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Crime & Punishment

 
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Empire Suicide Ganking 2016

First post
Author
Galaxy Duck
Galaxy Farm Carebear Repurposing
#41 - 2016-11-23 21:40:01 UTC
Orca Platypus wrote:
While ganking is cancer and indeed ruining eve, while it is being stupidly endorsed, buffed, overpowered and catered to, as if to kill eve faster, one insta-undock bookmark would've saved you in this case.

And never haul in T1 industrials, they are all ****, balanced just to be a ganker entertainment, like all barges, and now NPCs too.


lolololol
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#42 - 2016-11-23 22:17:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Orca Platypus wrote:
While ganking is cancer and indeed ruining eve, while it is being stupidly endorsed, buffed, overpowered and catered to as if to kill eve faster
I don't know what game you're describing, but it certainly isn't Eve. The only correct part is that it's endorsed, the rest is just bollocks.

Quote:
one insta-undock bookmark would've saved you in this case.
Given the value of what he was hauling and how his ship was fitted it would have died at the first gate patrolled by gankers anyway.

Quote:
And never haul in T1 industrials, they are all ****, balanced just to be a ganker entertainment, like all barges, and now NPCs too.
Utter horseshit, some of the T1 industrials can pack a fairly serious tank and/or align/warp like a cruiser; at least 2 of the haulers can do both at the same time.

What got the OP killed was not his choice of ship but the choices he made about the fit and the cargo.

TL;DR You don't know what you're talking about, :not shocked:

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack

Dark Lord Trump
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#43 - 2016-11-23 22:41:33 UTC
Orca Platypus wrote:
While ganking is cancer and indeed ruining eve, while it is being stupidly endorsed, buffed, overpowered and catered to, as if to kill eve faster, one insta-undock bookmark would've saved you in this case.

And never haul in T1 industrials, they are all ****, balanced just to be a ganker entertainment, like all barges, and now NPCs too.

Skiff can pack a monster tank, Procurer is so cheap for its tank it's hardly worth ganking anyway. The Nereus is sometimes used as an entosis boat because it can be super tanky.
I'd also like to see how ganking is killing eve. Personally I think that the people who leave EvE over being ganked are simply not meant for the game and would have either gotten bored missioning in hisec anyway or lost something to someone eventually and ragequit. I'm aware this probably can't be proven, but I've offered just as much evidence as you have.

I'm going to build a big wall that will keep the Gallente out, and they're going to pay for it!

Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#44 - 2016-11-23 22:51:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Dark Lord Trump wrote:
Skiff can pack a monster tank, Procurer is so cheap for its tank it's hardly worth ganking anyway. The Nereus is sometimes used as an entosis boat because it can be super tanky.
I'd also like to see how ganking is killing eve. Personally I think that the people who leave EvE over being ganked are simply not meant for the game and would have either gotten bored missioning in hisec anyway or lost something to someone eventually and ragequit. I'm aware this probably can't be proven, but I've offered just as much evidence as you have.
Hate to be a pedant, but the Skiff isn't a T1 ship, or a barge for that matter; it's a T2 exhumer. P

Other than that, pretty much all of the above.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack

Orca Platypus
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#45 - 2016-11-24 07:33:53 UTC
Dark Lord Trump wrote:
Skiff can pack a monster tank, Procurer is so cheap for its tank it's hardly worth ganking anyway. The Nereus is sometimes used as an entosis boat because it can be super tanky.

Skiff will mine like 1.5 ventures when "packing monster tank", which is so bad you're literally better off with Covetor being ganked because it will outmine the difference. Tanking barges only work in gankers delusions.
Since gank is essentially free, with meta fit catalysts being under 1mil, there is nothing in the game currently that isn't worth ganking, just gankers grown completely lazy and stupid with the abundance game design and buffs have thrown them onto.
Nereus in entosis boat fit has a whopping 3k m3 cargo hold. You can haul more in a Maller, which makes tank fit Nereus, much like all tank fit barges, useless.
Dark Lord Trump wrote:
I'd also like to see how ganking is killing eve. Personally I think that the people who leave EvE over being ganked are simply not meant for the game and would have either gotten bored missioning in hisec anyway or lost something to someone eventually and ragequit. I'm aware this probably can't be proven, but I've offered just as much evidence as you have.

