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PSA: Relic/Data Sites not being completed, Junk cans

Author
Chopper Rollins
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#21 - 2016-12-03 09:56:43 UTC
Regarding cherrypicking: i've been doing every site i find in a constellation just to get others to spawn and i'm wondering if these cargo scanners used by cherrypickers are very accurate.
I've come across a few that have definitely been cherry-picked ( i know because i watched them do it while i was cloaked) and after killing the poor schmuck i hacked the cans left over just because.
A few times i've scored faction pos mods and yummy things.
Are can-scanners 100% accurate?



Goggles. Making me look good. Making you look good.

Tipa Riot
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#22 - 2016-12-03 14:35:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Tipa Riot
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Tipa Riot wrote:
I appreciate CCP Karkur's work but this comment is totally out of place and seeing a dev to express like a whiny carebear makes me angry, especially if the person in question has the actual power to just change it!

Stop complaining and insulting players, make the cans immune to cargo scanners, fixed.

I don't read anything serious into her post.

She's always teasing (usually Doomchinchilla), having a joke or posting small bits from out of work.

Knowing her post history, I don't think it was a serious whine.

Maybe, but there was no mark (smiley, whatever) to indicate a pure troll post. Calling people using legal game mechanics psychopaths is not that funny ...

I'm my own NPC alt.

SurrenderMonkey
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#23 - 2016-12-03 16:50:25 UTC
Tipa Riot wrote:
Scipio Artelius wrote:
Tipa Riot wrote:
I appreciate CCP Karkur's work but this comment is totally out of place and seeing a dev to express like a whiny carebear makes me angry, especially if the person in question has the actual power to just change it!

Stop complaining and insulting players, make the cans immune to cargo scanners, fixed.

I don't read anything serious into her post.

She's always teasing (usually Doomchinchilla), having a joke or posting small bits from out of work.

Knowing her post history, I don't think it was a serious whine.

Maybe, but there was no mark (smiley, whatever) to indicate a pure troll post. Calling people using legal game mechanics psychopaths is not that funny ...


I bet you're fun at parties.

"Help, I'm bored with missions!"

http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/

Satchel Darkmatter
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#24 - 2016-12-03 23:33:05 UTC
Scanning a can with a cargo scanner should just trigger a timer and if the can is left over the timer duration it pops, sites would then automatically clean themselves up when players clean out the good loot.

Nice simple solution.
Graabeerd Khagah
MoonFyre BattleGroup Holdings
#25 - 2016-12-04 00:57:58 UTC
Hello again everyone,first of all thank you for being civil in this matter and keeping the discussion going. Secondly, this morning I caught the last ten minutes of the Talking in Station show with Matterall and this was mentioned that the situation has turned for the worse. Due to the fact that the thought was that the Alpha Clones were responsible for this situation. But, I don't know if this particular is true or not so I can't say

The question was asked if anybody ever found any sites in the last few days and many including myself responded with no, none, zilch. I am going to ask those of the WH community have you noticed any similar sites as well.

I am not going to sit here and accuse anyone of wrong doing, but seriously this is becoming an issue that needs to be looked at closer. I will ask that CCP Karkur to offer her ideas and thoughts as well to weigh in on the matter, and as for you the rest maybe offer other ideas as well.

Have a great weekend btw, but I will be checking this thread for any updates. 07.
Moac Tor
Cyber Core
Immediate Destruction
#26 - 2016-12-04 01:08:24 UTC
Gadget Helmsdottir wrote:
Nalia White wrote:
i always asked myself why ccp made it possible to scan the content of cans. if they would dissalow it this wouldn't be a problem and the sense of wonder for explorers would be even bigger :)


Agreed.

--Gadget

Actually, it makes the hacking game much more interesting when you know there is a couple 100 mil + in a can.

There are plenty of good reasons for taking the good loot and leaving all the junk cans.

And why would an explorer be interested in making more sites spawn for their competition, therefore devaluing the loot rewards. People forget that this is still a PvP game even when doing PvE activities.

This just sounds like QQ from people that choose to not adapt and fit a cargo scanner to their exploration setups.
Gadget Helmsdottir
Gadget's Workshop
#27 - 2016-12-04 08:56:05 UTC
Moac Tor wrote:
Gadget Helmsdottir wrote:
Nalia White wrote:
i always asked myself why ccp made it possible to scan the content of cans. if they would dissalow it this wouldn't be a problem and the sense of wonder for explorers would be even bigger :)


Agreed.

--Gadget

Actually, it makes the hacking game much more interesting when you know there is a couple 100 mil + in a can.

There are plenty of good reasons for taking the good loot and leaving all the junk cans.

And why would an explorer be interested in making more sites spawn for their competition, therefore devaluing the loot rewards. People forget that this is still a PvP game even when doing PvE activities.

This just sounds like QQ from people that choose to not adapt and fit a cargo scanner to their exploration setups.



Personally, I think it's more interesting when you don't know what's in each can.
It actually lends to sense of ... y'know... exploration.

I'm quite sure there are good reasons for taking the loot and leaving trash. They've already been posted...

The loot isn't getting devalued by cleaning up the site. They expire in an hour or so anyway.
As for the PVP... making the cans unscannable can only entice more PVP due to more time spent in a site.

Think there might be something wrong with your hearing. I only posted a single word...

--Gadget


Work smarter, not harder. --Scrooge McDuck, an eminent old-Earth economist

Given an hour to save New Eden, how would respected scientist, Albertus Eisenstein compose his thoughts? "Fifty-five minutes to define the problem; save the galaxy in five."

