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[June] Fighter Damage Reduction

First post First post First post
Wilfred Motte
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1001 - 2017-06-10 00:19:55 UTC
Millpucky wrote:
Wilfred Motte wrote:
Exactly 2 weeks, to the day, after I dropped $200 to inject myself into a carrier, so that I could rat in NS, to make isk, to buy frigates to go shoot other people in frigates.

Well played, CCP. Well. Played.

2 weeks? WOW! see skill injectors need to go away. Took me YEARS to get into a Capital class ship.

No dude. You misunderstood. I didn't go from freaking subscribe to carrier in two weeks. I've been skilling towards it for about a year. I dropped $200 to fill that gap.

Skill injectors do, in fact, not need to go away. CCP made $200 off of me in order to buy those to do that. Does that make sense? Maybe not, because it would have translated to another annual subscription, but I would have subscribed anyway, so it was extra money they made out of hand.
Trevize Demerzel
#1002 - 2017-06-10 00:20:29 UTC
To be clear...

I'm not upset about the nerf to the isk that can be made in a carrier/super while ratting.

I'm pissed that they've made supers ... a 30bil isk ship fitted so easily defanged and killed. It sucks in PVP already and they just made it worse. They are also making the fighters 15% more likely to be shot at by rats. Go get bent CCP. Seriously...

A change I'd be fine with:

Reduction in the dmg dealt by fighters to rats.
Increase fighter EHP
Make fighters have better resists to being rendered useless in PVP

To be up front on this issue.. Yes I rat in a super. I average 85mil ticks. I'm sure many do better then I do. I live in an area with frequent hot droppers, frequent gangs and other "hazards". I also have kids so I'm fairly casual. I'll run sites for an hour or so then safe up and deal with real life. I'm not hard core ratting for hours on end. I rat at best for 1.5 hours 3-4 times a week. Obviously I'm not the target problem here. But ya.... I'm tired of being the target of this ill conceived nerfs.


Teckos Pech
Goonswarm Federation
#1003 - 2017-06-10 00:20:55 UTC
Yodasmaster4 wrote:
I disagree with the "bit too effective in PVP" just reduce the bounties.

Then you are nerfing bounties for those not causing the problem. Good job. Lets go nerf the income for the vast majority of players. Why? Did they do something wrong? Nope. A very small subset of players were injecting too much ISK into the game so we are screwing over everyone else EXCEPT those players causing the problem.

Balance is just a word in the dictionary between Bad and Boob to you isn't it?

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online

kev kammer
#1004 - 2017-06-10 00:22:25 UTC
**** i have spent well over a year (and alot alot of isk and money) planning to do carriers finally got skills done to almost good place iv aimed a year towards this as ishtar and vni were just boring and to much afk. Carriers seemed fun more of a challenge and better for me as i wanted to get into a cap battles and move towards a mino, and use the isk from ratting to pay for the losses and skill books. I pay for my accounts and spend the isk i make in game on ships to blow up. This feels like all your doing is making pve harder to sell plex but your wrong vni and ishtar is the problem never made so much as 2 accounts ishtars ratting in havens, guess back to that then. Lower the bounties by 5% to 10% not keep weakening one ship type. Hurry up and fix assault frigs first. The people who do pve should have an aim stopping at vni now seems perfect why get any ship bigger than that for pve. (in null)
Nasar Vyron
S0utherN Comfort
#1005 - 2017-06-10 00:24:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Nasar Vyron
Yodasmaster4 wrote:
I disagree with the "bit too effective in PVP" just reduce the bounties.

Have you looked at the damage output of a Erebus vs a Nyx? A Leviathan vs a Wyvern?

Super's have higher sustained damage output than a titan as it stands unless you start factoring in a targeted DD on cooldown -and that's just paper dps not actual. Titans can't even compare in application on a good day. Not even looking at the fact that there's less than a 5% difference in max tank fit EHP between a Wyvern and Levi.

I'm not saying buff titans by any means, I hate power creep on all levels, but if you don't think something is out of wack with that picture I don't really know what to say.

PvP aside, you do realize nerfing bounties hurts everyone, including the little guy. It's like people who argue for a flat tax and ignore the fact that the top 1% hold the majority of the wealth and sit on it so it's not even circulating which is horribly unhealthy for any economy.
kev kammer
#1006 - 2017-06-10 00:29:20 UTC  |  Edited by: kev kammer
Its annoying at least say your going to do it give a month then discuss convince and then do it. IF its ratting that is the problem solve it give all caps a role bonus somehow so when the rat they get less isk the longer they rat more they get penalised but over all nerfing dps of a carriers is my problem not a supper as suppers are a little op.
Curant Thanger
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1007 - 2017-06-10 00:34:15 UTC
a negative isk hull modifier on capitals, easy, done, solves problem without killing pvp
Renegade Stars
Stellae Renascitur
#1008 - 2017-06-10 00:39:54 UTC  |  Edited by: C0ATL
Already gave my 2 cents about this topic but I'm back due to CCP Quant's response on Reddit.

Posting ludicrous numbers and later on editing the post to lower them...and even later on admitting that even the edited numbers were cherry-picked is not giving any trust-inducing vibes.

Cherry-picking is always a sign of attempting to manipulate opinions in your favor. Realizing that you ****** up but instead of doing the right thing, you go ahead and fill a post with false info is a new kind of low I never expected from CCP. It is true that they have made poor decisions about game mechanics or balance in the past, but never have I seen such an insulting behavior from them -- then again, I rarely go to forums so maybe this was the eye-opener I needed to finally lose all respect for CCP.