It already did. The drop in subs was mostly from hisec where rampant griefing has bled subs to the point where 33% of eve quit. Or did you think it was null/low (who was getting new toys all the time) have been quitting? Even if you don't like Gevlon, his ratting graphs showed activity drops quite clearly. All hail nerf hisec campaign, one thing that gewn tears have saturated CCP enough to actually commit this atrocity. RIP eve.
Noragen Neirfallas
Emotional Net Loss
#46 - 2016-11-24 12:40:09 UTC
Orca Platypus wrote:
Dark Lord Trump wrote:
Skiff can pack a monster tank, Procurer is so cheap for its tank it's hardly worth ganking anyway. The Nereus is sometimes used as an entosis boat because it can be super tanky.

Skiff will mine like 1.5 ventures when "packing monster tank", which is so bad you're literally better off with Covetor being ganked because it will outmine the difference. Tanking barges only work in gankers delusions.
Since gank is essentially free, with meta fit catalysts being under 1mil, there is nothing in the game currently that isn't worth ganking, just gankers grown completely lazy and stupid with the abundance game design and buffs have thrown them onto.
Nereus in entosis boat fit has a whopping 3k m3 cargo hold. You can haul more in a Maller, which makes tank fit Nereus, much like all tank fit barges, useless.
Dark Lord Trump wrote:
I'd also like to see how ganking is killing eve. Personally I think that the people who leave EvE over being ganked are simply not meant for the game and would have either gotten bored missioning in hisec anyway or lost something to someone eventually and ragequit. I'm aware this probably can't be proven, but I've offered just as much evidence as you have.

It already did. The drop in subs was mostly from hisec where rampant griefing has bled subs to the point where 33% of eve quit. Or did you think it was null/low (who was getting new toys all the time) have been quitting? Even if you don't like Gevlon, his ratting graphs showed activity drops quite clearly. All hail nerf hisec campaign, one thing that gewn tears have saturated CCP enough to actually commit this atrocity. RIP eve.

Being so shocked by this revelation I went and attempted to validate your figures with fits so we could together go and rage against the machine. I need some help first. No matter how much I try I can not get a venture to mine at 66% of a skiff. I would like suggestions on how to acheive this

I'm going to make a few assumptions while I work through my findings
Assumption 1
You never need to cycle off to drop ore to station and always acheive 100% mining efficiency with yoru cycles
Assumption 2
You are mining veldspar and selling it in Jita on buy orders
Assumption 3
You purchased the fittings I constructed from Jita on sell orders
Assumption 4
All ships are omni tanked and I selected the Cal Navy antimatter as the ammo shooting them

Here are the figures I got to attempting to validate your claims
Venture 2.7k ehp, 10.4 m3/s(6mil isk per hour), 7.8mil isk,
Procurer 82k ehp, 20 m3/s(12mil isk per hour), 53mil isk
Skiff 120k ehp, 22 m3/s(13.5mil isk per hour), 247mil isk
Covetor 8.2k ehp, 30.3 m3/s(18mil isk per hour), 57.5mil isk
Code standard destroyer fit for solo ganking 448DPS, 4mil isk

Assumption 5
I'm going with 22 seconds for concord to respond (my personal experiance in .6 systems)
So each destroyer can deal 9856 damage before concord respond to stop it.

Venture = 1 Gank cata. Isk efficiency 3.8mil per cata
Procurer = 9 Gank cata. Isk efficiency 17mil/1.8mil per cata
Skiff = 13 Gank cata. Isk efficiency 195mil/15mil per cata
Covetor = 1 Gank cata. Isk efficiency 52.5mil per cata

To summerise you need 9 or 13 people to kill a proc/skiff and its still more efficient to gank a covetor. Ganking can be done once every 15 mins. I know what I would choose given the option

PS I've done more anti ganking(well to be fair we wern't trying to prevent ganks so much as enjoyed ******* with random people with kill rights flying catas and talos's) than most(defiently not all I lack dedication) people posting in these forums. But do us all a favour and post based on fact and not butt hurt. Thankyou

Member and Judge of the Court of Crime and Punishment

Noragens basically the Chribba of C&P - Zimmy Zeta

Confirming that we all play in Noragen's eve. - BeBopAReBop

ISD Buldath favorite ISD

'"****station games" - Sun Tzu' - Ralph King Griffin

Galaxy Duck
Galaxy Farm Carebear Repurposing
#47 - 2016-11-24 15:05:28 UTC
"Since ganking is essentially free..."

