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- Proposal of Ship Scanning as Hostile Act Resolution -
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Galaxy Chicken
Galaxy Farm Carebear Repurposing
#41 - 2016-07-26 18:24:30 UTC
I'm pretty sure a lot of people actually see us baddies as an undesirable element that the devs just haven't figured out how to remove.
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#42 - 2016-07-26 18:24:43 UTC
Lex Gabinia wrote:
Drago Shouna wrote:

But.....Players who play this game but fight against change are the problem. I'm not talking about the mechanics specifically, but the whole central concept needs to be examined and re-thought.



In the bolded section above you are, as I read it, asking to change the entire concept of the game. If you like a game but want to change the entire concept of the game, hence the game, then why play this game and not another game that has what you like?


Correct.

Basic Premise of Eve Online: You can be shot anywhere, anytime by anyone....who is willing to accept the consequences of such an action.

What this change is asking for is to limit the above.

The solution to "the problem" here is to not be stupid.

If you undock in a freighter with 8 billion ISK worth of goods....you are stupid. You are stupid because you have just put a "Gank Me!" sign on. If you reduced the value of your cargo you become much, much less interesting as a potential gank target. If you use the right kind of ship you might get away with it in certain circumstances (e.g. a JF jumping from a citadel to another citadel).

But the bottom line here is people are being stupid, other people are taking advantage of that, and the one's being stupid instead of accepting the consequences of their stupidity....want to change the fundamental nature of the game.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#43 - 2016-07-26 18:26:23 UTC
Galaxy Chicken wrote:
I'm pretty sure a lot of people actually see us baddies as an undesirable element that the devs just haven't figured out how to remove.


It is more than that...they do not realize that this is a feature, not a bug. To them it is a bug because they do not fully understand the game.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Drago Shouna
Doomheim
#44 - 2016-07-26 18:29:43 UTC
Lex Gabinia wrote:
Drago Shouna wrote:

But.....Players who play this game but fight against change are the problem. I'm not talking about the mechanics specifically, but the whole central concept needs to be examined and re-thought.



In the bolded section above you are, as I read it, asking to change the entire concept of the game. If you like a game but want to change the entire concept of the game, hence the game, then why play this game and not another game that has what you like?


This has a lot of what I like, but some things are just wrong and need re-examining now the playerbase is changing, and it is changing hence more and more of these kind of posts that have been locked over the last few days.

Ignoring them all won't make the players opinions change that made them, it'll eventually just **** them off enough for them to leave like so many others have, and players like you will cheer that we have one less whinging carebear, but where does it stop and we start to get a meaningful increase in new members that will stay?

Keeping things as they are obviously isn't working.

I've been here over 4 years now, and will probably be here for 4 more, but as a subbed player for all that time I'm entitled to an opinion, and my opinion is that it's sad to see players ignored and numbers shrinking.

Solecist Project...." They refuse to play by the rules and laws of the game and use it as excuse ..." " They don't care about how you play as long as they get to play how they want."

Welcome to EVE.
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#45 - 2016-07-26 18:31:45 UTC
Another option:

If you have small yet valuable cargo you cannot scan a blockade runner (not sure about a deep space transport). It is also one of the fastest ships in the game considering its class (an industrial hauler). Fit it properly and it is nearly impossible to gank in HS.

In fact, here let me help you Bads.

http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Hauling

Go there and read that page and the linked pages.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Galaxy Chicken
Galaxy Farm Carebear Repurposing
#46 - 2016-07-26 18:38:57 UTC
How about we let the marketing team worry about subscription numbers and us players just worry about having fun. Deal?
Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#47 - 2016-07-26 18:39:12 UTC
I cargo-scanned OP's skull...



..."No signatures detected"

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log
Lex Gabinia
Res Repetundae
#48 - 2016-07-26 18:40:22 UTC
Drago Shouna wrote:
Lex Gabinia wrote:
Drago Shouna wrote:

But.....Players who play this game but fight against change are the problem. I'm not talking about the mechanics specifically, but the whole central concept needs to be examined and re-thought.



