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Low Amount of Sites in Lowsec
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Zack Azthor
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2017-03-25 05:33:09 UTC
Hello, I'm an Alpha Clone. After doing some Exploration things, I find it quite fun playing with the hacking minigames. However, searching for sites becomes very tedious after a while. I've been exploring for two days in lowsec. Mostly, I find wormholes to W-Space and Combat Sites, but no relic or data sites. So I went to W-Space to find that most of the Relic/Data Sites are guarded by Sleepers, which I cannot combat with an Imicus.

I guess what I'm asking is for advice to pick a better lowsec space to explore. I don't mind staying in lowsec for a while. Probably also asking for experience sharing and some tips in exploring.
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#2 - 2017-03-25 06:22:07 UTC
Probably just a run of bad luck and bad timing, either that or the competition for hacking sites has now moved to low sec.

Anyway, the best advice is look for deadend systems located in pipelines and pocket clusters that are off the beaten track, way out in the boonies. Usually those systems act as a net, holding multiple exploration sites for days on end.

Also be prepared to travel around a lot and change up your usual time of game play. Evening hours might have more competition than Afternoon or Morning hours. Just remember the less traveled a system is, the more sites it should have available.



DMC

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#3 - 2017-03-25 06:29:58 UTC
try using thera wormholes to get out to deep nullsec, the pirate hacking sites are unguarded and have the best loot in null. Also some of the pirate sites can spawn in wormholes. Seems like the high/low sec sites just aren't worth doing anyways.

https://eve-scout.com/ documents all the connections in and out of thera,

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter
Bjinjael Muklum
Doomheim
#4 - 2017-03-25 07:01:20 UTC
Zack Azthor wrote:
Hello, I'm an Alpha Clone. After doing some Exploration things, I find it quite fun playing with the hacking minigames. However, searching for sites becomes very tedious after a while. I've been exploring for two days in lowsec. Mostly, I find wormholes to W-Space and Combat Sites, but no relic or data sites. So I went to W-Space to find that most of the Relic/Data Sites are guarded by Sleepers, which I cannot combat with an Imicus.

I guess what I'm asking is for advice to pick a better lowsec space to explore. I don't mind staying in lowsec for a while. Probably also asking for experience sharing and some tips in exploring.


get a WH mapper and make your own routes and go in there. do it.

C1-C3 will populate all types of data/relic sites.

yes there will be sleeper ones but there will also be the sites you're looking for. i promise. today i totally found an empty c2 with like 8 Data sites and 5 relic sites. thats a lot of ISK, or datacores, or conduits or whatever you're hacking for.

there are plenty of empty C1's-C3's out there with sigs overlooked.

at the same time you'll get wandering or static holes to Null and you can dip out there and run those sites too which can/is profitable.

if you're in WH space, be careful, use d scan, bookmarks always (BOOKMARK THE HOLE YOU CAME IN FROM!! XD) bring extra probes, yes people will be waiting at sites to kill you, be savvy

you CAN and WILL make a lot of ISK if you risk it for the biscuit, fly safe!
Kathern Aurilen
#5 - 2017-03-25 08:13:52 UTC
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
Probably just a run of bad luck and bad timing, either that or the competition for hacking sites has now moved to low sec.
He's right. Sometimes the sites are scarce in my high security system too, but sometimes I have 3 and 4 spawn at a time the whole day. It comes in waves, sometimes there is just too many and other days they won't hardly spawn all day.

No cuts, no butts, no coconuts!

Forum alt, unskilled in the ways of pewpew!
Zack Azthor
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2017-03-25 08:29:07 UTC
Yeah, two days of bad luck now T_T Bad for me. I'm planning to travel to faraway lowsec sites (rather than waiting for the lowsecs near me), I guess.

I did find some Data/Relic Sites without Sleepers, but they're quite rare (if I base this assumption only by my experience). Hmm, I'm interested in what you call "mapping". As far as I know, Wormholes collapse after a period of time and or when enough mass enter the holes. How is it possible to map these wormholes if, say tomorrow, they're all gone? I'm really interested to give it a try though. WH mapper? What's that?

You mentioned the C1-C3 types of W-Space. I'm not quite sure how to see what type it is. I do know that there are C1-C6 (from EVE Wiki), but I don't know how to determine them, yet. Mind telling me xD I haven't got the need to look it up, so I didn't. But if you could give me answers, I'd be really grateful.

