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Alphas and F2P Have Failed

Author
Zarek Kree
Lunatic Legion Holdings
#641 - 2017-04-06 20:24:44 UTC
Scialt wrote:
I disagree with the first sentence strongly. I've seen a million people in the new pilots forum make posts about how it takes too long to get to (what they perceive) as the "end game" to be told by everyone here that Eve has no end game and that they should quit and go play WOW or something.

Now of course not everyone has the mindset of wanting to take part in the "upper echelons" of a game... but it's silly not to recognize that many do.

Second... while new players do join, we've been going in a negative direction for a while now in terms of total players (with an uptick with Alphas but not an upward trend overall). That means more people are stopping playing Eve than starting. While we don't have hard numbers on that, I wonder how many more of those who are stopping are people relatively new to the game (those who subbed for a few months to a year and didn't renew) vs those who had been longer term players. I'm enjoying myself a lot now... and I enjoyed myself a lot when I stopped in 2009 (I left due to out of game reasons, not due to lack of enjoyment). But even back in the 2006-2009 time period... I hit a lull period where the game stopped being new but I had to wait for a while to get to be able to do things I wanted to do. I stopped playing as much and nearly quit... but decided to give it another try (with another 6-9 months of AFK training)... and had a much better time. Perhaps I connected with a better group of players... but I'm not so sure. I've tried going back with alts and doing stuff with that level of skill points and isk rewards... and frankly I tolerate it less now than I did back then. I do think there's a period from after the game stops being new and before you start having enough skills and taking in enough isk to start thinking about strategic goals in the game as opposed to just "getting by" where Eve struggles most with retention.

Now keep in mind... CCP has done some good things to make it more palatable than it was when I went through that lull. For example, we don't have to worry about learning skills anymore (that was a horrible thing... waiting for learning skills to train so you could start actually training to do stuff... or suffering crappy training times by not training learning skills). But I still firmly believe there is a point (perhaps a different point depending on what you're doing) where you have to get past a grind to get to "the good stuff". And it usually hits at a point where the 600m skill injector cost is prohibitive in terms of what you can make with the skills you have at the time.

But again... my views are from my experience years ago and what I see as an older player who went back and tried to run lower level content in an alt. I could be totally off on what a 6-12 month player who's new to Eve is feeling.


The only way to address the concerns of those players wanting an instant end-game fix is to fundamentally change the entire nature of the game. If they do that, I'll leave along with many others. You can't dumb down this game or make it easier without breaking it.

We're only months into their effort to reverse the downward trend with alphas and an enhanced NPE. We won't know if it's succeeded or failed for at least a year when the retention numbers become clearer. It's certainly not time to talk about changing the nature of the game.
Scialt
Universal Sanitation Corporation
#642 - 2017-04-06 20:49:04 UTC
Zarek Kree wrote:
Scialt wrote:
I disagree with the first sentence strongly. I've seen a million people in the new pilots forum make posts about how it takes too long to get to (what they perceive) as the "end game" to be told by everyone here that Eve has no end game and that they should quit and go play WOW or something.

Now of course not everyone has the mindset of wanting to take part in the "upper echelons" of a game... but it's silly not to recognize that many do.

Second... while new players do join, we've been going in a negative direction for a while now in terms of total players (with an uptick with Alphas but not an upward trend overall). That means more people are stopping playing Eve than starting. While we don't have hard numbers on that, I wonder how many more of those who are stopping are people relatively new to the game (those who subbed for a few months to a year and didn't renew) vs those who had been longer term players. I'm enjoying myself a lot now... and I enjoyed myself a lot when I stopped in 2009 (I left due to out of game reasons, not due to lack of enjoyment). But even back in the 2006-2009 time period... I hit a lull period where the game stopped being new but I had to wait for a while to get to be able to do things I wanted to do. I stopped playing as much and nearly quit... but decided to give it another try (with another 6-9 months of AFK training)... and had a much better time. Perhaps I connected with a better group of players... but I'm not so sure. I've tried going back with alts and doing stuff with that level of skill points and isk rewards... and frankly I tolerate it less now than I did back then. I do think there's a period from after the game stops being new and before you start having enough skills and taking in enough isk to start thinking about strategic goals in the game as opposed to just "getting by" where Eve struggles most with retention.

