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How can ppl do Lv4s with Strategic Cruisers or Drakes?
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Lich Lord Venetrax
Doomheim
#1 - 2012-01-18 21:50:21 UTC
I was just wondering how can you manage Lv4 missions with the DPS of a Loki or Drake, max I'm able to do on EFT is around 300DPS but it sounds hard to pull down enemy BS with such low damage....so I'm gonna ask how do you do it? Thx^^
XXSketchxx
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#2 - 2012-01-18 21:55:08 UTC  |  Edited by: XXSketchxx
Lich Lord Venetrax wrote:
I was just wondering how can you manage Lv4 missions with the DPS of a Loki or Drake, max I'm able to do on EFT is around 300DPS but it sounds hard to pull down enemy BS with such low damage....so I'm gonna ask how do you do it? Thx^^


With better fits than what you're EFT warrioring.

I'm guessing you're doing those super awesome passive recharge fits where you use all the low slots for tanking?
Lich Lord Venetrax
Doomheim
#3 - 2012-01-18 22:00:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Lich Lord Venetrax
XXSketchxx wrote:
Lich Lord Venetrax wrote:
I was just wondering how can you manage Lv4 missions with the DPS of a Loki or Drake, max I'm able to do on EFT is around 300DPS but it sounds hard to pull down enemy BS with such low damage....so I'm gonna ask how do you do it? Thx^^


With better fits than what you're EFT warrioring.

I'm guessing you're doing those super awesome passive recharge fits where you use all the low slots for tanking?


Give me one then, nope for Loki I use low for 4 gyro
Svodola Darkfury
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2012-01-18 22:02:40 UTC
You should be getting significantly higher damage out of T3 fits with proper skills/fitting.

Drake I'm assuming you're using non-t2 or faction launchers, which means the dps drop is gigantic.

My WH drake can run 500 omni tank and just under 400 dps (about 400 with 3% ROF/dmg implants) and the huge jump in DPS I got from it was finally get T2 heavy missile launchers and then using Scourge Fury ammo. You only use the scourge fury for Cruisers or bigger (even against cruisers you're taking a minor dps hit).


The fit isn't in front of me at the moment but I think its:

Highs: 7x Heavy Missile IIs w/ Scourge Fury for beefy targets, precision or caldari navy scourge for smaller targets.

Mids: 2x invuln II, 3x LSE II, 1x Shield Recharger II

Lows: 2x SPR II, 2x BCS II

Rigs: 3x Med Core Defence Field Purger Is

The fit is going to be very tight on powergrid without either Advanced Weapon upgrades 5 or Shield Upgrades 5. If you can't fit it, swap out a LSE II for a Shield Recharger II for a modest tank loss. Also requires a 3% cpu implant even with good skills.

For missions you'd swap out the invulns for mission specific hardeners and be able to take just about any level 4 with careful pulling. And as usual, if you need more tank for a mission, pull the BCS's out for SPRs.

Director of Frozen Corpse Industries.
XXSketchxx
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#5 - 2012-01-18 22:04:54 UTC
Lich Lord Venetrax wrote:
XXSketchxx wrote:
Lich Lord Venetrax wrote:
I was just wondering how can you manage Lv4 missions with the DPS of a Loki or Drake, max I'm able to do on EFT is around 300DPS but it sounds hard to pull down enemy BS with such low damage....so I'm gonna ask how do you do it? Thx^^


With better fits than what you're EFT warrioring.

I'm guessing you're doing those super awesome passive recharge fits where you use all the low slots for tanking?


Give me one then, nope for Loki I use low for 4 gyro


Figure it out yourself or go to ships and modules. This isn't a charity zone.
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#6 - 2012-01-18 22:09:19 UTC
Three gyros:

[Loki, mishins]
Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
Tracking Enhancer II
Tracking Enhancer II

Republic Fleet 10MN Afterburner
Pithum C-Type Medium Shield Booster
Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II
Caldari Navy Shield Boost Amplifier

425mm AutoCannon II, EMP M
425mm AutoCannon II, EMP M
425mm AutoCannon II, EMP M
425mm AutoCannon II, EMP M
425mm AutoCannon II, EMP M
425mm AutoCannon II, EMP M

Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit II
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit II

Loki Defensive - Amplification Node
Loki Electronics - Tactical Targeting Network
Loki Engineering - Augmented Capacitor Reservoir
Loki Offensive - Projectile Scoping Array
Loki Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst


Hobgoblin II x5

Better range/damage application:

[Loki, Sansha - Logu]
Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
Republic Fleet Gyrostabilizer
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System

Heat Dissipation Field II
Photon Scattering Field II
Heat Dissipation Field II
Dread Guristas Large Shield Booster
10MN Afterburner II

425mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Thunderbolt Fury Heavy Missile
425mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M
425mm AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M

Medium Bay Loading Accelerator II
Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I

Loki Defensive - Adaptive Shielding
Loki Electronics - Tactical Targeting Network
Loki Engineering - Augmented Capacitor Reservoir
Loki Offensive - Hardpoint Efficiency Configuration
Loki Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst


