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[June] Fighter Damage Reduction

First post First post First post
Author
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#2281 - 2017-06-17 07:39:17 UTC
Miss 'Assassination' Cayman wrote:

You mean the Drifter incursions that were slaughtering hundreds of Thrashers each day while printing 3-5 billion ISK per site? I ran those for 3 days and made 22 bil.

You mean the heavily bugged sites that weren't working properly and as soon as they did that doctrine evaporated in favour of the lossless doctrines instead. Also yes they killed thrashers but since thrashers are cheaper than a single fighter and fighters are effectively 'ammo' that doesn't really count as a comparison.

As for Akktu. Being subscribed for years does not give you rights to have an unbalanced mechanic. Yes capital anoms will be great to have.... though of course they can't be any more lucrative than at present anyway. Since it doesn't matter how 'dangerous' the opponents are.
As for blind cyno's, LOL, yeah..... can't possibly see that going wrong one way or another. Either it will be gameable and the big entities will be able to make sure the cyno's are inside their territory for the first few to farm them, or it will be too random and no-one with a brain will use the content making the development time worthless.
Valdr Auduin
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2282 - 2017-06-17 12:21:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Valdr Auduin
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Miss 'Assassination' Cayman wrote:

You mean the Drifter incursions that were slaughtering hundreds of Thrashers each day while printing 3-5 billion ISK per site? I ran those for 3 days and made 22 bil.

You mean the heavily bugged sites that weren't working properly and as soon as they did that doctrine evaporated in favour of the lossless doctrines instead. Also yes they killed thrashers but since thrashers are cheaper than a single fighter and fighters are effectively 'ammo' that doesn't really count as a comparison.

As for Akktu. Being subscribed for years does not give you rights to have an unbalanced mechanic. Yes capital anoms will be great to have.... though of course they can't be any more lucrative than at present anyway. Since it doesn't matter how 'dangerous' the opponents are.
As for blind cyno's, LOL, yeah..... can't possibly see that going wrong one way or another. Either it will be gameable and the big entities will be able to make sure the cyno's are inside their territory for the first few to farm them, or it will be too random and no-one with a brain will use the content making the development time worthless.

So either content is broken and gameable and will be monopolized by bigsec alliances or it's broken and useless to everyone?

So.... I guess it's official, EVE is actually a dead game.
Tessa Sage
Long Pig Luncheon Meat
Sending Thots And Players
#2283 - 2017-06-18 15:14:45 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:

Maybe if we had sites that could be done co-operatively using the new large grid where shooting/hacking this tower over here impacts that structure 1000km away over there and everyone on grid (who isn't cloaked) shares the payouts along the way, but even then supers could split their squadrons to some extent, though the range would place them at greater risk of losing fighters to PvP.


Extend the grid to 20,000 km and merge combat sites by type or description. Essentially switching off normal ratting criteria and going full DED site. There will be an equilibrium point then, where capitals cannot align to the next spawn as quickly and in turn don't have the DPS spread to finish the site at a reasonable clip compared to battleship and faction cruiser counterparts.

Valdr Auduin wrote:

content is broken and gameable and will be monopolized by bigsec alliances or it's broken and useless to everyone?

So.... I guess it's official, EVE is actually a dead game.


No it just needs more DED.
Tessa Sage
Long Pig Luncheon Meat
Sending Thots And Players
#2284 - 2017-06-18 15:31:08 UTC
Frostys Virpio wrote:
Lord Heluene wrote:

So now CCP.............you have taken away my ability to mine, and you are about to take away my ability to rat........I don't PVP unless forced to.

People still mine and still rat. No ability were taken away from you.


The incentive is still there like Frostys addresses.

Lord Heluene, ratting should not be viewed as dps = ISK. In fact it can be more lucrative than mining in that it's augmented by drop You are just as likely to land an additional combat site or high valued faction rat wreck, as you are to be engaged by a solo PVP'er entering your sov in that tick cycle.

Yes, PVP will happen in both circumstances, fighting npc rats will happen in both circumstances; the two styles of play in tandem complement and reinforce any one toon's survivability.

So, ratting or mining, which do you find more proficiency and having more replicability per login? Regardless of the nerfs, that is not something CCP decides for you.

