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High Sec Ganking - CONCORD Balance request

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Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#601 - 2017-02-27 06:57:21 UTC
NightmareX wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
NightmareX wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
No. They won't thought. Take 10 random -10's and it is not clear at all they'll fleet up. They might, but the chances are it won't happen. If 10 -10's who are part of the same group show up, they will likely fleet up. But that is an entirely different issue.

There is no evidence that ganking is endemic, let alone an epidemic.

You still get my point, even though you wont admit it that is way to easy to just keep ganking times after times when you have the ships ready in station. And my idea has to go towards each single players anyways. If you do a crime alone or if you do it with 120 others, it doesn't matter. You should get pusnished harder and harder for each players who commit crimes the more ganks or crimes you / they do. That's all that matters. Yes, what you do and what the consequences should be from that is what i'm talking about and nothing more.


Easy?

No, I don't agree because alot of work goes into ganking. There is a reason why Goons, et. al.decided to do another Burn Jita event weeks ago. They needed that time to pre-position assets to make Burn Jita feasible. Weeks.

You keep saying, "It is easy." And then offer a stupid "They just re-ship." Just so story. Well how did those ships get there? How did the modules and ammo get there? What about comms, FCs, scouts, bumpers, etc.

I'd call you a liar, but I think you are just simply totally clueless.

Again, logistics has nothing to do with what you do with the ships AFTER you have got them. How hard is this to understand?

I'm talking about the consequences you should face AFTER you have committed a crime / gank with your ships.

Yes, once you have started your ganking event or something, you will already have a butt load of them ready in station that you can just jump into and undock to gank another victim right away without getting any more consequences than the normal 15 minute Concord timer. Yey, such a hard task right there.

This is not hard to understand and you have to be incredible stupid to not understand that doing crimes out in space with a PVP fitted ship has nothing to do with the logistics behind getting a ship to a station.
Teckos Pech wrote:
Yada yada yada....what is your experience with ganking please?

I will tell you that when you can explain to me what a criminal is and how they should be treated.


Dummy you can't gank anyone if you don't have a ship to gank with....duurrrrr

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
NightmareX
Pandemic Horde High Sec Division
#602 - 2017-02-27 06:57:39 UTC  |  Edited by: NightmareX
Teckos Pech wrote:
According to zkillboard NightmareX has killed 4 freighters and 1 jump freighter. Two of the freighters we killed in LS and 2 in HS, the two HS kills appear to be war decs. And the JF kill was clearly a HS war dec.

So, pretty much no ganking experience at all. None.

Now that that is settled....

Have you heard about having alts?

Again, i'm not gonna explain you anything when you can't even explain what a criminal is and how they are supposed to be treated to me.

Here is a list of my current EVE / PVP videos:

1: Asteroid Madness

2: Clash of the Empires

3: Suddenly Spaceships fighting in Tama
NightmareX
Pandemic Horde High Sec Division
#603 - 2017-02-27 06:59:01 UTC
Teckos Pech wrote:
Dummy you can't gank anyone if you don't have a ship to gank with....duurrrrr

Didn't i say once you have a ship in station, then it's super easy to continue doing ganks?

Where do you get it from that i'm talking about doing something without a ship?

Need glasses or something so you can read what i'm writing to you, or?

Here is a list of my current EVE / PVP videos:

1: Asteroid Madness

2: Clash of the Empires

3: Suddenly Spaceships fighting in Tama
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#604 - 2017-02-27 06:59:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
NightmareX wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
NightmareX wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
No. They won't thought. Take 10 random -10's and it is not clear at all they'll fleet up. They might, but the chances are it won't happen. If 10 -10's who are part of the same group show up, they will likely fleet up. But that is an entirely different issue.

There is no evidence that ganking is endemic, let alone an epidemic.

You still get my point, even though you wont admit it that is way to easy to just keep ganking times after times when you have the ships ready in station. And my idea has to go towards each single players anyways. If you do a crime alone or if you do it with 120 others, it doesn't matter. You should get pusnished harder and harder for each players who commit crimes the more ganks or crimes you / they do. That's all that matters. Yes, what you do and what the consequences should be from that is what i'm talking about and nothing more.


Easy?

No, I don't agree because alot of work goes into ganking. There is a reason why Goons, et. al.decided to do another Burn Jita event weeks ago. They needed that time to pre-position assets to make Burn Jita feasible. Weeks.

