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Dev blog: Command Bursts and the New World of Fleet Boosting

First post First post
Author
Bo Goodwin
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#521 - 2016-08-30 14:12:32 UTC
The only thing about this mighty nerfing of off-grid boosting I know for sure is it is getting some really cool people, who just want to help out new people and solo-ers, to leave EVE forever.

Now I subbed a year about 2-3 months ago. I like mining. I like being boosted. I like my booster to be able to relax while playing, not working while playing.

Isn't this game about community? I've played EVE for years now, years apart of course, but every time I come back it seems they keep changing things nobody wants...actually that most people hate.

So if these changes are how you repay and reward long-time players, then CCP,, you have lost touch with your playerbase.

I don't PvP, FW, PI, explore, PvE, incursions or any of that crap. I like to mine some rocks while I chat with friends and not get blown up.

So if these changes go through, you can better believe that many people will cancel their subscriptions, I included.

It's always a sign of game companies that fail when they start to ignore their player base.
Nobody wanted these changes, everyone I know in-game hates these changes, these changes aren't needed.

Do better, CCP, because right now you really suck and I want my money back.

I play this game to mine with my friends, some of those friends can't stare at the screen all ******* day.

Let me add, of all the changes I've seen in this game (since 2005), this is the most asinine.

I truly hope that this is just some sick joke. CCP, and the devs responsible for this BS, you are killing this game.
Arrendis
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#522 - 2016-08-30 14:13:23 UTC
Ashterothi wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
give me an example of some one doing something in eve that is not PvP any example at all


Incursion communities

Industry corps

Signal Cartel

Drifter Hive "tours"


Incursion communities are full of PvPers' alts, making money with which to PvP.

Industry is completely PvP - not only is it the engine that drives all of the PvP (somebody's gotta build those ships, guns, ammo, etc!) but you're competing with other players for the best prices on everything.

Signal Cartel is competitive - they pay for those holes. If you get paid for one, nobody else gets paid for it.

Hive "tours" - folks are stockpiling the elements they get out of the hives, and a lot of them are hoping it'll prove profitable... to fuel pvp. This one's the closest though... so far.
Arrendis
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#523 - 2016-08-30 14:15:02 UTC
Drago Misharie wrote:
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
O.o pvp is player vs player <- no where in that does it say anything about destruction

the most obvious form is violent however only people with a very shallow understanding limit it to that

Ok, not to be insulting, but that's not what 99.9% of the members of eve define this as PVP.

You are a very small minority with this definition.


No, he's not. All of the large players in nullsec understand industry and market manipulation are PvP.
Ncc 1709
Fusion Enterprises Ltd
Reckless Contingency.
#524 - 2016-08-30 14:16:04 UTC
27 pages in 22 hours. surly ccp can see this is something people dont want
Noxisia Arkana
Deadspace Knights
#525 - 2016-08-30 14:18:52 UTC
Ncc 1709 wrote:
27 pages in 22 hours. surly ccp can see this is something people dont want


There are a lot of specific implementation pieces that people do not want. But bringing boosts on grid has been a complaint of solo pvp players for a long time. It also makes sense. The range and mechanics feel off.
Lonan O'Labhradha
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#526 - 2016-08-30 14:19:57 UTC
Ncc 1709 wrote:
27 pages in 22 hours. surly ccp can see this is something people dont want


Just because people are talking about something doesn't mean they don't want it. I have wanted on-grid boosting forever, and CCP has been promising it forever. I think people just want it to be done correctly. Command ships hanging in empty space is not fun content during a battle. You are supporting the fleet, but have no hope of ever getting a killmail. It's boring, crappy content facilitated by the boosting mechanics.

Bo Goodwin
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#527 - 2016-08-30 14:20:00 UTC
Ncc 1709 wrote:
27 pages in 22 hours. surly ccp can see this is something people dont want



They don't care because they always cater to the PvPers who whine and cry louder than any carebear I've ever seen.
Noxisia Arkana
Deadspace Knights
#528 - 2016-08-30 14:23:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Noxisia Arkana
Also, if boosts coming on grid is a shock just causing you to enter into this conversation then you haven't been very active in the community. At a couple of fanfests, all the time on the forums, the DEVs have said that they want on grid boosting but it wasn't a priority. Your time to try to pry industrial boosting from pvp boosting was then - not now. It's been an active discussion for a couple of years at least.

edit: And I will add this - the announcement of a mining boost battlecruiser is no accident. It's to offset the loss of boosts from rorq/orca. Hopefully it'll be a worthwhile swap.
Lonan O'Labhradha
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#529 - 2016-08-30 14:28:57 UTC
Bo Goodwin wrote:
Ncc 1709 wrote:
27 pages in 22 hours. surly ccp can see this is something people dont want



They don't care because they always cater to the PvPers who whine and cry louder than any carebear I've ever seen.


