EVE General Discussion

That is how structures tend to work in this game. The vulnerability window is set by the group anchoring the structure. Been that way pretty much forever. See, figured you wouldn't like it.

Might I suggest you sit down and have a long hard think....maybe this game is not for you. You will get shot at. You will be killed. You cannot stop this kind of thing. Not in this game.

This is not true...or more accurately it ignores the actual history.

Some merc corps would hunt via the watchlist. They'd use it to see when people are online. Then they'd run locator agents. Then go to that system...if not there start scouting surrounding systems. Find the guy, and if in space and feasible, engage him.

After the watchlist change, the first step is now gone. Making the remaining steps that much more difficult.

Oh...and you do realize you can also fly ships with guns on them too. Nothing says you can't undock and shoot them in the face too.

In fact, if they have decced several corps at once, try contacting those corps. See if any would be interested in working cooperatively.

Find a main system where you can both stage out off. Get ships in that system so you can fight. If you have the numbers get some guys in logistics ships as well. Work on fleet composition--kitchen sink doesn't work well. Get everyone in ships of similar capabilities.

To get ships there maybe have 1 or 2 guys drop corp or have their alts drop corp and use freighters to move ships to your staging system and put ships on contracts.

If they have 5 guys after you, try to bring 7, 8, 9 or even 10 guys.

It is not free unless you let it be free. See the guys doing the war dec...they have OOC corp alts do their hauling, immune to war decs. They know about ganking and how to avoid it. Failing that they can also use Red Frog Freight. In other words, it is only free because the understand the game better than you and take advantage wherever they can. Whereas you do not. You do not use all the advantages available to you and instead come to the forums and complain bitterly.



Of course it is a real fight. It is a real fight in that shots were fired, something blew up and an killmail was generated. If you were expecting some sort of honorable e-bushido forget it. That is just errant nonsense and not how this game works. When you have an opponent you hit him wherever he is weakest. If that means he was foolish enough to undock a freighter you hit him there.



There are no bonuses. If you force them to dock up...you have won that engagement. Yes, you might have to camp them in for awhile, but doing that is how war decs work. The idea of a structure(s) is actually not bad, in that it gives both sides something to fight over. If you force them to dock up and then go and shoot their structure the war is over. If not then you have a fight. Same for your structure. That is how it works in NS. Shoot the structures. Defend them and you have a fight. Don’t defend them you lose your sov.

As ever, drac missing the point by a hares breth, geronimo regurgitating truisms and half truths and whiles ignoring people flat out telling him how to do what je says is impossible.

Lads we have had this conversation, now off to bed with the lot of ye.

You start off with not true all the time and then never say why it is not true. These people have chosen to hunt in a segment of the game that is the safest, what do they expect to find, seriously. I never really went on about this part as I thought it was damn obvious, but I am surprised to see that it is not. If you want to hunt carebears then expect to get kiss and cuddles back and a hurt stare.

The watch list was free intel which you get upset with elsewhere, please be consistent, I want the OS to give this data on a per constellation basis and the happy thing is that it is something to shoot for the more aggressive but not so competent hisec players, that in itself can change attitudes over time. As I said the move towards just doing hub and pipe camping happened before the watch list changed and was due to the lack of targets.

Why? Wars are legal in New Eden. You gave your opponent notice and filed the proper paperwork so now you get to fight. If you don't want to fight, then don't. You can dock up, or just opt-out of the war by leaving the corporation.

Exploding, harassing, stealing from, and possibly completely destroying your opponent is all part of war. Corporations are expected to defend themselves from those that want to wage war on them, but whether you defend a corporation is completely up to you. If you don't enjoy that, or tire of any given war, then just leave or stay out of a player corporation.

Of course it is a real fight. Assets are on the line and both sides want different results. Consequences flow from who wins such an engagement and there are many decisions a player can make to get their desired outcome.