You keep saying, "It is easy." And then offer a stupid "They just re-ship." Just so story. Well how did those ships get there? How did the modules and ammo get there? What about comms, FCs, scouts, bumpers, etc.

I'd call you a liar, but I think you are just simply totally clueless.

Again, logistics has nothing to do with what you do with the ships AFTER you have got them. How hard is this to understand?

I'm talking about the consequences you should face AFTER you have committed a crime / gank with your ships.

Yes, once you have started your ganking event or something, you will already have a butt load of them ready in station that you can just jump into and undock to gank another victim right away without getting any more consequences than the normal 15 minute Concord timer. Yey, such a hard task right there.

This is not hard to understand and you have to be incredible stupid to not understand that doing crimes out in space with a PVP fitted ship has nothing to do with the logistics behind getting a ship to a station.
You are aware that in the real world, which you keep referencing, the act of knowingly helping criminals with support or equipment is a crime.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#605 - 2017-02-27 07:01:08 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
NightmareX wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
NightmareX wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
No. They won't thought. Take 10 random -10's and it is not clear at all they'll fleet up. They might, but the chances are it won't happen. If 10 -10's who are part of the same group show up, they will likely fleet up. But that is an entirely different issue.

There is no evidence that ganking is endemic, let alone an epidemic.

You still get my point, even though you wont admit it that is way to easy to just keep ganking times after times when you have the ships ready in station. And my idea has to go towards each single players anyways. If you do a crime alone or if you do it with 120 others, it doesn't matter. You should get pusnished harder and harder for each players who commit crimes the more ganks or crimes you / they do. That's all that matters. Yes, what you do and what the consequences should be from that is what i'm talking about and nothing more.


Easy?

No, I don't agree because alot of work goes into ganking. There is a reason why Goons, et. al.decided to do another Burn Jita event weeks ago. They needed that time to pre-position assets to make Burn Jita feasible. Weeks.

You keep saying, "It is easy." And then offer a stupid "They just re-ship." Just so story. Well how did those ships get there? How did the modules and ammo get there? What about comms, FCs, scouts, bumpers, etc.

I'd call you a liar, but I think you are just simply totally clueless.

Again, logistics has nothing to do with what you do with the ships AFTER you have got them. How hard is this to understand?

I'm talking about the consequences you should face AFTER you have committed a crime / gank with your ships.

Yes, once you have started your ganking event or something, you will already have a butt load of them ready in station that you can just jump into and undock to gank another victim right away without getting any more consequences than the normal 15 minute Concord timer. Yey, such a hard task right there.

This is not hard to understand and you have to be incredible stupid to not understand that doing crimes out in space with a PVP fitted ship has nothing to do with the logistics behind getting a ship to a station.
You are aware that in the real world, which you keep referencing, that the act of knowingly helping criminals with support or equipment is a crime.


Not to mention that wars are won and lost based on logistics. But noooope, lets ignore all that because it does not fit with the narrative.

Totally dishonest nonsense.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
NightmareX
Pandemic Horde High Sec Division
#606 - 2017-02-27 07:01:33 UTC  |  Edited by: NightmareX
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
You are aware that in the real world, which you keep referencing, that the act of knowingly helping criminals with support or equipment is a crime.

Yes, but there is no way for Concord to find out that a Freighter pilot is going to deliver ships to a bunch of criminals. In real life you can figure that more easy out, because of investigators who will find things like this out.

Here is a list of my current EVE / PVP videos:

1: Asteroid Madness

2: Clash of the Empires

3: Suddenly Spaceships fighting in Tama
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#607 - 2017-02-27 07:01:53 UTC
NightmareX wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
According to zkillboard NightmareX has killed 4 freighters and 1 jump freighter. Two of the freighters we killed in LS and 2 in HS, the two HS kills appear to be war decs. And the JF kill was clearly a HS war dec.

So, pretty much no ganking experience at all. None.

Now that that is settled....

Have you heard about having alts?

Again, i'm not gonna explain you anything when you can't even explain what a criminal is and how they are supposed to be treated to me.


Well, post your ganking alts then so we can see. You keep asking for proof, now here is your chance to lead by example.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#608 - 2017-02-27 07:03:32 UTC
NightmareX wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
Dummy you can't gank anyone if you don't have a ship to gank with....duurrrrr

Didn't i say once you have a ship in station, then it's super easy to continue doing ganks?

Where do you get it from that i'm talking about doing something without a ship?

Need glasses or something so you can read what i'm writing to you, or?