Now keep in mind... CCP has done some good things to make it more palatable than it was when I went through that lull. For example, we don't have to worry about learning skills anymore (that was a horrible thing... waiting for learning skills to train so you could start actually training to do stuff... or suffering crappy training times by not training learning skills). But I still firmly believe there is a point (perhaps a different point depending on what you're doing) where you have to get past a grind to get to "the good stuff". And it usually hits at a point where the 600m skill injector cost is prohibitive in terms of what you can make with the skills you have at the time.

But again... my views are from my experience years ago and what I see as an older player who went back and tried to run lower level content in an alt. I could be totally off on what a 6-12 month player who's new to Eve is feeling.


The only way to address the concerns of those players wanting an instant end-game fix is to fundamentally change the entire nature of the game. If they do that, I'll leave along with many others. You can't dumb down this game or make it easier without breaking it.

We're only months into their effort to reverse the downward trend with alphas and an enhanced NPE. We won't know if it's succeeded or failed for at least a year when the retention numbers become clearer. It's certainly not time to talk about changing the nature of the game.


I think there's a middle ground between "instant end-game" and lessening the grind to get to a point of skills/isk that feels like you're able to access most of EVE. CCP took a step toward doing that by getting rid of the learning skills. Perhaps another step could be that if you're Omega, you get 5X the sp when training until you hit 5 million SP (or some other smaller multiplier if needed).

I came up through mission running as an isk making mechanism... but the rewards from missions pretty much suck until you get to lvl 4. Once you get to the point you can run those without dying... your income goes way up and with that income comes a lot of other opportunities (including skill injectors these days). Think of the period I'm talking about as that time to get to being able to afford and successfully fly a ship capable of level 4's without having skill injectors. I'm thinking that shortening the time it takes to get to that point would be a positive on retention.
Salvos Rhoska
#643 - 2017-04-06 20:55:58 UTC
EVE takes time.
A lot of it.

Depending on what you are doing, as a new player it can be pretty grim looking at your tiny SP pool, small profits and constant "i have no goddam idea what is going on" situation.

For that alone, I recommend new players join player corps asap.
I didnt, but Im stubborn to a fault and hardly an example.

Things start getting much better once new players start figuring things out and have some SP to spread around.
Or, fly together with others to enable them to participate in content otherwise outside their reach.

By 3-6months they start to have some real options and basic understanding.

Just as with constantly preaching the Golden Rules, we should constantly preach that EVE learning curve is steep, and systemic progression veeeery slow. Alongside that, that there are things they can do, either by using their brains/creativity, or joining others.

If we can get them past the 3 month hump, I think they are set and hooked.
Zarek Kree
Lunatic Legion Holdings
#644 - 2017-04-06 21:25:59 UTC
Scialt wrote:
I think there's a middle ground between "instant end-game" and lessening the grind to get to a point of skills/isk that feels like you're able to access most of EVE. CCP took a step toward doing that by getting rid of the learning skills. Perhaps another step could be that if you're Omega, you get 5X the sp when training until you hit 5 million SP (or some other smaller multiplier if needed).

I came up through mission running as an isk making mechanism... but the rewards from missions pretty much suck until you get to lvl 4. Once you get to the point you can run those without dying... your income goes way up and with that income comes a lot of other opportunities (including skill injectors these days). Think of the period I'm talking about as that time to get to being able to afford and successfully fly a ship capable of level 4's without having skill injectors. I'm thinking that shortening the time it takes to get to that point would be a positive on retention.


There's a big difference between having the skills to fly something and having the experience to use it effectively. I still remember my first couple of months when I skill injected myself into a VNI and then went off to lowsec to rat. I think I lasted all of 30 minutes before I got blown up by another player. My skills were fine but I didn't have the experience and understanding to do that successfully. That's like giving a new driver a Porsche when he needs to be learning in a Honda. What I've learned over the past year is that experience trumps skills every time. And there is no shortcut to experience.

