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EALUR FOUND AMONG THOSE RESCUED
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Aquila Shadow
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#21 - 2012-01-13 03:04:10 UTC
Slaves are illigel in the state so i dont no how this man was planning on starting up a slave company when the state customs officials are just as opposed to slaves as the republic is.

                                              "Let Vigilance Be Your Sword"
Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#22 - 2012-01-13 08:24:03 UTC
Manwe Todako wrote:
Rodj Blake wrote:

On the contrary, there was very little violence involved when we began civilising them.


When the Ealur were enslaved by the Amarr, the Amarr found a rustic, idyllic, agrarian civilization of tribes people at peace with their surroundings. They were non-aggressive, mellow people who were terrestrially intuitive yet not technologically adept. They were skilled in sufficient living and in the harmonious use of their planet.

The Amarr, noticing that they were not like them, assumed that they must be under the judgment of God. After-all, the Amarr reason, "anyone not like us must be under God's judgment." Assuming that, they further assumed that they ought to punish the Ealur on God's behalf. So that is what they did, reasoning as they do, "anyone not like us, being under God's judgment, should be punished by us." They literally worked the Ealur to death and millions died in Amarr mines and fields, Mr. Blake. So stop lying about how your "civilization of the Ealur" involved little violence. Are you now defining millions worked to death in harsh labor as non-violent?

The Ealur are more civilized than a slave holding Amarrian Empire can ever hope to be. They need to civilize you, not the other way around. You and I both know that the enslavement of the Ealur by the Amarrian Empire was cowardly, brutal, and completely unnecessary even to spread your religion among them. The Ealur are a very receptive and open minded people. Your missionaries could have accomplished a non-violent, non-slavery approach to proselytization. Your defense of your people's enslavement of the Ealur is beneath your intelligence. It is as wrong now as it was then.


I put it to you that far from merely being a humanitarian organisation dedicated to helping slaves on the verge of death, the Disciples of Ston are in fact hoping to overthrow the Empire by removing as many slaves from it as possible.

Dolce et decorum est pro Imperium mori
Arkady Sadik
Gradient
Electus Matari
#23 - 2012-01-13 10:08:13 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
I put it to you that far from merely being a humanitarian organisation dedicated to helping slaves on the verge of death, the Disciples of Ston are in fact hoping to overthrow the Empire by removing as many slaves from it as possible.
If removing slaves from the Empire was a method towards overthrowing it, Jamyl would be one of the worst enemy you have.
Caellach Marellus
Stormcrows
#24 - 2012-01-13 10:26:31 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
I put it to you that far from merely being a humanitarian organisation dedicated to helping slaves on the verge of death, the Disciples of Ston are in fact hoping to overthrow the Empire by removing as many slaves from it as possible.


You realise the flaw in your logic Admiral?

If the Disciples didn't rescue these people, they'd be almost certainly dead. So they'd be removed from the Empire regardless in that factor.

The Disciples actually do the Empire a favour, by returning those who wish to continue serving their former owners. It's like finding a credit chip down the back of the sofa you hadn't realised you'd lost.

When your gut instincts tell you something is wrong, trust them. When your heart tells you something is right, ignore it, check with your brain first. Accept nothing, challenge everything.
Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#25 - 2012-01-13 11:18:37 UTC
Arkady Sadik wrote:
Rodj Blake wrote:
I put it to you that far from merely being a humanitarian organisation dedicated to helping slaves on the verge of death, the Disciples of Ston are in fact hoping to overthrow the Empire by removing as many slaves from it as possible.
If removing slaves from the Empire was a method towards overthrowing it, Jamyl would be one of the worst enemy you have.


I'm not saying that it's a good method, merely that I suspect that the Disciples think that it's a good method.

Dolce et decorum est pro Imperium mori
Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#26 - 2012-01-13 11:19:50 UTC
Caellach Marellus wrote:


The Disciples actually do the Empire a favour, by returning those who wish to continue serving their former owners. It's like finding a credit chip down the back of the sofa you hadn't realised you'd lost.


I believe that they claim to have emancipated over 13,000 slaves. How many of these were returned to their owners?

Dolce et decorum est pro Imperium mori
Tiberious Thessalonia
True Slave Foundations
#27 - 2012-01-13 11:54:19 UTC
Even one is better than the none that would have happened had the Disciples not done anything, surely, to your view?
Rodj Blake
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#28 - 2012-01-13 13:16:19 UTC
Tiberious Thessalonia wrote:
Even one is better than the none that would have happened had the Disciples not done anything, surely, to your view?


You're assuming that all of the emancipated slaves were on the verge of death. I have my doubts about this.

Dolce et decorum est pro Imperium mori
Manwe Todako
Disciples of Ston
#29 - 2012-01-13 14:19:56 UTC
Aquila Shadow wrote:
Slaves are illigel in the state so i dont no how this man was planning on starting up a slave company when the state customs officials are just as opposed to slaves as the republic is.


Dear Friend,
I appreciate your idealism and feelings of loyalty toward your nation, but you need to understand that Caldari is rife with slavery. I was a former slave who began life in Amarr and was illegally sold to a Caldari Corporate minion. There are masses of slaves residing in Caldari space and it is easy to get them there. Jita, for example is a cesspool of human trafficking and exploitation. Customs officials are unable to detect covert transport of slaves from Amarr territory into their space. Only a tiny fraction of smugglers get caught.

To believe the illegal slave commerce is not a reality in Caldari space is to believe a myth.

SANKOFA
Arkady Sadik
Gradient
Electus Matari
#30 - 2012-01-13 14:25:07 UTC
The Caldari Navy regularly supports the Imperial Navy with slave raids into Republic space, and has done so for many years.
Manwe Todako
Disciples of Ston
#31 - 2012-01-13 15:01:40 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:

I put it to you that far from merely being a humanitarian organisation dedicated to helping slaves on the verge of death, the Disciples of Ston are in fact hoping to overthrow the Empire by removing as many slaves from it as possible.


