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CCP Fozzie Commits Rorqual Genocide

Author
Sheeth Athonille
Rabid Dogz Mining
The Bastion
#21 - 2016-08-19 12:24:47 UTC
Minerva Arbosa wrote:
Just wait till mineral prices skyrocket, and the Gila goes from being 200m / hull to 600m / hull. Do you all honestly think ship prices aren't going to skyrocket due to mineral prices going up severly? I can't wait until all the minerals I am building up sky rocket in price up to the new normal of double or triple the price. You don't think it will happen then wait and see.


Judging by your apparent knowledge of industry and pirate hulls, I think I might skip on your assessment.

As for OP, I definitely agree that the most logical choice would be to simply remove the immobility. As was said, no other boosting ship has this handicap, so why should the rorq?
Syrias Bizniz
some random local shitlords
#22 - 2016-08-19 14:58:21 UTC
Minerva Arbosa wrote:
Just wait till mineral prices skyrocket, and the Gila goes from being 200m / hull to 600m / hull. Do you all honestly think ship prices aren't going to skyrocket due to mineral prices going up severly? I can't wait until all the minerals I am building up sky rocket in price up to the new normal of double or triple the price. You don't think it will happen then wait and see.


I'm just gonna like your post now. Then i will take away my thumbs-up as a display of my disaprovement with your post.
Minerva Arbosa
Spatial Forces
Warped Intentions
#23 - 2016-08-19 15:46:31 UTC
Sheeth Athonille wrote:
Minerva Arbosa wrote:
Just wait till mineral prices skyrocket, and the Gila goes from being 200m / hull to 600m / hull. Do you all honestly think ship prices aren't going to skyrocket due to mineral prices going up severly? I can't wait until all the minerals I am building up sky rocket in price up to the new normal of double or triple the price. You don't think it will happen then wait and see.


Judging by your apparent knowledge of industry and pirate hulls, I think I might skip on your assessment.

As for OP, I definitely agree that the most logical choice would be to simply remove the immobility. As was said, no other boosting ship has this handicap, so why should the rorq?


It's just a ship name as an example. If mineral prices skyrocket in price, then so do ship prices. Stop reading everything for face value and just get the concept.
SurrenderMonkey
The Exchange Collective
Solyaris Chtonium
#24 - 2016-08-19 16:21:00 UTC  |  Edited by: SurrenderMonkey
Minerva Arbosa wrote:
Sheeth Athonille wrote:
Minerva Arbosa wrote:
Just wait till mineral prices skyrocket, and the Gila goes from being 200m / hull to 600m / hull. Do you all honestly think ship prices aren't going to skyrocket due to mineral prices going up severly? I can't wait until all the minerals I am building up sky rocket in price up to the new normal of double or triple the price. You don't think it will happen then wait and see.


Judging by your apparent knowledge of industry and pirate hulls, I think I might skip on your assessment.

As for OP, I definitely agree that the most logical choice would be to simply remove the immobility. As was said, no other boosting ship has this handicap, so why should the rorq?


It's just a ship name as an example. If mineral prices skyrocket in price, then so do ship prices. Stop reading everything for face value and just get the concept.



If mineral prices were to skyrocket (exceedingly unlikely to happen due to this change, btw), more people will mine minerals, bringing the mineral price back in line.

"Help, I'm bored with missions!"

http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/

Princess Adhara
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#25 - 2016-08-20 02:10:31 UTC
Minerva Arbosa wrote:
Sheeth Athonille wrote:
Minerva Arbosa wrote:
Just wait till mineral prices skyrocket, and the Gila goes from being 200m / hull to 600m / hull. Do you all honestly think ship prices aren't going to skyrocket due to mineral prices going up severly? I can't wait until all the minerals I am building up sky rocket in price up to the new normal of double or triple the price. You don't think it will happen then wait and see.


Judging by your apparent knowledge of industry and pirate hulls, I think I might skip on your assessment.

