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BREAKING: Ishukone CEO Derided At CEP Session

Author
Ashlar Vellum
Esquire Armaments
#21 - 2017-03-01 16:03:19 UTC
Makoto Priano wrote:
On the matter of the CP comments, I'd say this: the comments were well-crafted to goad certain parties, and are in turn gracious to the Federation. Given the circumstances on the ground during that crisis, diplomacy and joint administration were of interest and value to both sides.

By saying well-crafted you mean word gracious was well chosen 'cause it is synonymous with merciful.
Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#22 - 2017-03-01 16:30:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Aria Jenneth
Mizhara Del'thul wrote:
So the Provists have a new champion. It went so well the last time, I can't see this going poorly at all for this one.


The Patriot faction's always been both militaristic and isolationist, Miz. The Liberals prefer to maintain links to the rest of the world. This is a division going back to probably just after the Morning of Reason. (Before that it would have probably just been a subtle distinction in the views of secessionist powers.)

It's nothing new, and it definitely didn't start with the Provists. We just don't usually see it producing outbursts like this.


Korsavius wrote:
Ayallah wrote:
Of course the CEP is derisive when it is suggested the State help fix the infection they allowed to happen.

The only derisive individual that was publicly announced is the CEO of Lai Dai. The rest of the CEP members, to our public knowledge, were not derisive outright. I suggest you exercise more discernment when trying to toss an entire nation into the line of your ridicule.


Ms. Ayallah's got this idea that the State is a piece of fruit ripe for the plucking, Mr. Korsavius. She wants you all Reclaimed by the sword-- invaded and enslaved by the Empire. It's a little distressing: this dream of hers is a nightmare of mine. Fortunately, she seems to be about the only person who thinks this isn't a colossally bad idea.

I guess she's realized she has some persuading to do.
TomHorn
Horn Brothers Holdings Inc.
#23 - 2017-03-01 16:40:51 UTC
Korsavius wrote:
Huh, I thought you rotted away like the rest of Heth's legacy. Funny how the cockroaches come crawling out at the scent of troubled waters.


We aint gone nowhere, just waiting , watching , waiting for the wind to change direction. Times change, not men , least of all me.
Makoto Priano
Kirkinen-Arataka Transhuman Zenith Consulting Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#24 - 2017-03-01 17:31:00 UTC
Oh, no worries, Horn. We know you've got all the density of a rock.

Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries: exploring the edge of the known, advancing the state of the art. Would you like to know more?

Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#25 - 2017-03-01 17:43:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Aria Jenneth
I've got kind of a theory that the Templis Dragonaurs are to the Caldari what the Sani Sabik are to the Amarr: an aberration, a distortion, but one that emerges organically out of the cultural traits of its host civilization, and will re-emerge from those same traits even if annihilated completely in any given generation. Maybe the Templis and Sani speak to something in the human animal that their host civilizations either suppress or fail to fully satisfy-- the will to power, or the desire to protect only one's (narrowly-construed) own.

It's a pity they're both so completely toxic.
Synthetic Cultist
Church of The Crimson Saviour
#26 - 2017-03-01 18:03:02 UTC
Aria Jenneth wrote:
I've got kind of a theory that the Templis Dragonaurs are to the Caldari what the Sani Sabik are to the Amarr: an aberration, a distortion, but one that emerges organically out of the cultural traits of its host civilization, and will re-emerge from those same traits even if annihilated completely in any given generation.


Consider the Right Human Hand.

Extend the Index Finger. Then extend the Thumb. They are at Right Angles. Then extend the middle Finger, at Right Angles to both the Index Finger and the Thumb.

Now consider the Left Human Hand, and extend the Digits in the same Method.

Observe Now, that the Two Hands cannot be Orientated relative to each other, in such a Way that all Digits point in the Same Direction as their Corresponding Digit on the Opposite Hand.

Such is the Ineffable Nature of the Templis Dragonaurs Relative to Caldari Orthodox Culture.

Same Historical Background. Same Cultural Ideas. Different Interpretations.