But how did the ship get in station? Magic? No! Somebody had to go buy the ships, modules and ammo, move them to the staging system, most likely assemble them and fit them and then put them on contracts, possibly hundreds of them. Possibly hours of work...but you want to ignore all that because it does not fit with your narrative.

There is a word for that. That word is: dishonest.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
NightmareX
Pandemic Horde High Sec Division
#609 - 2017-02-27 07:03:51 UTC
Teckos Pech wrote:
Well, post your ganking alts then so we can see. You keep asking for proof, now here is your chance to lead by example.

Like i said earlier to you, i asked first. Deliver your proof of what a criminal is and how they are supposed to be treated.

Here is a list of my current EVE / PVP videos:

1: Asteroid Madness

2: Clash of the Empires

3: Suddenly Spaceships fighting in Tama
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#610 - 2017-02-27 07:04:20 UTC
NightmareX wrote:
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
You are aware that in the real world, which you keep referencing, that the act of knowingly helping criminals with support or equipment is a crime.

Yes, but there is no way for Concord to find out that a Freighter pilot is going to deliver ships to a bunch of criminals. In real life you can figure that more easy out, because of investigators who will find things like this out.



Uhhh no, you were the one to keep referencing the real world. The rest of us were fine sticking with in game references.

You made your bed, now lie in it. Roll

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Nat Silverguard
Aideron Robotics
Aideron Robotics.
#611 - 2017-02-27 07:05:22 UTC
NightmareX wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
Dummy you can't gank anyone if you don't have a ship to gank with....duurrrrr

Didn't i say once you have a ship in station, then it's super easy to continue doing ganks?

Where do you get it from that i'm talking about doing something without a ship?

Need glasses or something so you can read what i'm writing to you, or?


so what happens if the gankers don't have ships to use? suddenly your '15 min criminal timer' is not too long and irrelevant anymore, yes?

Just Add Water
NightmareX
Pandemic Horde High Sec Division
#612 - 2017-02-27 07:05:38 UTC
Teckos Pech wrote:
But how did the ship get in station? Magic? No! Somebody had to go buy the ships, modules and ammo, move them to the staging system, most likely assemble them and fit them and then put them on contracts, possibly hundreds of them. Possibly hours of work...but you want to ignore all that because it does not fit with your narrative.

There is a word for that. That word is: dishonest.

Like i said, no one cares about how it got into the station. We only cares about how it gets out of the station and what you do with it out in space.

There is a difference from getting something into a station to what you do with a ship after undocking it. Logic doesn't seems to be your strong points here, that's for sure.

Here is a list of my current EVE / PVP videos:

1: Asteroid Madness

2: Clash of the Empires

3: Suddenly Spaceships fighting in Tama
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#613 - 2017-02-27 07:06:16 UTC
NightmareX wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
Well, post your ganking alts then so we can see. You keep asking for proof, now here is your chance to lead by example.

Like i said earlier to you, i asked first. Deliver your proof of what a criminal is and how they are supposed to be treated.


Nope, this is a new claim.

Either post the name of your ganking alt(s) so we can see or we'll just assume this is another dishonest representation.

BTW, for the record I have claimed to only gank on this character. You can go check zkillboard too. You'll see all the freighter and JF killmails I'm on. I would bet 99.9% coincide with Burn events too. I have not had a chance to kill a freighter or JF in LS or NS.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Nat Silverguard
Aideron Robotics
Aideron Robotics.
#614 - 2017-02-27 07:07:40 UTC
NightmareX wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
Well, post your ganking alts then so we can see. You keep asking for proof, now here is your chance to lead by example.

Like i said earlier to you, i asked first. Deliver your proof of what a criminal is and how they are supposed to be treated.


nope, you still didn't justify that recurring ganks are bad and needs to be changed. you presented alot of false equivalencies and fallacies that won't convince anybody let alone CCP

Just Add Water
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#615 - 2017-02-27 07:07:59 UTC
NightmareX wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
But how did the ship get in station? Magic? No! Somebody had to go buy the ships, modules and ammo, move them to the staging system, most likely assemble them and fit them and then put them on contracts, possibly hundreds of them. Possibly hours of work...but you want to ignore all that because it does not fit with your narrative.

There is a word for that. That word is: dishonest.

Like i said, no one cares about how it got into the station. We only cares about how it gets out of the station and what you do with it out in space.

There is a difference from getting something into a station to what you do with a ship after undocking it. Logic doesn't seems to be your strong points here, that's for sure.


