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How to I make my ship enter warp faster?
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Begil
Apocalypse Incorporated
#1 - 2012-01-05 21:38:38 UTC
What ship mods if any improve the time it takes my ship into warp after jumping into a system?

I want to improve my indy survival when taking shortcuts through low sec.
Velicitia
XS Tech
#2 - 2012-01-05 21:45:12 UTC
istabs or rigs would probably be your best bet. Also getting the evasive manoeuvring skill will help (IIRC, it's +5% agility per level).

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Astrid Stjerna
Sebiestor Tribe
#3 - 2012-01-05 21:49:06 UTC
Begil wrote:
What ship mods if any improve the time it takes my ship into warp after jumping into a system?

I want to improve my indy survival when taking shortcuts through low sec.


AFAIK, there are no modules that will decrease your warp start times.

There are skills that will reduce the time required to enter warp, up to a certain point. Beyond that, I can only suggest a couple of things:

Contact someone in your militia for a traffic report (most of us are out in lowsec on a fairly regular basis, so there's lots of intel available). Use your autopilot to plot a course around systems with large numbers of pod-kills, or set it to make the journey as short as possible to minimize the risk.

Train Infomorph Psychology for a while and set up a jumpclone at your most common destinations -- that'll remove the need to enter warp in the first place, and it gets you there a lot faster.

When you're in a lowsec system, warp directly to a celestial (a planet) and use your Directional Scanner to poke around a bit before proceeding.

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Begil
Apocalypse Incorporated
#4 - 2012-01-05 22:01:14 UTC
Thanks for the info.
Kilrayn
Caldari Provisions
#5 - 2012-01-05 22:31:31 UTC
There are also low slot modules 'nanofiber internal structure' that improves ship agility. This will help your ships maneuverability and will in most cases improve warp alignment.

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Kessiaan
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2012-01-05 23:00:29 UTC
There is nothing that will save a T1 hauler blindly jumping through lowsec - you can improve the odds with nanos and warp stabs but your luck will still run out, probably sooner rather than later.

Things that will help a lot:

1) Train for a blockade runner (these are practically untouchable in lowsec and if well flown can still slip through most nullsec camps)
2) Use a scout alt, or get someone to scout you in.
3) If you plan on staying in one area of lowsec, get blues with the locals (they'll probably charge you for this if you're strictly an indy pilot, but it's still less expensive than getting shot and losing your ship, cargo, and pod.

Don't try to solo in lowsec. If you have to ask how, you're not ready for it.

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Keno Skir
#7 - 2012-01-06 14:16:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Keno Skir
You can almost half your aligning time with use of an afterburner. The AB (when engaged) will increase your speed to approx double what is your usual max. Since you warp at 75% max speed your job is to achieve 75% of max in as little time as possible.

Step 1 : Time in seconds how long it takes between you hitting warp (from a standstill like at a gate) and your ship actually entering warp.

Step 2 : Time how long one cycle is for your chosen afterburner module (look in the info for cycle length).

If the cycle time of your afterburner is more than a second or so faster than your warp-align time then you know you could be aligning faster.

The AB Trick :

When you are ready to warp (just jumped through a gate and cloaked on the other side) and have a destination locked, engage the warp drive as normal. As soon as you have clicked WARP you must engage the AB for 1 cycle (click it once to engage and then again so it flashes red).

When the AB disengages at the end of its cycle you will enter warp almost instantly, since you are now doing more than 75% of your original speed.

I use this trick for large indys and battleships and cut a good ten seconds off my Abaddons warp time.

EDIT : Also, the great thing about this trick is it works better for newbies than for vets since training the AFTERBURNERS skill increases AB cycle time (saving power but increasing indy warp time).

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Astrid Stjerna
Sebiestor Tribe
#8 - 2012-01-06 15:43:17 UTC
Kessiaan wrote:
There is nothing that will save a T1 hauler blindly jumping through lowsec - you can improve the odds with nanos and warp stabs but your luck will still run out, probably sooner rather than later.

Things that will help a lot:

1) Train for a blockade runner (these are practically untouchable in lowsec and if well flown can still slip through most nullsec camps)
2) Use a scout alt, or get someone to scout you in.3) If you plan on staying in one area of lowsec, get blues with the locals (they'll probably charge you for this if you're strictly an indy pilot, but it's still less expensive than getting shot and losing your ship, cargo, and pod.

Don't try to solo in lowsec. If you have to ask how, you're not ready for it.


Some of us (usually in fleets) may call this a "doing a +1" (or +2, or +3). It's simply a shorthand way of saying 'Jump through one (or more) gates and tell us what you see'.

