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Every year, there are less users playing, why??

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Ralph King-Griffin
New Eden Tech Support
#61 - 2016-07-20 04:51:38 UTC
Caleb Seremshur wrote:
Johan Civire wrote:
Well the reason is pokemon go


A pretty damning condemnation of your product and/or service if Pokemon-Go has more pulling power over your own customer base than you do.

I've done the old double-dip unsub. Unsubbed, WWB happened, resubbed, realised I was still burnt out, unsubbed again.

Why?

It's tired. The game is tired. It actively fatigues me to play it.

People have been shot at over pokemongo, its digital darwinisim.

Murderers of Negotiable Motivations

=]|[=
Brokk Witgenstein
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#62 - 2016-07-20 05:54:47 UTC
We need more applied Darwinism. Lots and lots.
Rek Seven
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#63 - 2016-07-20 08:21:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Rek Seven
Pandora Carrollon wrote:

The issue here isn't CCP, it's you the player. Either you have literally done everything there is to do in EVE, or you have blocked off certain parts of the sandbox because you find them uninteresting. Regardless, the issue is still you.


Yeah it's like when you go out for dinner and your food tastes disgusting - it is not the foods fault. We are the ones with the taste buds so we are the ones to blame... Right?? Straight

All games get dull over time, that is to be expected. Eve takes about 1-2 years before you fully understand the game and decide what you do and don't like. After that point the question is whether the things you do like are enough to keep you coming back for more.

EVE is a very interesting game when you look at it as a whole but for a game that is all about spaceships it's pretty weak. It's supposed to be a futuristic space ship game but all you do is push buttons, unlike other games such as Elite dangerous, war thunder, etc where the actual flying of your craft can be exhilarating.

The wishlist is pretty much complete...
Noah Reese
#64 - 2016-07-20 10:16:16 UTC
CCP aimed for a more mainstream game with better palatable game mechanics appealing to a broader audience. This resulted in more people who didn't necessarily agree too much to the EVE values "of old" so they kept joining massive coalitions or kept to themselves otherwise, mostly forms of pve grind.

What EVE needs are content creators and initiators. These are sorely lacking because the old guard is either bored, burnt out or decided that this isn't "their" EVE anymore and simply stopped bothering. The newer players lack the drive for this because of the above mentioned reasons.

It's been going on for a long while and people, me included, have been stating for years now that this was bound to happen. The question is ofc course which route will end up being best for EVE, of that I'm not sure.
Caleb Seremshur
Bloodhorn
Patchwork Freelancers
#65 - 2016-07-20 10:42:49 UTC
Rek Seven wrote:
Pandora Carrollon wrote:

The issue here isn't CCP, it's you the player. Either you have literally done everything there is to do in EVE, or you have blocked off certain parts of the sandbox because you find them uninteresting. Regardless, the issue is still you.


Yeah it's like when you go out for dinner and your food tastes disgusting - it is not the foods fault. We are the ones with the taste buds so we are the ones to blame... Right?? Straight

All games get dull over time, that is to be expected. Eve takes about 1-2 years before you fully understand the game and decide what you do and don't like. After that point the question is whether the things you do like are enough to keep you coming back for more.

EVE is a very interesting game when you look at it as a whole but for a game that is all about spaceships it's pretty weak. It's supposed to be a futuristic space ship game but all you do is push buttons, unlike other games such as Elite dangerous, war thunder, etc where the actual flying of your craft can be exhilarating.


I still play runescape... been playing that since 2003.
Towron Paboo
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#66 - 2016-07-20 11:05:43 UTC
I started two month ago...and now I will quit again.
Reason is, that I get killed over and over again in high-sec while mining some minerals and afterwards getting mails that press charges. As long as a game says that it is legal to kill newbies while they try to find out how the game works.
I won't pay for something like that...sandbox or not...there should be an area where I am save, especially as a newbie.
So you won't get new players when most of them make such an anoying experience.
Have fun.
CowQueen MMXII
#67 - 2016-07-20 11:13:34 UTC  |  Edited by: CowQueen MMXII
Yun Kuai wrote:

1) The biggest problem area is that in my almost 8 of years of playing, the game's core mechanics (read pve) are almost exactly the same as when I started.