Miners only care about low-interaction productivity. If they took Rorqual boosts away entirely and applied it as a basic bonus to the individual ships you would think that was perfect. The Rorqual is merely an inconvenience as it currently is and the on-grid Rorqual is an even further inconvenience.

What you really want is a ship with an auto-pilot button that flies itself out to a belt, pulses a smart bomb and pulls all of the minerals into your cargo hold then returns the entire solar system's mineral wealth to your station so you can play with blue prints and make isk.

Or perhaps just an isk printing press...

PVE always wants convenience.

If they offered you a structure that did what the Rorqual did, you'd praise their genuine intellect and for seeing the light.
Bo Goodwin
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#530 - 2016-08-30 14:32:06 UTC
Lonan O'Labhradha wrote:
Bo Goodwin wrote:
Ncc 1709 wrote:
27 pages in 22 hours. surly ccp can see this is something people dont want



They don't care because they always cater to the PvPers who whine and cry louder than any carebear I've ever seen.


Miners only care about low-interaction productivity. If they took Rorqual boosts away entirely and applied it as a basic bonus to the individual ships you would think that was perfect. The Rorqual is merely an inconvenience as it currently is and the on-grid Rorqual is an even further inconvenience.

What you really want is a ship with an auto-pilot button that flies itself out to a belt, pulses a smart bomb and pulls all of the minerals into your cargo hold then returns the entire solar system's mineral wealth to your station so you can play with blue prints and make isk.

Or perhaps just an isk printing press...

PVE always wants convenience.

If they offered you a structure that did what the Rorqual did, you'd praise their genuine intellect and for seeing the light.


lol, hello incompetent ganker. Please cry a little more. My glass is not yet full.
Actually what I really want is CCP to not make changes that will make all my friends leave.
But you might know that if you quit crying and start using your brain.
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
Brave Collective
#531 - 2016-08-30 14:33:25 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Anyone thinking of cashing out leadership skills they don't want into skill extractors should do so quickly before the market crashes. Prices are down already.


No. I hate that abomination of a mechanic and will not use it.

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

Aura sound-clips: Aura forever

Noxisia Arkana
Deadspace Knights
#532 - 2016-08-30 14:34:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Noxisia Arkana
@Lonan - I mean people play the game for different reasons. If you gave PVPers a way to generate killmails and post them to zkill to get their isk efficiency up without undocking there would be a ton of shittlers just plugging away at the I win button and rubbing their epeen.

Lets face it, out of the two PVE is the more monotonous. It's frankly a blessing that people are willing to mine an asteroid for the type of engaging game play it creates.
Lonan O'Labhradha
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#533 - 2016-08-30 14:39:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Lonan O'Labhradha
Noxisia Arkana wrote:
@Lonan - I mean people play the game for different reasons. If you gave PVPers a way to generate killmails and post them to zkill to get their isk efficiency up without undocking there would be a ton of shittlers just plugging away at the I win button and rubbing their epeen.

Lets face it, our of the two PVE is the more monotonous. It's frankly a blessing that people are willing to mine an asteroid for the type of engaging game play it creates.


I mentioned in my first post that the Rorqual changes don't address the mindnumbing annoyance of warping between belts collecting rocks for 15 hours.

My point was that PVE has a tendency to prefer changes to the system which provide them with greater convenience which means that @Bo would probably be interested in the "Rorqual Tower" structure as a solution to the problem but doesn't want to admit it.

Improvement to PVE Mining content is a difficult thing to do... If mining was fun, minerals would be plentiful and not worth mining. The boringness of the activity inherently creates its value

Also @Bo, I'm not a mindless ganker. I've never ganked anything, actually. I'm more of a support ship pilot--I tend to favor stealth, command ships and logi which is why this thread interests me.
Winter Archipelago
Autumn Industrial Enterprises
#534 - 2016-08-30 14:42:32 UTC
Noxisia Arkana wrote:
@Lonan - I mean people play the game for different reasons. If you gave PVPers a way to generate killmails and post them to zkill to get their isk efficiency up without undocking there would be a ton of shittlers just plugging away at the I win button and rubbing their epeen.

For what it's worth, there are already people who do that by smartbombing hundreds of cheap frigates to get their name in the Top-10 list for a particular ship or system.
Drazz Caylen
Team-Pyro Industries
#535 - 2016-08-30 14:47:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Drazz Caylen
Ncc 1709 wrote:
27 pages in 22 hours. surly ccp can see this is something people dont want

Wrong assertion.

27 pages in 22 hours about a topic that people have mixed feelings about.

If you read through most of it you will find real concerns about the actual implementation to make it worthwhile and folks pointing out loopholes in the system already. They provide data from their experience from all kinds of different playing fields.
Ongrid boosts are something not only wanted but needed to make the boosting mechanic worthwhile and reasonable by any stretch of the imagination.

Even if you cut out everyone who can't wait for the miner related devblog and thus put their opinions to the table based on their assumptions, the topic would still be fairly big.
Even if you cut out the whiners who think their boosting alt will be worthless, the topic would still be fairly big.