Plama145 Plamiasty
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#2285 - 2017-06-19 18:42:50 UTC

Hello There!
Dear CCP Crew
On the beginning, why in the patch notice was not clear described reduction to mother ship and carriers but some link forward? Anyway, how you can write about fixing some "****" and add some skins for ship if nobody give a **** about that,you do nothing at all in this game , you should start working at McDonald not in this game development.
Till to this time ( and i play this game very long time )i give you 2 examples witch still not fixed:
1 think : when you go to escalation 10/10 Maze and you hit (bump the gate or another derbs) you can't switch off the WARP, my question is ? when you get this done?
2 think: why you reduced / nerf Fighters and give us some stupid explanation about 2% players generating 20% ISK by itself, try to make to right but not reducing my PVP
Very easy way to do that is strength-up EHP or resist
HOW possible is for Ship witch cost around 20 B , is no able to shoot off a ******* Dred?? I asking you why?? somebody has there a brain disease? Or you trying to suck out everything what you can, coz you have so “disable” marketing. Keep it going and rest of players gonna put this game “out of window” and you gonna become unemployed coz nobody will employ a losers.

P.s
A year ago, we got the long awaited Capital ship changes which finally revitalized the class as a whole. It was obvious that Capital ships were going to be very powerful, both in PVP and PVE. You gave us powerful end game ships to work towards - something worth commitment to Eve. Roughly six months later you did the same thing with the Rorqual. Now, a year after these changes, when most players have finally begun to benefit from them, you reduce the ships back to roughly where they were before.
AAetius Retlow
Tactical Stability Union
#2286 - 2017-06-20 06:36:17 UTC
Did the song Supercaps just come true!!???
https://soundcloud.com/davidkmagnus/supercaps
xxxTRUSTxxx
Galactic Rangers
Already Replaced.
#2287 - 2017-06-20 07:55:34 UTC
Plama145 Plamiasty wrote:

Hello There!
Dear CCP Crew
On the beginning, why in the patch notice was not clear described reduction to mother ship and carriers but some link forward? Anyway, how you can write about fixing some "****" and add some skins for ship if nobody give a **** about that,you do nothing at all in this game , you should start working at McDonald not in this game development.
Till to this time ( and i play this game very long time )i give you 2 examples witch still not fixed:
1 think : when you go to escalation 10/10 Maze and you hit (bump the gate or another derbs) you can't switch off the WARP, my question is ? when you get this done?
2 think: why you reduced / nerf Fighters and give us some stupid explanation about 2% players generating 20% ISK by itself, try to make to right but not reducing my PVP
Very easy way to do that is strength-up EHP or resist
HOW possible is for Ship witch cost around 20 B , is no able to shoot off a ******* Dred?? I asking you why?? somebody has there a brain disease? Or you trying to suck out everything what you can, coz you have so “disable” marketing. Keep it going and rest of players gonna put this game “out of window” and you gonna become unemployed coz nobody will employ a losers.

P.s
A year ago, we got the long awaited Capital ship changes which finally revitalized the class as a whole. It was obvious that Capital ships were going to be very powerful, both in PVP and PVE. You gave us powerful end game ships to work towards - something worth commitment to Eve. Roughly six months later you did the same thing with the Rorqual. Now, a year after these changes, when most players have finally begun to benefit from them, you reduce the ships back to roughly where they were before.


the difference between your op and the ps says a lot dude.Roll
TsuRuiChen Gallentius
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#2288 - 2017-06-20 23:51:36 UTC
TrouserDeagle wrote:
still would like fighters to be less ezmode anti-everything


Honestly Fighters are way "ezmode" to kill, they have huge sigs and its beyond easy to defang a carrier, if anything nerf Hotdrop spam.
Miss 'Assassination' Cayman
CK-0FF
Valkyrie Alliance
#2289 - 2017-06-21 00:21:17 UTC
TsuRuiChen Gallentius wrote:
TrouserDeagle wrote:
still would like fighters to be less ezmode anti-everything


Honestly Fighters are way "ezmode" to kill, they have huge sigs and its beyond easy to defang a carrier, if anything nerf Hotdrop spam.

Or just bring a single Griffin. Carriers are laughably vulnerable in small numbers where they don't have enough firepower spread across enough targets to take out enemy ships quickly.
Valdr Auduin
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2290 - 2017-06-21 01:04:10 UTC
Miss 'Assassination' Cayman wrote:
TsuRuiChen Gallentius wrote:
TrouserDeagle wrote:
still would like fighters to be less ezmode anti-everything


Honestly Fighters are way "ezmode" to kill, they have huge sigs and its beyond easy to defang a carrier, if anything nerf Hotdrop spam.