Lol wut?
Black Pedro
Mine.
#48 - 2016-11-24 19:10:46 UTC
Galaxy Duck wrote:
"Since ganking is essentially free..."

Lol wut?
You can ignore Basil there. He has some unconventional ideas like a Catalyst, and thus ganking, is "free" because certain career agents award them, and that docking up while in a war is an "exploit". For that matter, he also claims that wars themselves are harassment under the EULA but for some reason CCP lacks the courage to enforce that. Oh, and there is a SP wall of 50M skill points or so before which you are completely non-viable as a PvP pilot in this game.

I may misremember the details or the logic of his theories but if you ask nicely I am sure he will try to explain his views.
Noragen Neirfallas
Emotional Net Loss
#49 - 2016-11-24 19:36:39 UTC
Black Pedro wrote:
Galaxy Duck wrote:
"Since ganking is essentially free..."

Lol wut?
You can ignore Basil there. He has some unconventional ideas like a Catalyst, and thus ganking, is "free" because certain career agents award them, and that docking up while in a war is an "exploit". For that matter, he also claims that wars themselves are harassment under the EULA but for some reason CCP lacks the courage to enforce that. Oh, and there is a SP wall of 50M skill points or so before which you are completely non-viable as a PvP pilot in this game.

I may misremember the details or the logic of his theories but if you ask nicely I am sure he will try to explain his views.

Oh please explain the logic of these views basil

Member and Judge of the Court of Crime and Punishment

Noragens basically the Chribba of C&P - Zimmy Zeta

Confirming that we all play in Noragen's eve. - BeBopAReBop

ISD Buldath favorite ISD

'"****station games" - Sun Tzu' - Ralph King Griffin

Jagd Wilde
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#50 - 2016-11-24 21:10:51 UTC
Omen Talozan wrote:
It started as a lol.

It is getting very old quite fast.

It is now out of control.


Ive quit.

Thanks for 13 years.



I laughed without guilt, good-bye yet another anti ganking alt.

Every alt I own has a red safety, this has brought my friends much laughter.

Orca Platypus
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#51 - 2016-11-25 17:31:57 UTC
Noragen Neirfallas wrote:
Orca Platypus wrote:
Dark Lord Trump wrote:
Skiff can pack a monster tank, Procurer is so cheap for its tank it's hardly worth ganking anyway. The Nereus is sometimes used as an entosis boat because it can be super tanky.

Skiff will mine like 1.5 ventures when "packing monster tank", which is so bad you're literally better off with Covetor being ganked because it will outmine the difference. Tanking barges only work in gankers delusions.
Since gank is essentially free, with meta fit catalysts being under 1mil, there is nothing in the game currently that isn't worth ganking, just gankers grown completely lazy and stupid with the abundance game design and buffs have thrown them onto.
Nereus in entosis boat fit has a whopping 3k m3 cargo hold. You can haul more in a Maller, which makes tank fit Nereus, much like all tank fit barges, useless.
Dark Lord Trump wrote:
I'd also like to see how ganking is killing eve. Personally I think that the people who leave EvE over being ganked are simply not meant for the game and would have either gotten bored missioning in hisec anyway or lost something to someone eventually and ragequit. I'm aware this probably can't be proven, but I've offered just as much evidence as you have.

It already did. The drop in subs was mostly from hisec where rampant griefing has bled subs to the point where 33% of eve quit. Or did you think it was null/low (who was getting new toys all the time) have been quitting? Even if you don't like Gevlon, his ratting graphs showed activity drops quite clearly. All hail nerf hisec campaign, one thing that gewn tears have saturated CCP enough to actually commit this atrocity. RIP eve.

Being so shocked by this revelation I went and attempted to validate your figures with fits so we could together go and rage against the machine. I need some help first. No matter how much I try I can not get a venture to mine at 66% of a skiff. I would like suggestions on how to acheive this

I'm going to make a few assumptions while I work through my findings
Assumption 1
You never need to cycle off to drop ore to station and always acheive 100% mining efficiency with yoru cycles
Assumption 2
You are mining veldspar and selling it in Jita on buy orders
Assumption 3
You purchased the fittings I constructed from Jita on sell orders
Assumption 4
All ships are omni tanked and I selected the Cal Navy antimatter as the ammo shooting them

Here are the figures I got to attempting to validate your claims
Venture 2.7k ehp, 10.4 m3/s(6mil isk per hour), 7.8mil isk,
Procurer 82k ehp, 20 m3/s(12mil isk per hour), 53mil isk
Skiff 120k ehp, 22 m3/s(13.5mil isk per hour), 247mil isk
Covetor 8.2k ehp, 30.3 m3/s(18mil isk per hour), 57.5mil isk
Code standard destroyer fit for solo ganking 448DPS, 4mil isk

Assumption 5
I'm going with 22 seconds for concord to respond (my personal experiance in .6 systems)
So each destroyer can deal 9856 damage before concord respond to stop it.