In the bolded section above you are, as I read it, asking to change the entire concept of the game. If you like a game but want to change the entire concept of the game, hence the game, then why play this game and not another game that has what you like?


This has a lot of what I like, but some things are just wrong and need re-examining now the playerbase is changing, and it is changing hence more and more of these kind of posts that have been locked over the last few days.

Ignoring them all won't make the players opinions change that made them, it'll eventually just **** them off enough for them to leave like so many others have, and players like you will cheer that we have one less whinging carebear, but where does it stop and we start to get a meaningful increase in new members that will stay?

Keeping things as they are obviously isn't working.

I've been here over 4 years now, and will probably be here for 4 more, but as a subbed player for all that time I'm entitled to an opinion, and my opinion is that it's sad to see players ignored and numbers shrinking.

People have been leaving since the game started. I had a beta character and then along came a baby so I left for a couple of years. (for those doing maths and wondering about this character's birthdate, this is but one of three accounts - but it is the main on this account Smile ) Others tried and didn't like it and left. So what?

Players are not ignored. They are asking for changes that would break the basis of the game and the game developer is not willing to make those changes and have told the players this. Getting an answer that you did not want is not being ignored.

A game is designed on a certain basis, the game developers like that basis and have said as much repeatedly and recently. Why do they have to change? If a person does not like the games basis they are obliged to adapt to the game not the other way round. Or they can choose not to play.
Drago Shouna
Doomheim
#49 - 2016-07-26 18:44:02 UTC
Teckos Pech wrote:
Another option:

If you have small yet valuable cargo you cannot scan a blockade runner (not sure about a deep space transport). It is also one of the fastest ships in the game considering its class (an industrial hauler). Fit it properly and it is nearly impossible to gank in HS.

In fact, here let me help you Bads.

http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Hauling

Go there and read that page and the linked pages.


I use my Viator all the time with a cov-ops cloak and haven't lost one yet. Heck I even use it for lvl 2/3/4 distribution missions, the lvl 2/3 when I'm increasing standings with agents. Mines even fitted with a T II Salvager for when you come across the odd wreck at a gate.

Solecist Project...." They refuse to play by the rules and laws of the game and use it as excuse ..." " They don't care about how you play as long as they get to play how they want."

Welcome to EVE.
Vortexo VonBrenner
Doomheim
#50 - 2016-07-26 18:44:42 UTC
zus wrote:
Proposal of Ship Scanning as Hostile Act in any solar system, pass the Resolution

Cargo Scanners / Ship Scanners use as Hostile Act.

"pass the resolution"? I hate to disappoint you OP, but I don't think that's the way things work. CCP will do as they wish with their game, it's not run by vote of players.

Just double-wrap your cargo and nobody will be interested in it. :D




EvE security zones in pictures

EvE quick reference pdf

EvE links
Drago Shouna
Doomheim
#51 - 2016-07-26 18:48:17 UTC
Lex Gabinia wrote:
Drago Shouna wrote:
Lex Gabinia wrote:
Drago Shouna wrote:

But.....Players who play this game but fight against change are the problem. I'm not talking about the mechanics specifically, but the whole central concept needs to be examined and re-thought.



In the bolded section above you are, as I read it, asking to change the entire concept of the game. If you like a game but want to change the entire concept of the game, hence the game, then why play this game and not another game that has what you like?


This has a lot of what I like, but some things are just wrong and need re-examining now the playerbase is changing, and it is changing hence more and more of these kind of posts that have been locked over the last few days.

Ignoring them all won't make the players opinions change that made them, it'll eventually just **** them off enough for them to leave like so many others have, and players like you will cheer that we have one less whinging carebear, but where does it stop and we start to get a meaningful increase in new members that will stay?