As for OP, I definitely agree that the most logical choice would be to simply remove the immobility. As was said, no other boosting ship has this handicap, so why should the rorq?


It's just a ship name as an example. If mineral prices skyrocket in price, then so do ship prices. Stop reading everything for face value and just get the concept.


Pricetag on the Gila doesn't come from the minerals (in the order of 10M to build), but from the BPC (remaining 190M). So a tripled price on the minerals would bring it to 220M. Yawn.
Thomas Lot
Spatial Forces
Warped Intentions
#26 - 2016-08-21 14:47:10 UTC
Princess Adhara wrote:
Minerva Arbosa wrote:
Sheeth Athonille wrote:
Minerva Arbosa wrote:
Just wait till mineral prices skyrocket, and the Gila goes from being 200m / hull to 600m / hull. Do you all honestly think ship prices aren't going to skyrocket due to mineral prices going up severly? I can't wait until all the minerals I am building up sky rocket in price up to the new normal of double or triple the price. You don't think it will happen then wait and see.


Judging by your apparent knowledge of industry and pirate hulls, I think I might skip on your assessment.

As for OP, I definitely agree that the most logical choice would be to simply remove the immobility. As was said, no other boosting ship has this handicap, so why should the rorq?


It's just a ship name as an example. If mineral prices skyrocket in price, then so do ship prices. Stop reading everything for face value and just get the concept.


Pricetag on the Gila doesn't come from the minerals (in the order of 10M to build), but from the BPC (remaining 190M). So a tripled price on the minerals would bring it to 220M. Yawn.



Good Lord... it's not about the Gila. It's about the increased risk to to mining fleets, and the lower yield now that Rorquals will not be used nearly as often. Yes, mineral prices are going to go up and therefore so will ship prices. Domi cost is 200Mil now, 400-500M by January as an example.
Kalido Raddi
Crown Mineworks
Goonswarm Federation
#27 - 2016-08-21 16:34:39 UTC
Who says Rorquals won't be used as often?

The entire playstyle for the Rorqual will be different. The Rorqual will now heavily favour groups who have the necessary organisation to use them effectively.

In short, if you have a well organised mining team and the necessary support from your alliance, Rorqual mining will definitely be a big thing.
Thomas Lot
Spatial Forces
Warped Intentions
#28 - 2016-08-21 17:36:28 UTC
Kalido Raddi wrote:
Who says Rorquals won't be used as often?

The entire playstyle for the Rorqual will be different. The Rorqual will now heavily favour groups who have the necessary organisation to use them effectively.

In short, if you have a well organised mining team and the necessary support from your alliance, Rorqual mining will definitely be a big thing.



I cannot disagree with you at all. Rorqual mining might be a really good thing. And many of us in Null have the resources and player base to fill out a support fleet to use it properly. Many who don't have that level of support will moth-ball the things. So I still stand by my conjecture that Rorquals will be used less often.

I may be completely wrong. Only the next year will give the answers.
morion
Lighting Build
#29 - 2016-08-22 09:17:16 UTC
Amarrchecko
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#30 - 2016-08-22 13:36:36 UTC
Thomas Lot wrote:
the lower yield now that Rorquals will not be used nearly as often. Yes, mineral prices are going to go up and therefore so will ship prices. Domi cost is 200Mil now, 400-500M by January as an example.


Lol. No.

Look at the monthly economic reports. The lion's share of low- and mid-end ores are mined in high sec. Zydrine and megacyte might see a significant increase in price IF rorquals end up being dumpstered by the changes... but those are a small part of the cost to build t1 or capital ships compared to trit, pye, mex... which are what most high-sec mining is focused on.
Amarrchecko
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#31 - 2016-08-22 13:44:47 UTC
Thomas Lot wrote:
I cannot disagree with you at all. Rorqual mining might be a really good thing. And many of us in Null have the resources and player base to fill out a support fleet to use it properly. Many who don't have that level of support will moth-ball the things. So I still stand by my conjecture that Rorquals will be used less often.