And yes, if you have to ask how to solo in lowsec, you're definitely not prepared. Solo lowsec roams are suicide in most cases if you are prepared,

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Othran
Route One
#9 - 2012-01-06 17:39:11 UTC
Kilrayn wrote:
There are also low slot modules 'nanofiber internal structure' that improves ship agility. This will help your ships maneuverability and will in most cases improve warp alignment.


They don't help a lot with reducing align time (the time taken to reach 75% of base speed). The reason is they give an agility bonus AND a speed bonus - you'll find that on certain ships they will actually increase the align time.

Inertial stabilisers and anything which reduces your base speed will get you into warp faster.

If you're in a player corp (NOT npc corp) then you can help your corpmates out when they're flying slow aligning ships by putting a couple of Stasis Webifiers on them. That reduces their base speed and they get to warp faster. Commonly known as web to warp.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#10 - 2012-01-06 18:16:13 UTC

To Enter warp, you must be aligned towards your destination and traveling at 75% of your max speed. If you are starting from a complete stop, you have no direction (no matter what your screen displays), and so the time to enter warp is only the time to accelerate to 75% speed.

Acceleration is a function of your ship's mass and your ships agility.

Nanofiber Internal Structures, Inertia Stabalizers, Low Friction Nozzle Joints, and Polycarbon Engine Housing all decrease your "agility modifier," allowing you to accelerate faster, and hence allow you to enter warp more quickly.

Modules like Reinforced bulkheads increase your "agility modifier", and INCREASE the time it takes to accelerate.
Armore Plates increase your mass, which increases the time it takes to enter warp.

Modules that only effect speed (Auxilary Thrusters and Overdrives) have NO EFFECT on the time it takes to enter warp.

Modules like the MWD's and AB's add tons of mass, and typically INCREASE the time it takes to enter warp. However, when these modules are turned off, a ship's max speed drops instantly, while its actual speed drops slowly, allowing you to suddenly be above your max speed the moment they shut off. They have a 10s base duration.

Finally, There are skills that improve your ships agility: Evasive Manuvering, Spaceship Command, Adv. Spaceship Command, etc

Once you are in warp, you travel at your ship's warp speed. Different ship classes have different warp speeds:
-- Capitals warp slowly... 0.75-1.5 au/s
-- BS's, BC's, t1 cruisers, and destroyers warp at 3 au/s
-- t2 cruisers warp at 3.75 au/s
-- Industrials warp at 4.5 au/s
-- Most frigs warp at 6 au/s
-- Combat inties and blockade runners warp at 9 au/s
-- Fleet inties, Covert Ops Frigs, and interdictors warp at 13 au/s.

The in warp velocity can be increased with the Hyperspacial Velocity Optimizer Rigs.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#11 - 2012-01-06 18:21:38 UTC
Othran wrote:
Kilrayn wrote:
There are also low slot modules 'nanofiber internal structure' that improves ship agility. This will help your ships maneuverability and will in most cases improve warp alignment.


They don't help a lot with reducing align time (the time taken to reach 75% of base speed). The reason is they give an agility bonus AND a speed bonus - you'll find that on certain ships they will actually increase the align time.

Inertial stabilisers and anything which reduces your base speed will get you into warp faster.

If you're in a player corp (NOT npc corp) then you can help your corpmates out when they're flying slow aligning ships by putting a couple of Stasis Webifiers on them. That reduces their base speed and they get to warp faster. Commonly known as web to warp.


I'm about 90% certain that increasing speed has NO EFFECT on the time to reach 75% of base speed.

Put All Nano's on a Dram, and its align time is decreased.
Put All Overdrives on a Dram, and its align time is the same.

And you get the same results with a Moros....

Increasing speed has NO EFFECT on align time....
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#12 - 2012-01-06 18:31:09 UTC
Keno Skir wrote:
The AB Trick :

When you are ready to warp (just jumped through a gate and cloaked on the other side) and have a destination locked, engage the warp drive as normal. As soon as you have clicked WARP you must engage the AB for 1 cycle (click it once to engage and then again so it flashes red).

When the AB disengages at the end of its cycle you will enter warp almost instantly, since you are now doing more than 75% of your original speed.

I use this trick for large indys and battleships and cut a good ten seconds off my Abaddons warp time.

EDIT : Also, the great thing about this trick is it works better for newbies than for vets since training the AFTERBURNERS skill increases AB cycle time (saving power but increasing indy warp time).


Forget the AB trick, and learn the MWD trick... Same principle, but there are no skills that increase the MWD's 10s duration. Additionally, you can fit an improved cloak on a ship, cloak your ship at the start of the mwd cycle (making you untargetable), and then uncloak right after the cycle ends while spamming warp...

