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- Proposal of Ship Scanning as Hostile Act Resolution -

Author
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#161 - 2016-07-28 09:09:36 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
As you gankers often say get a friend, I just did.

And you run away because you realise its not some poor blue collared pleb that you can bully.

I'm not a ganker and never have been. Never ganked a ship in 8 years and I don't intend to ever start.

Those that want to play that way however, have every bit as much of a right to choose that style of play as I have to choose my style of play and they create additional challenge in the game, which from my perspective is a good thing.

As to you being a blue-collar pleb, there isn't such a thing in my opinion. All professions from the most simple to the most critical is important to how society works and no one deserves to be degraded because of the type of work they do.

I just don't want to continue the off topic discussion as it isn't constructive or on topic. But, if you feel you need believe you had a victory, then I give it to you Drac. You can be validated that you scared me away from the thread. All the best to you.

I'll happy discuss issues on topic, but this is very boring now.


You start with personal attacks and digs then run away screaming.

You also try to make out that I am being dismissive to blue collar workers or plebs, not at all, I am pointing out that they are easily bullied but I am not. Again a personal attack to take some sort of moral high ground on your part.

Of course you don't want to continue this.

Ganking is fine, however the balance is wrong, it also does not help when people who oppose it suddenly find their most effective strategy in game removed by people using their representative position at the CSM to influence CCP to make a change that directly benefits them in game. It is quite understood be me that the change to wreck EHP is actually a good one, but the motives behind that change were based on reacting to a strategy carried out by the AG.

You can slice it or dice it by attacking me, or making pathetic veild threats of legal action on behalf of what exactly, but at the end of the day someone got the game rules changed to negate a strategy that his enemies were using in game. CCP were incompetent and fell for it and then buffed the EHP of freighters with the DCU II to try to balance off against it which gankers keep screaming is a masive nerf.

Well let me put it so you gankers understand it, I would prefer to still have the wrecks easy to blow up rather than the EHP buff from the DCU II. That is simple, so when you people talk about nerfs I will ram this down your throats every which way I can.



1. No one made any threats of legal action against you at all. I accused you of slander. It takes some real mental gymnastics to conflate an accusation with a threat, but at this stage, I'm not surprised at how skillfully you contort your critical faculties.

2. If you really believe that 'blue collar plebs' are easily bullied, or any kind of pleb, then you are in for a rude surprise one of these days.

3. If ehp on wrecks was increased as a result of making DCU's passive, then I've got bad news for you. The original 'requests' to make DCU's passive are over three years old, and always came from carebears.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

The Groundskeeper
State War Academy
Caldari State
#162 - 2016-07-28 09:09:51 UTC  |  Edited by: The Groundskeeper
Dracvlad wrote:
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
I did some further research on the wreck EHP change which we discussed on a locked thread, it was confirmed to me that Endie did push for it because AG was ganking wrecks.

How convenient. You did some more research that confirmed your opinion to you.

Genius.

No posting of the evidence that shows it of course, but good that you confirmed it to yourself. As if anything else would be expected.


You came in fast to try to water down what I said, who ae you exactly, Endie perhaps?


No, I'm Endie. And I can tell you straight up that gankers were one of those I was aware would be positively affected, yes, but they were not the main point. The main goal was to give supercap killers the chance to get the rewards for their kills: it was illogical that people who had put at risk dread fleets of small groups of supers in order to take down something like a nyx could see the pay-off from that destroyed in a second or two by a mistaken lock or by a griefing bystander. The change gave them a few seconds to retrieve the dropped loot.

Not every CSM commented on this - several were boycotting the CSM or were simply inactive - but nobody objected and several were very supportive. It was a sensible change. It was also, in retrospect, a sensible change in the sphere of suicide ganking: nothing in eve should have no counter, whether that is bumping on one side or wreck-killing on the other. Only self-interested solipsists can willfully fail to understand that.