I may be completely wrong. Only the next year will give the answers.


I agree they will be used less often. Even if the changes are "ideal" and rorqs are viable to use in belts, some players will still stop using rorqs. Some rorqs have always just been AFK in a POS all day long for larger mining groups to use. Some rorq pilots don't have any semblance of skills necessary to fly one where it may come under fire. Some people will just be afraid of losing one.

But I'd like to hope that for the people who do use rorqs wisely, they will be better off than they are now with it sitting behind a POS shield. Consider a solo miner with like 4-8 accounts. He probably has a rorq, 3-6 pilots in skiffs, and 0-1 pilots acting as a hauler. Suddenly his rorq: is in a belt providing boosts that are relatively better than what the average miner in null has since not everyone uses rorqs anymore, is in a belt getting its own yield of maybe 50m/hr with new super mining drones, is providing on-the-spot compression so that no hauler (or no warping in and out of the belt) is necessary anymore, is providing RR support so that hulks are a more attractive option instead of skiffs.

Sure, that rorq WILL die eventually. But after insurance, especially in a quiet area of null (which there are a lot of) or in an alliance where a fleet will happily form for some content that might save the rorq sometimes, it won't take very many hours of operation for that rorq to more than pay for itself. Anything after that point is gravy, more isk made than if the pilot had been using a BC or orca for boosts and not lost his booster... but missed out on the advantages the rorq has.
SurrenderMonkey
The Exchange Collective
Solyaris Chtonium
#32 - 2016-08-22 18:14:18 UTC
Thomas Lot wrote:


Good Lord... it's not about the Gila. It's about the increased risk to to mining fleets, and the lower yield now that Rorquals will not be used nearly as often. Yes, mineral prices are going to go up and therefore so will ship prices. Domi cost is 200Mil now, 400-500M by January as an example.



Oh, wow. That triggered some sympathetic embarrassment.

About 2/3s of the cost of a domi hull is in Trit, Pyerite and Mexallon, predominantly sourced in high sec. The yields for these are unlikely to be impacted in any way.

Good luck with your prediction that null mineral values will quadruple. They wouldn't do that if you removed boosts entirely. Lol

"Help, I'm bored with missions!"

http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/

JG Wentworth
The Russian Miners
#33 - 2016-08-22 18:25:39 UTC  |  Edited by: JG Wentworth
Amarrchecko wrote:
Sure, that rorq WILL die eventually. But after insurance, especially in a quiet area of null (which there are a lot of) or in an alliance where a fleet will happily form for some content that might save the rorq sometimes, it won't take very many hours of operation for that rorq to more than pay for itself. Anything after that point is gravy, more isk made than if the pilot had been using a BC or orca for boosts and not lost his booster... but missed out on the advantages the rorq has.


I does not matter how quiet a nulsec region is when thera holes allow for the projection of overwhelming force to anywhere in the game. Once VOLTA (and friends) knows that you are sieging an roqual in x system, they will check that system whenever they get a hole in your region, (or nearby). I've seen them burn 25 jumps to tackle and kill ratting carriers (who are not immobilized for 5 minutes)

Once your system has several rorqual losses on zkillboard (especially in quiet regions where there are not very many targets), even roaming gangs will farm your rorquals. Also elite pvpers will put cloaky alts in your system and drop bombers on your rorqual.
Hauler Haulington
Harvesters Of Massive Ores
#34 - 2016-08-22 18:52:54 UTC
SurrenderMonkey wrote:
Minerva Arbosa wrote:
Sheeth Athonille wrote:
Minerva Arbosa wrote:
Just wait till mineral prices skyrocket, and the Gila goes from being 200m / hull to 600m / hull. Do you all honestly think ship prices aren't going to skyrocket due to mineral prices going up severly? I can't wait until all the minerals I am building up sky rocket in price up to the new normal of double or triple the price. You don't think it will happen then wait and see.