This annoys lowsec gate campers, as they have to decloak you before that 10s are up. When executed properly, they won't have time to lock you before you initially cloak up or nor when you decloak and warp away.
Ursula LeGuinn
Perkone
Caldari State
#13 - 2012-01-07 11:59:06 UTC
Likes all around. I've been away from the game for forever and forgot the particulars of the AB/MWD pulse trick. Thanks!

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Othran
Route One
#14 - 2012-01-07 13:52:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Othran
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
Increasing speed has NO EFFECT on align time....


Then something has changed Gizz because it certainly used to - and I'm pretty certain nothing has changed in the last year.

Think about it logically - your ship has mass and an inertia modifier which are used to calculate acceleration. If you increase the base maximum speed without altering mass or inertia then it WILL take you longer to reach 75% max speed. You haven't altered the acceleration in any way so how are you getting to 75% max speed in the same time?

NB - I'm talking about jumping then aligning so there's nothing other than acceleration in play.

Edit - I think EFT is wrong here. I just did a quick test on a normal Vaga + HG snakes. With my skills that boosts the base speed by 103m/s or 24.5% if you prefer. EFT claims 5.2 secs align whether the implants are in or not. I got 6 secs (+/- 0.2) three times in a row. Maybe its the server tick. I can't test without the implants now for obvious reasons P
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#15 - 2012-01-07 16:07:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Gizznitt Malikite
Othran wrote:
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
Increasing speed has NO EFFECT on align time....


Then something has changed Gizz because it certainly used to - and I'm pretty certain nothing has changed in the last year.

Think about it logically - your ship has mass and an inertia modifier which are used to calculate acceleration. If you increase the base maximum speed without altering mass or inertia then it WILL take you longer to reach 75% max speed. You haven't altered the acceleration in any way so how are you getting to 75% max speed in the same time?

NB - I'm talking about jumping then aligning so there's nothing other than acceleration in play.

Edit - I think EFT is wrong here. I just did a quick test on a normal Vaga + HG snakes. With my skills that boosts the base speed by 103m/s or 24.5% if you prefer. EFT claims 5.2 secs align whether the implants are in or not. I got 6 secs (+/- 0.2) three times in a row. Maybe its the server tick. I can't test without the implants now for obvious reasons P


If this were a car, you would be absolutely right....

Both EFT and EvE Wiki agree with '08 Posts about the acceleration algorithm:

http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Acceleration
Vt = Vmax * (1 - e^(-t * 10^6 / (I*M) )

If this formula is right, the time to reach 75% of max speed is independent of max speed.

plug in, Vt = 0.75 Vmax to warp, and solving for t:

0.75 * Vmax = Vmax * (1 - e^(-t * 10^6 / (I*M) ). Reduced and Rewritten: t = I*M * 10^-6 * - ln (0.25)

Its only dependent on Inertia and Mass, and max speed doesn't matter.

Granted, eve wiki could be wrong (which provided allof the above formulas for my lazy ass)..

Given the 1s server tic, I would imagine its very hard to distinguish between 5.2 and 6s, because I don't think the server does. I'd try a bigger aligntime (Abbadon or Moros) to really see if there is a difference....
Othran
Route One
#16 - 2012-01-07 18:07:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Othran
Yeah I need to look at bigger ships - you know the stuff I fly and my TZ so its probably impossible to determine any real effect.

Hadn't seen that formula - its lunacy on wheels IMHO, but this is Eve Roll

No wonder the nano-age (which I missed) was so stupidly unbalanced.

/me wanders off to adjust a fit or two

Ta Gizz.

Edit - and to all the newbies reading the thread this should show that nobody knows it all.

Edit2 - are we sure that the formula didn't get changed with the nano-nerf? I wasn't around but that formula is odd enough to make me wonder.
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#17 - 2012-01-07 18:55:24 UTC
Othran wrote:

Edit2 - are we sure that the formula didn't get changed with the nano-nerf? I wasn't around but that formula is odd enough to make me wonder.


I wasn't around for the nano nerf either...
Othran
Route One
#18 - 2012-01-07 19:38:51 UTC
Gizznitt Malikite wrote:
Othran wrote:

Edit2 - are we sure that the formula didn't get changed with the nano-nerf? I wasn't around but that formula is odd enough to make me wonder.


I wasn't around for the nano nerf either...


Do me a favour please and ask in corp? Its an odd formula to say the least Blink
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings
#19 - 2012-01-07 19:52:18 UTC
I never heard or saw anything during the nanonerf about align times being affected. Ship stats were adjusted, mods that affected ship mass no longer did so and instead directly buffed agility (nanofiber internal structures, polycarbs)...but otherwise the only core game mechanic change was the missile damage formula.
Begil
Apocalypse Incorporated
#20 - 2012-01-08 19:14:56 UTC
Thank you for all the great info.
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