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[118.6] Recurring Opportunity removal

First post First post First post
Author
Naz al-Ghul
State War Academy
Caldari State
#361 - 2016-07-01 12:44:21 UTC
I think there should be a return of Thrill of the Hunt later, but in an expanded form. I'm of a mind that the skill queue should be accelerated through activity within the game. I.e. You get a really small boost for logging in, but you also get a boost for clearing out ratting sites, finishing manufacturing projects, mining an asteroid to its depletion. Basically a player should be rewarded for playing the game outside of just material gains and losses through ISK. I get that this is a massively multiplayer space simulation and not a traditional MMO, but traditional MMOs have ideas that keep people logged in. We can borrow some of those ideas on some level and retain EVE Online's identity. So long as there is risk involved or resources involved, it's perfectly fine.
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#362 - 2016-07-01 16:02:33 UTC
Titanium Seagull wrote:
Daichi Yamato wrote:
Ekanea Molou wrote:
Hi CCP. Perhaps if you measure the crowd's reaction in response to withdrawing this potentially addictive game element, you could improve your data? Why did you remove it?


You missed this thread then?

The response to the feature was overwhelmingly negative.


Yes, most new players, casual players, or returning players missed it because we don't read the forums daily. We don't scour them for things to complain about, but we do come to them when changes that we care about are linked in patch notes, hence the reason you see an 'overwhelmingly negative' response initially, and now an 'overwhelmingly negative' response to their removal.

Honestly, this is going to be the reason I quit and never come back. It's a little thing, but it's a thing that matters. It's a thing that's indicative of what CCP is doing. They've adopted a freemium model of upsells for 'big fish' by introducing skill injectors. The changes to the economy have made it very difficult to succeed in doing anything without buying and selling PLEX (I remember when getting to L3 missions meant you could actually afford the ship required to farm them).

If you're going to go after a freemium model for your income, make your game free to play.

If you're not, then don't penalize new players for not buying your freemium nonsense, and don't yank those few things that could help new players get an edge after only a few weeks.

Unless something amazing happens before the time I've already bought runs out, I probably won't even log again. There's just no reason to play as a newbro.


No the response was still overwhelmingly negative. look at the number of posts in that thread compared to here.

You guys have gotten hung up on thinking it allows you to train faster than vets. it doesnt, you train SLOWER than vets with these dailies. For the thousandth time, if noobs want to train faster, there are a million better ways to do it than dailies. i.e. just make noobs train faster. (this is actually how it used to work...you know, when EVE was constantly growing in subscription base.)

The other thing you are hung up on is that you cant do anything without billions of isk and millions of SP. You have simply and completely missed the whole point of eve and thats probably why you've repeatedly quit.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#363 - 2016-07-01 16:04:55 UTC
Naz al-Ghul wrote:
I think there should be a return of Thrill of the Hunt later, but in an expanded form. I'm of a mind that the skill queue should be accelerated through activity within the game. I.e. You get a really small boost for logging in, but you also get a boost for clearing out ratting sites, finishing manufacturing projects, mining an asteroid to its depletion. Basically a player should be rewarded for playing the game outside of just material gains and losses through ISK. I get that this is a massively multiplayer space simulation and not a traditional MMO, but traditional MMOs have ideas that keep people logged in. We can borrow some of those ideas on some level and retain EVE Online's identity. So long as there is risk involved or resources involved, it's perfectly fine.


Why should botters get even more benefits than waht they do now?
Why should people be penalised for having a job and a family?

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Koldais
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#364 - 2016-07-01 19:54:35 UTC
Took out the 10,000SP daily and replaced it with garbage only people without a job, family or life can do?

This is the only way I can express my disgust to CPP

http://s369.photobucket.com/user/koldfusion77/media/Buycot_CCP.jpg.html
NovaCat13
Seymourus and Co.
#365 - 2016-07-02 14:31:02 UTC
Good riddance

Koldais wrote:
Took out the 10,000SP daily and replaced it with garbage only people without a job, family or life can do?

This is the only way I can express my disgust to CPP

http://s369.photobucket.com/user/koldfusion77/media/Buycot_CCP.jpg.html


That's funny because that's what I did because they added dailies. I also stopped logging in.

Just say NO to Dailies

elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
Brave Collective
#366 - 2016-07-02 20:06:26 UTC
Naz al-Ghul wrote:
I think there should be a return of Thrill of the Hunt later, but in an expanded form. I'm of a mind that the skill queue should be accelerated through activity within the game. I.e. You get a really small boost for logging in, but you also get a boost for clearing out ratting sites, finishing manufacturing projects, mining an asteroid to its depletion. Basically a player should be rewarded for playing the game outside of just material gains and losses through ISK. I get that this is a massively multiplayer space simulation and not a traditional MMO, but traditional MMOs have ideas that keep people logged in. We can borrow some of those ideas on some level and retain EVE Online's identity. So long as there is risk involved or resources involved, it's perfectly fine.


No!

You know my fellow capsuleers that you give names are this way because they stayed through all the hardship. Now you get everything handed to you on a golden platter and you complain and complain.

