Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Bottom-line up front: allow the creation of NPC corp subsidiaries that are owned by the NPC corps but run by players.

Background: As of right now, players have two choices.

First, is to stay in an NPC corp. Pros- protection from war declarations. Cons- no game supported means to formally organize as a social or economic "group" within the game. Also, players in NPC corps are unable to claim nullsec space, nor are they able to declare wars on others. No ability to purchase shared hangar space with other players. Additionally, no shared wallet system with other players. A very un-social way to play EVE.

Second, is to join a Player corp. Pros- the ability to formally organized as a "group". Shared wallet system and ability to purchase hangar space. Can declare war on others and claim nullsec space. Generally a positive social event. Cons- no protection from war declarations.

Discussion: most mature, warrior-like corps/alliances generally declare wars only against other similar warrior-like corps/alliances. These are often initiated due to a battle over sovereignty, resources or revenge, and is generally accepted as a normalcy in the PvP portion of EVE. However, there are less scrupulous individuals, often called "griefers", that target new and/or non-violent corps in order to boost their low self-esteems. For a newbie or non-violent corp, they basically have no options. What often results is the dissolution of the new and/or non-violent corp due to repeated griefer wars.

EVE is meant as as sandbox, and should accomodate all styles of play, to include providing some sort of protection to those that love the PvE, industry, and social aspects of the game but possess no desire to PvP. But then again, the war declaration function must still exist as well. How can we resolves these issues?

SOLUTION: Enable the creation of NPC-corp owned subsidiaries that are operated by players. Essentially, it would be a hybrid of our two current options. The subsidiary would be protected from war declarations (just as players are now within the NPC corps). Additionally, the subsidiary would be allowed to buy a hangar office and use a shared wallet. However, they would be unable to claim nullsec space, declare wars, or build a POS. There could be further restrictions, such as those players within the subsidiary must maintain a positive standing with both their faction and CONCORD.

Thoughts?

EDIT- As owning a POS would allow for significant exploitation, it has been removed as a potential option for an NPC-owned subsidiary.

So, essentially, you want a 100% invulnerable highsec research pos, with none of the hassle?

I'm having a problem seeing actually what the benefits of this would be.

Actually EVE already accommodates all play styles and the one you're looking for is called a NPC corp. Your problem isn't that you love PvE, industry and social aspects and have no desire to PvP. We have tons of people like that in player corps happily doing all kinds of industry related activities for the corp and dodging PvP. The real problem is that you want to do everything the industry players in player corps already do, as far as POSs are concerned, while denying others the opportunity to influence you back. So basicly have the freedoms that the sandbox offers, while at the same time denying others those very same freedoms, because you don't like it.

What you want isn't going to happen, since things being static leads to boredom and stagnation, which is poison to a sandbox game. These games in general and EVE economy especially runs on destruction, player interaction and drama, so to keep things going you want to encourage social interaction and asset destruction. The improvements you ask for organisation within the NPC wardec shield seem fine to me in principle. The details might need tweaking, but encouraging players to organize and interact is all good. Maybe once they have more confidence and have grown in size they grow a backbone and become real corporations. The bottom line is though, that if you want to own a POS, you're going to have to be vulnerable to attacks. They are important player assets, vital to industry and are limited in how many there can be in EVE, so they need to be vulnerable to hostile actions one way or another.

In short, boo on POS running under NPC dec shield, but yes on improving player interaction and organization tools even for people in NPC corps.

Hey all! Thanks to most of you for your constructive criticism.

sHERU- I especially like your idea of being able to change our NPC corp. It'll allow other "carebears" like myself to at least organize somewhat. As it is, a player may develop friends and associates online, but are unable to group up with them outside of creating a corp. And like you said, it'd be very noob friendly. I would imagine a group like EVE University would especially benefit from it.

Danika- I see your point. It'd definitely be exploited by ISK farmers. If that's the case, then yeah, no POSes. But like sHERU mentioned, there could be other benefits such as a reduction in costs for certain services on those NPC stations.

Lord Zim- A subsidiary would allow non-combat players to organize as a social and economic "group". This would be beneficial for newbie training organizations, industry/mining groups, mission runners, and/or social groups. The key benefit for them would be protection from griefer wars. Negatives would be the inability to declare war and the inability to own/control areas of space. It's a way to solve the griefer corp problem without having to rework the war declaration system.

Caliph Muhammed- First off, cool name. Second, I did not mention suicidal ganks (such as those used during Hulkageddons), which can target anyone regardless of whether or not they are in a corp. That, I think, is just fine, as it usually ends with CONCORD taking out the hostiles (if done in highsec) and is often done without abusing the war declaration system. Third, I did not say anyone was a "psychopath". I did, however, trash on "griefer" corps, which I think is warranted. Ganking someone in lowsec is 100% fine. It's expected, as it is lowsec. But targeting a newbie or indy corp with repeated griefer wars in highsec is wretched.

Destination SkillQueue- After reading your post and Danika's, I agree that POS ownership should only be retained by player corps. They would be abused under the initial plan I proposed. I'm glad though that you agree that there should be better options for those under NPC corps.

Imrik86- Thanks for the bump!

Lord Zim- Great question. Not being able to own POS would definitely reduce the opportunities for exploitation. I could see the mega-industry dudes taking advantage of it in regards to a shared hangar space. This would especially be the case for those folks out there that own multiple accounts for mining & other indy ops. However, many of them use "work-arounds" currently to get over the present inability to share a hangar by contracting equipment between their characters for a very small fee. In short, it would make their lives "easier", but not grant them significant capabilities outside of what they already have.

Question for others- As long as the NPC subidiary is unable to own a POS or claim space, is there any other avenue for exploitation by unscrupulous players?

Lord Zim- True. It's a common problem with corps as it is. That's been an ongoing issue with corp hangars, in that there are few tracking controls for corp CEOs and hangar managers. Player corps have to develop their own systems for tracking what is in a hangar and carefully manage priviledges for their corp members.

Totally agree. While I think the initial Career Agent set-up is phenomenal in getting a person introduced to the various options in the game, there is little follow-up for a new player afterwards. It'd make for a better transition towards a player corp to at least be able to join an NPC corp that is known for assisting new players. And if folks make friends but don't want the vulnerability of a corp, there's the possibility then of all joining the same NPC corp together.