Or just bring a single Griffin. Carriers are laughably vulnerable in small numbers where they don't have enough firepower spread across enough targets to take out enemy ships quickly.

You require more pylo- tubes.
Siliya
House of Tyrell
#2291 - 2017-06-21 22:58:22 UTC
Guess they kept the agro changes even tho they said they were going to leave them out
Jang Taredi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#2292 - 2017-06-23 14:53:49 UTC
Siliya wrote:
Guess they kept the agro changes even tho they said they were going to leave them out


I noticed a slight increase in aggro.
Trevize Demerzel
#2293 - 2017-06-27 22:21:24 UTC
Ya it's very obvious they kept the aggro changes. Maybe not 15% but ya....


There's also a fairly obvious change to hitting frigs. I can put all 5 squads on a frig and it can take quite a while before they get lucky enough to hit it...

Great info that! Beware the solo frig coming to defang a carrier. Tho they could already do that cause ya know it makes sense that a 5mil ship can render a 30bil ship weapons useless.

-

Freeman Kurt
Interstellar Central Technologies
#2294 - 2017-06-30 07:18:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Freeman Kurt
I absolutely protest against these changes.


you make spaceships in the game worse to play and the carrier is not the solution to the isk faucet. the one percent makes all the isk and that sounds more of a problem for you than it is to us. Damage reductions at carriers saying it will make the game better for you financially is not what your customers want to hear


The one percent are the characters who do trading in the game on a daily basis, so you should target them and not carriers. they have trillions of isk in their wallets and they spend it on skill injectors just because they have so much isk hanging around.
Freeman Kurt
Interstellar Central Technologies
#2295 - 2017-06-30 09:36:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Freeman Kurt
The Judge wrote:
Not everyone will be happy with this change, but reducing NPC bounty payouts through a direct rebalance of carriers and supers is in the best interest of eve as a whole. Changing bounty payouts would hurt people ratting in every class of ship when carriers and supers are the main problem child. This is the best option I can see.

Keep up the great work.



I absolutely protest against these changes.


you make spaceships in the game worse to play and the carrier is not the solution to the isk faucet. the one percent makes all the isk and that sounds more of a problem from CCP than it is to us. Damage reduction at carriers saying it will make the game better for CCP financially is not what your customers want to hear


The one percent are the characters who do trading in the game on a daily basis, so you should target them and not carriers. they have trillions of isk in their wallets and they spend it on skill injectors just because they have so much isk hanging around.
Naren Vintas
Some Assembly Required.
#2296 - 2017-06-30 09:54:57 UTC
I want to chip in and say that hardly anyone supports these changes indeed. That the discussion on the subject has died is most discouraging. Personally I am glad the CCP decided to reduce the nerfs, but I am still disheartened about how sudden the change was and was hardly discussed outside the dev team, it seems. Getting only a couple of days of notice for a "solution" to a problem that has way deeper roots is very consumer unfriendly.

I do hope they look at the ISK generation "problem" with carriers in a meaningful way, but I hope they will not penalize those who decided to train into carriers and spent months training for the carriers, only to be nerfed to the point that afk-ratting is again "the best" way to earn money.

And sure, you can train to carrier with injectors quite quckly, and that can be both bad and good thing. On one hand, it makes the carriers more readily available. More people getting carrier means that we're not niche 6% of the population anymore. On the flipside I can understand that the money generated would skyrocket. But alas, this is not the problem with carrier balancing, but rather the methods used to generate said isk. I assume that when the CCP designed combat anomalies for people to rat in, they did not anticipate carrier usage in this scenario, and while the carriers were rare it was alright, but suddenly more people are generating more money with it. This should not call for the carrier nerf itself, but rather revision of how the money is generated.

However. I stand for actively playing the game, and carriers are great active way to play the game. I would not like the AFK Ishtar ratters to earn more money than an active carrier, especially since they cost far less and can generate the income with next-to-no attention and can be left running for great part of the day. The way that CCP seems to favour multiboxing and afking does not look promising to me as a player.