The only time I complained was when I made the observation that it takes a while to train 10 attribute skills to shove of a minute or two of the other skills training time. My complaint was to my corpmates who went through the very same phase as I did back then.

So get over yourselves already, EVE is not a f-ing level up game. You have engineering V, so do I - big deal.

NOBODY can train any skill beyond V but you believe you need all that.

Spoiler alert, you do not.

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

Aura sound-clips: Aura forever

Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#367 - 2016-07-02 22:16:13 UTC
NovaCat13 wrote:
Good riddance

Koldais wrote:
Took out the 10,000SP daily and replaced it with garbage only people without a job, family or life can do?

This is the only way I can express my disgust to CPP

http://s369.photobucket.com/user/koldfusion77/media/Buycot_CCP.jpg.html


That's funny because that's what I did because they added dailies. I also stopped logging in.


I was gonna say, the new events with extended periods and a ceiling to rewards are actually better for those with commitments outside the game.

But it's curious to see that a fan of the old dailies has time to mess around with photo bucket to make a qq post and what looks like a man-cave Roll

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Caleb Seremshur
Mortis Angelus
The morgue.
#368 - 2016-07-03 08:00:12 UTC
Disappointed this happened. That's all I got to say.
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
Brave Collective
#369 - 2016-07-03 13:47:53 UTC  |  Edited by: elitatwo
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
LUH-3417 Ormand wrote:
Hold on, I've got it. New players can only acquire SP by defeating other players in PvP at .00001% of your opponent's SP. This would clearly enhance the NPE and even encourage interaction. Retention would go through the roof!
Big smileBig smileBig smileBig smileBig smileBig smileBig smileBig smileBig smileBig smile


I'd love to see opportunities related to PVP that award SP, aimed at new players.

A 'Get your first kill' opportunity, a 'Kill 5 players in lowsec' opportunity, a 'Kill 5 players in nullsec or wormholes' opportunity, a 'Legally kill someone in highsec' opportunity, an 'Illegally kill someone in highsec' opportunity - all of these would provide pointers toward the fun parts of EVE.

Hell, even a 'Lose 10 ships in PVP' opportunity would be great.

Obviously vets making alt accounts would do them too and would collude to achieve them easily, but that won't stop them achieving something.


That is interesting since it would serve even vets that may be interested in pvp but never really did anything else but to obey orders in 100% tidi before.

In this case I define pvp as in they go out on their own and cannot call 5000 fax carriers for help if things go south. The experience gathering here would be invaluable since skillbooks have zero influence in how long you can extent your ships lifetime, only your decisions can.

I urge everyone to watch the "eveiseasy" youtube channel and see what a 21 day old can do with the experience of a vet like Suitonia.
And you have to admit 21 days is not so unappealing as a decade now, is it?

In my experience the skillpoints newbies envy to have early on are not as important as knowing how to fly your ship and in case you have a favorite ship that you like to fly every day, it is much more difficult to fight someone who know her / his ship that well.
You spend day fiddling with your fit until you found yours that works for you and only you and when you wreck havoc for the first time it will feel like your "first time".

At that point when you train a gunnery skill from lets say 3 to 4 you will feel your progress much different than you would if you just apply point somewhere.

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

Aura sound-clips: Aura forever

Skiff Laduko
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#370 - 2016-07-04 12:03:44 UTC
Being pretty new I was kind of liking the SPs. Seems to take for ever to gain some relatively low level skill. Looked into skill injectors, but what low level player has 700mil Isk laying around.
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
Brave Collective
#371 - 2016-07-04 14:58:22 UTC
Skiff Laduko wrote:
Being pretty new I was kind of liking the SPs. Seems to take for ever to gain some relatively low level skill. Looked into skill injectors, but what low level player has 700mil Isk laying around.


EVERYONE trained those skills from ZERO to now. You ungrateful noobs start all at level 3. And you do not have to train your attributes ontop of your silver-spoon.

Train the skills like everyone else did. That will put you in the right place and you can get experience your progression like you should - gradually not instant.

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

Aura sound-clips: Aura forever

LUH-3417 Ormand
Gallente Distribution Manufacturing Mining
#372 - 2016-07-04 15:37:13 UTC
As long as newbs don't find the game fun and entertaining, we're happy. Roll
Visello Gaterau
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#373 - 2016-07-04 18:31:10 UTC
Guess the eve just got hard for the skids and will return to wow agian for their dailies Lol
Viala Kreatoro
Doomheim
#374 - 2016-07-05 08:03:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Viala Kreatoro
elitatwo wrote:
Skiff Laduko wrote:
Being pretty new I was kind of liking the SPs. Seems to take for ever to gain some relatively low level skill. Looked into skill injectors, but what low level player has 700mil Isk laying around.


EVERYONE trained those skills from ZERO to now. You ungrateful noobs start all at level 3. And you do not have to train your attributes ontop of your silver-spoon.

Train the skills like everyone else did. That will put you in the right place and you can get experience your progression like you should - gradually not instant.


At those times you couldnt even warp through a system in one go. What a blast of a game that was, in the first month or 2 of your character.