Are deep nullsec free from sovereignty? If so, I'd like to give it a try. But without cloaking devices, I guess that I'm at a huge disadvantage. I've only read guides and theories and tips about living in nullsec, but nothing by real experience. I'm most afraid of the gate camps and Interdiction Spheres, I guess. Maybe enlighten me a bit xD? Plus, I'm still quite a newbie in fitting ships and I still have a lot of modules to recognise and what suits what ship better, etc.

I think that W-Space is more viable for new players like me to travel, since there are no sovereignty (right?) and no intels in Local. Sure they have cloaking devices, but to try to get to me, they'd need Combat Probes and before they actually scanned me down, I'd have noticed the Probes in the D-Scan right? So I guess it's pretty okay. While in Nullsec, they know for sure that I'm there. Or am I ignorant to think of it this way? Plus, I've met some CovOps ship, but they didn't look for me I guess (I'm using a pretty cheap ship anyway [Imicus]). Oh and I found an Astrahus in a W-Space. I guesspeople do live there too, but how would they go back to hisec/lowsec? I mean the Wormholes are random right?
Do Little
Bluenose Trading
#7 - 2017-03-25 08:31:34 UTC
There are corporations in Eve dedicated to exploration where you can find expert advice on how and where to look. Talk to https://www.eve-scout.com/signal-cartel/

Honrado deQuiros
Cartella Shipments and Storage
#8 - 2017-03-25 15:50:05 UTC
+1 on deadend systems, try to map those out using dotlan. Even in hisec, you'd see deadend systems with 10s of unexplored sites all bunched up.
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2017-03-25 23:04:31 UTC  |  Edited by: DeMichael Crimson
Wow, that was a lot of questions mixed in with a lot of text. It's understandable a new player would have a lot of questions. I've edited your post and listed the questions below.

Zack Azthor wrote:

1 - WH mapper? What's that?

2 - I do know that there are C1-C6 (from EVE Wiki), but I don't know how to determine them, yet. Mind telling me xD

3 - Are deep nullsec free from sovereignty?

4 - I'm most afraid of the gate camps and Interdiction Spheres, I guess. Maybe enlighten me a bit xD?

5 - I think that W-Space is more viable for new players like me to travel, since there are no sovereignty (right?) and no intels in Local.

6 - They'd need Combat Probes and before they actually scanned me down, I'd have noticed the Probes in the D-Scan right?

7 - While in Nullsec, they know for sure that I'm there. Or am I ignorant to think of it this way?

8 - Oh and I found an Astrahus in a W-Space. I guess people do live there too, but how would they go back to hisec/lowsec?

9 - I mean the Wormholes are random right?


Some of those questions pertain to content designed for more experienced players. In my opinion new players should first concentrate on getting familiar with game play controls, training up basic skills and ship fitting as well as Piloting tactics before actually jumping into game play content designed for more experienced players.

http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Tips_and_Tricks
http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/3rd_Party_Tools

Also I'd like to mention most answers pertaining to the game can be found by using Google search and checking all links to various Eve related Wiki's, Blogs and Forum threads for more info. Now I'm going to try answering your questions as best as I can.

1 - There's various 3rd party apps available that map out w-hole systems. Some w-holes are static meaning they will always spawn in a certain w-hole class leading to certain parts of K-space (high, low and null sec space).
https://www.pathfinder-w.space/
https://siggy.borkedlabs.com/pages/welcome
https://tripwire.eve-apps.com/

2 - There's various ways to tell which type of w-hole you've encountered in-game.
http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Wormholes
http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Wormhole_Space
http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Wormhole_Information
http://www.ellatha.com/eve/wormholelist.asp
http://www.ellatha.com/eve/WormholeSystemslist.asp
https://tripwire.torpedodelivery.com/wiki/whvisual/

3 - Most Nullsec space is player Alliance controlled, however there are some areas where players don't actually own Sovereignty but still patrol and try to control it.
http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/System_security#Null_Security
http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Category:Factions (includes map of NPC controlled space)
https://eveinfo.net/wiki/ind~2379.htm#0.0_Regions_with_NPC_Sovereignty
https://eveinfo.net/wiki/inde~544.htm (Drone Regions)