Venture = 1 Gank cata. Isk efficiency 3.8mil per cata
Procurer = 9 Gank cata. Isk efficiency 17mil/1.8mil per cata
Skiff = 13 Gank cata. Isk efficiency 195mil/15mil per cata
Covetor = 1 Gank cata. Isk efficiency 52.5mil per cata

To summerise you need 9 or 13 people to kill a proc/skiff and its still more efficient to gank a covetor. Ganking can be done once every 15 mins. I know what I would choose given the option

PS I've done more anti ganking(well to be fair we wern't trying to prevent ganks so much as enjoyed ******* with random people with kill rights flying catas and talos's) than most(defiently not all I lack dedication) people posting in these forums. But do us all a favour and post based on fact and not butt hurt. Thankyou


I was away for quite some time and missed when CCP made yet another nerf to mining... well, they want to kill it, and I only saw the recent gutting of mining links and missed the barge rebalance, so I guess my figures were a bit outdated. Hell, I even thought Procurer was 6 million boat like it used to be, since that's the price I stocked up at last year.

That said, with corrected figures, my point still stands. It's very clear that all barges are sadistically balanced to be trivially gankable, so there's no tank difference, as the only defense miner has is gtfo, and the least exposure in the belt is the way to go. Any amount of tank can be countered by brainlessly adding more basically free catalysts, so whatever tank you bring, will just make special olympics team to bring more catalyst alts on you. It becomes a challenge of how much you can mine before special olympics team makes their lazy stupid move, and that's where Covetor/Hulk becomes the only viable choice, and full tank barges are as good as, ok, 2 ventures. And of course, goes without saying, in current game balance, no undocking with special olympics teams in local, because every barge is trivially gankable, and making it interesting for special olympics cancer team by undocking a barge which is one little notch less trivial to gank is counter-productive - you'll have to jumpclone away and resume in another location.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#52 - 2016-11-25 19:01:18 UTC
Orca Platypus wrote:
I was away for quite some time and missed when CCP made yet another nerf to mining... well, they want to kill it, and I only saw the recent gutting of mining links and missed the barge rebalance, so I guess my figures were a bit outdated. Hell, I even thought Procurer was 6 million boat like it used to be, since that's the price I stocked up at last year.

That said, with corrected figures, my point still stands. It's very clear that all barges are sadistically balanced to be trivially gankable, so there's no tank difference, as the only defense miner has is gtfo, and the least exposure in the belt is the way to go. Any amount of tank can be countered by brainlessly adding more basically free catalysts, so whatever tank you bring, will just make special olympics team to bring more catalyst alts on you. It becomes a challenge of how much you can mine before special olympics team makes their lazy stupid move, and that's where Covetor/Hulk becomes the only viable choice, and full tank barges are as good as, ok, 2 ventures. And of course, goes without saying, in current game balance, no undocking with special olympics teams in local, because every barge is trivially gankable, and making it interesting for special olympics cancer team by undocking a barge which is one little notch less trivial to gank is counter-productive - you'll have to jumpclone away and resume in another location.

You should be ashamed of yourself for attempting to use Special Olympics as an insult.

Now get out and crawl back to whatever hole you've been hiding in since you last left Eve.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack

Noragen Neirfallas
Emotional Net Loss
#53 - 2016-11-25 22:57:54 UTC
Orca Platypus wrote:
Noragen Neirfallas wrote:

Being so shocked by this revelation I went and attempted to validate your figures with fits so we could together go and rage against the machine. I need some help first. No matter how much I try I can not get a venture to mine at 66% of a skiff. I would like suggestions on how to acheive this

I'm going to make a few assumptions while I work through my findings
Assumption 1
You never need to cycle off to drop ore to station and always acheive 100% mining efficiency with yoru cycles
Assumption 2
You are mining veldspar and selling it in Jita on buy orders
Assumption 3
You purchased the fittings I constructed from Jita on sell orders
Assumption 4
All ships are omni tanked and I selected the Cal Navy antimatter as the ammo shooting them