Keeping things as they are obviously isn't working.

I've been here over 4 years now, and will probably be here for 4 more, but as a subbed player for all that time I'm entitled to an opinion, and my opinion is that it's sad to see players ignored and numbers shrinking.

People have been leaving since the game started. I had a beta character and then along came a baby so I left for a couple of years. (for those doing maths and wondering about this character's birthdate, this is but one of three accounts - but it is the main on this account Smile ) Others tried and didn't like it and left. So what?

Players are not ignored. They are asking for changes that would break the basis of the game and the game developer is not willing to make those changes and have told the players this. Getting an answer that you did not want is not being ignored.

A game is designed on a certain basis, the game developers like that basis and have said as much repeatedly and recently. Why do they have to change? If a person does not like the games basis they are obliged to adapt to the game not the other way round. Or they can choose not to play.



Repeatedly telling the players if you don't like it feel free to go away doesn't alter the fact that the majority of players feel something is wrong with the game.

Solecist Project...." They refuse to play by the rules and laws of the game and use it as excuse ..." " They don't care about how you play as long as they get to play how they want."

Welcome to EVE.
Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#52 - 2016-07-26 18:55:56 UTC
Drago Shouna wrote:
Lex Gabinia wrote:
Drago Shouna wrote:
Lex Gabinia wrote:
Drago Shouna wrote:

But.....Players who play this game but fight against change are the problem. I'm not talking about the mechanics specifically, but the whole central concept needs to be examined and re-thought.



In the bolded section above you are, as I read it, asking to change the entire concept of the game. If you like a game but want to change the entire concept of the game, hence the game, then why play this game and not another game that has what you like?


This has a lot of what I like, but some things are just wrong and need re-examining now the playerbase is changing, and it is changing hence more and more of these kind of posts that have been locked over the last few days.

Ignoring them all won't make the players opinions change that made them, it'll eventually just **** them off enough for them to leave like so many others have, and players like you will cheer that we have one less whinging carebear, but where does it stop and we start to get a meaningful increase in new members that will stay?

Keeping things as they are obviously isn't working.

I've been here over 4 years now, and will probably be here for 4 more, but as a subbed player for all that time I'm entitled to an opinion, and my opinion is that it's sad to see players ignored and numbers shrinking.

People have been leaving since the game started. I had a beta character and then along came a baby so I left for a couple of years. (for those doing maths and wondering about this character's birthdate, this is but one of three accounts - but it is the main on this account Smile ) Others tried and didn't like it and left. So what?

Players are not ignored. They are asking for changes that would break the basis of the game and the game developer is not willing to make those changes and have told the players this. Getting an answer that you did not want is not being ignored.

A game is designed on a certain basis, the game developers like that basis and have said as much repeatedly and recently. Why do they have to change? If a person does not like the games basis they are obliged to adapt to the game not the other way round. Or they can choose not to play.



Repeatedly telling the players if you don't like it feel free to go away doesn't alter the fact that the majority of players feel something is wrong with the game.

Prove iits the majority, anecdotal mewling on the forums dont count.

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
Swoop McFly
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#53 - 2016-07-26 19:04:34 UTC
Drago Shouna wrote:
Repeatedly telling the players if you don't like it feel free to go away doesn't alter the fact that the majority of players feel something is wrong with the game.


Repeatedly telling the players that something is wrong with the game doesn't alter the fact that the majority of players feel that there isn't.


See what I did there?
Drago Shouna
Doomheim
#54 - 2016-07-26 19:11:45 UTC
"Prove its the majority, anecdotal mewling on the forums don't count."



Well the last time I checked or we were given the stats, whatever, the vast majority of players were in 0.5 to 1.0 space, HS.

I can only presume as all these complaints and threads are started by players in said space that the majority are pissed off with certain playstyles, whether it's wardecs or plain ganking.

CCP will probably keep ignoring it all to a large extent, personally I'd much rather have more players to sell my stuff to rather than less and less.