4 - Gate camps and Interdiction Spheres. Gate camps are done in all system security levels and I think high sec is probably more prominent due to suicide ganking. Bookmarks and Piloting skills can greatly increase chance of staying safe in all system security levels.
http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Manual_piloting
http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Gate_camps
http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Introduction_to_PvP:_Gates
http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Bookmarks
http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Safe_spots
http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Warp_disruption#Specialized
http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Interdiction_101

5 - Yes, w-space is the only area in-game that has no Sovereignty and no Local Intel. However there are definitely player Corporations and Alliances that actively patrol and control various w-space systems. Using w-space for travel is risky and unreliable since w-holes can close at various times and new ones won't always lead to where you need to go. Basically it's a time consuming hit and miss alternative for players looking for travel shortcuts from one area to another area of known space.

6 - Yes, Combat Probes are needed to scan ships and will show on Directional Scanner. However a very highly skilled player can probe ships very quickly and be warping to them without them knowing it. Ships fit with Covert Ops Cloak and Combat Recon ships are undetectable by Directional Scanners.
http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Directional_Scanner_Guide

7 - Yes, in all security system levels of known space Local chat will show players within that system.

8 - Yes, players do live in, patrol and control w-space systems. They have to scan and use w-holes for travel to and from known space just like everyone else.

9 - Most w-holes lead to random systems but there are some static w-holes that will always lead to the same security level of known space which is what W-hole mappers are used for.

Sorry about the wall of text / info overload. I hope you have good luck and much success here in Eve.


DMC

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
Zack Azthor
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#10 - 2017-03-28 04:00:04 UTC
I'm sorry if I have troubled you in reading the questions contained within the texts. Nevertheless, thank you very much for the tips and various links. I realise that I have a lot of things to learn before going to W-Space, but I guess that curiosity of these features still render me more intrigued rather than learning the basic mechanics. Although it might be more practical and efficient to learn all the basic mechanics and get myself more proficient in playing this game, I still prefer to do the interesting stuffs while learning (albeit perhaps less efficiently) the mechanics. I realise that flying without good knowledge will lead in frequent ship kills and probably also pod kills, but I'm ready xD It's a game after all. I apologise if I offended anyone by saying it's just "a game".

Don't be sorry for providing information xD I'm more grateful the more info provided. I probably will need some time to read all those, but it's better to have the materials beforehand rather than to search for more materials after finishing one (or so I think). Thank you for the time to respond :-)
Zack Azthor
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2017-03-28 04:01:00 UTC
Honrado deQuiros wrote:
+1 on deadend systems, try to map those out using dotlan. Even in hisec, you'd see deadend systems with 10s of unexplored sites all bunched up.


I tried this, it seems to be true. I found a Ghost Site and some good amount of data/relic sites in deadend systems. But why though? What makes them spawn more sites than other systems?
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2017-03-28 04:52:40 UTC
Zack Azthor wrote:
Honrado deQuiros wrote:
+1 on deadend systems, try to map those out using dotlan. Even in hisec, you'd see deadend systems with 10s of unexplored sites all bunched up.


I tried this, it seems to be true. I found a Ghost Site and some good amount of data/relic sites in deadend systems. But why though? What makes them spawn more sites than other systems?

Those systems don't spawn more sites than other systems. Usually there's not a lot of players going into those systems and since exploration sites have a life span of 3 to 5 days, the sites tend to pile up in those systems.


DMC

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
Shallanna Yassavi
qwertz corp
#13 - 2017-03-28 05:26:38 UTC
Most lowsec systems are going to be one of two things:

Full of sites and pirates.
-or-
Stripped of sites and empty.

One which isn't one or the other is valuable.

A signature :o
Zack Azthor
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2017-03-28 12:13:36 UTC
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
Zack Azthor wrote:
Honrado deQuiros wrote:
+1 on deadend systems, try to map those out using dotlan. Even in hisec, you'd see deadend systems with 10s of unexplored sites all bunched up.


I tried this, it seems to be true. I found a Ghost Site and some good amount of data/relic sites in deadend systems. But why though? What makes them spawn more sites than other systems?