Here are the figures I got to attempting to validate your claims
Venture 2.7k ehp, 10.4 m3/s(6mil isk per hour), 7.8mil isk,
Procurer 82k ehp, 20 m3/s(12mil isk per hour), 53mil isk
Skiff 120k ehp, 22 m3/s(13.5mil isk per hour), 247mil isk
Covetor 8.2k ehp, 30.3 m3/s(18mil isk per hour), 57.5mil isk
Code standard destroyer fit for solo ganking 448DPS, 4mil isk

Assumption 5
I'm going with 22 seconds for concord to respond (my personal experiance in .6 systems)
So each destroyer can deal 9856 damage before concord respond to stop it.

Venture = 1 Gank cata. Isk efficiency 3.8mil per cata
Procurer = 9 Gank cata. Isk efficiency 17mil/1.8mil per cata
Skiff = 13 Gank cata. Isk efficiency 195mil/15mil per cata
Covetor = 1 Gank cata. Isk efficiency 52.5mil per cata

To summerise you need 9 or 13 people to kill a proc/skiff and its still more efficient to gank a covetor. Ganking can be done once every 15 mins. I know what I would choose given the option

PS I've done more anti ganking(well to be fair we wern't trying to prevent ganks so much as enjoyed ******* with random people with kill rights flying catas and talos's) than most(defiently not all I lack dedication) people posting in these forums. But do us all a favour and post based on fact and not butt hurt. Thankyou


I was away for quite some time and missed when CCP made yet another nerf to mining... well, they want to kill it, and I only saw the recent gutting of mining links and missed the barge rebalance, so I guess my figures were a bit outdated. Hell, I even thought Procurer was 6 million boat like it used to be, since that's the price I stocked up at last year.

That said, with corrected figures, my point still stands. It's very clear that all barges are sadistically balanced to be trivially gankable, so there's no tank difference, as the only defense miner has is gtfo, and the least exposure in the belt is the way to go. Any amount of tank can be countered by brainlessly adding more basically free catalysts, so whatever tank you bring, will just make special olympics team to bring more catalyst alts on you. It becomes a challenge of how much you can mine before special olympics team makes their lazy stupid move, and that's where Covetor/Hulk becomes the only viable choice, and full tank barges are as good as, ok, 2 ventures. And of course, goes without saying, in current game balance, no undocking with special olympics teams in local, because every barge is trivially gankable, and making it interesting for special olympics cancer team by undocking a barge which is one little notch less trivial to gank is counter-productive - you'll have to jumpclone away and resume in another location.

Are you being serious right now? Are you aware you can gank a titan if you just add enough catalysts too it. Hell I can gank literally anything by adding enough. It becomes an issue of is it worth it when something else is eaiser/do I have the pilots online to pull it off.

Nov 25 2016 2220
Of the last 250 mining barges killed by Code. 8 were Procurers. Of those 8 only one tried to actually fit a buffer tank. The 1 that did was obviously very low in fitting skills and shield skills but it still took 6 to kill him in a 0.5 system.

I'm not the smartest guy around but if only 3.2% of the mining barges targeted are Procurers well... might be worth looking into if you do a bit of mining in lower security areas of highsec

Member and Judge of the Court of Crime and Punishment

Noragens basically the Chribba of C&P - Zimmy Zeta

Confirming that we all play in Noragen's eve. - BeBopAReBop

ISD Buldath favorite ISD

'"****station games" - Sun Tzu' - Ralph King Griffin

Morgan Agrivar
Doomheim
#54 - 2016-11-25 23:25:17 UTC
I ganked a Venture in an Atron once.

It was cool. Huh huh huh uh huh...
Galaxy Duck
Galaxy Farm Carebear Repurposing
#55 - 2016-11-26 18:03:50 UTC
Orca Platypus wrote:
Noragen Neirfallas wrote:
Orca Platypus wrote:
Dark Lord Trump wrote:
Skiff can pack a monster tank, Procurer is so cheap for its tank it's hardly worth ganking anyway. The Nereus is sometimes used as an entosis boat because it can be super tanky.