Solecist Project...." They refuse to play by the rules and laws of the game and use it as excuse ..." " They don't care about how you play as long as they get to play how they want."

Welcome to EVE.
Paranoid Loyd
#55 - 2016-07-26 19:17:07 UTC  |  Edited by: Paranoid Loyd
Drago Shouna wrote:

I can only presume
Now that we've cleared that up stop saying the majority unless you preface it with any or all of the following: Ignorant, Lazy, Foolish

"There is only one authority in this game, and that my friend is violence. The supreme authority upon which all other authority is derived." ISD Max Trix

Fix the Prospect!
Shae Tadaruwa
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#56 - 2016-07-26 19:28:12 UTC
If you aren't doing anything stupid, there's nothing to fear from being scanned.

Dracvlad - "...Your intel is free intel, all you do is pay for it..." && "...If you warp on the same path as a cloaked ship, you'll make a bookmark at exactly the same spot as the cloaky camper..."
Max Fubarticus
K Diamond Holding LTD.
Bullets Bombs and Blondes
#57 - 2016-07-26 19:37:32 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
zus wrote:
Dark Lord Trump wrote:
Explain why? Cargo scanning is completely harmless to the target ship.



What is the motive in their use Question

Curiosity, same with the ship scanner.



I scanned a ship one time. The character had the usual stuff, ammo, nanite paste, scripts... several Frozen Corpses.
My reaction was... this dude has Jeffrey Dahmer syndrome. Freaked me out
Last time I scanned.Lol

Max

Civil discourse is uniquely human. After all, when is the last time a pride of lions and a herd of water buffalo negotiated SOV over a watering hole? Never. Someone either gets their ass kicked or eaten. At the end of the day someone holds SOV.
Darek Castigatus
Immortalis Inc.
Shadow Cartel
#58 - 2016-07-26 19:37:37 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
zus wrote:
Dark Lord Trump wrote:
Explain why? Cargo scanning is completely harmless to the target ship.



What is the motive in their use Question

Curiosity, same with the ship scanner.


Actually the ship scanner also has a combat use because it shows current capacitor levels, you'll usually see it on bhaalgorns and other neuting ships so they dont waste neuts on something thats already cap dry.

Pirates - The Invisible Fist of Darwin

you're welcome
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#59 - 2016-07-26 19:42:25 UTC
Drago Shouna wrote:

Repeatedly telling the players if you don't like it feel free to go away doesn't alter the fact that the majority of players feel something is wrong with the game.


There is nothing wrong with the game, it is that these players do not understand the game.

This is a game of choices and consequences, risk vs. reward. If you make a bad choice it can lead to bad consequences. These consequences are typically imposed by other players.

A player who loads up his freighter with 10 billion ISK in goodies and undocks is making a bad choice and taking a considerable risk....and for very little reward.

Just as one does not cross a street wearing a blind fold, one should not undock in a freighter with a cargo running into the billions of ISK.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online
Teckos Pech
Hogyoku
Goonswarm Federation
#60 - 2016-07-26 19:47:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Teckos Pech
Drago Shouna wrote:
"Prove its the majority, anecdotal mewling on the forums don't count."



Well the last time I checked or we were given the stats, whatever, the vast majority of players were in 0.5 to 1.0 space, HS.

I can only presume as all these complaints and threads are started by players in said space that the majority are pissed off with certain playstyles, whether it's wardecs or plain ganking.

CCP will probably keep ignoring it all to a large extent, personally I'd much rather have more players to sell my stuff to rather than less and less.


I am in a NS alliance.

I have had anywhere from 2 to all 6 of my alts in HS.

That there are pilots in HS, does not tell you much about the views of those players regarding the nature of the game.

"The curious task of economics is to demonstrate to men how little they really know about what they imagine they can design."--Friedrich August von Hayek

8 Golden Rules for EVE Online