Also, there's never been a time when I've been twiddling my thumbs waiting for skill training to complete. There is ALWAYS something I'm capable of doing that's new and interesting. And those things prepare me for other activities I can do later when I better skills.

What needs to improve is the on-boarding of new players into the existing game structure. And that's exactly what CCP is focusing on now.
Salvos Rhoska
#645 - 2017-04-06 22:10:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Salvos Rhoska
Zarek Kree wrote:
I still remember my first couple of months when I skill injected myself into a VNI and then went off to lowsec to rat. I think I lasted all of 30 minutes before I got blown up by another player.


You used skill injectors in your first couple months to get into a VNI? :D

Zarek Kree wrote:
What needs to improve is the on-boarding of new players into the existing game structure. And that's exactly what CCP is focusing on now.

So cos you bought yourself into a VNI with injectors and got blown up, CCP should fast-track players even quicker than when you failed to P2W into existing game structures to this result?
Zarek Kree
Lunatic Legion Holdings
#646 - 2017-04-06 22:51:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Zarek Kree
Salvos Rhoska wrote:
Zarek Kree wrote:
I still remember my first couple of months when I skill injected myself into a VNI and then went off to lowsec to rat. I think I lasted all of 30 minutes before I got blown up by another player.


You used skill injectors in your first couple months to get into a VNI? :D

Zarek Kree wrote:
What needs to improve is the on-boarding of new players into the existing game structure. And that's exactly what CCP is focusing on now.

So cos you bought yourself into a VNI with injectors and got blown up, CCP should fast-track players even quicker than when you failed to P2W into existing game structures to this result?


I'm arguing no such thing. If you actually bothered to READ what I wrote, you'd see that I AGREE WITH YOU (yeah, I'm as shocked as you are). I was pretty clear that I DON'T think people should be able to fast-track into skills they aren't ready for. On-boarding is the process by which you inculcate new people - which is exactly what the new NPE system is. Now take some deep breaths, slow down and read what people write before responding with nonsense.
Marika Sunji
Perkone
Caldari State
#647 - 2017-04-07 10:07:11 UTC
Scialt wrote:
lessening the grind to get to a point of skills/isk that feels like you're able to access most of EVE


If you're a new player without a crippling injector addiction, you can forget all about capital ships and their existence for a year or so. Which is as it should be, they are a goal, something to strive for. With caps out of the way, as long as you focus on a single race, you can train into most of decently fit (meta4 weapons) ships, with the exception of certain highly specialized platforms (HICs, BLOPS), within about half a year from the start of the game. Sure, you will not excel at them, but additional dictor, logi, recon can turn the tides of battle, and certainly would provide you with access to most parts of EVE.
Salvos Rhoska
#648 - 2017-04-07 10:07:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Salvos Rhoska
Zarek Kree wrote:
Now take some deep breaths, slow down and read what people write before responding with nonsense.

Zarek Kree wrote:
What needs to improve is the on-boarding of new players into the existing game structure. And that's exactly what CCP is focusing on now.


Explain the above.

What do you mean by "on-boarding new players into the existing game structure"?
How is that to be improved?
How is CCP focusing on that now?
Gimme Sake
State War Academy
Caldari State
#649 - 2017-04-07 10:24:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Gimme Sake
Arthur Aihaken wrote:

EVE has as a point of fact been dying for years - it's just now accelerating past the point of no return. There are far too many players in high-sec, so a kick (rather than nudge) is desperately needed. This only works if low-sec folks have a chance to stand on their own, though - so supers need to go.


^
That.


Low sec used to be the place for fun small gang brawl and new players to get in touch with pvp basics. Now everyone drops titans and faxes on frigates.


If you try to introduce new players to pvp and the answer to "how long does it take to fly supers" is a few years, then don't be suprised of their "F*** That " reaction. The gamer mindset is experience the best a game has to offer.