Bo Goodwin wrote:
Actually what I really want is CCP to not make changes that will make all my friends leave.
Sounds like you have tons of friends who just jump the gun. The mining devblog is not yet out. Hold your horses.
Andrea Cemenotar
Elena Minasse Operations
#536 - 2016-08-30 14:48:09 UTC
Bo Goodwin wrote:
The only thing about this mighty nerfing of off-grid boosting I know for sure is it is getting some really cool people, who just want to help out new people and solo-ers, to leave EVE forever.

Now I subbed a year about 2-3 months ago. I like mining. I like being boosted. I like my booster to be able to relax while playing, not working while playing.

Isn't this game about community? I've played EVE for years now, years apart of course, but every time I come back it seems they keep changing things nobody wants...actually that most people hate.

So if these changes are how you repay and reward long-time players, then CCP,, you have lost touch with your playerbase.

I don't PvP, FW, PI, explore, PvE, incursions or any of that crap. I like to mine some rocks while I chat with friends and not get blown up.

So if these changes go through, you can better believe that many people will cancel their subscriptions, I included.

It's always a sign of game companies that fail when they start to ignore their player base.
Nobody wanted these changes, everyone I know in-game hates these changes, these changes aren't needed.

Do better, CCP, because right now you really suck and I want my money back.

I play this game to mine with my friends, some of those friends can't stare at the screen all ******* day.

Let me add, of all the changes I've seen in this game (since 2005), this is the most asinine.

I truly hope that this is just some sick joke. CCP, and the devs responsible for this BS, you are killing this game.



no offense, but I think you are overreacting a little bit

also please bear in mind that this is not all information we have got on the subject and that the next scheduler blog will talk about rebalancing of orca and rorqual
Memphis Baas
#537 - 2016-08-30 14:54:02 UTC
Most MMO's that use buffs allow the recipient to click off (turn off) beneficial buffs if they wish to no longer have the effects. Mostly this is just a waste of the materials / ammo the command ship used to buff the target, but there are some possible cases where extra MWD speed is not desirable. Will you let us turn off boosts by right-clicking their icon or something similar?

Also, if a cloaked ship is in range, will it be affected by the fleet boosts?

If yes, will the visual of the boost betray where that cloaked ship is?

How about same question for titan effects, particularly as they affect members of the opposite fleet too.
May Arethusa
Junction Systems
#538 - 2016-08-30 14:55:05 UTC
Caldari 5 wrote:
Actually I normally Fly a Griffin/Kitsune, and I'm normally 50km+ from the Furball in the middle, the Siege Skills/Links are normally all that stops me from being 1 Lucky Volleyed off the field, allowing me to warp recharge shields and warp back in from a different area/angle and continue.

Perhaps you need to learn how to fly instead of staying stuck to an anchor :P


In case you were wondering, those siege links add roughly 300 EHP to a Griffin, and 500 to a Kitsune. Ships which, if currently available evidence is to be believed, you don't actually fly that often. You wouldn't be posting on an alt making spurious claims would you? Because honestly, trying to make a point of the importance of Siege Links to a Griffin smacks of desperation.

My point stands. Your Griffin is pretty low on the list of ships considered when bringing links to a fleet fight, and that handful of extra hitpoints was a byproduct of a flawed system that a large section of the community believed needed fixing. You still want them? You now know what you need to do. Hug a Command Ship/Destroyer.

Sure must be nice out there though, far from danger with your ECM to keep you safe. I wouldn't know, I'm often too busy flying in and around the hostile fleet, hounded by drones while every spare neut, web, and scram is being dedicated to putting an end to my shennanigans. Links made my job easier, a lot easier in fact, but not having them wasn't the end of the world. I won't miss them.
KhanidLady
White Knight Social Club
Streamfleet
#539 - 2016-08-30 14:55:44 UTC
Memphis Baas wrote:
Most MMO's that use buffs allow the recipient to click off (turn off) beneficial buffs if they wish to no longer have the effects. Mostly this is just a waste of the materials / ammo the command ship used to buff the target, but there are some possible cases where extra MWD speed is not desirable. Will you let us turn off boosts by right-clicking their icon or something similar?

Also, if a cloaked ship is in range, will it be affected by the fleet boosts?

If yes, will the visual of the boost betray where that cloaked ship is?

How about same question for titan effects, particularly as they affect members of the opposite fleet too.



old boosts didnt allow that either and i think this adds unneeded complexity.
Lug Muad'Dib
Funk'in Hole
#540 - 2016-08-30 14:56:55 UTC
Really disapointed, was really thinking OGB will be gone, at least the skirmish one.

The new system is worst for small gang and FW pvp. Now we will be able to solo pvp in a linked frigate with booster in the next system Roll
The timer need to be very short or very long, or boosting capacity only based on position. The AOE with mid-lenght timers is the worst solution.

Hope CCP get a lot of skin to sell in November, the drop in playerbase won't be funny..