Skiff will mine like 1.5 ventures when "packing monster tank", which is so bad you're literally better off with Covetor being ganked because it will outmine the difference. Tanking barges only work in gankers delusions.
Since gank is essentially free, with meta fit catalysts being under 1mil, there is nothing in the game currently that isn't worth ganking, just gankers grown completely lazy and stupid with the abundance game design and buffs have thrown them onto.
Nereus in entosis boat fit has a whopping 3k m3 cargo hold. You can haul more in a Maller, which makes tank fit Nereus, much like all tank fit barges, useless.
Dark Lord Trump wrote:
I'd also like to see how ganking is killing eve. Personally I think that the people who leave EvE over being ganked are simply not meant for the game and would have either gotten bored missioning in hisec anyway or lost something to someone eventually and ragequit. I'm aware this probably can't be proven, but I've offered just as much evidence as you have.

It already did. The drop in subs was mostly from hisec where rampant griefing has bled subs to the point where 33% of eve quit. Or did you think it was null/low (who was getting new toys all the time) have been quitting? Even if you don't like Gevlon, his ratting graphs showed activity drops quite clearly. All hail nerf hisec campaign, one thing that gewn tears have saturated CCP enough to actually commit this atrocity. RIP eve.

Being so shocked by this revelation I went and attempted to validate your figures with fits so we could together go and rage against the machine. I need some help first. No matter how much I try I can not get a venture to mine at 66% of a skiff. I would like suggestions on how to acheive this

I'm going to make a few assumptions while I work through my findings
Assumption 1
You never need to cycle off to drop ore to station and always acheive 100% mining efficiency with yoru cycles
Assumption 2
You are mining veldspar and selling it in Jita on buy orders
Assumption 3
You purchased the fittings I constructed from Jita on sell orders
Assumption 4
All ships are omni tanked and I selected the Cal Navy antimatter as the ammo shooting them

Here are the figures I got to attempting to validate your claims
Venture 2.7k ehp, 10.4 m3/s(6mil isk per hour), 7.8mil isk,
Procurer 82k ehp, 20 m3/s(12mil isk per hour), 53mil isk
Skiff 120k ehp, 22 m3/s(13.5mil isk per hour), 247mil isk
Covetor 8.2k ehp, 30.3 m3/s(18mil isk per hour), 57.5mil isk
Code standard destroyer fit for solo ganking 448DPS, 4mil isk

Assumption 5
I'm going with 22 seconds for concord to respond (my personal experiance in .6 systems)
So each destroyer can deal 9856 damage before concord respond to stop it.

Venture = 1 Gank cata. Isk efficiency 3.8mil per cata
Procurer = 9 Gank cata. Isk efficiency 17mil/1.8mil per cata
Skiff = 13 Gank cata. Isk efficiency 195mil/15mil per cata
Covetor = 1 Gank cata. Isk efficiency 52.5mil per cata

To summerise you need 9 or 13 people to kill a proc/skiff and its still more efficient to gank a covetor. Ganking can be done once every 15 mins. I know what I would choose given the option

PS I've done more anti ganking(well to be fair we wern't trying to prevent ganks so much as enjoyed ******* with random people with kill rights flying catas and talos's) than most(defiently not all I lack dedication) people posting in these forums. But do us all a favour and post based on fact and not butt hurt. Thankyou


I was away for quite some time and missed when CCP made yet another nerf to mining... well, they want to kill it, and I only saw the recent gutting of mining links and missed the barge rebalance, so I guess my figures were a bit outdated. Hell, I even thought Procurer was 6 million boat like it used to be, since that's the price I stocked up at last year.

That said, with corrected figures, my point still stands. It's very clear that all barges are sadistically balanced to be trivially gankable, so there's no tank difference, as the only defense miner has is gtfo, and the least exposure in the belt is the way to go. Any amount of tank can be countered by brainlessly adding more basically free catalysts, so whatever tank you bring, will just make special olympics team to bring more catalyst alts on you. It becomes a challenge of how much you can mine before special olympics team makes their lazy stupid move, and that's where Covetor/Hulk becomes the only viable choice, and full tank barges are as good as, ok, 2 ventures. And of course, goes without saying, in current game balance, no undocking with special olympics teams in local, because every barge is trivially gankable, and making it interesting for special olympics cancer team by undocking a barge which is one little notch less trivial to gank is counter-productive - you'll have to jumpclone away and resume in another location.