Futile to try explaining them the excitement of small gang or fleet combat if they get popped by fighters in a few seconds.

"Never not blob!" ~ Plato

Clockwork Robot
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#650 - 2017-04-07 11:15:29 UTC
Gimme Sake wrote:
Arthur Aihaken wrote:

EVE has as a point of fact been dying for years - it's just now accelerating past the point of no return. There are far too many players in high-sec, so a kick (rather than nudge) is desperately needed. This only works if low-sec folks have a chance to stand on their own, though - so supers need to go.


^
That.


Low sec used to be the place for fun small gang brawl. Now everyone drops titans and faxes on frigates.



Granted I speak from zero null-sec experience here, but I highly doubt there was ever a time when "overwhelming force or avoid" was not the absolute unbreakable doctrine for each and every cubic inch of EvE. Ganker or Miner, Industrialist or Soverign-grinder... If the advantage wasn't yours, you'd bail.

Romantacizing something that never was just sets unrealistic hopes/expectarions.
Gimme Sake
State War Academy
Caldari State
#651 - 2017-04-07 11:23:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Gimme Sake
Clockwork Robot wrote:
Gimme Sake wrote:
Arthur Aihaken wrote:

EVE has as a point of fact been dying for years - it's just now accelerating past the point of no return. There are far too many players in high-sec, so a kick (rather than nudge) is desperately needed. This only works if low-sec folks have a chance to stand on their own, though - so supers need to go.


^
That.


Low sec used to be the place for fun small gang brawl. Now everyone drops titans and faxes on frigates.



Granted I speak from zero null-sec experience here, but I highly doubt there was ever a time when "overwhelming force or avoid" was not the absolute unbreakable doctrine for each and every cubic inch of EvE. Ganker or Miner, Industrialist or Soverign-grinder... If the advantage wasn't yours, you'd bail.

Romantacizing something that never was just sets unrealistic hopes/expectarions.



I'm not talking about picking fights or about fairness, blops were common before in ls. I'm talking about the perspectives available to new players. Nobody likes being used as a meat shield of cannon fodder but supers are something outside of the rock paper scissors philosophy subcaps submit to.

The only counter for supers are supers. Nothing atainable for a new bro.

"Never not blob!" ~ Plato

Zoubidah Al-Kouffarde
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#652 - 2017-04-07 11:46:20 UTC
Gimme Sake wrote:


The only counter for supers are supers. Nothing attainable for a new bro.


What do you mean? any new player can buy subscriptions for multiple accounts, a few dozen PLEX, buy advanced characters for those accounts, and then have supers to counter supers.

There's nothing preventing a newbro from defending himself from those tactics.

Oh, and before anyone shouts "OMG IT'S P2W", a few hours of grind can provide enough PLEX to fund all that ^^

"You would not be the first "ganker aligned" player to be found to having some issues. Here's a dark secret: there are some in AG who, because of battling gankers, have managed to get to know a few of them, found they had issues, and helped them" HW

Gimme Sake
State War Academy
Caldari State
#653 - 2017-04-07 11:48:55 UTC
Zoubidah Al-Kouffarde wrote:
Gimme Sake wrote:


The only counter for supers are supers. Nothing attainable for a new bro.


What do you mean? any new player can buy subscriptions for multiple accounts, a few dozen PLEX, buy advanced characters for those accounts, and then have supers to counter supers.

There's nothing preventing a newbro from defending himself from those tactics.

Oh, and before anyone shouts "OMG IT'S P2W", a few hours of grind can provide enough PLEX to fund all that ^^


Ha ha ha!

"Never not blob!" ~ Plato

Keno Skir
#654 - 2017-04-07 11:56:52 UTC
Zoubidah Al-Kouffarde wrote:
Gimme Sake wrote:


The only counter for supers are supers. Nothing attainable for a new bro.


What do you mean? any new player can buy subscriptions for multiple accounts, a few dozen PLEX, buy advanced characters for those accounts, and then have supers to counter supers.