PVE is not the game's core mechanic, maybe one of many, but even that can be argued.

Yun Kuai wrote:

2) The inflation factor ...

There is no inflation in EVE, only thing getting more expensive is Plex and even that drpped significantly in the last few months. Last EVE Vegas there was a nice presentation about that.

Yun Kuai wrote:

3) Cookie cutter class changes also took a lot of fun out flying different ships


Right now, much more modules and ships are useful for different purposes as in the last few years. Before tiericide, many ships and most modules were actually quite crappy and were only used on the way up to the top choice. I also don't see any ship being so dominant right now that it qualifies as cookie cutter and even the different weapon systems within the larger groups (missiles, hybrids,...) seem balanced in a way that everything has its place (remember the time where the only good medium missile was the heavy missile and the Tengu made battleships with cruise missiles almost oboslete?)

Moo! Uddersucker, moo!
Dirty Forum Alt
Forum Alts Anonymous
#68 - 2016-07-20 11:17:29 UTC
Towron Paboo wrote:
I started two month ago...and now I will quit again.
Reason is, that I get killed over and over again in high-sec while mining some minerals and afterwards getting mails that press charges. As long as a game says that it is legal to kill newbies while they try to find out how the game works.
I won't pay for something like that...sandbox or not...there should be an area where I am save, especially as a newbie.
So you won't get new players when most of them make such an anoying experience.
Have fun.

As an actual new player (up to 1 month old per CCP I believe) - you are safe in the rookie systems designated by CCP - but yeah there is nothing worth mining in them, and they get mined out fast every day, so you probably weren't in one.

You could also try learning how to fit a tank onto your ship, or just try something other than mining...

The dead swans lay in the stagnant pool. They lay. They rotted. They turned Around occasionally. Bits of flesh dropped off them from Time to time. And sank into the pool's mire. They also smelt a great deal.

Paula Nancy Millstone Jennings (Sussex)
Tao Dolcino
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#69 - 2016-07-20 12:00:46 UTC
Dirty Forum Alt wrote:
or just try something other than mining...


Yes, but it's not a solution : someone has to mine, at the end, so his point is valid.
It's a bit the same than when a new pilot says : earning ISK is difficult with mining, and a vet answers : "don't bother, mate, just buy a PLEX and sell it for ISK". How often i read that kind of sentences from vets. "mining is not worth it, give up".
Then who will mine the ore we all need ?
Mining and missions are the two main ways to start making ISK in EVE, and new players are always told that these activities are not "noble", (but ganking noob miners is noble Roll)
All what you vets have to propose to the new players is : pay to win. Buy PLEX with real money, sell it, so you don't have to work hard for your ISK.
Then where is the sense of accomplishment ?
Why mining the hard way is carebear, and pay to win gankers are hardcore ? Isn't there something hypocrite in all that ?
I understand very well why new miners leave EVE.
Brokk Witgenstein
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#70 - 2016-07-20 12:07:33 UTC
Towron Paboo wrote:
As long as a game says that it is legal to kill newbies while they try to find out how the game works.
I won't pay for something like that...sandbox or not...there should be an area where I am save, especially as a newbie.


But you were so close! You already found out an important part of how the game works: there is no area where you're safe.
Caleb Seremshur
Bloodhorn
Patchwork Freelancers
#71 - 2016-07-20 12:19:06 UTC
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:
Towron Paboo wrote:
As long as a game says that it is legal to kill newbies while they try to find out how the game works.
I won't pay for something like that...sandbox or not...there should be an area where I am save, especially as a newbie.


But you were so close! You already found out an important part of how the game works: there is no area where you're safe.