Synthia 1, Empress of Kaztropol.

It is Written.

Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#27 - 2017-03-01 18:46:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Aria Jenneth
Synthetic Cultist wrote:
Consider the Right Human Hand.

Extend the Index Finger. Then extend the Thumb. They are at Right Angles. Then extend the middle Finger, at Right Angles to both the Index Finger and the Thumb.

Now consider the Left Human Hand, and extend the Digits in the same Method.

Observe Now, that the Two Hands cannot be Orientated relative to each other, in such a Way that all Digits point in the Same Direction as their Corresponding Digit on the Opposite Hand.

Such is the Ineffable Nature of the Templis Dragonaurs Relative to Caldari Orthodox Culture.

Same Historical Background. Same Cultural Ideas. Different Interpretations.

Neat metaphor, but I don't actually think it works very well, Synthia.

The Templis aren't apart from Caldari culture even at the level that Delve is apart from the Empire. They're interlaced with it, entwined and embedded in it. They represent qualities the Caldari broadly consider admirable: they're profoundly dedicated to the Caldari people, culture, and traditions. Just, they're so dedicated to those ideas that they're willing to do stuff like bomb Gallentean-majority underwater cities to let in the sea (Nouvelle Rouvenor), try to drive out Intaki who sided with the State during the ensuing war (the Waschi Uprising), and so on.

The basic framework can be found in the Patriot faction, basically from first to last. History, the same. Culture, the same. Interpretations, also largely the same-- just, in the case of the Templis, unleavened by humility, moderation, or compassion. They take the usual Caldari disregard for the interests of outsiders, and make it absolute. To the Templis, those who are not Caldari are entitled to nothing at all-- not honoring of agreements, not any place in the State, not even their lives.

The Templis are kind of like Patriots, distilled. They're purists in a world that despises purity, and that makes them terrible.

Mostly, I don't worry a lot about the Achura being basically at the mercy of the Caldari. We're recognized as close cousins, our faith as the Way of the Winds by another name. We're still required to live apart if we want to live as our ancestors did, but Achura can also join the Caldari culture and live as citizens of the State.

My predecessor felt that the State protected us. And probably it does, but....

The experience of the Mordu's Legion Intaki suggests that even the closest, most obvious and most honorable friendship is not enough to satisfy the Templis, for whom blood and culture are all, and friendship and obligation to outsiders are nothing. The Achura are not from Caldari Prime. We have our own culture, but, more disturbing, probably, to the Templis, is that so many of Achur blood live as Caldari. To them, that is not a thing to which we have any right, and never mind whether it was forced on us: we are not Caldari by blood, so, to the Templis, the Caldari may do whatever they want to us.

I dread the day the Templis turn their attention to Achura.
Makoto Priano
Kirkinen-Arataka Transhuman Zenith Consulting Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#28 - 2017-03-01 18:51:58 UTC
I would 'like' that statement, Ms. Jenneth, but let us instead say that I agree with it completely, while not being fond of its truth.

There is, it seems, a point at which virtue becomes vice.

Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries: exploring the edge of the known, advancing the state of the art. Would you like to know more?

Synthetic Cultist
Church of The Crimson Saviour
#29 - 2017-03-01 19:09:29 UTC
Aria Jenneth wrote:
Neat metaphor, but I don't actually think it works very well, Synthia.


Perhaps it Works more Accurately for the Amarr Religions.

Synthia 1, Empress of Kaztropol.

It is Written.

Saya Ishikari
Ishukone-Raata Technological Research Institute
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#30 - 2017-03-01 19:09:51 UTC
Aria Jenneth wrote:
I dread the day the Templis turn their attention to Achura.

You wouldn't stand alone, if and when their fear leads them to you and yours.

