Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Emotions do not care if they brought about by a game or by an event in real life. To say that someones emotions, feelings of being a victim are useless and of no value is simply crazy because they are just as important AND just as real to that person as the good feelings are that you might get from killing them. See that's the issue with emotions and emotional reactions, simply because you do not feel that way, or because you think others should not feel a certain way does not mean that they do not.

Another issue here is that you and Black Pedro claim that you are not telling people how they should feel when in simple reality that is exactly what you are doing. In fact you not only tell them that is in fact what you are doing when you tell them that it is not possible to be a victimized because game and all that and therefore it is not possible to be victim.

True... you are allowed to be emotional when you lose. It is natural.

But regardless of one's emotional state, if someone "loses" in a game and demands that the game be modified to be more to his/her benefit/liking based on something as subjective as emotions... you also enable everyone else to make the same argument on the same basis.
And they may want things to be VERY different from you want.

If you lose, I am sorry. But people do have to learn that loss is natural and you are never going to get exactly what you want (not even the most hardened and bloodthirsty PVPer vets what they want in EVE)

I keep saying this, and almost nobody seems to be able to see how important this is!

DST's are almost there. Now give them 4-5 high slots and 3-4 turret/launcher slots, and the PG/CPU to actually use them. And you actually have a reasonable T2 Heavy transporter for EVE.

The whole 'Industrials have to have no guns' is a blinkered mindset, and that is what we are challenging here. The idea that is at the very foundation of this. Would it mean that people could create some niche combat fits using industrial hulls that actually would be mostly effective, sure but who cares? Isn't that a good thing that someone who is only trained in Industrial hulls can then use a niche fit to actually be effective in PvP. And no, your linked KM's showing the super rare bait KM that already exists don't count given they all involve either loads of logi, an afk ship someone found, or a very very bad fit & piloting.

Escorts are also a joke, we all know it. The isk simply isn't there for a start, also escorts can't really do much to stop a gank in 10 seconds in Highsec, yes there are a few niche things they can attempt and pray do enough, but with the shortness of the time a gank has to happen in they really can't do much, and we all know how much everyone 'loves' freighter escorts in low/null and wants to go back to no jump freighters or bridges right..... right.... No, didn't think people really wanted to go back to that sort of mind numbing tedium.

Also note that we are calling for longer gank timers, not shorter, and for lag inducing concord spawns to be replaced with a basically lag free method alongside this also.
The idea is not to 'nerf' ganking but to increase interaction and variables. If anything the changes I'm suggesting would buff ganking since it would be easier to gank combat ships (even if they can actually shoot back).

How is that a reasonable heavy transporter, while a ship that merely tanks it's way through gatecamps isn't? Why do you think people will use the extra grid to fit guns, instead of using it to fit an oversized repper? (and a cyno, of course)

What do you think a hauler with 4-5 unbonused guns, so ~150-200 DPS, is actually going to achieve?

Why are the ships I fly literally every day considered super rare bait KMs? I stroll through gatecamps in that occator.

If someone is only trained in industrial hulls, but they have the skills to use weapons, then they're skilled in frigates, destroyers and probably cruisers. If they aren't, it's less than ten hours train for them to get their racial cruiser and medium weapon skills, without implants. That's from a brand new character, so if someone is properly skilled in industrial ships, it'll be less.

Any of those ships will be more effective in PVP than a fat, slow brick with frigate DPS. (Incidentally, what is stopping you using industrial ships in PVP anyway? Tank a nerus, fill with drones, neuts in the highs. It isn't hard.)

Please note that I have never mentioned escorts. That's a job for the hauler pilot's alt anyway.

there should be buff for ganking

widen gap between 1 and .5 for Concord respond, then implement security tax of (7.5%*(Sec System-.5)) for Mission, Bounty, and LP.

idk what to do for hauler