You're right, nothing can be done. You're completely helpless.
Orca Platypus
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#56 - 2016-11-26 22:45:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Orca Platypus
Noragen Neirfallas wrote:
Are you being serious right now? Are you aware you can gank a titan if you just add enough catalysts too it. Hell I can gank literally anything by adding enough. It becomes an issue of is it worth it when something else is eaiser/do I have the pilots online to pull it off.


No, it doesn't, and you know it, but still try to derail it trying to put irrelevant points in.
It is well known that special olympics team known as ganktards are lazy and stupid, they already fell to the easiest and foolproof-est thing to do - ganking - usually by failing at everything else (while constantly telling us eve should be a dark and dangerous place... for everyone but them, apparently). So, yes, there is a high possibility that they would go for easiest target, thus it is a #1 mistake to be a target in the first place! It is not rocket science - ganktards in system - dock the hell up, clone jump away, resume at new location, and don't mine within 3 jumps from their cancer dens. If you didn't dock up, you deserve to die (though of course ganktards did nothing to deserve the kill, self-destruct should be faster).

Noragen Neirfallas wrote:
Of the last 250 mining barges killed by Code. 8 were Procurers. Of those 8 only one tried to actually fit a buffer tank. The 1 that did was obviously very low in fitting skills and shield skills but it still took 6 to kill him in a 0.5 system.

I'm not the smartest guy around but if only 3.2% of the mining barges targeted are Procurers well... might be worth looking into if you do a bit of mining in lower security areas of highsec


It is stupid to begin with. First of all, only cancer dens are dangerous, most 0.5 and 0.6 system never saw CODE in them. Second, assuming you're mining in a Procurer in a cancer den area, you're literally ganking yourself. As it stands, Covetor would have to mine for 5 hours to outmine Procurer for its full cost. Thus, by mining in a Procurer, you are guaranteed to lose a Covetor every 5 hours, all by yourself, with only difference being that it leaves no killboard trace. If you self-gank for at least once a week, shouldn't I wonder if you are ********?

Thus, yeah, mining around cancer dens is picking your poison. Either you go with Covetor like you should, and have to dock up every time Special Olympics team enters local, or you mine in a Procurer and every 5 hours you gank yourself, then lazy stupid ganktards drop enough input broadcasted alts on you and you lose a Procurer too.

Which is exactly the point. Do not mine in a Procurer. Do not mine near cancer dens. I have no sympathy for morons who couldn't follow those two simple rules, the only issue I have with it is that ganktards get stupid high reward for flying almost free ships with little to no thought into it. Current hisec is so depopulated, surely there's a good place that never saw a catalyst flying in it that you can occupy, do it.

Galaxy Duck wrote:
You're right, nothing can be done. You're completely helpless.

The irony of firing that stupid comment at a post describing exactly what should be done, oh, the irony.
Benson en Efnyssen
Celtic Anarchy
Dead Terrorists
#57 - 2016-11-26 23:12:52 UTC
This thread took a turn to tragically salty yet hilarious.

I'm honestly glad ganking is a legitimate hisec talent and without it, despite people saying it's risk free there would be no risk to miners or afk autopilots.
Galaxy Duck
Galaxy Farm Carebear Repurposing
#58 - 2016-11-26 23:18:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Galaxy Duck
Yes, Orca Platypus, yes...

Let the butthurt flow through you. Big smile
Orca Platypus
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#59 - 2016-11-26 23:36:02 UTC
Benson en Efnyssen wrote:
This thread took a turn to tragically salty yet hilarious.

There wasn't any salt here, until you came that is.

Benson en Efnyssen wrote:
I'm honestly glad ganking is a legitimate hisec talent and without it, despite people saying it's risk free there would be no risk to miners or afk autopilots.


"Talent", lol. They called it emergent once. Imagine this, the playstyle placed so obviously to make no moron able to miss it, carefully engineered and regulated to the last second by CCP, emergent. I gotta say, poop is probably more emergent, and takes more "talent" than ganking.

The thing is not the risk. For all I care, put NPC gankers there and let them make the risk (at least I thought that's what drifters were supposed to be).

The problem is risk vs reward. AFK mining is relatively low risk for the new eden's most pathetic reward. Hauling is high risk for low reward. Ganking is zero risk, no investment, stupidly high reward. Clearly we can see at least two things here that require a balance pass.
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#60 - 2016-11-26 23:51:21 UTC
My personal favorite thing about alpha's.

The old school salt mines are open for business.

Welcome back Orca Platypus.