There's nothing preventing a newbro from defending himself from those tactics.

Oh, and before anyone shouts "OMG IT'S P2W", a few hours of grind can provide enough PLEX to fund all that ^^


You have no idea what you're talking about.

Pirate
Martin Solo
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#655 - 2017-04-07 11:58:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Martin Solo
Hello there good ppl of Eve..

Im not sure if my input here is any good, but least i can give my pov..

I am one of the new bros, that recently joined the game..

My history in gaming started out as a fps gamer, but the last 10 years have mainly been focused around mmo's, mainly wow..

The reason ive started playing eve, has nothing to do with the alpha state, i just wanted to try it out (way to late ive realised since its fk epic)

My first experience with eve, least the 2 first days, were alot of WTF am i doing?!.. The game for a new player is some cases so overwhelming (least with no network) that i was close to quitting..

But why am i still here then ?

As a veteran mmo player (10 years of wow) i could see what i was getting into.. The bigger the struggle, the bigger the reward..

After ratting around for 2 weeks, getting sniped a few times in lowsec, i finally felt like i was ready to join a corp (had some basic knowledge, so i wouldent be that mutch of a pain to train, and i was hoping to find safety in numbers, and stuff to do with others..
This might come down to the corp i joined, but joining a corp, gave me nothing of what i was looking for.. The game seems a bit infested with the whole "spy" thing.. Even though i got a warm welcome, i felt even more isolated..
I was told to "go do solo pvp"... Yet i joined the corp, realising that the economy and skills i have in the game atm, would make me more into cannon fodder, then engage in real pvp.

I was looking for ppl to do missions with, maby even (sorry for saying it) even mine with ppl.. The whole idea of doing stuff as a team was the driving force for me, and atm its a bit shattered..

Anyways..

I instantly realised that the alpha state, is bullshit, least if you wana play the game for real.. The only problem i see with the alpha state, is thats it considdered a way that you can actually play the game. (imo its not, but its a great way to give a ppl a chance to try it out (and realising as alpha that you need omega)

My only input is.. (and as new as i am, i realise that im prob wrong) but..

Instead of having alpha as it is, i would limit it to maby 1 month of free gametime, with no limits.. Once the month is over, the account gets frozen, and you can only play once you upgraded to omega.. (so it dosent end up as an alt account that either farm's, or ganks (or whatever exploits there are).

1 month to figure out, if eve is your game.

Im a little bit conserned, since ive played wow, and we all know how that turned out.. It went from one of the most grindy awsome games, to one of the most ********. unrewarding and rotten games ive seen..

What wow did wrong, was catering to mouthbreathers.. Instead of being proud of their creation, they slowly tried morphing it into a game, even the most unintilligent players could comprehend, i guess in an attempt to get more subs (failed misserably)

As i see it, Eve is complicated as fk, and im loving it.. I love the whole experience of being clueless newbro every 5 minuttes, and putting in some work to later have a big "AHA" moment..

Reading my post, i admint it makes little sence so


Im new to eve, but im not here because of the alpha state, im here because of

1 # Scott Manlys videos on the fountain wars on youtube
2 # Eve fanfest videos on youtube
3 # I want to be part of a team, and do stuff as a team.
4 # i want a fkn challenge and not a baby game like wow.

(english is my 3rd language, so sry for making you all blind with my exellent grammar) :D

Hope my input is usefull in some shape or form.. o7
Gimme Sake
State War Academy
Caldari State
#656 - 2017-04-07 12:06:09 UTC
Martin Solo wrote:


Hello there good ppl of Eve..

Im not sure if my input here is any good, but least i can give my pov..

I am one of the new bros, that recently joined the game..

My history in gaming started out as a fps gamer, but the last 10 years have mainly been focused around mmo's, mainly wow..

The reason ive started playing eve, has nothing to do with the alpha state, i just wanted to try it out (way to late ive realised since its fk epic)

My first experience with eve, least the 2 first days, were alot of WTF am i doing?!.. The game for a new player is some cases so overwhelming (least with no network) that i was close to quitting..

