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Make The Fitting Requirements for Cynos the Same as Combat Probes
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Brigadine Ferathine
Presumed Dead Enterprises
Against ALL Authorities.
#1 - 2016-11-27 23:57:45 UTC
Why does CCP make it so any ship with more fitting capacity than a shuttle can fit a cyno, but expanded combat probe launcher(required for combat probes) is VERY hard to fit on a fully fitted ship due to MASSIVE CPU requirement?

No fully fitted BS should be able to hot drop If the same ship cant launch combat probes due to high CPU requirements. Cyno Timers aren't enough anymore. Fights that don't involve Cynos are super super rare and it needs to stop.

Hotdropping is too mainstream now. I have had many 1v1 fights ruined because of it. Enough is enough. Make the hot droppers life equally hard as those that probe.

The balance between hotdropping and combat probing is SUPER off in favor of hot dropping. Fix it. Make it equal at least.
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#2 - 2016-11-28 03:09:40 UTC
Or restrict them to force recons only.

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

Aura sound-clips: Aura forever
Brigadine Ferathine
Presumed Dead Enterprises
Against ALL Authorities.
#3 - 2016-11-28 03:14:44 UTC
elitatwo wrote:
Or restrict them to force recons only.

hmmm maybe. Could be a little harsh. But the right idea.
Brigadine Ferathine
Presumed Dead Enterprises
Against ALL Authorities.
#4 - 2016-11-29 05:37:18 UTC
elitatwo wrote:
Or restrict them to force recons only.

I thought about this some more and perhaps limit it to Force recons, Mauraders, Carriers, Dreads, all caps, assault frigates and logi crusiers.
Lienzo
Amanuensis
#5 - 2016-11-29 06:36:38 UTC
I think it would be cool if we had different size cynos with different mass limits. Is it really better if only capital ships have access to cynos? I think it would be awesome if freighters had a high slot and could play the role of being bait. Maybe CODE. could be lured to lowsec. huehuehue. Of course, we'd have to fix that wee little problem of not having enough PG or CPU. I could be running a complex or something and respond to a player generated "escalation." That would keep me logged in lots.

Titan pilots, harken to me. Cast off your bonds as bridge slaves! You are not municipal traffic workers. You could be bait, with fleets of caps and subcaps at your beck and call. Well, ok, one fleet, plus reinforcements as they trickle into the fold. Also, no other supers. Minor detail.

There are a couple of "concerns" concomitant to all that, but I'll graciously yield the floor for you tell me all about it.
Lugh Crow-Slave
#6 - 2016-11-29 07:13:33 UTC
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Why does CCP make it so any ship with more fitting capacity than a shuttle can fit a cyno



because this way even two week old players can have a HUGE impact on the battle field

BLOPS Hauler
The 16.8km Bubble
Brigadine Ferathine
Presumed Dead Enterprises
Against ALL Authorities.
#7 - 2016-11-29 07:49:52 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Why does CCP make it so any ship with more fitting capacity than a shuttle can fit a cyno



because this way even two week old players can have a HUGE impact on the battle field

And that is why it must change.
Iain Cariaba
#8 - 2016-11-29 08:34:04 UTC
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Why does CCP make it so any ship with more fitting capacity than a shuttle can fit a cyno



because this way even two week old players can have a HUGE impact on the battle field

And that is why it must change.

No, that is precisely why it should not change. It is one of the few ways a two week old player can impact a fleet, and this is a good thing.
Brigadine Ferathine
Presumed Dead Enterprises
Against ALL Authorities.
#9 - 2016-11-29 09:40:54 UTC
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Why does CCP make it so any ship with more fitting capacity than a shuttle can fit a cyno



because this way even two week old players can have a HUGE impact on the battle field

And that is why it must change.

No, that is precisely why it should not change. It is one of the few ways a two week old player can impact a fleet, and this is a good thing.

Too much impact. Sorry not sorry. Besides, I said a frigate class or two would be able to use it. maybe 20 day train tops?
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
#10 - 2016-11-29 12:31:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Robert Caldera
its not the cyno which kills.. its the fleet behind.
Cyno is just a way to bypass the cheapest intel tool named local chat. There has to be a way, because otherwise, well, nice kills wouldnt happen.
Elenahina
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2016-11-29 14:23:11 UTC
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Why does CCP make it so any ship with more fitting capacity than a shuttle can fit a cyno, but expanded combat probe launcher(required for combat probes) is VERY hard to fit on a fully fitted ship due to MASSIVE CPU requirement?

Because. I mean that is literally the only reason - blah blah game balance. Whether you agree it's balanced or not, that is CCP's reasoning.

Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
No fully fitted BS should be able to hot drop If the same ship cant launch combat probes due to high CPU requirements.
Why not? You're really not providing much in the way of reasons. You're mostly just venting about why it upsets you.

Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Fights that don't involve Cynos are super super rare and it needs to stop.

[citation needed] I can tell you for a fact that this is bullshit. We get fights on a regular basis that don't get hotdropped. Maybe you're poking the wrong bear. Some groups are going to hotdrop just because they can - PL, Sex and Coke Party off the top of my head. They'll drop titans on cruiser gangs just for the lulz. No amount of twiddling with cyno requirements is going to change that.

Brigadine Ferathine wrote:

Hotdropping is too mainstream now. I have had many 1v1 fights ruined because of it. Enough is enough. Make the hot droppers life equally hard as those that probe.

The balance between hotdropping and combat probing is SUPER off in favor of hot dropping. Fix it. Make it equal at least.


If you're accepting a 1v1 fight, you're going in with the knowledge that the other guy is probably not going to honor it. It's just the way Eve is - there's no reason to honor a duel. Agony has a rule about honoring 1v1's - if you don't, you get kicked from the corp. I have never offered nor accepted one for precisely the reasons your dancing around the edges of - very very few people honor them. That's not a problem with cynos, it's a problem with people.