Hammerhead II x4
Hobgoblin II x5

Oh look, a Drake:

[Drake, better mishin drake more gank]
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Ballistic Control System II
Beta Reactor Control: Shield Power Relay I

Shield Recharger II
Large Shield Extender II
Large Shield Extender II
10MN Afterburner II
Invulnerability Field II
Invulnerability Field II

Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
[empty high slot]

Medium Core Defence Field Purger I
Medium Core Defence Field Purger I
Medium Core Defence Field Purger I


Hobgoblin II x5

Oh look, a silly Drake:

[Drake, stupid mishin drake full gank]
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System

Pithum C-Type Medium Shield Booster
Shield Boost Amplifier II
Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron
Domination 10MN Afterburner
Heat Dissipation Field II
Ballistic Deflection Field II

Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
[empty high slot]

Medium Bay Loading Accelerator II
Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst I


Hobgoblin II x5

Those all break 400 easily without drones.
stoicfaux
#7 - 2012-01-18 22:09:27 UTC
XXSketchxx wrote:
Figure it out yourself or go to ships and modules. This isn't a charity zone.


I'm a bit rusty, but let me see if I can translate from ******* to Helpful:
Try 'google'ing "eve level 4 drake mission running fit" or some equivalent. It should turn up hits from previous threads on the subject. You can also try Battleclinic which has rated fits: http://eve.battleclinic.com/browse_loadouts.php?mode=date

Alternately, be patient and someone (nice) will probably post a fitting or three.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Lich Lord Venetrax
Doomheim
#8 - 2012-01-18 22:09:50 UTC
XXSketchxx wrote:
Lich Lord Venetrax wrote:
XXSketchxx wrote:
Lich Lord Venetrax wrote:
I was just wondering how can you manage Lv4 missions with the DPS of a Loki or Drake, max I'm able to do on EFT is around 300DPS but it sounds hard to pull down enemy BS with such low damage....so I'm gonna ask how do you do it? Thx^^


With better fits than what you're EFT warrioring.

I'm guessing you're doing those super awesome passive recharge fits where you use all the low slots for tanking?


Give me one then, nope for Loki I use low for 4 gyro


Figure it out yourself or go to ships and modules. This isn't a charity zone.


Then dont reply here cause the topic is about understanding it, not figure by myself moron.
Spineker
#9 - 2012-01-18 22:10:38 UTC
Drake and Level 4s would be insanely boring and slow. Would be much better off blitzing through the Level 3s. You can do it in a drake but ugh.
XXSketchxx
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#10 - 2012-01-18 22:23:50 UTC
Lich Lord Venetrax wrote:


Then dont reply here cause the topic is about understanding it, not figure by myself moron.


how about next time you post the fits you've been working up (terribly) so we can help point out where you're mistaken, rather than begging for people to feed you for the night
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#11 - 2012-01-18 22:24:42 UTC
I have done L4s with BCs but even with a 'cane it's stupidly boring and inefficient.

Since the day I put my butt on a gank fit Mael they became certainly not boring and very efficient. Maybe you should do L3s with Drake and L4 with a battleship.

EvE Online portal | EvE markets tutorials
stoicfaux
#12 - 2012-01-18 22:35:54 UTC
Lich Lord Venetrax wrote:
I was just wondering how can you manage Lv4 missions with the DPS of a Loki or Drake, max I'm able to do on EFT is around 300DPS but it sounds hard to pull down enemy BS with such low damage....so I'm gonna ask how do you do it? Thx^^


Generally speaking, try to fit 3-4 weapons mods in the lows (Gyrostabilizers, Ballistic Control Units, etc..) For guns, you'll want to fit Tracking Computers or Tracking Enhancers to increase your range and tracking. For missiles, you want Target Painters. Webs can help both types of weapons. Then you'll want a prop mod (a propulsion mod such as an AB or MWD.) You may then want to fit modules to improve targeting range, locking speed, and/or number of locks.

Once you have gank maxed out, start taking away modules until you get a tank that will let you survive long enough to kill the mission NPCs down to a manageable level (e.g. gank is tank.)


Couple of problems with your ship choices:

a) Damage projection. The Loki uses medium guns with are relatively short ranged for a level 4 mission. Meaning, you'll waste a lot of time flying into range. (The 100km range and no damage degradation of HMLs is one reason why the Tengu is the "best" T3 at running Level 4s.) Using long range artillery guns isn't much better because they have lower DPS and a very slow RoF.

b) Protection (aka tank.) The Drake is known for having a mighty passive tank. Unfortunately, fitting for a passive tank that can withstand level 4s requires giving up 'gank' modules. Lower DPS increases your mission times. A max gank, active tanked Drake can put out 532 DPS with kinetic missiles.


tl;dr - Basically, you're boned. Train to fly a Tengu (712 DPS not counting implants.) Fly the Drake for it's tank while training up your gank skills and save for a Tengu. Fly a Loki because it's fun (not efficient) to go zoom zoom!