But why am i still here then ?

As a veteran mmo player (10 years of wow) i could see what i was getting into.. The bigger the struggle, the bigger the reward..

After ratting around for 2 weeks, getting sniped a few times in lowsec, i finally felt like i was ready to join a corp (had some basic knowledge, so i wouldent be that mutch of a pain to train, and i was hoping to find safety in numbers, and stuff to do with others..
This might come down to the corp i joined, but joining a corp, gave me nothing of what i was looking for.. The game seems a bit infested with the whole "spy" thing.. Even though i got a warm welcome, i felt even more isolated..
I was told to "go do solo pvp"... Yet i joined the corp, realising that the economy and skills i have in the game atm, would make me more into cannon fodder, then engage in real pvp.

I was looking for ppl to do missions with, maby even (sorry for saying it) even mine with ppl.. The whole idea of doing stuff as a team was the driving force for me, and atm its a bit shattered..

Anyways..

I instantly realised that the alpha state, is bullshit, least if you wana play the game for real.. The only problem i see with the alpha state, is thats it considdered a way that you can actually play the game. (imo its not, but its a great way to give a ppl a chance to try it out (and realising as alpha that you need omega)

My only input is.. (and as new as i am, i realise that im prob wrong) but..

Instead of having alpha as it is, i would limit it to maby 1 month of free gametime, with no limits.. Once the month is over, the account gets frozen, and you can only play once you upgraded to omega.. (so it dosent end up as an alt account that either farm's, or ganks (or whatever exploits there are).

1 month to figure out, if eve is your game.

Im a little bit conserned, since ive played wow, and we all know how that turned out.. It went from one of the most grindy awsome games, to one of the most ********. unrewarding and rotten games ive seen..

What wow did wrong, was catering to mouthbreathers.. Instead of being proud of their creation, they slowly tried morphing it into a game, even the most unintilligent players could comprehend, i guess in an attempt to get more subs (failed isserably)

As i see it, Eve if complicated as fk, and im loving it.. I love the whole experience of being clueless newbro every 5 minuttes, and putting in some work to later have a big "AHA" moment..

Reading my post, i admint it makes little sence so


Im new to eve, but im not here because of the alpha state, im here because of

1 # Scott Manlys videos on the fountain wars on youtube
2 # Eve fanfest videos on youtube
3 # I want to be part of a team, and do stuff as a team.
4 # i want a fkn challenge and not a baby game like wow.

(english is my 3rd language, so sry for making you all blind with my exellent grammar) :D

Hope my input is usefull in some shape or form.. o7




You don't need to be in a player owned corp to do solo pvp. If you feel isolated change the corp, there are better corps, new player friendly, out there. Eve university, karma fleet, pandemic horde are the first to come to my mind.

The trial system was prior to alpha clone status and had some similar limitations regarding usable ships and skills.

"Never not blob!" ~ Plato

Keno Skir
#657 - 2017-04-07 12:15:54 UTC
Martin Solo wrote:
Hello there good ppl of Eve..

Im not sure if my input here is any good, but least i can give my pov..

I am one of the new bros, that recently joined the game..

My history in gaming started out as a fps gamer, but the last 10 years have mainly been focused around mmo's, mainly wow..

The reason ive started playing eve, has nothing to do with the alpha state, i just wanted to try it out (way to late ive realised since its fk epic)

My first experience with eve, least the 2 first days, were alot of WTF am i doing?!.. The game for a new player is some cases so overwhelming (least with no network) that i was close to quitting..

But why am i still here then ?

As a veteran mmo player (10 years of wow) i could see what i was getting into.. The bigger the struggle, the bigger the reward..

After ratting around for 2 weeks, getting sniped a few times in lowsec, i finally felt like i was ready to join a corp (had some basic knowledge, so i wouldent be that mutch of a pain to train, and i was hoping to find safety in numbers, and stuff to do with others..
This might come down to the corp i joined, but joining a corp, gave me nothing of what i was looking for.. The game seems a bit infested with the whole "spy" thing.. Even though i got a warm welcome, i felt even more isolated..
I was told to "go do solo pvp"... Yet i joined the corp, realising that the economy and skills i have in the game atm, would make me more into cannon fodder, then engage in real pvp.