Well they newbie systems are safe zones kind of so that's one myth debunked straight away.
Dirty Forum Alt
Forum Alts Anonymous
#72 - 2016-07-20 12:20:28 UTC
Tao Dolcino wrote:
Dirty Forum Alt wrote:
or just try something other than mining...


Yes, but it's not a solution : someone has to mine, at the end, so his point is valid.
It's a bit the same than when a new pilot says : earning ISK is difficult with mining, and a vet answers : "don't bother, mate, just buy a PLEX and sell it for ISK". How often i read that kind of sentences from vets. "mining is not worth it, give up".
Then who will mine the ore we all need ?
Mining and missions are the two main ways to start making ISK in EVE, and new players are always told that these activities are not "noble", (but ganking noob miners is noble Roll)
All what you vets have to propose to the new players is : pay to win. Buy PLEX with real money, sell it, so you don't have to work hard for your ISK.
Then where is the sense of accomplishment ?
Why mining the hard way is carebear, and pay to win gankers are hardcore ? Isn't there something hypocrite in all that ?
I understand very well why new miners leave EVE.

I have never recommended buying plex to anybody - but then I'm against micro-transactions in general.

I advocate their getting into missions starting out - particularly the rookie missions that give them a big boost in isk/skills/equipment.

People will always mine - and if they are smart they'll find the profitable areas to do it and learn to defend themselves in their chosen home. **** I didn't even tell him not to mine - I gave him *2* options. Learn to protect himself *or* do something else.

Why are you all so eager to take offence? One would think you felt guilty about your chosen profession of mining...Seriously, stop being so defensive.


PS: I'm not saying ganking miners is noble. I'm not a part of CODE, and I have no interest in that style of play. But they *are* part of the game - so burying your head in the sand and pretending gankers don't exist is just stupid.

The dead swans lay in the stagnant pool. They lay. They rotted. They turned Around occasionally. Bits of flesh dropped off them from Time to time. And sank into the pool's mire. They also smelt a great deal.

Paula Nancy Millstone Jennings (Sussex)
Brokk Witgenstein
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#73 - 2016-07-20 12:21:36 UTC
Caleb Seremshur wrote:
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:
Towron Paboo wrote:
As long as a game says that it is legal to kill newbies while they try to find out how the game works.
I won't pay for something like that...sandbox or not...there should be an area where I am save, especially as a newbie.


But you were so close! You already found out an important part of how the game works: there is no area where you're safe.


Well they newbie systems are safe zones kind of so that's one myth debunked straight away.


They are not. You can perfectly shoot a vet on the undock of Pator Tech school. Just can't grief the new players there.
Consider the myth bunked again ;-)
Dirty Forum Alt
Forum Alts Anonymous
#74 - 2016-07-20 12:32:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Dirty Forum Alt
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:
Caleb Seremshur wrote:
Brokk Witgenstein wrote:
Towron Paboo wrote:
As long as a game says that it is legal to kill newbies while they try to find out how the game works.
I won't pay for something like that...sandbox or not...there should be an area where I am save, especially as a newbie.


But you were so close! You already found out an important part of how the game works: there is no area where you're safe.


Well they newbie systems are safe zones kind of so that's one myth debunked straight away.


They are not. You can perfectly shoot a vet on the undock of Pator Tech school. Just can't grief the new players there.
Consider the myth bunked again ;-)

TBH I kind of miss the days when CCP didn't enforce their rules on rookie griefing. I got a lot of my early PvP experience counter-baiting the people picking on new players in those systems....I think my record was about 150 in a single month. Seriously, they were almost as bad as the new players they were picking on - and oh so much more satisfying.



In any case, as I say, the official CCP line in the sand is 1 month of age or less in such systems is protected - anything over 30 days and you are fair game even there.

The dead swans lay in the stagnant pool. They lay. They rotted. They turned Around occasionally. Bits of flesh dropped off them from Time to time. And sank into the pool's mire. They also smelt a great deal.