Those systems don't spawn more sites than other systems. Usually there's not a lot of players going into those systems and since exploration sites have a life span of 3 to 5 days, the sites tend to pile up in those systems.


DMC


I looked it up and someone said that this is because PvE in deadend systems = harder to escape from pirates. Is it because there's only one Stargate that leads to other system, thus making it possible for the pirates to camp in stations and stargates? If that is the reason, can't one just log off safely while they're in their safe spot?
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#15 - 2017-03-28 12:46:39 UTC
Zack Azthor wrote:
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
Zack Azthor wrote:
Honrado deQuiros wrote:
+1 on deadend systems, try to map those out using dotlan. Even in hisec, you'd see deadend systems with 10s of unexplored sites all bunched up.


I tried this, it seems to be true. I found a Ghost Site and some good amount of data/relic sites in deadend systems. But why though? What makes them spawn more sites than other systems?

Those systems don't spawn more sites than other systems. Usually there's not a lot of players going into those systems and since exploration sites have a life span of 3 to 5 days, the sites tend to pile up in those systems.


DMC


I looked it up and someone said that this is because PvE in deadend systems = harder to escape from pirates. Is it because there's only one Stargate that leads to other system, thus making it possible for the pirates to camp in stations and stargates? If that is the reason, can't one just log off safely while they're in their safe spot?

Yeah, having one way in or out of a system makes it easier to be caught but just as you said, if you've already prepared before hand by making safe spots, gate spots, insta-undock spots, etc, keep watch on local and work D-scan, you can quickly warp to safe and log out if someone does enter the system while you're busy.

However if you have a Covert Ops cloaked ship, you can actually just hide and watch what they're doing. If you have Combat Probes and launcher, you might even be able to scare them off by probing for them since they'll be watching D-scan as well. If more players enter system, yeah, log off and hopefully they'll be gone when you return later.

DMC

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
Zack Azthor
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2017-03-28 13:39:19 UTC
I see. Thank you for the clarification!
Dupard Lemmont
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#17 - 2017-03-29 11:52:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Dupard Lemmont
Zack Azthor wrote:
Hello, I'm an Alpha Clone. After doing some Exploration things, I find it quite fun playing with the hacking minigames. However, searching for sites becomes very tedious after a while. I've been exploring for two days in lowsec. Mostly, I find wormholes to W-Space and Combat Sites, but no relic or data sites. So I went to W-Space to find that most of the Relic/Data Sites are guarded by Sleepers, which I cannot combat with an Imicus.

I guess what I'm asking is for advice to pick a better lowsec space to explore. I don't mind staying in lowsec for a while. Probably also asking for experience sharing and some tips in exploring.


A little comment regarding the wormholes there.

Before entering a wormhole, check the difficulty of the wormhole. They range from C1 to C6.
Atleast C1, C2 and C3 have the potential to contain both relic and data sites which are not guarded by sleepers. And they can be quite lucrative. I once found loot worth over 100 mill in one single container.

When you right click a wormhole and open info, you will see this text:
This wormhole seems to lead into Unknown parts of space. - This is C1 to C3 wormholes.
This wormhole seems to lead into Dangerous Unknown parts of space. - This is C4 and C5 wormholes.
This wormhole seems to lead into Deadly Unknown parts of space. - This is C6 wormholes.

As others have pointed out, the wormholes are often guarded by other players. Waiting for a kill.
Most players living in a wormhole will scan down all sites that are popping up and saving bookmarks for them.
They will search for you when you enter the wormhole. Especially if they see your ship on their directional scanner.
Often they will fly cloaked ships, so they can see you but you cant see them.

Wormholes are really "end-game" content and better to have a trained omega clone.
The data and relic site mini games are also very very hard. The antiviruses are very strong and even with a T2 hacker/analyzer it will be hard. With a T1 hacker/analyzer you must rely on luck, finding the core quickly before stumbling into other stuff.
So if you're just going to hack I would fly a T2 covert ops frigate with a covert ops cloak. I would also fit double- or triple warp core stabilizers. You will still have enough targeting range and scan resolution that it will not be a challenge to target the containers. However if a stealthbomber comes in and applies warp disruptor on you - you can still warp away. Only thing that can really stop you is a warp interdiction sphere - however if you watch d-scan effectively while hacking, you should be able to see if an interdictor is getting close.
Zack Azthor
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2017-03-31 11:19:23 UTC
Dupard Lemmont wrote:
Zack Azthor wrote:
Hello, I'm an Alpha Clone. After doing some Exploration things, I find it quite fun playing with the hacking minigames. However, searching for sites becomes very tedious after a while. I've been exploring for two days in lowsec. Mostly, I find wormholes to W-Space and Combat Sites, but no relic or data sites. So I went to W-Space to find that most of the Relic/Data Sites are guarded by Sleepers, which I cannot combat with an Imicus.