Freeman Kurt wrote:
I absolutely protest against these changes. I will not be buying anymore plexes and I will be unsubscribing when my game time ends.


you make spaceships in the game worse to play and the carrier is not the solution to the isk faucet. the one percent makes all the isk and that sounds more of a problem for you than it is to us. Damage reductions at carriers saying it will make the game better for you financially is not what your customers want to hear


The one percent are the characters who do trading in the game on a daily basis, so you should target them and not carriers. they have trillions of isk in their wallets and they spend it on skill injectors just because they have so much isk hanging around.


I would strongly advise against announcing that you are unsubscribing. The forum moderators do not differentiate between going Free to Play (aka Alpha Clone) and Quitting the Game. The posts of the latter are against the forum terms of use, and will use that as a reason to remove your post.

Also, this change doesn't concern traders. Traders do not "generate" money, they flip the money that already exists in the economy. They take money from other players. Ratting, on the other hand, generates the money and puts it into the system.
Freeman Kurt
Interstellar Central Technologies
#2297 - 2017-07-02 05:27:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Freeman Kurt
Naren Vintas wrote:
I want to chip in and say that hardly anyone supports these changes indeed. That the discussion on the subject has died is most discouraging. Personally I am glad the CCP decided to reduce the nerfs, but I am still disheartened about how sudden the change was and was hardly discussed outside the dev team, it seems. Getting only a couple of days of notice for a "solution" to a problem that has way deeper roots is very consumer unfriendly.

I do hope they look at the ISK generation "problem" with carriers in a meaningful way, but I hope they will not penalize those who decided to train into carriers and spent months training for the carriers, only to be nerfed to the point that afk-ratting is again "the best" way to earn money.

And sure, you can train to carrier with injectors quite quckly, and that can be both bad and good thing. On one hand, it makes the carriers more readily available. More people getting carrier means that we're not niche 6% of the population anymore. On the flipside I can understand that the money generated would skyrocket. But alas, this is not the problem with carrier balancing, but rather the methods used to generate said isk. I assume that when the CCP designed combat anomalies for people to rat in, they did not anticipate carrier usage in this scenario, and while the carriers were rare it was alright, but suddenly more people are generating more money with it. This should not call for the carrier nerf itself, but rather revision of how the money is generated.

However. I stand for actively playing the game, and carriers are great active way to play the game. I would not like the AFK Ishtar ratters to earn more money than an active carrier, especially since they cost far less and can generate the income with next-to-no attention and can be left running for great part of the day. The way that CCP seems to favour multiboxing and afking does not look promising to me as a player.


Freeman Kurt wrote:
I absolutely protest against these changes. I will not be buying anymore plexes and I will be unsubscribing when my game time ends.


you make spaceships in the game worse to play and the carrier is not the solution to the isk faucet. the one percent makes all the isk and that sounds more of a problem for you than it is to us. Damage reductions at carriers saying it will make the game better for you financially is not what your customers want to hear


The one percent are the characters who do trading in the game on a daily basis, so you should target them and not carriers. they have trillions of isk in their wallets and they spend it on skill injectors just because they have so much isk hanging around.


I would strongly advise against announcing that you are unsubscribing. The forum moderators do not differentiate between going Free to Play (aka Alpha Clone) and Quitting the Game. The posts of the latter are against the forum terms of use, and will use that as a reason to remove your post.

Also, this change doesn't concern traders. Traders do not "generate" money, they flip the money that already exists in the economy. They take money from other players. Ratting, on the other hand, generates the money and puts it into the system.



You say that traders take the isk and carriers don't but if ccp is pointing that one percent is earning bigger rewards with isk, why not go for the traders as well. They are the one percent because they have the most isk over everyone else in the game right now. The traders should get nerfed not carriers and The carrier ratters are not rich like the traders are
FubukiYsera
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2298 - 2017-07-02 21:52:42 UTC
Suitonia wrote:
Great changes



are u player ??? realy ???

thıs dev blog totaly useless.. all csm only help to ccp not player..
FubukiYsera
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2299 - 2017-07-02 22:06:22 UTC


ccp guys... and all csm members... all together go to hell..


ccp play whıt all players not play this game

tnx ccp...for kıll thıs game



FubukiYsera
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2300 - 2017-07-02 22:12:26 UTC
all ccp members leaders workers etc... 2002-2016 cant make money ???? ccp ıs goıng down ???? what your problem ??? fırst game chance to free to play.. and last 6 mounth all dev blog and all change ıs bullsheet.. u read to forum ????? u healty ??? Are you sure you are not blind??