I usually try to avoid sarcasm, but this bate is nearly irresistible. Yep, Mr. Blake, you have nailed us. Our huge, massive corporation of highly trained subversive experts is systematically trying to drain the empire of its millions upon millions of slaves all for the goal of overthrowing the Theocracy and replacing it with pagan chaos. And, we're close to achieving that goal. Just a few more slaves and we've done it and the Empire will collapse into our laps.

Sarcasm concludes with a suggestion that you change your bye line to:

Dulce et decorum est ingens BOMBULUM

SANKOFA
Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#32 - 2012-01-13 15:10:23 UTC
Manwe Todako wrote:


I usually try to avoid sarcasm, but this bate is nearly irresistible. Yep, Mr. Blake, you have nailed us. Our huge, massive corporation of highly trained subversive experts is systematically trying to drain the empire of its millions upon millions of slaves all for the goal of overthrowing the Theocracy and replacing it with pagan chaos. And, we're close to achieving that goal. Just a few more slaves and we've done it and the Empire will collapse into our laps.



So if the sarcasm is assuming you are making a big difference, I suppose the reality is that you are making no difference at all?

Just as I thought.

Sabik now, Sabik forever
Manwe Todako
Disciples of Ston
#33 - 2012-01-13 15:24:21 UTC
Silas Vitalia wrote:


So if the sarcasm is assuming you are making a big difference, I suppose the reality is that you are making no difference at all?

Just as I thought.



Your thought process is informed by the propaganda you learned in Capsuleer training that you are some sort of Demi-god and that your importance and influence is Cosmic in scale. The Disciples of Ston impact individuals. Do we make a difference? Ask the Cottons and Greenhands if we made a difference in their lives. No, we are not demi-gods ruling the cosmos. We are simple servants making a difference in the individual lives we rescue and help.

SANKOFA
Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#34 - 2012-01-13 19:41:11 UTC
Manwe Todako wrote:

Your thought process is informed by the propaganda you learned in Capsuleer training that you are some sort of Demi-god and that your importance and influence is Cosmic in scale.


And your thought process is informed by the propaganda you learned in Capsuleer training that you are some sort of Forum-God, and that your importance and influence deserves scores of simultaneous threads covering the same general issues.

Sabik now, Sabik forever
Manwe Todako
Disciples of Ston
#35 - 2012-01-13 21:23:41 UTC
Silas Vitalia wrote:

Tell you what, if I purchase a few hundred thousand and just give them to you, will you shut up about it for a few weeks and give us some peace?


How many hundred thousand slaves will you transfer to our care for two weeks of silence?

SANKOFA
Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#36 - 2012-01-13 21:47:49 UTC
Manwe Todako wrote:
Silas Vitalia wrote:

Tell you what, if I purchase a few hundred thousand and just give them to you, will you shut up about it for a few weeks and give us some peace?


How many hundred thousand slaves will you transfer to our care for two weeks of silence?


Name your price.



Sabik now, Sabik forever
Manwe Todako
Disciples of Ston
#37 - 2012-01-13 22:19:13 UTC
Silas Vitalia wrote:
Manwe Todako wrote:
Silas Vitalia wrote:

Tell you what, if I purchase a few hundred thousand and just give them to you, will you shut up about it for a few weeks and give us some peace?


How many hundred thousand slaves will you transfer to our care for two weeks of silence?


Name your price.




You used the word "few hundred thousand." That would indicate a minimum of 300,000 slaves probably up to 500,000 slaves. For two weeks of no Disciples of Ston posting to the IGS, we would like the transfer of 400,000 slaves to our care. One half (200,000) is to be received up front with the other half (200,000) upon successful completion of our agreement. We would receive these individuals at any high security station of your choice. You would designate the starting date of the agreement.

SANKOFA
Caellach Marellus
Stormcrows
#38 - 2012-01-13 22:21:36 UTC
Rodj Blake wrote:
Tiberious Thessalonia wrote:
Even one is better than the none that would have happened had the Disciples not done anything, surely, to your view?


You're assuming that all of the emancipated slaves were on the verge of death. I have my doubts about this.


Do you have any evidence to support your claims? Otherwise they're as unfounded as the accusations the Disciples made against PIE Pilots of abandoning slaves at Stargate borders.

Double standards there Admiral.

When your gut instincts tell you something is wrong, trust them. When your heart tells you something is right, ignore it, check with your brain first. Accept nothing, challenge everything.
Silas Vitalia
Doomheim
#39 - 2012-01-14 05:40:52 UTC
Manwe Todako wrote:
For two weeks of no Disciples of Ston posting to the IGS, we would like the transfer of 400,000 slaves to our care. One half (200,000) is to be received up front with the other half (200,000) upon successful completion of our agreement. We would receive these individuals at any high security station of your choice. You would designate the starting date of the agreement.


Agreed.

400,000 are currently waiting for you on Khanid Prime IX, Khanid Transport Storage station (0.9). Contact me for a mutually appropriate meeting time and I'll have the paperwork finalized. I don't care to follow up on this, so you can have the whole lot "up front."

Sabik now, Sabik forever
Aquila Shadow
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#40 - 2012-01-14 09:44:57 UTC
Arkady Sadik wrote:
The Caldari Navy regularly supports the Imperial Navy with slave raids into Republic space, and has done so for many years.


well thats a blatent lie. one of the corner stone agrements for the caldari-amarr alliance was that caldari navy units were not to be used in the slave trade.

                                              "Let Vigilance Be Your Sword"
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