Geronimo McVain
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2016-12-04 10:26:41 UTC
Just make the cans unscannable and it solves the problem.
Violet Hurst
Fedaya Recon
#29 - 2016-12-04 10:56:23 UTC
I'd like to add that cherrypicking or even deliberately leaving sites unfinished is in my opinion a legit way of gaining an advantage over other explorers in the same chain as you. If you're lucky you might be able to make the other guy scan down an additional signature and do an additional warp.
When we're talking about exploration fit ships, this might be one of the few advantages the racial covops frigates have over the Astero: They scan and warp faster. Given the Astero's superiority over covops frigates in pretty much every other aspect, I don't think it needs a buff.
Infrequent
Tidal Lock
Vapor-Lock
#30 - 2016-12-04 14:44:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Infrequent
Moac Tor wrote:
Gadget Helmsdottir wrote:
Nalia White wrote:
i always asked myself why ccp made it possible to scan the content of cans. if they would dissalow it this wouldn't be a problem and the sense of wonder for explorers would be even bigger :)


Agreed.

--Gadget

Actually, it makes the hacking game much more interesting when you know there is a couple 100 mil + in a can.

There are plenty of good reasons for taking the good loot and leaving all the junk cans.

And why would an explorer be interested in making more sites spawn for their competition, therefore devaluing the loot rewards. People forget that this is still a PvP game even when doing PvE activities.

This just sounds like QQ from people that choose to not adapt and fit a cargo scanner to their exploration setups.


Because if you have all of the explorers 'adapt' then suddenly you have constellations full of unfinished sites with fresh ones spawning hourly instead of every few minutes. If you're doing your exploration in a constellation that forces you to adapt a pseudo 'PvP' tactic into your PvE because there's so many explorers that you MUST compete, then you're doing exploration wrong, your choice of constellation is poor and you should perhaps take the risk and go to less saturated, more dangerous space, there's more than enough space in this game that is unused because people stick to their safe space instead of taking that risk.
Graabeerd Khagah
MoonFyre BattleGroup Holdings
#31 - 2016-12-04 18:10:32 UTC
Again, thank you everyone for your valued inputs, opinions and thoughts. Here is another thought I had last night just for the sake of civil discussion related. The use of cargo scanners I believe should be left alone, meaning that I have no objections to it's use. I use one all the time and still clear the sites as is to respawn a new site.

My thinking that yes, it is possible that by leaving a partially completed site can produce an amount of pvp, but would defeat the purpose of exploration to a degree. I think that because explorers are a hearty lot bent on finding hidden treasures and then losing their finds so the aggressor reaps the benefits really discourages explorers.

On the other hand however I am wondering if Alphas are abusing the use of cargo scanners so that if another explorer goes only to find an incomplete site and someone else is sitting there cloaked and engage in hopes of getting the drops after podding, is it really fair for all parties involved?

I am of the opinion that this is justifiable, meaning risk and reward. We take risks in explorations in hopes of getting rewarded for the efforts put out in hoping to cash in and maybe come out ahead with a 100mil haul, maybe. Some comments about the Dronelands again I believe we should throw that into the mix as well even tho I never been there yet myself.

I don't know if we could come to a solution to this but I like to know more before I offer any solutions, or even petition a change to a small degree in the use of cargo scanners by restricting it's use to only Omegas, your thoughts ideas?
Graabeerd Khagah
MoonFyre BattleGroup Holdings
#32 - 2016-12-04 18:15:54 UTC
Chopper Rollins wrote:
Regarding cherrypicking: i've been doing every site i find in a constellation just to get others to spawn and i'm wondering if these cargo scanners used by cherrypickers are very accurate.
I've come across a few that have definitely been cherry-picked ( i know because i watched them do it while i was cloaked) and after killing the poor schmuck i hacked the cans left over just because.
A few times i've scored faction pos mods and yummy things.
Are can-scanners 100% accurate?





I would think it would be?
Moac Tor
Cyber Core
Immediate Destruction
#33 - 2016-12-04 18:38:53 UTC
Infrequent wrote:
Because if you have all of the explorers 'adapt' then suddenly you have constellations full of unfinished sites with fresh ones spawning hourly instead of every few minutes.

So?...

I have not seen a good reason as to why this is a problem. You need to understand supply and demand. Lack of sites simply means the value of sites and the loot contained within them increases.

Taking your flawed logic to the extreme I could suggest that all sites instantly re spawn in the same system so that special snowflakes don't have to compete and have an unlimited supply of sites they can continuously farm.
Moac Tor
Cyber Core
Immediate Destruction
#34 - 2016-12-04 18:40:32 UTC
Graabeerd Khagah wrote:
Chopper Rollins wrote:
Regarding cherrypicking: i've been doing every site i find in a constellation just to get others to spawn and i'm wondering if these cargo scanners used by cherrypickers are very accurate.
I've come across a few that have definitely been cherry-picked ( i know because i watched them do it while i was cloaked) and after killing the poor schmuck i hacked the cans left over just because.
A few times i've scored faction pos mods and yummy things.
Are can-scanners 100% accurate?





I would think it would be?

Cargo scanners are 100% accurate.
Graabeerd Khagah
MoonFyre BattleGroup Holdings
#35 - 2016-12-05 20:19:31 UTC
Once again, I want to reach out to each and everyone of you for being a part of this discussion! I will consolidate the main points and then write up a summary to close this out. Again, my thanks to all of you and I will see you in space! 07
Aston Martin DB5
Deaths Consortium
Pandemic Horde
#36 - 2016-12-05 21:34:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Aston Martin DB5
Spawn rates for relic and data sites are broken and how they despawn.
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