"At the end of it all, we have only what we've left in our wake to be remembered by." -Kyoko Ishikari, YC 95 - YC 117

Ashlar Vellum
Esquire Armaments
#31 - 2017-03-01 19:43:44 UTC
Aria Jenneth wrote:
I've got kind of a theory that the Templis Dragonaurs are to the Caldari what the Sani Sabik are to the Amarr: an aberration, a distortion, but one that emerges organically out of the cultural traits of its host civilization, and will re-emerge from those same traits even if annihilated completely in any given generation. Maybe the Templis and Sani speak to something in the human animal that their host civilizations either suppress or fail to fully satisfy-- the will to power, or the desire to protect only one's (narrowly-construed) own.

It's a pity they're both so completely toxic.

It's more akin with the purist movement in the Empire than sani sabik cults. Also word sani doesn't have a bad connotation per se in amarr it literally means - blood, nothing more. Furthermore sani sabik cults are gaining popularity for quite a while now in the Republic that has nothing to do with it "host" civilization.
Casserina Leshrac
Sanguine Illuminations
#32 - 2017-03-01 19:48:59 UTC
Ashlar Vellum wrote:
Aria Jenneth wrote:
I've got kind of a theory that the Templis Dragonaurs are to the Caldari what the Sani Sabik are to the Amarr: an aberration, a distortion, but one that emerges organically out of the cultural traits of its host civilization, and will re-emerge from those same traits even if annihilated completely in any given generation. Maybe the Templis and Sani speak to something in the human animal that their host civilizations either suppress or fail to fully satisfy-- the will to power, or the desire to protect only one's (narrowly-construed) own.

It's a pity they're both so completely toxic.

It's more akin with the purist movement in the Empire than sani sabik cults. Also word sani doesn't have a bad connotation per se in amarr it literally means - blood, nothing more. Furthermore sani sabik cults are gaining popularity for quite a while now in the Republic that has nothing to do with it "host" civilization.


I would add that several Gallente cults have sprung up further distilling from the source of the Faith.

However, seeing the propensity of the Gallente for embracing fads these cults are little more than cliques of debauched and debased individuals.

However I have noted, a few Gallente who are willing to embrace not just Sani Sabik practices but the words from the Apophryca as well. These do bear watching.

We stand at the Abyss, drawing the Patterns of Fate - Casserina Leshrac, Savant, Sani Sabik.

Aria Jenneth
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#33 - 2017-03-01 19:51:13 UTC
Ashlar Vellum wrote:
Aria Jenneth wrote:
I've got kind of a theory that the Templis Dragonaurs are to the Caldari what the Sani Sabik are to the Amarr: an aberration, a distortion, but one that emerges organically out of the cultural traits of its host civilization, and will re-emerge from those same traits even if annihilated completely in any given generation. Maybe the Templis and Sani speak to something in the human animal that their host civilizations either suppress or fail to fully satisfy-- the will to power, or the desire to protect only one's (narrowly-construed) own.

It's a pity they're both so completely toxic.

It's more akin with the purist movement in the Empire than sani sabik cults. Also word sani doesn't have a bad connotation per se in amarr it literally means - blood, nothing more. Furthermore sani sabik cults are gaining popularity for quite a while now in the Republic that has nothing to do with it "host" civilization.


With great respect, my lord, and recognizing that I'm largely responsible for raising these tangents, maybe we should avoid derailing this topic further?

My tendency to pattern-match and theorize doesn't actually have a whole lot to do with Ishukone getting yelled at by Lai Dai. I'd love to talk about this some more, though.
Ashlar Vellum
Esquire Armaments
#34 - 2017-03-01 20:27:21 UTC
You are right, sani sabik discussion has nothing to do with the OP and all those comments made during CEP session.
Elmund Egivand
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#35 - 2017-03-02 01:56:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Elmund Egivand
Korsavius wrote:
Huh, I thought you rotted away like the rest of Heth's legacy. Funny how the cockroaches come crawling out at the scent of troubled waters.


Such is the way of the Fascist. Alone, and without popular support, they hide their views under a veil of common decency. Suddenly, when they smell a whiff of popular support, feel the change in the winds of popular sentiments and see the inklings of not being alone, they cast off the veil and start advocating extreme actions to shape the world to match their extreme ideals. Once they get into power, they will do everything to hold onto that power, even if it means exterminating every single person who holds a different view. Strip them of their power and they will run, hide, put on another mask and play the blame game or play pretend instead of taking responsibility for their actions.