It's true though that undocking a freighter in highsec while in a war is a pretty poor decision in the first place given all the options to move goods available. But if you choose to do so, then getting to your destination safely means you have won that fight.

Killing and taking the goods of your enemy should be one of your goals in most wars. It weakens them and makes you stronger. Capturing a prize in a legal war is not piracy or robbery - there is a long tradition of such actions in real-world wars (not that really means much in this video game).

If you don't want to lose your stuff in a war, then don't get yourself in a war in the first place. But if you are fighting a war, it is up to you to do what is necessary to keep your stuff safe as it is fair game. All's fair in love and war remember?

Why would you want to punish intended game play? So players don't do it? If you don't want them to declare war, then just eliminate wars. That's much cleaner and more fair than making wars so costly or risky that no one ever declares one. More honest too.

Wars are fine. They enable legal fighting in highsec as they are intended to do. All that is needed (aside from maybe a wardec-immune social corp for small groups that aren't competing and some mechanism to penalize corp-hopping) are some structures that the aggressors want or have to use to provide something to counter-attack if they refuse to undock. Loss of that structure can't end the war as that makes your structures invulnerable, but you should be able to inflict some financial loss on the aggressor if they choose to not undock. After all you, the defender, have the choice not to undock if the other side shows up with overwhelming force, so it is only fair that the other side is treated the same.

i actually think, as a war dec corp/alliance, because you are paying for the ability to destroy ships in high sec we should have access to additional information. An extra panel containing the active war decs and who is offline and online and where they are located.

At the same time this information should be available to the defending corp/alliance.

At the same time war deccing should be linked to some sort of leaderboard and badging system linked to some sort of "opportunity" which in turn scales war dec costs.

from a defenders point of view they too have "opportunity" and completion of tasks rewards reduced length of time of war dec, increased time inbetween being decced again or just some sort of reward linked activity. (mining so much whilst a war dec is active, NPC ratting whilst a war dec is active)

I hate the war dec mechanic.
on one hand it's an easy way to sign into the game and hunt/pvp/get dunked or what ever on the other it feels like an out of date mechanic paying so many millions in ISK for next to nothing in return on both sides.

To me the answer is simple.

A corp ticks a box as being a Merc and in return they pay higher costs for war decs but get special access to a upto date panel giving info about who is signed in and where and what ship they are in and location.

Corps/ Alliances that don't tick the box as a Merc don't get this information.

Defenders receive this information automatically but are locked into being in the corp until the war dec is over. This should stop a war decced corp from joining an NPC corp. Again another example of the mechanic being somewhat overdue an overhaul.

Good for them, its those players that have joined Pandemic Horde rather than hisec and it shows. Yes I was in that situation as a new player too, was funny.

I have read Feyd's blog, he writes very well.

I have plenty of war dec experience, mainly as a defender but including being aggressors and allies, you do know it was me who destroyed Siegfried Cohenbergs POS in Niarja a while back, that was an ally war dec you know... The other aggresive war decs I was in an entity that did it and I was involved in two POS take downs, see an objective in space, funny that...

I do not tend to fight the main war dec entities, though the last two decs I had I was looking to pick some people off, the right opportunity did not manifest itself, there was a Legion in Amarr that I was set up to kill but someone killed him first. I have plenty of experience of war decs. And without the watch list I now go off and do stuff in space and I never drop corp with my main toons, though I do drop my alts out to do stuff or scout for me. But nice try... Do you have to blanket war dec to be able to comment on war decs?

I am talking about the new players joining the game and going straight to null sec as they joined Pandemic Horde, it is one of the reasons that content has dried up in hisec, but perhaps that intake will then come back to hisec and be more up for it then a normal batch of new players, one can only hope so... You are talking about new players that are doing stuff in hisec, good for them.

I agree, PvP should exist in hisec, but it does not have to be just as cannon fodder, the key thing is to change peoples attitudes on both sides of the fence and that is not easy. A good start is not to assume that people are against PvP in hisec because they have a different viewpoint.