Dracvlad wrote:
You also try to make out that I am being dismissive to blue collar workers or plebs, not at all, I am pointing out that they are easily bullied but I am not. Again a personal attack to take some sort of moral high ground on your part.

...

You can slice it or dice it by attacking me, or making pathetic veild threats of legal action on behalf of what exactly, but at the end of the day someone got the game rules changed to negate a strategy that his enemies were using in game. CCP were incompetent and fell for it and then buffed the EHP of freighters with the DCU II to try to balance off against it which gankers keep screaming is a masive nerf.


Heh ok you're one of those guys.
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#163 - 2016-07-28 09:17:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Dracvlad
The Groundskeeper wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
I did some further research on the wreck EHP change which we discussed on a locked thread, it was confirmed to me that Endie did push for it because AG was ganking wrecks.

How convenient. You did some more research that confirmed your opinion to you.

Genius.

No posting of the evidence that shows it of course, but good that you confirmed it to yourself. As if anything else would be expected.


You came in fast to try to water down what I said, who ae you exactly, Endie perhaps?


No, I'm Endie. And I can tell you straight up that gankers were one of those I was aware would be positively affected, yes, but they were not the main point. The main goal was to give supercap killers the chance to get the rewards for their kills: it was illogical that people who had put at risk dread fleets of small groups of supers in order to take down something like a nyx could see the pay-off from that destroyed in a second or two by a mistaken lock or by a griefing bystander. The change gave them a few seconds to retrieve the dropped loot.

Not every CSM commented on this - several were boycotting the CSM or were simply inactive - but nobody objected and several were very supportive. It was a sensible change. It was also, in retrospect, a sensible change in the sphere of suicide ganking: nothing in eve should have no counter, whether that is bumping on one side or wreck-killing on the other. Only self-interested solipsists can willfully fail to understand that.


So you show your true face at last.

Yeah right and Eve is a game of unicorns and rainbows where we all hug each other.

EDIT: More than postively affected, you destroyed the most effective counter that the AG movement had by this and you knew exactly what you were doing.

EDIT2: A lot of people have respect for you in this game, I have heard plenty of good things about you, but can't you just man up and admit it, hell well played and all that at the meta level. But seriously, lets cut the crap!

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#164 - 2016-07-28 09:26:55 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:


So you show your true face at last.

Yeah right and Eve is a game of unicorns and rainbows where we all hug each other.


This was literally just meaningless sperging that addressed nothing he said, so we're going to move on...

Quote:
EDIT: More than postively affected, you destroyed the most effective counter that the AG movement had by this and you knew exactly what you were doing.


It's not a counter to ganking though, it's only a counter to looting the gank. And it's not been destroyed at all. Just because you give something more EHP, doesn't mean you can't still wreck it. Gankers have proven this on a daily basis ever since the last round of barge buffs.

Quote:
EDIT2: A lot of people have respect for you in this game, I have heard plenty of good things about you, but can't you just man up and admit it, hell well played and all that at the meta level. But seriously, lets cut the crap!


This is also meaningless dribble. You have yet to actually demonstrate why anything he's said is 'crap', you're just taking pot-shots and hoping you'll land your mark, but unfortunately, it's little more than an ad hominem, and has done nothing to refute his points, or prove him 'guilty' of anything.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

The Groundskeeper
State War Academy
Caldari State
#165 - 2016-07-28 09:29:38 UTC
He said I was well-respected I'm changing sides I'm with you now Dracvlad of Taishi Combine, proud members of Second-Dawn. Let's take down those filthy gankers with their insistence on shooting things. Have you considered a career in Pandemic Legion?
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#166 - 2016-07-28 09:32:30 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:


EDIT: More than postively affected, you destroyed the most effective counter that the AG movement had by this and you knew exactly what you were doing.


Said tactic had no counter.

Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#167 - 2016-07-28 09:41:37 UTC
The Groundskeeper wrote:
He said I was well-respected I'm changing sides I'm with you now Dracvlad of Taishi Combine, proud members of Second-Dawn. Let's take down those filthy gankers with their insistence on shooting things. Have you considered a career in Pandemic Legion?