I guess what I'm asking is for advice to pick a better lowsec space to explore. I don't mind staying in lowsec for a while. Probably also asking for experience sharing and some tips in exploring.


A little comment regarding the wormholes there.

Before entering a wormhole, check the difficulty of the wormhole. They range from C1 to C6.
Atleast C1, C2 and C3 have the potential to contain both relic and data sites which are not guarded by sleepers. And they can be quite lucrative. I once found loot worth over 100 mill in one single container.

When you right click a wormhole and open info, you will see this text:
This wormhole seems to lead into Unknown parts of space. - This is C1 to C3 wormholes.
This wormhole seems to lead into Dangerous Unknown parts of space. - This is C4 and C5 wormholes.
This wormhole seems to lead into Deadly Unknown parts of space. - This is C6 wormholes.

As others have pointed out, the wormholes are often guarded by other players. Waiting for a kill.
Most players living in a wormhole will scan down all sites that are popping up and saving bookmarks for them.
They will search for you when you enter the wormhole. Especially if they see your ship on their directional scanner.
Often they will fly cloaked ships, so they can see you but you cant see them.

Wormholes are really "end-game" content and better to have a trained omega clone.
The data and relic site mini games are also very very hard. The antiviruses are very strong and even with a T2 hacker/analyzer it will be hard. With a T1 hacker/analyzer you must rely on luck, finding the core quickly before stumbling into other stuff.
So if you're just going to hack I would fly a T2 covert ops frigate with a covert ops cloak. I would also fit double- or triple warp core stabilizers. You will still have enough targeting range and scan resolution that it will not be a challenge to target the containers. However if a stealthbomber comes in and applies warp disruptor on you - you can still warp away. Only thing that can really stop you is a warp interdiction sphere - however if you watch d-scan effectively while hacking, you should be able to see if an interdictor is getting close.


Ah thanks for the tips! I guess that I was lucky in hacking those sites, because I got all of 'em. Or maybe I'm just really good at hacking xD Flattering myself, how pitiful lol.
Ivory Harcourt
Space Ants
Brave Collective
#19 - 2017-03-31 12:28:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Ivory Harcourt
Zack Azthor wrote:
Hello, I'm an Alpha Clone. After doing some Exploration things, I find it quite fun playing with the hacking minigames. However, searching for sites becomes very tedious after a while. I've been exploring for two days in lowsec. Mostly, I find wormholes to W-Space and Combat Sites, but no relic or data sites. So I went to W-Space to find that most of the Relic/Data Sites are guarded by Sleepers, which I cannot combat with an Imicus.

I guess what I'm asking is for advice to pick a better lowsec space to explore. I don't mind staying in lowsec for a while. Probably also asking for experience sharing and some tips in exploring.


1) Factional Warfare?

It is possible that you were scanning down in Factional Warfare area, which is more lively than the rest of low. Go to a different lowsec areas or regions. Here is the example:

Black Rise is a mostly lowsec region with almost all systems being in factional warfare. You can see it by looking at the colour inside the ellipse representing a system, if there are two, the system is contested.
Another example: Derelik (security map not sovereignty map), mixed region with no factional warfare.

A map of all regions (highsec in the middle, then a ring of lowsec, then nullsec at the edge) is here: http://evemaps.dotlan.net/map

2) Try nullsec

Nullsec provides better rewards. If you join a corporation in sovereignty nullsec (conquerable), you get the access to their space with relatively safe-ish environment. Alternatively, NPC Nullsec might be a way to go, however nullsec (and wormholes) also means potential gatecamps with bubbles. You'll learn how to avoid them, though...

Example of NPC nullsec: Syndicate
Example of sovereignty nullsec: Tenerifis


3) Try wormholes again

....damn, that has been already explained.