational and transit times are taken into account-not so much. The current idea of incursions as an isk generator seem to be generated by a couple of things.

1. Time flys when you're having fun. People of underestimating their total time commitment.

2. Big wallet flashies and bad math.

3. Folks flying faction ships with faction fits for the the first time and underestimating how much they could make with those ships running level 4s (it's more than 30m/hour).

4. Incursions are not being run evenly but at peak times. This means that a higher hourly reward is possible, but there is a lot of down/cycle time without heavy incursion running.

Bottom line 621b/week is a drop in the bucket for the eve economy (the Plex market in Jita churns 1.2T per DAY!). All this rage is a community issue being mistaken for an ISK one. If these shinny fleets split up and ran level 4s, there pilots would probably find themselves making more isk/hour. The enjoyment of flying with people (and unfamiliarity with use of heavy faction fits in L4s) is inflating the perception of profit.
gfldex
#453 - 2012-01-23 19:10:47 UTC
Nirnias Stirrum wrote:
What im most dissapointed about overall is that NO ONE IS BLOODY WARDECCING US!! I mean come on people we make you cry, the least you could do is war dec us and fight us to vent your frustration!


Sorry dude, but Incursions and wardecs are not compatible. Neither are killrights. Incursions are pure carebear content.

If you take all the sand out of the box, only the cat poo will remain.
Avid Bumhumper
Beekeepers Anonymous
#454 - 2012-01-23 19:11:16 UTC
Krissada wrote:
Lex Alandar wrote:

This thread clearly shows the motivation:

-tear collection
-as many sansha mom bpcs as the bears will serve up for them



One is correct and the other is wrong.
Guess which one you imbecile.


This from someone who is having a fit over people making too much fake money in a game? Roll

My Tinfoil hat has been sugically implanted, so no,it is not for sale.....
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#455 - 2012-01-23 19:16:58 UTC
Jas Dor wrote:
Lets do some math. According to CCP incursions are paying out 621 billion a week.
Source?
Razor Blue
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#456 - 2012-01-23 19:26:22 UTC
Id be curious to see such data as well.

As far as i know, CCP havent published any information of how much isk is being injected by Incursions.

The 621b is probably just a number that someone thinks how much 3high sec incursions produce in perfect conditions.
Lex Alandar
Q Division Five
#457 - 2012-01-23 19:56:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Lex Alandar
Katherine Starlight wrote:
Andski wrote:




revenant BPCs only drop in lowsec incursions, hope that helps


they kill the lowsec ones too afaik.

Darius is a master at collecting tears, i wonder what he does with all of them, take a bath in them maybe?[/quote]


....and the more hisec incursions are burned through (despawned), the more lowsec ones become available

honestly you people really need to try more than one step in logic


They get rewarded, monetarily, for collecting tears.

edit: and get to throw up the "incursion nerf" as their reason


Why wouldn't they do it?



For the record I'm in favour of changes to incursions, I thought it was pretty ridiculous when I started seeing all these noobs with named-gun machariels farming stupid isk.

I hear though from the dedicated lvl 4 runners that they can easily surpass incursion isk/hour. Without the hassle of finding a fleet, contesting sites, or downtime waiting/forming up/etc.

The whole damn system is ******, and it shows in the 1% monthly inflation
Brumi Viri
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#458 - 2012-01-23 20:06:44 UTC
Tallian Saotome wrote:
Jo Hei wrote:
Elisha Starkiller wrote:

so i did a couple lvl4's instead and dam lvl4's are boring... no one to talk to no fun, i was out of eve and back into BF3 in no time.....


This is my point. Instead of letting new or casual players enjoy the game the way they want to, the griefers killing off incursions are culling genuine interest in this game and so are preventing its growth. Mostly it is out of attention-seeking, "oh look at us, we're special!", but honestly, Dear BrickSquad, its time for you guys to stop crying about game features. Either play something else or HTFU.

Well, given that its currently being controlled by an 'elite' cliche that utterly control who can run incursions, and will ban you for agreeing that just perhaps, they should be ended when the mom spawned because, well, thats how its supposed to happen(or the mom wouldn't spawn for days) who are utterly disrupting peoples homes for an extended period because they are deliberately prolonging the penalties to people who aren't incursion runners...

Thats rather a problem, when you can be banned from this activity for disagreeing with someone.



BTL has a very democratic approach with due process. No one is banned just because. Also they allow you to have a CASE where you can submit information and appeal your ban. There are people getting un-ban all the time.
Ammzi
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#459 - 2012-01-23 20:08:11 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Jas Dor wrote:
Lets do some math. According to CCP incursions are paying out 621 billion a week.
Source?