I am not going to reply to the others, they are hot air.

Of course you are well respected in the game, you play to win and you do and you did with this.

My objective here was not to directly go after you, but to neuter the whining of yet another nerf to ganking, the balance that Fozzie put in for Freighter structure EHP after the wreck EHP change in no way balanced against what AG was doing and which was destroyed by that change. That was my point, also the change was removing an offensive act to adding EHP on the defensive side, thanks guys for the great content.

There was so much wrong with that.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#168 - 2016-07-28 09:42:25 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:


EDIT: More than postively affected, you destroyed the most effective counter that the AG movement had by this and you knew exactly what you were doing.


Said tactic had no counter.



You shot them, but were not very good at it.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#169 - 2016-07-28 09:50:03 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:


You shot them, but were not very good at it.


Game mechanics meant that their shot always landed before you could kill them.
Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#170 - 2016-07-28 09:52:44 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
The Groundskeeper wrote:
He said I was well-respected I'm changing sides I'm with you now Dracvlad of Taishi Combine, proud members of Second-Dawn. Let's take down those filthy gankers with their insistence on shooting things. Have you considered a career in Pandemic Legion?


I am not going to reply to the others, they made great points that I can't refute.


FTFY. What you originally wrote was called 'projection', and it was also 'irony' at the same time, since it was in and of itself hot air.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#171 - 2016-07-28 09:53:18 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:


You shot them, but were not very good at it.


Game mechanics meant that their shot always landed before you could kill them.


So you don't like going after fast moving targets that could blow stuff up before you can react, what does this sound like baltec1?

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#172 - 2016-07-28 09:57:00 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:


So you don't like going after fast moving targets that could blow stuff up before you can react, what does this sound like baltec1?


I don't like broken mechanics, hence why I supported no insurance payout for ganking ships and the removal of the boomerang tactic, both of which were big nerfs to ganking.
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#173 - 2016-07-28 09:58:51 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
The Groundskeeper wrote:
He said I was well-respected I'm changing sides I'm with you now Dracvlad of Taishi Combine, proud members of Second-Dawn. Let's take down those filthy gankers with their insistence on shooting things. Have you considered a career in Pandemic Legion?


I am not going to reply to the others, they made great points that I can't refute.


FTFY. What you originally wrote was called 'projection', and it was also 'irony' at the same time, since it was in and of itself hot air.


Remiel, you are obviously an intelligent guy and you are someone whose comments I read. I will call them hot air when I think it is. The other day you stood up for freedom of expression against those who are easily offended, you got a big plus in my book for that. That counts for a lot to me, Voltaire said it very well you know.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#174 - 2016-07-28 10:01:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Dracvlad
baltec1 wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:


So you don't like going after fast moving targets that could blow stuff up before you can react, what does this sound like baltec1?


I don't like broken mechanics, hence why I supported no insurance payout for ganking ships and the removal of the boomerang tactic, both of which were big nerfs to ganking.


We are talking about the fact that you as gankers could not catch or blow up fast moving targets, which are difficult to stop, so what happens you push for a change that negates that, then try to divert attention on other things. You did stop some wreck ganks, it was actually good developing content, but you could not have AG actually winning could you?

EDIT: I do actually support the EHP change to wrecks by the way and am man enough to say so.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#175 - 2016-07-28 10:07:24 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
The Groundskeeper wrote:
He said I was well-respected I'm changing sides I'm with you now Dracvlad of Taishi Combine, proud members of Second-Dawn. Let's take down those filthy gankers with their insistence on shooting things. Have you considered a career in Pandemic Legion?


I am not going to reply to the others, they made great points that I can't refute.


FTFY. What you originally wrote was called 'projection', and it was also 'irony' at the same time, since it was in and of itself hot air.