And why the comparison to probing? The two are fundamentally different mechanics. Why should we accept probing as the baseline for cyno requirements?

Eve is like an addiction; you can't quit it until it quits you. Also, iderno
Cade Windstalker
#12 - 2016-11-29 14:39:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Cade Windstalker
Combat probes are in no way equivalent to a cyno. Combat probes are, generally speaking, only fitted to specialized ships for one. They're also extremely low risk when in use and very high reward, so giving them restricting fittings is a way of introducing a weakness to an otherwise fairly low risk and high utility module.

Cynos, in contrast, cost fuel, keep the ship in space for 10 minutes which almost guarantees its destruction, and require you to risk every ship that comes through that cyno.

Lastly, and probably most importantly, putting restrictive fittings on cynos isn't going to prevent their use, it's just going to restrict further what ships people use as bait, since those who want to run cynos are going to be inclined to do so regardless.

If you are currently having issues identifying ships equipped with a cyno may I recommend fitting a ship or cargo scanner to determine what your target is fitted with before engaging? Those modules have a lower fitting cost than a cyno and therefore should be fairly easy for you to bring along, right?
Iain Cariaba
#13 - 2016-11-29 19:41:11 UTC
Cade Windstalker wrote:
Combat probes are in no way equivalent to a cyno. Combat probes are, generally speaking, only fitted to specialized ships for one. They're also extremely low risk when in use and very high reward, so giving them restricting fittings is a way of introducing a weakness to an otherwise fairly low risk and high utility module.

Cynos, in contrast, cost fuel, keep the ship in space for 10 minutes which almost guarantees its destruction, and require you to risk every ship that comes through that cyno.

Lastly, and probably most importantly, putting restrictive fittings on cynos isn't going to prevent their use, it's just going to restrict further what ships people use as bait, since those who want to run cynos are going to be included to do so regardless.

If you are currently having issues identifying ships equipped with a cyno may I recommend fitting a ship or cargo scanner to determine what your target is fitted with before engaging? Those modules have a lower fitting cost than a cyno and therefore should be fairly easy for you to bring along, right?

But, but, but.... :EFFORT:!!!!!!1!!!!!11!!ONE1!

Why should OP make the effort when it's far easier for him to whine to CCP in an attempt to have the game changed to his liking?
PopeUrban
El Expedicion
Flames of Exile
#14 - 2016-11-29 22:11:01 UTC
Another "CYNOS RUIN MY HONORABLE DUELS" post?

Look, buddy, The only difference between the fleet that hotdropped you and the fleet that gatecamped you is that in one of these cases you had to take the bait.

Stop taking the bait.
Brigadine Ferathine
Presumed Dead Enterprises
Against ALL Authorities.
#15 - 2016-11-30 00:06:23 UTC
PopeUrban wrote:
Another "CYNOS RUIN MY HONORABLE DUELS" post?

Look, buddy, The only difference between the fleet that hotdropped you and the fleet that gatecamped you is that in one of these cases you had to take the bait.

Stop taking the bait.

Man then no PvP would ever happen.
Iain Cariaba
#16 - 2016-11-30 02:14:22 UTC
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
PopeUrban wrote:
Another "CYNOS RUIN MY HONORABLE DUELS" post?

Look, buddy, The only difference between the fleet that hotdropped you and the fleet that gatecamped you is that in one of these cases you had to take the bait.

Stop taking the bait.

Man then no PvP would ever happen.

Then don't whine when you fall for the bait.
Brigadine Ferathine
Presumed Dead Enterprises
Against ALL Authorities.
#17 - 2016-11-30 02:52:02 UTC
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
PopeUrban wrote:
Another "CYNOS RUIN MY HONORABLE DUELS" post?

Look, buddy, The only difference between the fleet that hotdropped you and the fleet that gatecamped you is that in one of these cases you had to take the bait.

Stop taking the bait.

Man then no PvP would ever happen.

Then don't whine when you fall for the bait.

How do you tell what is bait and what isn't?
Tabyll Altol
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#18 - 2016-11-30 10:32:00 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Why does CCP make it so any ship with more fitting capacity than a shuttle can fit a cyno



because this way even two week old players can have a HUGE impact on the battle field


No the only make the impact possible. The impact is no way of the 2 weeks old player its the capital force that chills at the fortizar/keepstar or in a pos which makes the difference.

But i got it you have super and want to drop stuff.

+1 for the idea
Tabyll Altol
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#19 - 2016-11-30 10:38:48 UTC
Robert Caldera wrote:
its not the cyno which kills.. its the fleet behind.
Cyno is just a way to bypass the cheapest intel tool named local chat. There has to be a way, because otherwise, well, nice kills wouldnt happen.


There are two ways to look at. Because of the cyno most titans will only be used when your sure you have the bigger super fleet. If the capablility of instant transfert of those ships would be limited the use of them would properly go up.

Same was the rise of the Lowsec Capitals after jump fattige hits.

still +1
Iain Cariaba
#20 - 2016-11-30 10:49:03 UTC
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
Iain Cariaba wrote:
Brigadine Ferathine wrote:
PopeUrban wrote:
Another "CYNOS RUIN MY HONORABLE DUELS" post?

Look, buddy, The only difference between the fleet that hotdropped you and the fleet that gatecamped you is that in one of these cases you had to take the bait.

Stop taking the bait.

Man then no PvP would ever happen.

Then don't whine when you fall for the bait.

How do you tell what is bait and what isn't?

It's all bait. Really, who cares if they drop titans on you and blap you off the field. You realize they probably spent more in fuel and ammo than your ship is worth?
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