And since my main is from those days im not an ungrateful kid, i'm someone that sees this game dying because of CCP undeniable stupid decisions.

The problem this game will always have is its ungrateful old EXPERT Userbase. And some pretending as if they always paid for the game when in reality a lot of them have used the plex system to get the **** for free and they have no problem to use the noobs. But when it comes to the experience and the right of the noob player to make their voices heard than that is completly unfair.

And eitherway you look at it, it produced unhappy players, and unhappy players leave.
So great move CCP for letting eve quicker be gone into oblivion while experimenting without communicating.
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#375 - 2016-07-05 15:02:46 UTC
Viala Kreatoro wrote:


The problem this game will always have is its ungrateful old EXPERT Userbase. And some pretending as if they always paid for the game when in reality a lot of them have used the plex system to get the **** for free and they have no problem to use the noobs. But when it comes to the experience and the right of the noob player to make their voices heard than that is completly unfair.



Noobs plex their accounts and inject their skills just as much as vets.

No one has a problem with noobs voicing their opinion. But i have a problem with no life grinders pushing their agenda and preying on the ignorance of noobs trying to get a feature that actually favours vets.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

KaarBaak
Squirrel Team
#376 - 2016-07-05 22:33:08 UTC
Koldais wrote:
Took out the 10,000SP daily and replaced it with garbage only people without a job, family or life can do?

This is the only way I can express my disgust to CPP

http://s369.photobucket.com/user/koldfusion77/media/Buycot_CCP.jpg.html

What...um....what did you do say...2 months ago...before the SP misfire? You could just do that?

KB

Dum Spiro Spero

Titanium Seagull
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#377 - 2016-07-06 04:02:25 UTC
Daichi Yamato wrote:
No the response was still overwhelmingly negative. look at the number of posts in that thread compared to here.

You guys have gotten hung up on thinking it allows you to train faster than vets. it doesnt, you train SLOWER than vets with these dailies. For the thousandth time, if noobs want to train faster, there are a million better ways to do it than dailies. i.e. just make noobs train faster. (this is actually how it used to work...you know, when EVE was constantly growing in subscription base.)


Hey I remember that, except it expired very quickly, I want to say it was 30 days or something?.That was also back when carriers and dreads were the only real capitals and everyone and their mom was tooling around in a Raven with MWDs. Also back when everyone used all that SP boost for learning skills, IIRC.

That said, of course newbros can't train as fast as vets, that's because we don't have the ISK capital or skills to have a head full of the best implants. This was helping bridge that gap for players that logged in every day. My problem with its removal is that if it were going to be removed it shouldn't have been there in the first place. Dailies are a great idea, period. This implementation may have left a lot to be desired, but evolve the implementation, don't just drop the idea. I can think of a few dozen other ways to do it that would have been consistent in-game and resolved a lot of the complaints. Maybe we'll see that, I don't know, but its outright disappearance feels scummy.

Daichi Yamato wrote:
The other thing you are hung up on is that you cant do anything without billions of isk and millions of SP. You have simply and completely missed the whole point of eve and thats probably why you've repeatedly quit.


That's not what I'm saying at all, what I'm saying is that what a lot of players want to do *does* require those things, and the path to getting them is paved with real currency instead of in-game effort. I know the SP deficit is almost impossible to reverse because that's a core game mechanic, but a huge part of making a game fun to play is giving the players the option to do something towards that end. If you give them that and then yank it away, it feels like a betrayal, even if it's a tiny thing.
Nya Kittenheart
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#378 - 2016-07-23 03:13:29 UTC
I enjoyed it ,i miss it , i hoped we would get more variety in the objectives and it could have been harder ...For me it was a good motivation to log in , and i m fairly sure it was a good thing for NPE.

Shame it disappeared because of bitter old vets and SP farming ... When human greed destroy a good gameplay design a real shame.
Nasar Vyron
S0utherN Comfort
#379 - 2016-07-23 04:38:51 UTC
Nya Kittenheart wrote:

Shame it disappeared because of bitter old vets and SP farming ... When human greed destroy a good gameplay design a real shame.



Uhh... that's not why it was removed. I'd love to know where you think you got your information from. Nice try tho.

It was removed because it wasn't having the desired effect on login numbers and from what most everyone could ascertain to make way for the serpentis event. They also hinted at bringing it back at a later date improving upon what they gathered.
Nya Kittenheart
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#380 - 2016-07-24 21:42:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Nya Kittenheart
Quote:
I'd love to know where you think you got your information from. Nice try tho.

I think i get my info wherever i want.You sure ,you dont want to check my ID too Shocked?

They also said they saw a significant increase in activity and that is a very desirable result for a new feature videogamly speaking .

And also i m not agreeing with the Devs conclusion about logging behavior; per my personnal and surroundings experiences.

It didn t really hit me either that shadow of serpentis and recurring opportunities were sharing the same UI ? Do they ?dont think so...
At worst would have created more encounters in anomalies and that is also activity but i can understand the fear of bugs from the devs.

Finally i dont want to be hinted about an eventual come back i want a statement that they are working on the evolution of the feature...