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Goose99
#13 - 2012-01-18 22:38:44 UTC
He probably forgot to switch ammo in eft. 300 dps for drake, and 500 dps for tengu, sounds about right if you use non-kinetic missiles. Lol@Caldari bonus, it's the equivalent of 1/4 of a regular bonus.Lol
Xenuria
#14 - 2012-01-19 01:39:15 UTC
983 DPS
Proteus
1045 Damage Repaired per Cycle
Can Tank ANY 2 Damage Types
Can Tank 3 large Neut towers
Can Tank level 5s...


GET

ON

MY

LEVEL

CSM 12 Candidate
Katherine Starlight
Doomheim
#15 - 2012-01-19 01:43:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Katherine Starlight
709 DPS with T2 ammo but i shoot T1 that gives around 590 with decent skills(not max), passive tanks all lvl4s till you kill off all incoming DPS, 708M/s perma AB (only thing that hurts you are webs frigs and cruisers). This is the Angel fit, it tanks the bonus room in AE lvl4 killing incoming DPS before hitting 60% shield where is starts to regen.

[Tengu, PVE TENGU]
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System

Large Shield Extender II
Caldari Navy Explosion Dampening Field
Caldari Navy Explosion Dampening Field
Invulnerability Field II
Gistum C-Type 10MN Afterburner
Invulnerability Field II

Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Heavy Missile
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Heavy Missile

Medium Core Defence Field Extender II
Medium Core Defence Field Extender II
Medium Core Defence Field Extender II

Tengu Defensive - Supplemental Screening
Tengu Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer
Tengu Offensive - Accelerated Ejection Bay
Tengu Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst
Tengu Engineering - Augmented Capacitor Reservoir



but the best thing, its sort of not a oneshotkill for gankers, and is way cheaper than papertanks. Get two of theese tengus and lvl4s go so fast noctises cant even keep up salvaging.

Why do so many think the thundercat cannot PVE and go with idiotic papertanks?, its more awesome in PVE than PVP.
Anya Ohaya
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#16 - 2012-01-19 02:07:27 UTC
Katherine Starlight wrote:


Why do so many think the thundercat cannot PVE and go with idiotic papertanks?, its more awesome in PVE than PVP.



Drake teaches pilots to sit there and absorb damage.

From what I understand of the Thundercat it doesn't have much long-term local tanking. You can't just pull all the aggro and sit there spamming missiles. You need speed tank and/or eliminate incoming DPS. (Or use RR like PL does in PVP).
Katherine Starlight
Doomheim
#17 - 2012-01-19 04:27:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Katherine Starlight
Anya Ohaya wrote:
Katherine Starlight wrote:


Why do so many think the thundercat cannot PVE and go with idiotic papertanks?, its more awesome in PVE than PVP.



Drake teaches pilots to sit there and absorb damage.

From what I understand of the Thundercat it doesn't have much long-term local tanking. You can't just pull all the aggro and sit there spamming missiles. You need speed tank and/or eliminate incoming DPS. (Or use RR like PL does in PVP).

It has a long term local tanking in missions, as long as you orbit something with the AB turned on, be it the beacon you warp in on in a pocket or a can. Unless its serpentis missions, then you can just sit there with full aggro spamming missiles. 400K+ EHP without implants against serpentis. Basicly you always have the AB turned on with the thundercat in missions, it is capstable.

Its not hard to move around. Heck just orbit the next acceleration gate.


also THUNDERCATS HOOOO
Firebolt145
The Hatchery
RAZOR Alliance
#18 - 2012-01-19 11:16:04 UTC
Drakes are very slow at completely killing lvl4's. But they are amazing at blitzing them. Not the best, but still amazing especially once you consider their price.

Tengu is very good both ways. I don't know much about Loki.
Outz Xacto
Echelon Munitions
#19 - 2012-01-19 16:43:15 UTC
Xenuria wrote:
983 DPS
Proteus
1045 Damage Repaired per Cycle
Can Tank ANY 2 Damage Types
Can Tank 3 large Neut towers
Can Tank level 5s...



Huzzah for blaster boating!

Would be semi interested in your setup to pass along to my hybrid loving friend.


OP:
Drake with proper missile SP can run L4s but as already pointed out, you're better off running multiple L3's. I've done most of the L4's in a drake and was thankful EVE has an ingame browser... cause I dont know how else I would have got through the boredom.

With proper skills a Tengu can be easily fit to deal over 700dps, tank any L4, cap stable etc.

Riggor riggings are your friend, you will not need a TP if you decide to use 2x T2 Riggors and Flare, and likely depending on the number of current frigs in a given wave or type of frigs you wont even need to change ammo types unless you just want to save some money on missiles...
Surge Roth
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#20 - 2012-01-19 18:45:23 UTC
Spineker wrote:
Drake and Level 4s would be insanely boring and slow. Would be much better off blitzing through the Level 3s. You can do it in a drake but ugh.


Too bad a lot of people think the drake is some god send lvl 4 mission running machine with a tank impossible to penetrate in some of these nerf threads I've seen lately.
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