Paula Nancy Millstone Jennings (Sussex)
Brokk Witgenstein
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#75 - 2016-07-20 12:52:05 UTC
To be fair, I too ragequit like ... (can't remember lol- too long ago. 2007? 2008?), and started over two years ago on this toon.

That first month can be a real bad experience if you don't stumble by coincidence upon the right people to help you along. Is this why allegedly subs are down? I don't think so. There is more information available now than ever before, and most folks really are willing to help.

Some of them just don't want to hear it though. How many Ventures / Retrievers do you have to lose before you think "hmm... maybe this Catalyst is not my friend?", before you think "before I let the dog out, maybe I should dock up and not be AFK in space?"

At some point, eventually, a wreck has to be produced to get the point across.
Crinnfika
Doomheim
#76 - 2016-07-20 13:14:54 UTC
The biggest problem is that EvE has basically no marketing presence outside of its own community.

When I tell some of my other gaming friends that I play EvE I one of two responses:
"What's Eve?"
or
"Wait Eve still exists?"

Right now youtube is the closest thing Eve has to marketing, and Eve makes terrible youtube videos. (yay colored dots everywhere!)
Dirty Forum Alt
Forum Alts Anonymous
#77 - 2016-07-20 13:19:58 UTC
Crinnfika wrote:
The biggest problem is...

Perhaps the *biggest* problem is that so many EVE players are so eager to tell CCP what the "biggest" problem is - and 1000 players will provide 1000 *different* problems - all 100% sure that theirs is the "biggest" one.....

The dead swans lay in the stagnant pool. They lay. They rotted. They turned Around occasionally. Bits of flesh dropped off them from Time to time. And sank into the pool's mire. They also smelt a great deal.

Paula Nancy Millstone Jennings (Sussex)
Pres Crendraven
#78 - 2016-07-20 13:30:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Pres Crendraven
Its been several years, I'm back for a couple months, maybe. In a word it was Nerfs that drove me out but its more complicated and has to do with the skill que. I thought I had signed a hidden contract with CCP that if I stayed long, paid my dues and set alarms to wake up in the middle of the night that I too would be able to fly a few awesome OP ships like the ones used to blow me out of the sky.

But every time I would train up to the ship of my dreams they would nerf it and I would have to start down a new path.

This is my new toon. I trained him to be an average frigate pilot.

His skill que is empty and will stay that way. But I came back and even his Tristan got stripped of his rocket launcher. Come here ******* CCP, come and take my light ion blasters. Who could believe they would have to nerf rockets. comeon, it was 9 dps. You got 15 bucks, go buy a beer. It was a bad decision in 07 when I started, a good decision in 12 when I quit, and another bad one in 16 to check in.

Oh yeah mining? Minecraft is fun, I got an OP pick, come and try to get it.

Meta34me

Corp and Alliance details hidden to protect the innocent.
Noah Reese
#79 - 2016-07-20 13:57:16 UTC
Crinnfika wrote:
The biggest problem is that EvE has basically no marketing presence outside of its own community.

When I tell some of my other gaming friends that I play EvE I one of two responses:
"What's Eve?"
or
"Wait Eve still exists?"

Right now youtube is the closest thing Eve has to marketing, and Eve makes terrible youtube videos. (yay colored dots everywhere!)


Just today I spoke to a new coworker, a 40something gamer like me. He's played lots of shooters, a few MMOs and a bunch of coop games and whatnot but he had never heard of EVE.
Josef Djugashvilis
#80 - 2016-07-20 15:02:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Josef Djugashvilis
I play less now, not directly because of 'cash for skills' but over time the niggles build up and I seem to find other things to do, whereas previously it was a case of, 'great I have a couple of hours to kill, I'll log in and do something'.

Mostly the daft things CCP come up with, 'loot spew' for example are balanced by the good things, but, and maybe it's just me, 'cash for skills' seems to be an an irreversible step in the wrong direction.

My annual sub is due shortly and I shall renew it.

I have been playing Eve for too long to give up on it easily.

This is not a signature.