I was looking for ppl to do missions with, maby even (sorry for saying it) even mine with ppl.. The whole idea of doing stuff as a team was the driving force for me, and atm its a bit shattered..

Anyways..

I instantly realised that the alpha state, is bullshit, least if you wana play the game for real.. The only problem i see with the alpha state, is thats it considdered a way that you can actually play the game. (imo its not, but its a great way to give a ppl a chance to try it out (and realising as alpha that you need omega)

My only input is.. (and as new as i am, i realise that im prob wrong) but..

Instead of having alpha as it is, i would limit it to maby 1 month of free gametime, with no limits.. Once the month is over, the account gets frozen, and you can only play once you upgraded to omega.. (so it dosent end up as an alt account that either farm's, or ganks (or whatever exploits there are).

1 month to figure out, if eve is your game.

Im a little bit conserned, since ive played wow, and we all know how that turned out.. It went from one of the most grindy awsome games, to one of the most ********. unrewarding and rotten games ive seen..

What wow did wrong, was catering to mouthbreathers.. Instead of being proud of their creation, they slowly tried morphing it into a game, even the most unintilligent players could comprehend, i guess in an attempt to get more subs (failed misserably)

As i see it, Eve is complicated as fk, and im loving it.. I love the whole experience of being clueless newbro every 5 minuttes, and putting in some work to later have a big "AHA" moment..

Reading my post, i admint it makes little sence so


Im new to eve, but im not here because of the alpha state, im here because of

1 # Scott Manlys videos on the fountain wars on youtube
2 # Eve fanfest videos on youtube
3 # I want to be part of a team, and do stuff as a team.
4 # i want a fkn challenge and not a baby game like wow.

(english is my 3rd language, so sry for making you all blind with my exellent grammar) :D

Hope my input is usefull in some shape or form.. o7


Sounds like you "get it" Lol

Come fly with us anytime, just get in touch Pirate
Martin Solo
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#658 - 2017-04-07 12:23:05 UTC
Gimme Sake wrote:



You don't need to be in a player owned corp to do solo pvp. If you feel isolated change the corp, there are better corps, new player friendly, out there. Eve university, karma fleet, pandemic horde are the first to come to my mind.

The trial system was prior to alpha clone status and had some similar limitations regarding usable ships and skills.


Damnit, im pretty sure my awsome grammer, created some confusion here..

Im not looking for solo pvp. In wow i was a healer (logi in eve) Im looking to do the same in eve if possible..

I want to establish my own economy, and not just be given "help".. I want to understand eve, and be a pillar in the corp im in..

I do really value your responce, since its dawning on me, that with the "needs" i got atm, im in a totally wrong corp.. Dont get me wrong, the corp is great and all, just not focused on what i am trying to find..

Thank you for your advice o7

Yebo Lakatosh
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#659 - 2017-04-07 12:30:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Yebo Lakatosh
Martin Solo wrote:
1 month to figure out, if eve is your game.
Dunno. That was the past model, and it successfully kept me away from the game I always wanted to try. It wasn't slightly appealing that I could taste an infamously harsh and complex title... while having a ticking clock signifying how much time I have left to decide.

I would have picked a lot more severely limited alpha state any day, if it meant I could learn the ropes and find my ways in my own pace. So jumped in when I heard about Alpha, and having a blast ever since.


And as others said... if you feel that what you are doing, or who you are doing it with is not fun / educational / profitable or whatever... move on.

Elite F1 pilot since YC119, incarnate of honor, integrity and tidi.

Martin Solo
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#660 - 2017-04-07 12:32:39 UTC
Keno Skir wrote:

Sounds like you "get it" Lol

Come fly with us anytime, just get in touch Pirate


I might take you up on that offer one day...

Ill send you a request...

Thank you :)