Remiel, you are obviously an intelligent guy and you are someone whose comments I read. I will call them hot air when I think it is. The other day you stood up for freedom of expression against those who are easily offended, you got a big plus in my book for that. That counts for a lot to me, Voltaire said it very well you know.


First of all, don't patronise me.

Secondly, what you think something is has been demonstrated on many occasions to not be what it is. Don't just dismiss what I'm saying because YOU think it's hot air. The difference between me and you, Vladdy boy, is I'm addressing what's being said, while you're doing little more than addressing the people saying it and making character judgements of them.

I don't really care where I stand in your 'book', Vladdy. Who the actual **** even are you? I'm not here to make friends, I'm here to dispell and call out absolute bullshit, which is what you're sperging at the moment.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104

baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#176 - 2016-07-28 10:07:47 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:


So you don't like going after fast moving targets that could blow stuff up before you can react, what does this sound like baltec1?


I don't like broken mechanics, hence why I supported no insurance payout for ganking ships and the removal of the boomerang tactic, both of which were big nerfs to ganking.


We are talking about the fact that you as gankers could not catch or blow up fast moving targets, which are difficult to stop, so what happens you push for a change that negates that, then try to divert attention on other things. You did stop some wreck ganks, it was actually good developing content, but you could not have AG actually winning could you?

EDIT: I do actually support the EHP change to wrecks by the way and am man enough to say so.


Again, I am against broken mechanics and that was a broken mechanic not only for ganking but also with super/titan wrecks and destroying tactical warps both of which were much bigger issues than ganking simple due to the number of people impacted.
Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#177 - 2016-07-28 10:09:35 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
I am not going to reply to the others, they are hot air.

Well that didn't last. Like, not even 1 second*


*may be a slight exaggeration. Could have been 2 seconds.

Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."

Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#178 - 2016-07-28 10:09:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Dracvlad
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
The Groundskeeper wrote:
He said I was well-respected I'm changing sides I'm with you now Dracvlad of Taishi Combine, proud members of Second-Dawn. Let's take down those filthy gankers with their insistence on shooting things. Have you considered a career in Pandemic Legion?


I am not going to reply to the others, they made great points that I can't refute.


FTFY. What you originally wrote was called 'projection', and it was also 'irony' at the same time, since it was in and of itself hot air.


Remiel, you are obviously an intelligent guy and you are someone whose comments I read. I will call them hot air when I think it is. The other day you stood up for freedom of expression against those who are easily offended, you got a big plus in my book for that. That counts for a lot to me, Voltaire said it very well you know.


First of all, don't patronise me.

Secondly, what you think something is has been demonstrated on many occasions to not be what it is. Don't just dismiss what I'm saying because YOU think it's hot air. The difference between me and you, Vladdy boy, is I'm addressing what's being said, while you're doing little more than addressing the people saying it and making character judgements of them.

I don't really care where I stand in your 'book', Vladdy. Who the actual **** even are you? I'm not here to make friends, I'm here to dispell and call out absolute bullshit, which is what you're sperging at the moment.


Of course I am patronising you, it is fun to do when people take themselves too seriously.

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#179 - 2016-07-28 10:10:51 UTC
Shae Tadaruwa wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
I am not going to reply to the others, they are hot air.

Well that didn't last. Like, not even 1 second*


*may be a slight exaggeration. Could have been 2 seconds.


baltec1 gave me too much of a target to shoot at, couldn't resist Big smileEvilTwisted

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp

Remiel Pollard
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#180 - 2016-07-28 10:22:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Remiel Pollard
Dracvlad wrote:
Of course I am patronising you, it is fun to do when people take themselves too seriously.


You were talking about hot air? Again, you fail to address anything said, you only make quips about the people saying it. However seriously I take myself is completely irrelevant to the topic at hand and anything I've said, and most definitely not within your realm of understanding or education, so I suggest you cool down with the disrespectful, inflamatory and antagonistic tirades before I start reporting them.

“Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.” - Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen, Pithum Nullifier Training Manual c. YC104