I believe those numbers came from my calculations. However I am not certain.


Ammzi wrote:
Mocam wrote:


Because they do break apart in levels and whereas you have 1 loss mail - daily there are mission runners losing ships to PvP across sec levels. They are NO more dangerous than doing missions.



It's relative. It's so unbelievably relative mate.
One pilot may not have lost any ships in incursions ever while another pilot might have lost several faction battleships and t3's over the course of a few months.
If you want to look at it as an average I doubt you'll be able to, because you don't have access to the necessary data, and again you might be able to although it won't be accurate.

Either way, you don't know how many mission in EVE and you only have a vague estimate of how many run incursions on a regular basis.
I could easily say the same about incursions. DAILY people lose ships to incursions across several sec level.
Look for yourself in constellation ship losses over highsec, lowsec and nullsec. Daily losses.

And what loss mail? I was talking about the guy's kills. All those kills he's been having the past couple of days account for BILLIONS of isk, all of those are incursion runners that have been griefed.

Just because those who run incursions are much more public about it by having massive channels and a large concentration of pilots in one place doesn't mean you can automatically assume anything about them without having necessary data when comparing missioners and incursion runners.
I'd say at peak time, a saturday or friday afternoon you'll be able to count a max of 500-800 active incursion runners at good circumstances.

Let's just assume:

3 highsec incursions, each with 3 vanguard system, each with 4 fleets in them (extremely crowded).
10 (11) pilots * 4 fleets * 3 systems * 3 constellations =360 - 396 active pilots earning isk.

Let's for that sake assume we have 4 assault fleets and 2 headquarter fleets:

20 * 4 + 40 * 2 = 160 pilots.

At best let's assume a total of these 520-556 pilots are all earning an average of 70 m/hour. This is totally viable, since some fleets are earning 40 m/hour because of dreadful long breaks, losing sites, forming fleet, losing members or waiting for better sites to spawn while other fleets are earning 120 m/hour.

So 520-556 * 70 m/hour = 36,4-38,9 billion isk is being created for incursions at PEAK time and EXTREME crowdness an hour in highsec, which only occurs at max 20 hours a week. The weekly average is much lower than that.

Half a thousand pilots, all this because of half a thousand pilots? Seems quite negligible in my eyes.




Ammzi wrote:
A reasonable ISK generation / hour from all incursions in highsec , (weekly average per hour) isn't way off when saying 10-15 billion isk is generated on average an hour from highsec incursions.

So somewhere between 1.6 trillion and 2.5 trillion isk is introduced to the game on average from incursions.
Ay - is this what is causing massive plex spikes?

To put this in perspective that is enough isk to buy 3300-5000 plex's every week from the isk in incursions.

So in the end that is 12,000-20,000 PLEX being able to be bought solely through incursion isk if my assumptions and calculations should hold.

If we say that there is about 3000 regular incursion runners and they have 1,5 accounts on average that is 4500 PLEX's bought (if all pay with plex).
This leaves 7,500 - 15,500 * 500 million isk = 3.7 - 7.78 trillion isk in their wallets!!

What do the market experts say? P
Brumi Viri
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#460 - 2012-01-23 20:11:11 UTC
RubyPorto wrote:
Tallian Saotome wrote:
Jo Hei wrote:
Elisha Starkiller wrote:

so i did a couple lvl4's instead and dam lvl4's are boring... no one to talk to no fun, i was out of eve and back into BF3 in no time.....


This is my point. Instead of letting new or casual players enjoy the game the way they want to, the griefers killing off incursions are culling genuine interest in this game and so are preventing its growth. Mostly it is out of attention-seeking, "oh look at us, we're special!", but honestly, Dear BrickSquad, its time for you guys to stop crying about game features. Either play something else or HTFU.

Well, given that its currently being controlled by an 'elite' cliche that utterly control who can run incursions, and will ban you for agreeing that just perhaps, they should be ended when the mom spawned because, well, thats how its supposed to happen(or the mom wouldn't spawn for days) who are utterly disrupting peoples homes for an extended period because they are deliberately prolonging the penalties to people who aren't incursion runners...

Thats rather a problem, when you can be banned from this activity for disagreeing with someone.


Clearly, the Banlists are stopping those who are banned from participating in the Incursion activity. Those who are banned could never kill a MOM.



Some people on the ban list are there for killing the MOM, others for killing Logistics, etc etc. BTL has un banned players that have killed MOMs in the past. They understand that people learn from their mistakes and are welcome back into the community.