I would also like to point out that in his infinite wisdom, Quant used only info (even if cherry-picked) that represented supercarrier ratting, while purposefully ignoring normal carrier ticks because they were too small to cause the impact he wanted to create. While it may come as a surprise to you, CCP, most of the players affected by the nerfs are just middle-classed capital pilots all over New Eden, ratting in their normal carriers -- and these people dont come near the 270mil ticks Quant was crying about, while bravely attempting to throw himself to the "wolves" so as to take the hate away from his comrades. Nor do they get close to the later mentioned 140mil ticks that were admitted to be the real data-mined tick of a supercarrier.

While I am sure that CCP eyes will never fall on this post, let alone muster the patience to read it, I feel the need to continue, in hopes that players who bought into Quant's bullshit will read and know the actual truth.

In my best moments, my ticks are around 60-63 mil -- while on average they range from 50 to 55. That is on a Nidhoggur trained to lvl 5, with max fighter skills and all the possible dps that can be crammed in it, without the use of officer mods. From all my alliance mates that fly a carrier, I've never seen anyone break the 55mil/tick limit, even at their best. Now some would say that 63 mil ticks are a great deal of ISK and I would agree to them, if I didnt know that to get that kind of income, I need to ignore any and all other activities (including simple things like chatting, alt-tabing for small periods or even paying attention to other ingame info), while dedicating my focus completely to the site. The downside to this is that after 1-2 hours of ratting in such a way, your brain is just begging you for a reason to dock the carrier and do something else. In short... its unsustainable.
In the meantime, you have VNI and Ishtar pilots getting 20mil ticks but ratting 23/7 -- getting less ISK/tick but more ISK/day due to the effortless mechanic of drone boats.

Yet, despite all this... we, the carrier pilots... the people who actually fit in CCP's campaign of "Anti-afk-isk-making" are the ones getting punished for their inability to manage/balance their game.

Its not about the ISK, CCP. These posts are the culmination of a whole year's worth of bad decisions on your part, implementation of crap mechanics and downright stupid nerfs. And on top of that, to remove any chance at saving face, you give these changes a 4 day notice.

Its funny how yesterday I was so pumped up for the chance to buy the long craved "Hazard Control" skin for my favorite class of ship... only to conclude this day that I am done with the game. I am sorry that I have just 2 accounts to unsub, as CCP needs to be punished for their lack of respect to the people that are keeping them in business --- luckily, though, there are players with many more accounts than me who are just as outraged, and are going to do the same.
kev kammer
#1009 - 2017-06-10 00:44:07 UTC
lol i just had a look at few chimera and Archon normal fits as in no bling 3 damage amps tech 2 and tech 1 drones tech 1 fighter support 3 with the suggested well new stats and dam a rattlesnake can do more damage i got 1200 dps almost max skill, why not take away thanatos and nid damage bonus make all the carriers a bit more level.
ISD Max Trix
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#1010 - 2017-06-10 00:45:51 UTC  |  Edited by: ISD Max Trix
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ISD Max Trix


Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

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Le Mittani
Free Ritto
#1011 - 2017-06-10 01:36:50 UTC
Hey CCP maybe make fozzie moderate threads instead of the ISD, first of all the ISD don't deserve it and second of all it would keep him away from ruining the game for a bit
Raz Keriz
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#1012 - 2017-06-10 01:39:36 UTC
Anon Imity
Arial Enterprise
Sigma Grindset
#1013 - 2017-06-10 01:40:39 UTC
Remember CCP, is it wise losing subscriptions just because you don't find another way to solve this "problem"? Change your mind please and try to test things before introducing them without bothering us players.
Blood Tide
#1014 - 2017-06-10 01:45:32 UTC
Burn Jita, Fire CCP Fozzie.
Chevy Caputtos
Goonswarm Federation
#1015 - 2017-06-10 01:47:16 UTC
Severely disappointed in you CCP.
Paradigm Calibre
Horizon Foundation
#1016 - 2017-06-10 01:48:02 UTC
Don't let the nullbears ruin carriers for everyone! Damned nullbears...

If PVE ratting is making too much money (and I can't disagree on that), then buff the rats or reduce the bounties, don't nerf carriers... How was it figured they're so strong in PVP that a 20-30% reduction is justified? 5-10%? Fine, tweak away. But this proposal is too huge.
#1017 - 2017-06-10 01:49:05 UTC
@ccp we all understand your attempting to protect your bottom line with sales of plex, however the current state of issuing Nerfs without any prior notice or a truly legitimate reason other then attempting to quell the progress of the very unreasonable... a blanket nerf is not going to repair the issue at hand the damage is already done to the eco system

all that these subsequent nerfs are going to result in is a even further player base reduction then is already being seen and the whole point of a sandbox game is to have the players shape it with minimal interference from ccp.

myself as a long time player have progressed to the point where the game has become stale and if you take the feeling of any progression or even making isk for that matter to a level where you feel like your not getting anywhere it removes any remaining incentive to continue playing.

i personally dont believe this is a matter of economy anymore its a matter of introduction of content or even a expansion of a new region for that matter would go alot longer of way in retaining players and introducing new players to the game.

but thats just my opinion
Frockly Geiger
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1018 - 2017-06-10 01:49:18 UTC
CCP What do you want us to train for that wont get nerfed for isk generation? High sec Incursions? I mean throw us a bone here.
ISD Max Trix
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#1019 - 2017-06-10 01:52:05 UTC
31. Abuse of CCP employees and ISD volunteers is prohibited.

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ISD Max Trix


Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department

I do not respond to EVE mails about forum moderation.

Le Mittani
Free Ritto
#1020 - 2017-06-10 02:00:52 UTC
Good luck removing all of the quitting and ccp bashing quotes dude, this thread is almost as much of a poopstorm as the idea its discussing