But that is a just simply a lie...which makes you a liar.

A ganker cannot simply reship if somebody did not spend the hours to get those ships to that station/citadel for the ganker to reship into.

One must precede the other. You keep wanting to skip this part, but I and others will keep bringing it up so that everyone can see how dishonest you are.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
NightmareX
Pandemic Horde High Sec Division
#616 - 2017-02-27 07:10:15 UTC  |  Edited by: NightmareX
Nat Silverguard wrote:
NightmareX wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
Dummy you can't gank anyone if you don't have a ship to gank with....duurrrrr

Didn't i say once you have a ship in station, then it's super easy to continue doing ganks?

Where do you get it from that i'm talking about doing something without a ship?

Need glasses or something so you can read what i'm writing to you, or?


so what happens if the gankers don't have ships to use? suddenly your '15 min criminal timer' is not too long and irrelevant anymore, yes?

Tell me what gankers that doesn't already have a billion ships ready before they start ganking peoples?

Because time is money for them and they doesn't have the time to sit there and re-fit a new ship everytime they lose a ship to Concord. So they will already have enough ships ready in station to be able to do ganking for weeks.

But again, this is not what the issue is about anyways, it's about what kind of consequences every criminals in EVE should face for doing crimes times after times independent of how many of few ships they have and independent of how much or little isk they have and independent of who they are and where they are. Once they commit a crime, then something will happen to the criminals that isn't harsh enough, specially if they just keep doing it.

That's what this is all about, so stop making lame excuses.

Here is a list of my current EVE / PVP videos:

1: Asteroid Madness

2: Clash of the Empires

3: Suddenly Spaceships fighting in Tama
NightmareX
Pandemic Horde High Sec Division
#617 - 2017-02-27 07:14:44 UTC  |  Edited by: NightmareX
Teckos Pech wrote:
NightmareX wrote:
Teckos Pech wrote:
But how did the ship get in station? Magic? No! Somebody had to go buy the ships, modules and ammo, move them to the staging system, most likely assemble them and fit them and then put them on contracts, possibly hundreds of them. Possibly hours of work...but you want to ignore all that because it does not fit with your narrative.

There is a word for that. That word is: dishonest.

Like i said, no one cares about how it got into the station. We only cares about how it gets out of the station and what you do with it out in space.

There is a difference from getting something into a station to what you do with a ship after undocking it. Logic doesn't seems to be your strong points here, that's for sure.


But that is a just simply a lie...which makes you a liar.

A ganker cannot simply reship if somebody did not spend the hours to get those ships to that station/citadel for the ganker to reship into.

One must precede the other. You keep wanting to skip this part, but I and others will keep bringing it up so that everyone can see how dishonest you are.

Keep to the point of what kind of consequences a criminal should face once they commit a crime or just leave this topic with your lame trolling.

It doesn't help what kind of excuses you use when the whole point is that when the criminals DOES have a ship in station and then undocks and then ganks someone that is what this is all about. Not anything before that. Only what the criminal player does after they have undocked a ship no matter how rarely they would be able to get a ship or not.

If they can get 1 million Destroyers into the station or if they only can do one gank before they are out of ships doesn't matter as it's the act of criminal acts after you have undocked a ship that is what i'm talking about.

Keep to that or simply just stop making troll posts.

Here is a list of my current EVE / PVP videos:

1: Asteroid Madness

2: Clash of the Empires

3: Suddenly Spaceships fighting in Tama
Nat Silverguard
Aideron Robotics
Aideron Robotics.
#618 - 2017-02-27 07:19:29 UTC
NightmareX wrote:

But again, this is not what the issue is about anyways, it's about what kind of consequences every criminals in EVE should face for doing crimes times after times independent of how many of few ships they have and independent of how much or little isk they have and independent of who they are and where they are. Once they commit a crime, then something will happen to the criminals that isn't harsh enough, specially if they just keep doing it.

That's what this is all about, so stop making lame excuses.


so again, for the nth time, what are those consequences and it's veracity to warrant this change.

Just Add Water
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#619 - 2017-02-27 07:20:46 UTC
NightmareX

Define Criminal.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
NightmareX
Pandemic Horde High Sec Division
#620 - 2017-02-27 07:21:37 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
NightmareX

Define Criminal.

Maybe you should do it as you seems to think you know this better than me, so teach me.

Here is a list of my current EVE / PVP videos:

1: Asteroid Madness

2: Clash of the Empires

3: Suddenly Spaceships fighting in Tama