Judging by your apparent knowledge of industry and pirate hulls, I think I might skip on your assessment.

As for OP, I definitely agree that the most logical choice would be to simply remove the immobility. As was said, no other boosting ship has this handicap, so why should the rorq?


It's just a ship name as an example. If mineral prices skyrocket in price, then so do ship prices. Stop reading everything for face value and just get the concept.



If mineral prices were to skyrocket (exceedingly unlikely to happen due to this change, btw), more people will mine minerals, bringing the mineral price back in line.


If this was the real world you could assume that. But since this is a game, if something becomes too annoying to do, people will just quit the game altogether.

This is just another change that makes living in nullsec more annoying. It is bad enough we have dread spawns now in all the mining anomalies, we don't need more tedious nonsense. How about they fix all the bugs in the game instead and all the lag too?
SurrenderMonkey
The Exchange Collective
Solyaris Chtonium
#35 - 2016-08-22 22:04:36 UTC
Hauler Haulington wrote:


If this was the real world you could assume that. But since this is a game, if something becomes too annoying to do, people will just quit the game altogether.



These complaints are growing rather insipid, now. Clearly you are not familiar with the things people will put themselves through in pursuit of more IPH. Furthermore, we're not talking about any change in the fundamental "annoyingness" of mining - just the yield.

"Help, I'm bored with missions!"

http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/

Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#36 - 2016-08-22 22:50:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
The Rorqual is getting a new skin.

Given the past record [ORE skin], don't expect further changes for another year or two.

[CCP Fozzie has stated November.]
Merkal Aubauch
V0LTA
WE FORM V0LTA
#37 - 2016-08-24 11:06:29 UTC
Is this guy whining about Rorqual being bad or V0lta being too good? ;)
Lord Mudeki
Kaishin.
#38 - 2016-08-30 00:14:20 UTC
Sheeth Athonille wrote:
Minerva Arbosa wrote:
Just wait till mineral prices skyrocket, and the Gila goes from being 200m / hull to 600m / hull. Do you all honestly think ship prices aren't going to skyrocket due to mineral prices going up severly? I can't wait until all the minerals I am building up sky rocket in price up to the new normal of double or triple the price. You don't think it will happen then wait and see.


Judging by your apparent knowledge of industry and pirate hulls, I think I might skip on your assessment.

As for OP, I definitely agree that the most logical choice would be to simply remove the immobility. As was said, no other boosting ship has this handicap, so why should the rorq?


Besides giving the added boosts over the Orca the Industrial Core was used in conjunction with Ore Blueprints that were needed to compress ore in the Rorqual, but with the changes that made compression instant in Citadels and pos compression arrays they removed those blueprints but still the indy core was needed to be active to compress ore in the rorqual. I have not seen anything about rorqual compression still having or being removed, I would say it would need to stay especially if they want people to put them in the belts. Which I really don't see happening even if it still does do compressions.
Axe Coldon
#39 - 2016-09-02 00:14:52 UTC
47 6f 64 wrote:
Build another one. If you are in null sec and your corp can't afford to replace a rorqual every few weeks, you are doing it wrong. The point of the game isn't to make stuff so that it never dies.


I call BS! A small corp doesn't mine enough to be replacing their rorqual all the time. Plus once the enemy figures out you are deploying them in system and can't defend, they will be there every day.

This change is a disaster for rorquals. This whole future of nothing is safe is bad. What made Eve great is somethings are sort of safe, and some are not.

No trees were killed in the sending of this message. However, a large number of electrons were terribly inconvenienced.

Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#40 - 2016-09-04 15:27:04 UTC
Syrias Bizniz wrote:
How to: Unfuck the Rorqual.

Step 1: Remove mining boosts all together. Add the yield mining ships were getting through mining boosts to the hulls / stripminers / whatever, so they all still make the same yield.


This seems unneccesary; there's a perfectly good commandship that is especially devoted to providing mining boosts as it is.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016