The worst part? It's just too easy for the Fascist to get into power since they typically appeal to the 'common man', especially when society is gripped in fear and anxiety. At least eventually, the society will finally regain their senses and oust the Fascist, but society will always be the one to shoulder the damage the Fascist has inflicted during his death throes.

A Minmatar warship is like a rusting Beetle with 500 horsepower Cardillac engines in the rear, armour plating bolted to chassis and a M2 Browning stuck on top.

Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#36 - 2017-03-02 03:39:21 UTC
Don't suggest that the Patriot bloc is the same as the Provist bloc. You'll find some Provist sentiment amongst us, but we're not all willing to throw any State citizen who doesn't agree with our politics under the bus. Neither is it the case that we cannot work with other political blocs in the best interests of the State as a whole.

I currently work under I-Red, but I am NOT a Liberal. Neither am I entirely unsympathetic to the thought that that State corporations ought to be focused on assisting the State population, at this time.

Sadly, the time for that is over. Kyonoke is out in the wild, now, and it will take the hard work and resources of the whole Cluster to defeat it. Once again the Caldari system works. Lai Dai speaks for the need to address our own problems and Ishukone reminds us that we also need to maintain links to the other nations at times like this.

They are both right and now each approach has the resources of a megacorporation dedicated to following it. I look forward to seeing which approach bears the most fruit.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.

Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#37 - 2017-03-02 04:39:34 UTC
Reppola is a damn traitor and gallente bootlicker. He should be executed for his actions, there should be no place in the State for such coward feddie-lovers.

It is disgusting to see how such disgrace is still allowed to lead a corporation. For shame.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.

Sterling Blades
Windstalker Security Corp
United Neopian Federation
#38 - 2017-03-02 06:56:19 UTC
Diana Kim wrote:
Reppola is a damn traitor and gallente bootlicker. He should be executed for his actions, there should be no place in the State for such coward feddie-lovers.

It is disgusting to see how such disgrace is still allowed to lead a corporation. For shame.


You're all heart Ms. Kim.

As admirable as your unwaveringly zealous loyalty to the Caldari State is, I believe your scathing remarks are misplaced at present. This has spread far beyond simply being an issue of your state, and is a problem for all of the empires. If it somehow manages to spread further, then I believe some level of temperance of your devotion to the state alone might be in order.

As it stands from an outsider's perspective, I don't see any traitorous rhetoric against the Caldari people from Mr. Reppola's words.

The gods are out there. They watch us. They guide, they manipulate. We rally behind the ones we adore, and rain fire against those who rally behind the ones we hate. The question now is, to whom does your allegiance fall behind, dear Empyreans?

Makoto Priano
Kirkinen-Arataka Transhuman Zenith Consulting Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#39 - 2017-03-02 12:56:37 UTC
Mr. Blades, it's best just to ignore her.

Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries: exploring the edge of the known, advancing the state of the art. Would you like to know more?

Diana Kim
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#40 - 2017-03-02 14:35:22 UTC
Sterling Blades wrote:
Diana Kim wrote:
Reppola is a damn traitor and gallente bootlicker. He should be executed for his actions, there should be no place in the State for such coward feddie-lovers.

It is disgusting to see how such disgrace is still allowed to lead a corporation. For shame.


You're all heart Ms. Kim.

As admirable as your unwaveringly zealous loyalty to the Caldari State is, I believe your scathing remarks are misplaced at present. This has spread far beyond simply being an issue of your state, and is a problem for all of the empires. If it somehow manages to spread further, then I believe some level of temperance of your devotion to the state alone might be in order.

As it stands from an outsider's perspective, I don't see any traitorous rhetoric against the Caldari people from Mr. Reppola's words.

The State is at WAR. Collaboration with the enemy is treason.

Honored are the dead, for their legacy guides us.

In memory of Tibus Heth, Caldari State Executor YC110-115, Hero and Patriot.